User talk:Visioncurve/Archive 3

Voting for "Military Historian of the Year" and "Military history newcomer of the year" closing

G'day all, voting for the WikiProject Military history "Military Historian of the Year" and "Military history newcomer of the year" is about to close, so if you haven't already, click on the links and have your say before 23:59 (GMT) on 30 December! Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 23:35, 28 December 2020 (UTC) for the coord team

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Unconstructive?

What did you possibly have in mind here?--2603:7000:2143:8500:B857:D117:30C1:B019 (talk) 13:52, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

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April 2021 WikiProject Military History Reviewing Drive

Hey y'all, the April 2021 WikiProject Military History Reviewing Drive begins at 00:01 UTC on April 1, 2021 and runs through 23:59 UTC on April 31, 2021. Points can be earned through reviewing articles on the AutoCheck report, reviewing articles listed at WP:MILHIST/ASSESS, reviewing MILHIST-tagged articles at WP:GAN or WP:FAC, and reviewing articles submitted at WP:MILHIST/ACR. Service awards and barnstars are given for set points thresholds, and the top three finishers will receive further awards. To participate, sign up at Wikipedia:WikiProject_Military_History/April 2021 Reviewing Drive#Participants and create a worklist at Wikipedia:WikiProject Military history/April 2021 Reviewing Drive/Worklists (examples are given). Further details can be found at the drive page. Questions can be asked at the drive talk page. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 17:26, 31 March 2021 (UTC)

My latest contribution

Flag of the Golden Horde

Öz Beg Khan (Personality)

Many Arab and Persian authors of the 14th-15th centuries described Öz Beg Khan as an able statesman and a kind person. Ibn Battuta, for instance, who was granted a personal audience with him in 1333, highly praised the Khan and wrote the following: "He is one of those seven kings who are the greatest and most powerful kings of the world." Historian al-Mufaddal described him as a young man of good appearance, excellent character, a fine Muslim, brave and energetic... (Read my contribution in full)

Oghuz Khagan, legendary ancestor of Turks in the Turkic and Altaic mythology

I strongly suggest you to research more about Oghuz Khagan, in the chronicles and sagas he is always told as the ancestor of Turkic people. No historical term suggests that he is only the khagan of Oghuz. There were Oghuz and Oghur tribes who were parents to the other historic tribal confederations called Kipchak and Karluk, but it did not happened in the age of Kipchaks, Karluks or Göktürks, it happened around 2000 BC (see: Oghur languages history, please, it is sourced) and Oghuz Khagan is dated to 2000 BC (see: Oghuz Khagan please, it is well-documented fact).

Let me get sourced quotes for you from the Wiki pages above:

"The separation into Oghur r-dialects and Oghuz z-dialects is dated to the 2nd millennia BCE."

"Oghuz Khagan or Oghuz Khan (Turkmen: Oguz Han; Turkish: Oğuz Kağan; Azerbaijani: Oğuz Xan or Oğuz Xaqan) is a legendary khan of the Turkic peoples."

The idea that he is only the ancestor of Oghuz Turks is just because his name contains "Oghuz". But it's not like that, it is, as I said, well-documented especially in medieval Turkic and Persian sources which was widely used in all Turkic world whether it is in Cumania or Seljuk. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Karak1lc1k (talk • contribs) 21:28, 24 April 2021 (UTC)

Regarding your "strongly suggest to research more...", I have done it in the past and in my turn I would like to recommend you to do your part of the homework in the future before suggesting someone to do something. In this case, you should have checked first the history of contributions to the Oghuz Khagan article, where you would have most probably discovered that the single greatest contributor to that article is actually me (see: 1), which means that I have already done tons of research you are asking me to do and have poured through a host of primary and secondary materials about Oghuz Khan trying to improve that page and find reliable sources to cite my additions. You keep quoting one specific sentence from the article that says: "Oghuz Khagan is a legendary khan of the Turkic peoples", but you later transform it to "a legendary ancestor of the Turkic Peoples" in your own words. He may be a legendary khan of all Turks, but surely not a legendary ancestor of Uygurs or Kyrgyz Turks. Here is a couple of reliable, academic books and research articles that are about or have portions that include information on Oghuz Khagan which clearly and unambigiously state that Oghuz Khagan was the epynomous ancestor of the Oghuz tribes.

• Asian Mythologies, compiled by Y.Bonnefoy. University of Chicago Press, 1993. p.337
• J. E. Woods, The Aqquyunlu: Clan, Confederation, Empire, Salt Lake City, Utah, 1999.
• S. Kamola, History and legend in the Jama al-tawarikh: Abraham, Alexander, and Oghuz Khan. Published online by Cambridge University Press, 2015.
• G. L. Penrose, "The Politics of Genealogy: An Historical Analysis of Abu’l-Gazi’s Shejere-i Terakima", Ph.D. diss., Indiana University, 1975.
• J. A. Boyle, "The Alexander Legend in Central Asia", Folklore 85, 1974, pp. 217-28.
• M. Dobrovits, "The Turco-Mongolian Tradition of Common Origin and the Historiography in Fifteenth Century Central Asia", Acta Orientalia (Academiae Scientiarum Hungaricae) 47, 1994, pp. 269-77.
• P. Pelliot, "Sur la legende d’Uguz khan en ecriture ouigoure”, T’oung pao 27, 1930, pp. 247-358.
• B. Flemming, "Political Genealogies in the Sixteenth Century”, Journal of Ottoman Studies 7-8, 1988, pp. 123-37.
• K. Jahn, “Zu Rasid al-Din’s "Geschichte der Oġuzen und Türken", Journal of Asian History 1, 1967, pp. 45-63.

--Visioncurve^{Timendi causa est nescire} 04:58, 26 April 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Magtymguly Pyragy

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Magtymguly Pyragy you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Whiteguru -- Whiteguru (talk) 22:00, 24 April 2021 (UTC)

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What

why did you revert cud cud

Try to guess it. --Visioncurve^{Timendi causa est nescire} 08:25, 2 May 2021 (UTC)

My latest contribution

Magtymguly Pyragy on Soviet Ruble, 1991

Not much is known about Magtymguly's family life. He was unable to marry a woman he loved from his own village, Meňli, whom he dedicated a great deal of his love poems. It may be implied though, through some of his poems and several other sources, that he was married to the wife of his deceased brother, Akgyz, after he was asked to do so by the local council of aksakgals (esteemed elders).

Apparently, after losing the love of his life, Magtymguly started composing under the Pyragy laqab (pseudonym), which is translated as "separated" from Arabic.

The following is the excerpt from Magtymguly's Aýryldym (Separated) poem dedicated to Meňli (in original Turkmen and its English translation):

Aýryldym gunça gülümden.
Syýa saçly sünbülimden,
Hoş owazly bilbilimden,
Şirin güftardan aýryldym.

Illeri bar diňli-diňli,
Sowuk suwly, ter öleňli,
Ili — gökleň, ady — Meňli,
Näzli dildardan aýryldym.

Magtymguly, aşyk mestan,
Bagladym şanyna destan,
Menzilgähi bagy-bostan.
Almaly nardan aýryldym.

I am separated from my flower.
From my black-haired beauty,
From my nice-voiced nightingale,
I am separated from my sweet-talking love.

She has lands with minarets,
With cold waters and meadows,
She comes from Gokleng, her name is Mengli,
I am separated from my tender lover.

Magtymguly, drunk with love,
I have composed a dastan for you,
The town of hers is full of gardens.
I am separated from my pomegranate.

Read my contribution in full here.

Your GA nomination of Magtymguly Pyragy

The article Magtymguly Pyragy you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Magtymguly Pyragy for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Whiteguru -- Whiteguru (talk) 04:41, 4 May 2021 (UTC)

Joke of the Day

A work week is so back-breaking and tough that after Monday and Tuesday, even the calendar says WTF.

Latest contribution

Personality of Jalal ad-Din Mingburnu

Shihab al-Din Muhammad al-Nasawi, the personal secretary of the Sultan Jalal ad-Din, described him as follows:

He was swarthy (dark-skinned), small in stature, Turkic in "behavior" and speech, but he also spoke Persian. As for his courage, I have mentioned it many times when describing the battles he took part in. He was a lion among lions and the most fearless among his valiant horsemen. He was mild in his temper though, did not get easily provoked and never used bad language.

Read the article in full here.

Sources

Hi, did you receive my new mail? I sent one to that Ocean mail of yours. HistoryofIran (talk)

Altai Language

There are more sources that say Altai is a Siberian Turkic or Northern Turkic language than Kypchak. These include these pages comparing [Kyrgyz|https://www.ethnologue.com/language/kir] and [Altai|https://www.ethnologue.com/language/alt]. It's very sad people are just throwing stuff and confusing people without doing any actual research like this Turkish researcher you mentioned who does not even speak the language and probably did not look at the language deep enough to correctly classify its language group. We do not have Kypchak features, we have Siberian features. Very unwise. The Wikipedia article of the Altai language says that Altai is in the Siberian Turkic language family. So therefore, the majority vote is that Altai is either Siberian Turkic or Northern Turkic, and not Kypchak.

Your GA nomination of Turkoman (ethnonym)

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Turkoman (ethnonym) you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Uness232 -- Uness232 (talk) 19:41, 28 May 2021 (UTC)

I am pretty sure you are already aware, but just to make sure, the article's nomination process is for now on hold until further changes are made, as major changes are necessary before I proceed with neutrality or go for further details, at least in my opinion. Also as I am fairly new to this (this is my 2nd Good Article review) I'm sorry if the quality of the review is not up to par with what it should be, and if there is any information you want me to add to make things better, I am always open to suggestions. Uness232 (talk) 18:37, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Turkoman (ethnonym)

The article Turkoman (ethnonym) you nominated as a good article has failed ; see Talk:Turkoman (ethnonym) for reasons why the nomination failed. If or when these points have been taken care of, you may apply for a new nomination of the article. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Uness232 -- Uness232 (talk) 15:01, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

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Copying within Wikipedia requires attribution

Thank you for your contributions to Wikipedia. It appears that you copied or moved text from Ethnic groups in Afghanistan into Afghan Turkmens. While you are welcome to re-use Wikipedia's content, here or elsewhere, Wikipedia's licensing does require that you provide attribution to the original contributor(s). When copying within Wikipedia, this is supplied at minimum in an edit summary at the page into which you've copied content, disclosing the copying and linking to the copied page, e.g., copied content from [[page name]]; see that page's history for attribution. It is good practice, especially if copying is extensive, to also place a properly formatted {{copied}} template on the talk pages of the source and destination. Please provide attribution for this duplication if it has not already been supplied by another editor, and if you have copied material between pages before, even if it was a long time ago, you should provide attribution for that also. You can read more about the procedure and the reasons at Wikipedia:Copying within Wikipedia. Thank you. If you are the sole author of the prose that was copied, attribution is not required. — Diannaa (talk) 14:01, 30 June 2021 (UTC)

I believe you have already taken matters into your own hands by doing me a favor and fixing it yourself. I am appreciative and thankful. Take care! --Visioncurve^{Timendi causa est nescire} 16:30, 30 June 2021 (UTC)

And again on Tomiris (film).— Diannaa (talk) 13:55, 16 August 2021 (UTC)

Hephthalites Language. Prakrit and Sanskrit.

I am disputing your revision on the Hephthalite page regarding their official languages. Prakrit was the common language used during the Hephthalite period, not Sanskrit. Sanskrit was historically used the Vedic Era millennia BCE as a religious language. It was continually used in religious texts only, not as a common language. Instead, Prakrit (specifically the dialect Gandhara Prakrit) was used as a common language by the Hephthalites. Prakrit, which was a Middle Indo-Aryan language, replaced Pali around the third century CE as the common language in North India. The previous claim of Sanskrit as the common language is inaccurate and misleading, even if it was still used as a religious language. An analogy would be like claiming that the USA uses Hebrew as a common language due to religious texts like Bible being written in Hebrew, instead of the spoken language English which replaced Old English. I will be editing it back to Prakrit and adding an appropriate reference. Since the original claim of Sanskrit, as well as your revision did not include any references for Sanskrit as a common language, that remains a disputed claim. Rancid Boar (talk) 11:10, 13 July 2021 (UTC)

The primary reason behind the removal of your intially dubious edit was that it was simply an unsourced addition; and you chose to add it directly to the infobox. I see you amended your shortcomings and added a ref, though you didn't properly cite it. I suggest you go through WP:CS first to understand how to cite sources correctly. Then, check into MOS:IBX, where you will find out for yourself that when considering any aspect of infobox design, you have to keep in mind the purpose of an infobox, which is to summarize and not supplant facts that appear in the article. You added Prakrit to the infobox, but the page does not mention it anywhere within itself. So, I suggest you fix that as well if you don't want your inclusion removed by experienced editors any time soon. Cheers! --Visioncurve^{Timendi causa est nescire} 03:37, 14 July 2021 (UTC)

Latest contribution

Culture of the Crimean Tatars

Yurts or nomadic tents have traditionally played an important role in the cultural history of Crimean Tatars. There are different types of yurts; some are large and collapsible, called "terme", while others are small and non-collapsible (otav).

On Nowruz holiday, Crimean Tatars usually cook eggs, chicken soup, puff meat pie (kobete), halva, and sweet biscuits. Children put on different masks and sing special songs under the windows of their neighbors, receiving sweets in return. You can read my contribution in full here.

Reverting my edit on Timur

Why did you revert the edit done by me which was based on historical sources and citation was also provided. Please give the valid reason. People come to Wikipedia to find real facts rather than just good facts. The information should be balanced. Please provide the 'valid' reason. Thanks. Nonethelessian (talk) 11:57, 21 July 2021 (UTC)

Hi, Nonethelessian, how is everything? I understand you may be new to Wikipedia, and it is very unlikely for a newcomer to be completely familiar with Wikipedia's markup language and its myriad of policies, guidelines, and community standards when they start editing. First and foremost is that all encyclopedic content on Wikipedia must be written from a neutral point of view avoiding stating opinions as facts. Obviously, your addition of "His (Timur's) blood thirsty army was defeated by Rampyari Gurjar Chauhan in Haridwar battle in 1398" was not written from a neutral point of view as per WP:NPOV, and is not in line with the WP:MOS. It is also a mere opinion of the freelance writer posted on a pro nationalist opinion site (that's what "about us" section of that website says). Secondly, that source is not regarded as reliable according to WP:RS, since reliable sources are published materials with a reliable publication process, authors who are regarded as authoritative in relation to the subject, or both. The source you used may be defined as questionable as per WP:QUESTIONED, because it has no editorial oversight and expresses views that rely heavily on personal opinions. If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me here. Thank you! --Visioncurve^{Timendi causa est nescire} 07:38, 22 July 2021 (UTC)

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Incomplete DYK nomination

Hello! Your submission of Template:Did you know nominations/Magtymguly Pyragy at the Did You Know nominations page is not complete; if you would like to continue, please link the nomination to the nominations page as described in step 3 of the nomination procedure. If you do not want to continue with the nomination, tag the nomination page with {{db-g7}}, or ask a DYK admin. Thank you. DYKHousekeepingBot (talk) 03:44, 30 July 2021 (UTC)

DYK nomination of Magtymguly Pyragy

Hello! Your submission of Magtymguly Pyragy at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and some issues with it may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) at your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! BuySomeApples (talk) 09:05, 30 July 2021 (UTC)

BuySomeApples, hi! Yeah I'm sorry, I believe I have missed that 7 day eligibility rule currently in place for DYK nominations. Better luck next time. Thanks for you time though and take care! --Visioncurve^{Timendi causa est nescire} 04:52, 1 August 2021 (UTC)

Take care as well and better luck next time! On a personal note, I really enjoyed that article. BuySomeApples (talk) 04:55, 1 August 2021 (UTC)

Mer

Hello:

The copy edit you requested from the Guild of Copy Editors of the article Merv has been completed.

Please let me know if you have any questions or concerns.

Best of luck with the GAN when you get to it.

Regards,

Twofingered Typist (talk) 20:23, 17 August 2021 (UTC)

Twofingered Typist, thank you very much. I appreciate that. Take care! --Visioncurve^{Timendi causa est nescire} 04:22, 18 August 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Tuqaq

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Tuqaq you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of QatarStarsLeague -- QatarStarsLeague (talk) 05:21, 18 August 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Tomiris (film)

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Tomiris (film) you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Some Dude From North Carolina -- Some Dude From North Carolina (talk) 00:01, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Tomiris (film)

The article Tomiris (film) you nominated as a good article has been placed on hold . The article is close to meeting the good article criteria, but there are some minor changes or clarifications needing to be addressed. If these are fixed within 7 days, the article will pass; otherwise it may fail. See Talk:Tomiris (film) for issues which need to be addressed. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Some Dude From North Carolina -- Some Dude From North Carolina (talk) 18:21, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

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Your GA nomination of Turkoman (ethnonym)

The article Turkoman (ethnonym) you nominated as a good article has been placed on hold . The article is close to meeting the good article criteria, but there are some minor changes or clarifications needing to be addressed. If these are fixed within 7 days, the article will pass; otherwise it may fail. See Talk:Turkoman (ethnonym) for issues which need to be addressed. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Uness232 -- Uness232 (talk) 22:21, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Wikiproject Military history coordinator election nominations open

Nominations for the upcoming project coordinator election are now open. A team of up to ten coordinators will be elected for the next year. The project coordinators are the designated points of contact for issues concerning the project, and are responsible for maintaining our internal structure and processes. They do not, however, have any authority over article content or editor conduct, or any other special powers. More information on being a coordinator is available here. If you are interested in running, please sign up here by 23:59 UTC on 14 September! Voting doesn't commence until 15 September. If you have any questions, you can contact any member of the coord team. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 01:59, 1 September 2021 (UTC)

Incomplete DYK nomination

Hello! Your submission of Template:Did you know nominations/Turkoman (ethnonym) at the Did You Know nominations page is not complete; if you would like to continue, please link the nomination to the nominations page as described in step 3 of the nomination procedure. If you do not want to continue with the nomination, tag the nomination page with {{db-g7}}, or ask a DYK admin. Thank you. DYKHousekeepingBot (talk) 04:54, 2 September 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Tomiris (film)

The article Tomiris (film) you nominated as a good article has failed ; see Talk:Tomiris (film) for reasons why the nomination failed. If or when these points have been taken care of, you may apply for a new nomination of the article. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Some Dude From North Carolina -- Some Dude From North Carolina (talk) 21:42, 2 September 2021 (UTC)

There's something wrong with Legobot, it actually passed the GA nomination. Congratulations to everyone involved! Take care! --Visioncurve^{Timendi causa est nescire} 02:57, 4 September 2021 (UTC)

Seperate article for Dede Korkut

Hello, I am thinking of a seperate article for Dede Korkut. But not sure where to begin. Do you think it's a good idea? Could you help? Thanks in advance. Beshogur (talk) 10:46, 4 September 2021 (UTC)

Beshogur, hi there. How are you? You know really well that I will always help you with any of your requests, however I wonder what do you mean by a separate article and is it really necessary? Will that article be solely about Dede Korkut as a legendary wise-man or you simply want to revamp the existing one? I must tell "Book of Dede Korkut" page indeed begs for an old good polishing, especially its "Synopses" section. So, I would like to ask you to kindly provide me with more details regarding your plans? Thank you! --Visioncurve^{Timendi causa est nescire} 04:45, 5 September 2021 (UTC)

Hi again, I'm fine, thanks for asking. I would like a make a page pure based on Dede Korkut and his personality. Probably, a work for later. Beshogur (talk) 09:24, 5 September 2021 (UTC)

Beshogur, no worries, I will surely help. But please, inform me in advance when you would like to start your page so that I'll get prepared and search for decent information from reliable sources. Take care! --Visioncurve^{Timendi causa est nescire} 02:41, 6 September 2021 (UTC)

Disruptive editing

First, don't tag-bomb my user page. You are engaged in disruptive editing; accusing someone else of it first does not relieve you of your responsibility to edit responsibly.

A couple problems with your repeated revert. First, there is no such thing as "Finno-Ugric people". Certainly not in Öz Beg's conception. You could add Magyar to Finnic if you like; Finnic is at least a reasonably coherent conception, even if it is ambiguous. Finno-Ugric is a reification of a linguistic theory with no basis in ethnography. It's also anachronistic.

The other is the SEAOFBLUE problem of linking 'Crimean' and 'Greeks' separately and right next to each other. Why do that, when we have a perfectly good article on Crimean Greeks, with a section that covers exactly this period?

When you revert someone, please try to understand what you're doing and whether your edits are actually improving things. — kwami (talk) 06:50, 6 September 2021 (UTC)

Disruptive editing, accusing someone? What on earth are you talking about? You have been reverted because you simply kept linking certain words to disambiguation pages. Do you understand what a disambiguation page means? I believe not and therefore, I suggest you go through the basics of Wikipedia first and start reading the edit summaries. --Visioncurve^{Timendi causa est nescire} 15:41, 7 September 2021 (UTC)

You accused me of disruptive editing, but I was not being disruptive. The reason I linked to a dab page is because the subject is ambiguous. There is no dedicated page to link to, so a dab page is best. The policy is that when linking to dab pages, you should do it explicitly, using the (disambiguation) tag, so that people know it was intentional. Are you able to find a better link? If so, please link there.

Meanwhile you continue to purposefully link to inappropriate pages, with SOB violations of the MOS. Perhaps you need to review the basics of editing here.

Can I at least remove your inappropriate links, or would that be considered edit-warring? Are you willing to clean up your own mess, or do we need to escalate this to ANI?

Meanwhile I tagged that paragraph for failing verification. A search of the entire source turns up nothing for the 2nd sentence. You need to provide an actual source, or the unsourced claims can be deleted. In fact, they can be deleted immediately, and you would need a RS to restore them, or you would be on the losing end of an edit-war, but I'll give you a chance to find a source first. If the existing source already does verify the claims, you can quote it on the talk page so to demonstrate that. — kwami (talk) 21:01, 7 September 2021 (UTC)

As far as I know, disambiguation is required whenever, for a given word or phrase on which a reader might search, there is more than one existing Wikipedia article to which that word or phrase might be expected to lead. However in our case, there was no need for disambiguation, you could've simply linked it to Volga Finns and perhaps added Permians right after it (though Permians are sometimes also grouped as Volga Finns), but no, you chose to cut the corners. Moreover, I have poured through a host of primary and secondary material related to Oz Begh Khan and the people of the Golden Horde, most of them have these people called collectively as the Finno-Ugric people. So my guess is there was no need to remove a Finno-Ugric term in the first place. These sources include:

• • • Azade-Ayse Rorlich, "The Volga Tatars: A Profile in National Resilience"; 2017.
    • "Anthropology & Archeology of Eurasia", 2008.
    • Agustí Alemany, "Sources on the Alans: A Critical Compilation"; 2000.
    • Alexander V. Maiorov, ‎Roman Hautala, "The Routledge Handbook of the Mongols and Central-Eastern Europe"; 2021.
    • Christoph Baumer, "History of Central Asia, volume 4"; 2018.
    • Allen J. Frank, Islamic Historiography and "Bulghar" Identity Among the Tatars and Bashkirs of Russia"; 1998.
    • Gregory Freeze, "Russia: A History, new edition"; 2002.
    • Janet M. Hartley, "The Volga: A History"; 2021.

Regarding your "you continue to purposefully link to inappropriate pages" and "Are you willing to clean up your own mess", I would suggest you do some decent research and homework first before pointing the finger at me, since it wasn't me who incorporated that dubious statement to the page or added, as you think, inappropriate links. However, if that statement indeed fails verification, the best of both worlds will be to simply remove it without giving it a benefit of the doubt and thus, end this discussion for good. --Visioncurve^{Timendi causa est nescire} 10:15, 8 September 2021 (UTC)

Done. Since you, who know the sources, aren't willing to fix the article, I removed the claims that fail verification. — kwami (talk) 23:12, 8 September 2021 (UTC)

Wikiproject Military history coordinator election nomination period closing soon

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Your GA nomination of Tuqaq

The article Tuqaq you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Tuqaq for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of QatarStarsLeague -- QatarStarsLeague (talk) 02:01, 12 September 2021 (UTC)

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DYK nomination of Turkoman (ethnonym)

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Wikiproject Military history coordinator election voting period closing soon

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Would you mind re-assessing the Jalal al-Din Mangburni's page?

Hello. Could you re-assess it as it has been expanded and improved greatly. Does it deserve to be B-class? If not, what more is needed? --81.213.215.83 (talk) 05:26, 9 October 2021 (UTC)

Hi. This is one of the articles I have a tremendous interest in, and I try to contribute to it as much as possible whenever I have time for it. Unfortunately, it begs extensive and professional copy-editing as it is written with poor grammar, research is obviously haphazard, statements of opinion are written in such a way as to be perceived as statements of research based facts while several sources are often biased or unreliable. My subjective opinion is that this page will score low based on what I have written above. Cheers! --Visioncurve^{Timendi causa est nescire} 05:47, 9 October 2021 (UTC)

Hello. I am the same person but using different computer (I do not create account as these IPs are from my workplace). I do grant the research is haphazard as I just introduce whatever I meet in the books I currently am reading. However, I refuse to even think that it is concievable to assert "statements of opinion are written in such a way as to be perceived as statements of research based facts". In my contributions, I cited all those opinions into relevant authors, I attribute those opinions into their owners (e.g. Harold Lamb, Jurgen Paul, Ibn al-Athir etc). I would be glad if you help to detect and amend grammatical mistakes like the typo you amended today. All in all, let us improve this article as the second season of the relevant series will begin soon and this page will be visited even more. The TV series is historically very misleading, I want to counter that. --88.230.171.39 (talk) 11:42, 9 October 2021 (UTC)

I have read the article carefully, detected grammatical inaccuracies and amended them all. --81.213.215.83 (talk) 04:03, 14 October 2021 (UTC)

• Also, as you are an expert historian, were the Khwarezmshahs a Turkoman? --81.213.215.83 (talk) 04:23, 10 October 2021 (UTC)

New message from TrangaBellam

Hello, Visioncurve. You have new messages at Talk:Magtymguly Pyragy.
Message added 16:55, 13 October 2021 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

TrangaBellam (talk) 16:55, 13 October 2021 (UTC)

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Good Article Reassessment of Turkoman (ethnonym)

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DYK nomination of Turkoman (ethnonym)

Hello! Your submission of Turkoman (ethnonym) at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and some issues with it may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) at your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! 4meter4 (talk) 19:25, 27 October 2021 (UTC)

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Where is the Modern Jalayirds in Turkey

Where are Jalayirids in Turkey now and which surnames do they have? Where are the children of Bayazit? 88.236.181.221 (talk) 22:22, 1 November 2021 (UTC)

Where are the children of Bayazit Jalayirid? Where are the jalayirids living in Turkey?

I'm wondering about this. Because there is a claim that my ancestry comes from Bayazıt Jalayirid. 88.236.189.68 (talk) 12:01, 2 November 2021 (UTC)

Turkmen literature

Hello:

The copy edit you requested from the Guild of Copy Editors of the article Turkmen literature has been completed.

Please let me know if you have any questions or concerns.

There are a couple of issues that need your attention. Most of the fonts/punctuation around the title of works was missing or incorrect. I have tried to fix/interpret them the best I can. You might want to check each work and make sure it is correct. Novels are bracketed with ...; stories "..."; and poems "...". Foreign surnames are not italicised, so I fixed those.

I added a "citation needed" tag after a citation that is incomplete or no longer works. I also added a "clarification needed" tag to a sentence in the Early 19th century section which I did not understand.

All the best with the article moving forward.

Twofingered Typist (talk) 20:06, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Merv

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Logged out editing

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Requesting some article expansion help

Greetings @ Visioncurve

You seem to have been contributing to Turkmen language related articles besides you seem to know Russian, Turkish and also Persian.

Requesting your visit to the 'historical linguistics' related article Draft:Aurats (word).

a) Google search seems to show the word 'arvad' used in Azerbaijani meaning wife is probably used in Turkmen language too and I am looking for confirmation and references for the same in the article Draft:Aurats (word), if the information is correct.

b) Some of 'historical linguistics' research for Azerbaijani language and Turkmen language might have been published in Russian, Persian and Turkish languages and may not be readily available in English language. If you happen to come across any suitable references from those language research, any point of time, then please do help in expansion of the Draft:Aurats (word).

Thanks and Warm regards

Bookku, 'Encyclopedias = expanding information & knowledge' (talk) 05:32, 5 January 2022 (UTC)

@Bookku: I am afraid that the owner of this talk-page is inactive for months. TrangaBellam (talk) 19:54, 12 January 2022 (UTC)

Two and half months inactivity as of now is okay. If he does not come back also some one like you may help out as and when they come across any suitable references.

Thanks for your concern and warm regards

Bookku, 'Encyclopedias = expanding information & knowledge' (talk) 15:14, 13 January 2022 (UTC)

Qara qoyunlu and Turkification of Azerbaijan

"Qaraqoyunlu are the drivers of these political migration movements from Anatolia to Iran and at the same time the first member of a new settlement movement that will ensure the restoration of Turkmen rule in Iran and, in fact, the Turkification of Azerbaijan. As it is understood from these words, the Turkish they spoke was the Oghuz or Turkmen language, which is called Azerbaijani today. It is understood that Jahanshah, one of the rulers of Qaraqoyunlu, was one of the representatives of Azerbaijani literature.

I want to add this, do you mind?

1.Source : Faruk Sümer, «Kara Koyunlular», I cilt, səh. VIII 2 source : Faruk Sümer, "Akkoyunlular", İslam Ansiklopedisi, I, s.251-271.

3source:https://islamansiklopedisi.org.tr/karakoyunlular Aydın memmedov2000 (talk) 15:44, 19 January 2022 (UTC)

Books : https://t.me/irs_azerbaijan/2035

https://t.me/irs_azerbaijan/2065

https://t.me/irs_azerbaijan/2156 Aydın memmedov2000 (talk) 15:48, 19 January 2022 (UTC)

It connects Kara-Koyunlu's Oghuz dialect with the Azerbaijani language. For example, Faruk Sumer noted that the Eastern Oghuz dialect of Kara-Koyunlu is called the Azerbaijani language today, while Muhsin Behramnejad called the Azerbaijani language as a legacy inherited from the Kara-Koyunlu Turkmen tribes. Sultan Kara-Koyunlu 1435-1467 Cihanshah is a well-known representative of Azerbaijani poetry Aydın memmedov2000 (talk) 15:49, 19 January 2022 (UTC)

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