User talk:Chiswick Chap/TalkArchive2021

Isa Briones

Greetings, Chiswick Chap! I am considering taking this article to GAN. Would you be willing to give it a quick once-over and let me know if anything stands out? TIA. —ATS (talk) 21:49, 31 December 2020 (UTC)

It seems fine. I was confused (surprised?) by having Spelling, Jay, and Jones cited as "Jones", indeed I thought the link was broken or missing. In the sfn all that is required is {{sfn|Spelling|Jay|Jones|2020|p=123}} which would be the usual approach to naming and linking. Chiswick Chap (talk) 09:06, 1 January 2021 (UTC)

Much obliged! —ATS (talk) 14:27, 1 January 2021 (UTC)

Nabataean?

Hello Chiswick Chap! That you for your edits to The Nabatean Agriculture! Your article Arab Agricultural Revolution is actually where I first heard of the book :). The reason I used the spelling Nabatean is because I got more google results for "Nabatean agriculture" in quotes than "Nabataean agriculture", but I don't know much about the topic and I'm not sure which spelling is more correct. What do you think?

BE certainly prefers -aean but no matter.

Also, unrelated but yesterday I came across the page Andalusi agricultural corpus, I thought you might want to link to it from Arab Agricultural Revolution. --Cerebellum (talk) 12:59, 3 January 2021 (UTC)

Will take a look. Many thanks, Chiswick Chap (talk) 13:01, 3 January 2021 (UTC)

Revert: Heraldry of Middle-earth

Speculative? The meaning of Narsil is pretty trivially obvious; the irony is that what precedes in the article is patent speculation, but counts as "sourced" because it appeared in a fanzine. Solicitr (talk) 17:12, 3 January 2021 (UTC)

The rule is pretty trivially simple: reliably sourced is OK, and unsourced isn't. It's a good general rule, and applies across the whole of Wikipedia. Anything unsourced may be removed by any editor at any time; with really new wet-behind-the-ears newbies, we try to avoid wholesale reversion and give them soft soap about welcome and by the way we have a weird and wonderful policy hidden behind this link if you accidentally click on it, but I doubt that applies in your case. Chiswick Chap (talk) 18:57, 3 January 2021 (UTC)

Minas Tirith

I received your notification and maybe I did a mistake because I add the insipiration in the wrong sentence but in the DVD bonus of « The Return of The King » section «  The creation of the Middle Earth » Alan Lee and the other visual designers are perfectly clear : not only the Mont Saint-Michel, France inspired Minas Tirith but Siena and St Michael’s Mount too. So I will be more accurate in my next modification and I ask the permission to edit the page. Homford (talk) 23:22, 6 January 2021 (UTC)

Thank you. The page is already a "Good Article", and does not need any substantial work, but if you have proof of a minor detail that needs adjusting, add it and cite it to the evidence, which must be a reliable source like a page of a textbook or an academic journal article. Chiswick Chap (talk) 08:31, 7 January 2021 (UTC)

Thank you for your answer. Ok if I add a minor detail, I will cite the source, the bonus DVD of The Return of the King, to be precise. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Homford (talk • contribs) 21:17, 7 January 2021 (UTC)

Well, since I don't know what "minor detail" you mean, I can't say whether it would be helpful or not, but if you mean the same thing as before then no, please don't. On the whole, citing DVDs is not ideal; it's far better to cite a text which can be verified directly. By the way, please could you SIGN your messages with ~~~~ as it's a mess otherwise: sometimes the bot adds a pseudo-signature afterwards but it's a lot of clutter. Chiswick Chap (talk) 09:40, 8 January 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Eyespot (mimicry)

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Eyespot (mimicry) you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Ealdgyth -- Ealdgyth (talk) 16:21, 7 January 2021 (UTC)

Pallas's cat

Thanks for your prompt passing of the page to GA !! I enjoyed collaborating with you on this. I have one more question, since you didn't ask it : do you think it worthwhile to add that

• in the western part of its range, it is sympatric with the leopard, as many records were obtained during leopard targeted surveys in Armenia and Iran
• and in Mongolia, montane parts of Central Asia and Himalayas, lots of records were obtained during camera trapping surveys for snow leopard ? -- BhagyaMani (talk) 17:19, 14 January 2021 (UTC)

These sound just like the kinds of fact that DYK delights in. All the best, Chiswick Chap (talk) 18:59, 14 January 2021 (UTC)

Map

I saw you requested a reference for a map on Geats. I am not the one who made it, but although it is lacking in several respects, I think it is realistic enough to stay without a reference tag. But, that is me.--Berig (talk) 17:10, 15 January 2021 (UTC)

I tagged it because the boundaries were so detailed; how would anyone know them from the 12th century? They certainly didn't have GPS or even theodolites and chains to do the triangulation with, back then. Chiswick Chap (talk) 18:48, 15 January 2021 (UTC)

Of course they are too sharp. I agree on that. But, on the other hand most historic maps are like that.--Berig (talk) 18:54, 15 January 2021 (UTC)

Yes. Seems to me that a source would be entirely appropriate - a complex set of claims is being made via the map, and that a source would help enormously. At least then any assumptions made, primary sources used, and disclaimers about accuracy would all become available. Right now it's indistinguishable from WP:OR.Chiswick Chap (talk) 19:02, 15 January 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Eyespot (mimicry)

The article Eyespot (mimicry) you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Eyespot (mimicry) for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Ealdgyth -- Ealdgyth (talk) 22:01, 15 January 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Theos Casimir Bernard

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Theos Casimir Bernard you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Whiteguru -- Whiteguru (talk) 09:40, 18 January 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Theos Casimir Bernard

The article Theos Casimir Bernard you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Theos Casimir Bernard for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Whiteguru -- Whiteguru (talk) 21:41, 20 January 2021 (UTC)

Middle-earth redirect

What is your opinion of the redirect Menas Teroth? (pointing to Gondor via Minas Tirith). It looks strange to me, and I can't find anything suggesting this was a draft name. Possibly an attempt at a phonetical. Is this a potentially useful phonetical in your opinion, or is this a draft name I'm not aware of, or should it have a trip to RFD? Hog Farm _Talk 05:12, 22 January 2021 (UTC)

I never saw it. could be an over-anxious double error, or a joke. Chiswick Chap (talk) 10:04, 22 January 2021 (UTC)

Turtle

With regard to the reference I reformatted in Turtle, my format used "access-date=11 January 2021" but what came out was "Retrieved January 11, 2021", which surprised me. Has there been some grand decision that all dates are to be formatted in a certain way? Cwmhiraeth (talk) 10:10, 11 January 2021 (UTC)

I don't think so. The tag "{{Use mdy dates|date = February 2018}}" at the top of Turtle may have something to do with it. Chiswick Chap (talk) 10:20, 11 January 2021 (UTC)

You are right. I tested it by removing the tag and the date format I had inputted was followed in the final citation. I never knew before that those tags had any useful function, thinking that they just directed editors to conform to the specified date format. Cwmhiraeth (talk) 10:37, 11 January 2021 (UTC)

Kevin Crossley-Holland

You may be interested to know, a propos of very little, that I'm currently listening to Peter Crossley-Holland's symphony on Dutton Digital, which is what led me down the rabbit hole to his son. Pleasant music, if a bit shapeless...still, overall quite an attractive piece. --Ser Amantio di Nicolao^{Che dicono a Signa?}_{Lo dicono a Signa.} 20:13, 14 January 2021 (UTC)

Very nice to see you here, and at KCH's page doing some good old-fashioned editing! I've been enjoying his Beowulf rather than Peter CH's music... Chiswick Chap (talk) 20:19, 14 January 2021 (UTC)

Hey, now, I remember how to do some old-fashioned editing. :-) Looking forward to getting some more done in the near-term once my next couple of bouts of AWB are dealt with. --Ser Amantio di Nicolao^{Che dicono a Signa?}_{Lo dicono a Signa.} 20:27, 14 January 2021 (UTC)

Commendation

Dear Chiswick Chap, I just wanted to tell you (also in case you may have got me wrong regarding my recent edits in your Tolkien articles) that I am highly impressed by your work done in this fascinating field – especially with regard to your profound and thorough sourcing with primary as well as secondary refereces. To my mind, your articles show a considerable degree of academic quality, which is especially important when dealing with fiction in a "real" encyclopedia … So please do keep it up, and have fun conveying the great magic of Middle-earth here! All the best--Hildeoc (talk) 09:55, 22 January 2021 (UTC)

Hildeoc, thank you, that is one of the nicest things I've ever been told here on Wikipedia, specially after a disagreement. It's admirable that you're big enough to see past such things. All the best, Chiswick Chap (talk) 10:03, 22 January 2021 (UTC)

I'm glad this has gone down well with you, my friend. Meneg suilaid--Hildeoc (talk) 11:12, 22 January 2021 (UTC)

PS: I just added the final entry over here. Do you think you could turn that into a proper lemma (or maybe in combination with Olwë) at some point?--Hildeoc (talk) 13:42, 22 January 2021 (UTC)

That's fine. An article would I think require more scholarly sources than now exist, but of course someone may devote a thesis to them. Chiswick Chap (talk) 14:01, 22 January 2021 (UTC)

I guess you're right. There's always a risk of overloading Wikipedia with in-universe fiction content – it really is a balancing act indeed.--Hildeoc (talk) 17:46, 22 January 2021 (UTC)

PPS: Would you mind if I asked one more question – just to get that right: According to WP:R#PLA, redirect terms should be set in boldface. How come this is not the case for probably most of the Middle-earth-related redirect lemmas, as I've recently noticed? (Wouldn't that be a good thing in terms of better orientation and navigation particularly with respect to the intricacy of Tolkien's universe per se, and the concomitant terminological abundance?)--Hildeoc (talk) 18:03, 22 January 2021 (UTC)

There are far too many minor redirects to handle in that way. The first paragraph is the best place for alternative names and there's only room for one or two before the paragraph becomes hopelessly indigestible. The policy doesn't begin to require total coverage, and I'd certainly object strenuously if anybody tried to make it do so. Chiswick Chap (talk) 19:03, 22 January 2021 (UTC)

Okay, I see your point. Though, to be honest, I'm still afraid some readers may get a little "dizzy" from some of the redirects, in fact – cf. e.g. Straight Road; right now, I'm trying to add some makeshift info there, but I guess, in this case, a profound article would actually be better (this may be a solid base to start from), considering the abstractness of that concept.--Hildeoc (talk) 19:44, 22 January 2021 (UTC)

Sigh. The navboxes are very clear and offer a simple overview of the project. The great majority of the bluelinks within the articles are to whole articles. I assume you know that hundreds of minor articles were deleted or merged last year; it was quite something to ensure the safety of the major ones in an AfD campaign, and quite a lot more work to provide suitable landing-spots for all the more significant redirects that resulted. The feeling that the thing had stabilised was a good one, and the very last thing I want is to start another round of hoo-hah. "The Straight Road" leads, er, straight to a very clear cosmological map clearly labelled with "The Straight Road" which ought to be enough to keep 99.9% of the human race happy on the matter really. Chiswick Chap (talk) 20:29, 22 January 2021 (UTC)

Keep cool – there's no need to get grumpy … I was just giving my – good-willed – opinion for the sake of providing an optimum of navigability in a complex universe (both literally and figuratively). And no, as a matter of fact I was not aware of the deletions / mergers. But anyway, I'm not arguing for more "new" articles in general, but just for precise, clear linking (cf. the recent RfD on "Noldorin"). Best wishes--Hildeoc (talk) 21:13, 22 January 2021 (UTC)

Apology

Hey. I'm sorry for being rude to you last year at the good article nomination. My ego was coping unhealthily with things in my personal life and I let it bring out the worst in me sometimes. I was just looking at that review page and felt bad. Again, sorry. isento (talk) 01:14, 24 January 2021 (UTC)

Many thanks, that's very sweet of you to say so. All the best, Chiswick Chap (talk) 09:10, 24 January 2021 (UTC)

Beowulf nomination

I see that you are working on a GA for Beowulf. Do want me to help you out?--Berig (talk) 12:07, 27 January 2021 (UTC)

The reviewer and I are working through the criteria this very moment! I think I'm coping fine (so now might not be the ideal moment to intervene) but do feel free to monitor the review and assist if need be. Chiswick Chap (talk) 12:11, 27 January 2021 (UTC)

I will leave you to it :-)--Berig (talk) 12:14, 27 January 2021 (UTC)

This user helped promote Beowulf to good article status.

		The Golden Wiki
		For Awesome Works while Being Awesome. Presented by SilkTork (talk) 18:48, 27 January 2021 (UTC)

And another one bites the dust! You've done some awesome work on this project, Chiswick. And without creating any drama! If we had more contributors like you, Wikipedia would move forward faster and happier. SilkTork (talk) 18:48, 27 January 2021 (UTC)

That's very kind of you, thank you again. Chiswick Chap (talk) 19:46, 27 January 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Virabhadrasana

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Virabhadrasana you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Whiteguru -- Whiteguru (talk) 10:01, 29 January 2021 (UTC)

Heaneywulf

Spotted in an edit summary - made me laugh! :-) Good work on Beowulf (wasn't aware we had a whole infobox on that). Was looking over some of the articles. Am a bit behind. Is Tolkien's monsters the latest 'big' one? I have also just noticed the scholars you added, especially Sandra Ballif Straubhaar and Richard C. West. Oh dear. I had not realised West had died. :-( I do need to pay closer attention. BTW, there was an extensive biographical account in the latest Tolkien Studies of Christopher Tolkien, which I should really get round to one day (unless you can acccess that already?). Carcharoth (talk) 03:50, 31 January 2021 (UTC)

Yes, all true. I don't have the CT article. Chiswick Chap (talk) 09:43, 31 January 2021 (UTC)

Armour against fate

Quick loose end to tie up, you probably don't remember it at all(!) but back in March 2020, I said this on my talk page in a conversation with you: "e.g. Fate and Free Will in the bit in Unfinished Tales [and other versions] where Ulmo app[e]ars to Tuor and says his bit about 'armour against fate', which is the title of a book I have on my shelves about British military intelligence in the First World War, though I think that is a complete coincidence". I've now gone and looked this up in both the book itself, and Wikipedia. The book (Armour Against Fate (1989) by Michael Occleshaw) confirms that the title is from the book's epigraph, quoting the funeral dirge in The Contention of Ajax and Ulysses, a 17th-century play by James Shirley. So I got to wondering if Tolkien's use of the phrase was because he was familiar with this, or whether (more likely, IMO) it is just an independent creation of a fairly logical (if dramatic) turn of phrase? The latter, IMO, because it occurs elsewhere, such as in the title of a romantic novel by Margaret Pedler, and again in a work of historical (fiction?) by Caroline Angus about Thomas Cromwell (both examples found on Wikipedia). I am sure other examples can be found. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar. It would also help if I had checked the Tolkien quote first, as it is actually: "in the armour of Fate (as the Children of Earth name it) there is ever a rift, and in the walls of Doom a breach, until the full-making, which ye call the End". So now have to work out the subtle difference between the concept of an armour against fate, and an armour of fate. Hmm. They appear to be completely different things. Though both probably related directly to free will and controlling your own fate. That was probably a loose end not really worth tying up! :-) Carcharoth (talk) 17:04, 31 January 2021 (UTC)

Surely Tolkien knew Shirley's poem

The glories of our blood and state
     Are shadows, not substantial things;
There is no armour against Fate;
     Death lays his icy hand on kings:
               Sceptre and Crown
               Must tumble down,
And in the dust be equal made
With the poor crooked scythe and spade.

We read it at school, as millions of other British schoolchildren did. It is number 69 in Palgrave's anthology The Golden Treasury, a book of popular poems; it was printed in an Everyman edition, in enormous quantities.

Tolkien probably did NOT read Shirley's play, and nor did anybody else; indeed, we didn't have any idea the poem came from the (utterly obscure) play.

An armour against fate would protect one from the Moirae, not a likely thing; an armour of fate is ... Tolkienianishly obscure. Chiswick Chap (talk) 17:15, 31 January 2021 (UTC)

Ah, thank you! :-) I should have read the Wikipedia article. Sadly, education by my day did not include those classics. I see from here that even more of the poem was probably published in those anthologies. Maybe I did encounter it under the title 'Death the Leveller', a search for which led me to this analysis? From what I've now read about Shirley's other plays (Honoria and Mammon and A Contention for Honor and Riches to start with) I see why they are obscure. Is that what Caroline-era plays were like? I am surprised several of the plays on the James Shirley page are not in Category:Plays by James Shirley. Anyway, as far as I can tell, Shirley's poem is about the inevitability of death, while Tolkien is describing armour as something protecting fate (or doom), and how free will is the way to breach that armour - i.e. fate is not set in stone. (This all reminds me a bit of The Chronicles of Prydain for some reason! But that is a rabbit hole it may be best not to go down.)

The other interesting thing is Ulmo referring to "the End" as "the full-making" - i.e. the Dagor Dagorath - nice collection of quotes here. Can you see the final version of Dagor Dagorath before deletion? Am I right that all we have at the moment is what is in Cosmology of Tolkien's legendarium - "The End of Days - Tolkien's world ends in Dagor Dagorath"? The phrase is used and described in varying levels of detail in Morgoth, Silmarils and Fëanor, and I think the longest bit on Dagor Dagorath is at Last Battle (Middle-earth), which is only linked from the disambiguation page Last Battle and redirects to History of Arda#First Age (current version) which concludes with a paragraph that refers to the War of Wrath but describes the Dagor Dagorath. Have the Dagor Dagorath and the War of Wrath been conflated there? (And where should the redirects actually point?) I've re-read Letter 131 just now, and I think the current description at History of Arda is wrong, so I will pop a comment on the talk page over there. Carcharoth (talk) 20:28, 31 January 2021 (UTC)

Good work. Yes, there are more verses in the anthologies. Chiswick Chap (talk) 20:31, 31 January 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Virabhadrasana

The article Virabhadrasana you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Virabhadrasana for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Whiteguru -- Whiteguru (talk) 05:01, 1 February 2021 (UTC)

Artefact deposition patterns

I don't know who wrote "artefact deposition patterns" into the article. But I'm pretty sure they were referring to my 2015 book about how Bronze Age people in a part of Sweden decided where in the landscape it was appropriate to deposit bronze objects and stone axes. This is part of a style of research known as landscape archaeology. Martin Rundkvist (talk) 13:36, 1 February 2021 (UTC)

Thanks Martin! Chiswick Chap (talk) 13:57, 1 February 2021 (UTC)

There's two "deposited" in a row now. Otherwise a good wording. Martin Rundkvist (talk) 14:27, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

Woops, sorted. Many thanks, Chiswick Chap (talk) 14:30, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

Great, glad that's sorted out. Chiswick Chap, is there anything else you think we need to do before taking to mainspace? There are a few comments here that we could possibly work in. The one that I think is most important of them is demonstrating notability in the lead. --Usernameunique (talk) 22:39, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

I see you incorporated some of those comments, such as deleting the suburbs—makes sense. Anything else you think bears doing/incorporating, or should we rock and roll? --Usernameunique (talk) 19:21, 6 February 2021 (UTC)

I'm ready to roll. The article has a ton of reliable secondary sources. Chiswick Chap (talk) 19:30, 6 February 2021 (UTC)

Sweet. I made a couple more edits to the lead; I'll give it a final readthrough and then (probably in the next 30 minutes) move it over and nominate it. --Usernameunique (talk) 21:21, 6 February 2021 (UTC)

Boom! --Usernameunique (talk) 22:20, 6 February 2021 (UTC)

I can feel the tension. Breathe! I've linked him to Swedish Wiki, too. Chiswick Chap (talk) 22:20, 6 February 2021 (UTC)

It does feel a bit like we're waiting for the other shoe to drop, doesn't it? But I doubt there's another article that I've helped write that has seen as much fine tuning before being taken to mainspace—hopefully our preparation pays off. --Usernameunique (talk) 00:56, 7 February 2021 (UTC)

Elros

Hello again! As I thought there should be a "content" of some kind assigned here to this name of a major legendarium character – do you have an idea how to create this lemma? (Redirect to Eärendil and Elwing maybe?) Sorry for bothering. Best wishes--Hildeoc (talk) 12:26, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

Yes, it's probably the best target. Chiswick Chap (talk) 12:27, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

Thanks, that was quick. Now, honestly, would you personally say it's better to leave it red or make that redirect then? What do you think?--Hildeoc (talk) 12:35, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

No, make a redirect to there. Chiswick Chap (talk) 12:36, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

Youtube interview

I can only assume you've seen this but if not, I would recommend; a thoroughly enjoyable video. Aza24 (talk) 20:21, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

Entertaining! Chiswick Chap (talk) 22:03, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

SCOP formalism

In case this discussion interests you, as you have voted keep in the past at the first AfD and have contributed some media: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/SCOP formalism (2nd nomination). Thanks, —PaleoNeonate – 05:31, 4 February 2021 (UTC)

Bird migration

Thank you for clarifying Stanford113 (talk) 14:57, 5 February 2021 (UTC)

TFL notification: LWT to appear on front page on 26 February 2021

Hi, Chiswick Chap. I'm just posting to let you know that London Wildlife Trust – a list that you have been heavily involved with – has been chosen to appear on the Main Page as Today's featured list for February 26. The TFL blurb can be seen here. If you have any thoughts on the selection, please post them on my talk page or at TFL talk. Regards, Giants2008 (Talk) 23:27, 5 February 2021 (UTC)

Language and Human Nature

Language and Human Nature. Spotted while browsing the templates. Had never heard of this! Also, it doesn't have an M-e WikiProject tag. Shock horror! :-) Carcharoth (talk) 21:52, 6 February 2021 (UTC)

An elegant curiosity. But it's nothing whatever to do with Middle-earth... Chiswick Chap (talk) 21:58, 6 February 2021 (UTC)

I was being slightly facetious as there are a number of articles tagged that way that are nothing to do with Middle-earth. Was just re-reading the excellent article on poetry in LotR. It is still very good! I was also trying to get more of a feel for the templates. The categories seem split slightly between the Tolkien ones and the navigational Middle-earth ones (by which I mean Category:WikiProject Middle-earth templates or more precisely Category:WikiProject Middle-earth article templates seems separate from Category:Middle-earth navigational boxes or more generally Category:Middle-earth templates). Is the overview here up-to-date? I guess what I am saying is that we have Template:Tolkien, Template:Tolkien Ensemble and Template:J. R. R. Tolkien in one category (the 'WikiProject Middle-earth article templates' one), and Template:Hobbit, Template:Languages of Middle-earth, Template:The Lord of the Rings & The Hobbit film series, Template:The Lord of the Rings, Template:Middle-earth, Template:Middle-earth films, Template:Middle-earth video games, Template:Tolkien tourism, and Template:J. R. R. Tolkien in the other category (the 'Middle-earth navigational boxes' one). I'm tempted to move all the 'Wikiproject article-related' ones to the Middle-earth navigational boxes, just so everything is in one place. In fact, I'll do that now. Carcharoth (talk) 08:26, 7 February 2021 (UTC) That has left Category:WikiProject Middle-earth article templates empty now. Carcharoth (talk) 08:35, 7 February 2021 (UTC)

Yes. I think "Middle-earth" should be restricted to articles that deal with Hobbit, LOTR, Silmarillion, Legendarium; and the same should go for WP Middle-earth, for the same reason. Thank you for kind words about Poetry. Chiswick Chap (talk) 09:08, 7 February 2021 (UTC)

Your reverts

Hi, I must say I find some of your "hypercorrect" reverts somewhat annoying and impolite (including the sometimes really exaggerated wording of your edit summaries, such as "aargh" etc., as if I were a stupid vandal or something), to tell the truth – like this one, for instance: Why exactly do you think that comma would "break the sense"?!--Hildeoc (talk) 00:20, 10 February 2021 (UTC)

I agree 100% with Chiswick Chap in this case: the comma is completely unnecessary (why would you even put it in?), and the brackets around the ellipses are no more indicative of the editorial pen than the ellipses themselves. Ellipses without brackets is standard typography. -- Elphion (talk) 02:09, 10 February 2021 (UTC)

Thanks, Elphion. Perhaps this is yet another British English thing, but yes, moving the comma did indeed break the sense. The groan relates mainly to those other editors who make many very small edits, believing in good faith they are being constructive, but every now and again turning things upside down. For the record, you are definitely not one of those. Chiswick Chap (talk) 08:39, 10 February 2021 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Original Barnstar
	Congratulations on getting Beowulf to good article status! A major undertaking, from which many readers will benefit. Alarichall (talk) 15:56, 11 February 2021 (UTC)

Alaric, that's really sweet of you! I had fun doing it. Good to hear from you. Chiswick Chap (talk) 16:16, 11 February 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Tolkien's maps

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Tolkien's maps you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Hog Farm -- Hog Farm (talk) 18:43, 17 February 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Tolkien's maps

The article Tolkien's maps you nominated as a good article has been placed on hold . The article is close to meeting the good article criteria, but there are some minor changes or clarifications needing to be addressed. If these are fixed within 7 days, the article will pass; otherwise it may fail. See Talk:Tolkien's maps for issues which need to be addressed. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Hog Farm -- Hog Farm (talk) 19:02, 17 February 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Tolkien's maps

The article Tolkien's maps you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Tolkien's maps for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Hog Farm -- Hog Farm (talk) 22:05, 17 February 2021 (UTC)

Hi!

How do I edit the References section of the article Adûnaic? It's ME-referenced... --ExperiencedArticleFixer (talk) 11:22, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

I've no idea why you'd want to, as the citations are valid? ME-ref is (of course) a template, and while it's not exactly deprecated, it's not ideal as it makes for maximum repetition of citation data. Editing them doesn't make a lot of sense unless one has the sources to hand to check and ideally to extend the citations in detail and to further pages. So, again, I've no idea what you may be trying to achieve, but the key fact is that the articles are very little in need of polishing and much in need of better sourcing; and any polishing will be swept away by fuller updating with better sourcing. Chiswick Chap (talk) 11:26, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

I just want to add the spaces in J. R. R.. --ExperiencedArticleFixer (talk) 11:29, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

Template:ME-ref/POME would be Peoples of Middle-earth, for instance. Chiswick Chap (talk) 12:04, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

Thanks! --ExperiencedArticleFixer (talk) 13:18, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

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A Companion to J. R. R. Tolkien

Thanks for expanding this. If you could add about 100 more words, it would qualify for a DYK. I can add infobox as my part and will take care of the nomination. What do you say? --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 03:18, 25 February 2021 (UTC)

Piotrus - OK, I'll see if I can rustle something up this morning! Chiswick Chap (talk) 09:06, 25 February 2021 (UTC)

Chiswick Chap, Sure. If you need help accessing the academic reviews, let me know. Most of them are probably in Library Genesis... _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 09:16, 25 February 2021 (UTC)

Piotrus All done. Chiswick Chap (talk) 10:10, 25 February 2021 (UTC)

Harbhajan Singh Khalsa

---

Hello Chiswick Chap,

So, I have questions for you.

Almost the entire historical information in the Wiki entry on Yogi Bhajan has been generated from his own words or his own words as repeated by his faithful students. If you look at the sources of the core content, they are almost all written by 'Something Something Singh Khalsa' or 'Something Something Kaur Khalsa'. These are all the given names of 3HO cult members. There is no daylight between what the Yogi said and what they repeat. Guru Fatha Singh Khalsa, a frequent editor of this page, wrote an almost 1,000 page book (Messenger from the Guru's House - it is cited in the footnote. Check it out if you are having trouble sleeping) on Bhajan without a SINGLE WORD OF CRITICISM. Guru Fatha Singh Khalsa is not what I, or anyone not in the 3HO cult, would call a 'good academic'. Read some of his output, or take a look at his web site. That foundation, devotees spewing group dogma, for much of the material does not seem to be a reliable source to build a good and balanced encyclopedia entry on.

If Bhajan is the pathological liar, exploiter of his follower and serial sexual abuser that it is now evident he was, why is the AOB Report, or even the 1977 Time Magazine article any less compelling than the content that Guru Fatha Singh Khalsa and other dogmatic followers post? Why can't this material be front and center? Why is it more balanced to base it on 'the official version' as provided by group members. Why is that any more legitimate? This is such a conservative approach to the Wikipedia entry on Bhajan.

I encourage you to read the actual AOB Report. No less than 30 women came forward with stories of horrendous exploitation at the hands (and teeth) of Yogi Bhajan. This is not some mass hysteria. Their stories were given independently and the patterns of sexual abuse by Bhajan match up. He was a biter of their private parts. He hit the women in the face. He was into degrading sex with vulnerable women.

To get an idea of where he created Kundalini Yoga from, read Philip Deslippe's account (unlike Guru Fatha Singh Khalsa, Deslippe is an actual historian) of how Bhajan changed his story of his 'golden chain' lineage. Bhajan lied about many things, including having invented both Kundalini Yoga and White Tantric Yoga. He lied about being designated the "Siri Singh Sahib" of the Western Hemisphere.

I would really like to know how to have these documented and well researched versions of Bhajan's story take prominence and have the stories of his abuse be brought back from the footnotes. Right now, it feels like someone is tending the garden and hiding all the truth under the compost pile. A casual reader is not going to get that there is a real problem with Bhajan.

So my question is, what do I have to do to get my edits to stick. What am I doing wrong? Also is there a method of having Guru Fatha Singh Khalsa, and other known devotees of Yogi Bhajan banned from editing this article? They are clearly in a conflict of interest position.

-an anonymous contributor.

---

— Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:569:79E2:CC00:8436:FF7A:5CC4:C1B3 (talk) 04:32, 28 February 2021 (UTC)

Thanks. I was in a rush. I had not noticed that the earlier ref to the Thompson Report had been deleted. They really did a lot of revisions in the last couple of days. I think the article is back to being objective and referenced. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 142.182.150.237 (talk) 21:31, 26 February 2021 (UTC)

Look, I am a good academic and I can keep balanced. The reason I removed the reference to "more likely than true" allegations is because the allegations against Harbhajan Singh Khalsa are potentially criminal in nature and "more likely than not is" is the standard for lesser, civil litigation, the standard for criminal litigation being "beyond a reasonable doubt."

It is amateurish to conflate the two as the authors of the AOB Report cited in the various media mentioned in the article have done. In reality, for the people posting that bit on the article, it is also a matter of wanting to cause harm to the reputation of Harbhajan Singh Khalsa. That is why I removed the text with the following reference to the Thompson Report at the bottom: "Ms. Thompson points out: "Many of the behaviors Yogi Bhajan is alleged to have committed are criminal in nature. The "preponderance of the evidence" standard as used in the AOB Report for the burden of proof ("more likely than not") is appropriate only in civil actions. The standard of proof required in criminal trials is "beyond a reasonable doubt.""

22:10, 26 February 2021 (UTC)

Please sign your postings. It was absolutely unacceptable to remove the "more likely than not" finding. The report could not substitute for a criminal inquiry as the subject was dead, so that is a smokescreen; all a posthumous inquiry can do is to examine the evidence and report on it fairly. The long paragraph of legalese was unacceptably one-sided and should not have gone into (wholly inappropriate for an encyclopedia) legalese. Chiswick Chap (talk) 22:19, 26 February 2021 (UTC)

/* Harbhajan Singh Khalsa */ Thanks Chiswick Chap for being kind in helping me to understand how to cite and edit properly. I have much to learn. I have been focused on this one particular matter because I believe a neutral entry should include both sides. I have been frustrated by any mention of the AOB report the sexual allegations including media links kept getting deleted unfairly and with a person with bias intent. I was doing my best with my very basic skills to restore some balance and neutral statement of the facts. I still have much to learn. Thanks to you Chiswick I am now using visual editor so I already am doing a better job. I do read your considerate explanation and hope to learn how to be more brief when adding content. I appreciate that you came and edited the Harbhajan page as you corrected my errors and others and settled the issue of unfair or biased deletes which have been happening on this page for months. I have diverse interests so I hope to learn to edit properly and be concise. Not quite there yet Netal2001 (talk) 23:11, 26 February 2021 (UTC)

I appreciate the open sharing. The version of the article I found a few minute ago indicated there were some unanswered questions, so I did my best to answer them as succinctly as possible. I hope you find the article as it stands to be be reasonable.

If you have the time, I recommend you read the Thompson Report. https://fairinvestigation.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/01/The-Thompson-Report.pdf There is no smokescreen. Even when subjects are dead, they deserve representation in any serious investigation. Moreover, while the accused may be deceased, allegations against them are hurtful to surviving family members and associates, so justice still requires a high bar, as in a) certainty in "beyond a reasonable doubt" and b) transparency in who the individual accusers are what they are alleging. Thanks for giving this your time. Guru Fatha Singh Khalsa (talk) 01:36, 27 February 2021 (UTC)

I'm glad there won't be any smokescreen. The basic point is that very serious allegations have certainly been made, and two reports have been written. These facts at least must be reported in the article. Beyond that, the allegations and the reports may, indeed should, be briefly and neutrally summarized, without putting any of the findings in Wikipedia's voice. Chiswick Chap (talk) 08:30, 27 February 2021 (UTC)

Indeed, the behaviors that Yogi Bhajan is alleged to have committed are criminal in nature and therefore very serious indeed. And indeed, two reports have been written: one a biased survey of questionable methodology based on anonymous allegations and the other a professional investigation of the former. These should indeed be reported in the article. The difficulty is when the article in our much loved and respected Wikipedia cites the conclusion of the sham AOB investigation as though it were an objective outcome of an actual professional investigation, as stated: "The report stated that the allegations were found on investigation to be 'more likely than not' true."

Please allow me to cite from you the relevant sections of the Thompson Report:

The AOB Report was intended to be an "investigative" report (subtitle)

...The AOB Report states, "...this is not a legal investigation; it is not intended to gather facts for a cases that would be tried in a court of law. Rather, it is intended to report An Olive Branch's findings as to whether it it more likely than not that Yogi Bhajan engaged in sexual and related misconduct." (citation) While the AOB took some care to indicate that the Report was not investigative in nature, in nonetheless reports the results of its "investigation," and the conclusion that it is "more likely than not" that Yogi Bhajan engaged in the alleged conduct.

On the other hand, the AOB Report goes to come length to give itself the imprimatur of a professional investigation. The Los Angeles Magazine article refers to the AOB Report as an investigation into whether the alleged behaviors of Yogi Bhajan did occur. In the news article announcing the AOB Report, it was referred to as an "investigation." The Los Angeles Magazine article discloses that the sexual allegations against Yogi Bhajan "...are likely true, according to a report released August 13, 2020 by An Olive Branch..." Siri Singh Sahib Corporation announced that it was launching an "independent investigation into allegations" and hiring An Olive Branch on March 9, 2020. (citation) The AOB Report was completed and is dated August 10, 2020. (p. 9)

"More likely than not" was the wrong standard to use in this investigation (subtitle)

Many of the behaviors that Yogi Bhajan is alleged to have committed are criminal in nature.(citation) The "preponderance of the evidence" standard as used in the AOB Report for burden of poof ("more likely than not") is appropriate only in civil actions. The standard of proof required in criminal trials is "beyond a resaonable doubt."(citation)

What does "more likely than not" refer to? In any case where a person or the state makes a claim against another person, the determination begins with the scales of justice being equal. (Recall the statue of the Lady of Justice holding scales that are even) If, after all of the information presented is considered by a decision-maker, the scale on one side moves just one percent, that is more likely than not that it did happen or more likely than not that it did not happen - a one percent difference change.

That standard is used in most cases where someone sues another person such as in an automobile accident where the issue is whether the person is accused of being negligent (not yielding to oncoming traffic, for example). When the claim is more serious, the standard requires more than a one percent change. In fraud cases, for example, the standard is that there must be "clear and convincing" evidence that fraud happened, an approximately 75 percent surety that it did occur.

The most serious cases are criminal cases where the defendant can be incarcerated for life or even given the death penalty. There the standard is that the evidence must prove "beyond a reasonable doubt" that the person committed the crime, or an approximately 95 percent certainty that he did it.

In this matter, the standard for labeling Yogi Bhajan a rapist and pedophile must be greater than "more likely than not." Since the allegations against him constitute some of the most serious crimes that can be committed, the correct standard must be "beyond a reasonable doubt." (p. 12)

Based on the above insights provided by the Thompson Report, I suggest that either: a) the sentence "The report stated that the allegations were found on investigation to be 'more likely than not' true." remain, but be balanced by a brief explanation of why "beyond a reasonable doubt" was not the appropriate standard of evidence in this case, or b) that the sentence be removed entirely. Thanks for taking the time to read and consider the merits of this lengthy missive.

Guru Fatha Singh Khalsa (talk) 02:55, 28 February 2021 (UTC)

Given that the law does not allow dead people to be tried in a criminal court case the idea that the standard is “beyond a reasonable doubt”in examining the sexual abuse allegations is incorrect. The flaws are the responsibility of the SSSC Board of directors including the three that designed. They are the ones the created the terms of references. Those flaws do not remove the facts that these sexual abuse allegations exist.The term “more likely than not” was used in the report precisely because there will never be a determination in a criminal court of law “beyond a reasonable doubt” The continued repeated deletion of the facts and citations around the allegations are not neutral edits. There are a number of civil lawsuits being prepared and eventually they will reach the courts. The verdicts in these civil actions will also not be “ beyond a reasonable doubt” either. Again because the accused is dead.

Many of those making the allegations as well as their supporters wanted a licensed law firm to conduct the investigation. The SSSC board disregard these requests and chose An Olive Branch.

Frankly the idea that the report criticizing a report on sexual abuse get more space is not balanced or neutral either.

If these deletions continued, I guess I will be forced to learn the Wikipedia process of reporting continue biased deletions of any mention of the sexual abuse allegations which even the Yoga Organization the accused founded ( and which commissioned and created the terms of reference for the AOB report) has reluctantly accepted the findings and is in process of significant internal changes.

Netal2001 (talk) 09:53, 28 February 2021 (UTC)

This talk page isn't the right place for discussions of article content, we should use its talk page. However, clearly "beyond reasonable doubt" is inapplicable for any inquiry as it can't be a criminal court. Chiswick Chap (talk) 10:03, 28 February 2021 (UTC)

Skald

Thanks for your input. Considering the good state of the article, I was actually wondering who would possibly defend a ref tag, and you answered it at once. I think it is an important article, and since you know enough about the topic, and care enough about it to insist that it needs more references, I would appreciate if you could help out by adding them. Thanks in advance! :-)--Berig (talk) 07:05, 1 March 2021 (UTC)

I might or might not be able, willing, or have the time to work on that article; I am certainly not an expert on the Skaldic tradition; but anybody who casts an eye over the article, as one is required to do before removing such a tag, will see at once that the article remains under-cited. Chiswick Chap (talk) 09:35, 1 March 2021 (UTC)

Verifiability is not about having every single line provided with a ref. The point of the policy is to avoid having original research in the article. It "requires inline citations for any material challenged or likely to be challenged", and note challenged and likely to be challenged, here. This is exactly why your revert surprises me. You say "I am certainly not an expert on the Skaldic tradition", but if I am to assume good faith by your revert, I have to deduct that you find material that is "likely to be challenged" in it. Please, point out the controversial parts, because reverting is not something I do with established editors. Likewise, I take for granted that an editor who reverts me has a better answer than the one you have provided so far. Let us be constructive here, and leave the article in a better shape. What parts look likely to be challenged?--Berig (talk) 11:06, 1 March 2021 (UTC)

I've challenged it, that is enough. But there are entire sections uncited, I'm astonished you think that's acceptable: I do not accept it. The lists contain literally dozens of uncited claims, substantiated only by bluelinks to Wikipedia, which is "not a reliable source", as you certainly know. Also, there are entirely uncited paragraphs. Basta. Chiswick Chap (talk) 11:15, 1 March 2021 (UTC)

Actually, the tag was totally correct all those years ago, and I'm actually angry that you're arguing that half-cited articles are acceptable. Wikipedia is reliable ONLY insofar as it can be verified; all unverified claims are ... what? - at best unknown quantities, at worst Original Research, Hoax, Nonsense, Confusion. In short: the entire enterprise stands or falls on the quality of its sources. Anything unsourced is garbage. Do I think that matters? YES! I believe that passionately. If you don't, I really don't know why you'd bother to edit - why would anyone want to tend a pile of WP:OR? Clearly, we, the whole project, is about telling the truth, indeed, speaking verifiable truth to power, and that truth includes history, religion, mythology, science, literature, art, politics, the whole bit. Is all this important? Of course it is, nothing we can do matters more than opposing falsehood and "fake news" everywhere and in everything. Do we need to show we can verify our claims? You bet we do. It's what makes us different from the fake noos-mongers, who can't verify anything. Chiswick Chap (talk) 11:27, 1 March 2021 (UTC)

Well, if you find so much of the article to be likely to be challenged, then we should keep your tag. Best,--Berig (talk) 12:11, 1 March 2021 (UTC)

Yes. Actually several of its "refs" are just dictionary definitions. I'm adding some material to the related scop, which may perhaps lead to some work on skald at some point. Chiswick Chap (talk) 12:15, 1 March 2021 (UTC)

I have been thinking of using the massive Skaldic Poetry of the Scandinavian Middle Ages website as a source.--Berig (talk) 12:23, 1 March 2021 (UTC)

Good idea. Chiswick Chap (talk) 13:00, 1 March 2021 (UTC)

Chiswick Chap, @Berig: It seems to me that the problem is that the article contains two lists: of poems and of notable skalds. Both are justifiable. I've checked, and our article List of skalds is intended to be comprehensive (it's taken from the Skaldic Poetry of the Scandinavian Middle Ages project rather than Skjaldedigtning as I first suspected; same difference), while the section, as a hidden note says, includes only those with Wikipedia articles (and should probably be updated using the category to find newer articles, such as Steinunn Refsdóttir). The list of poems may have replaced an independent article, because the history at Skaldic poems (which redirects to a section characterising the genre rather than to the list section) begins with a mention of deletion. That section should be trivial to reference, although I suspect a better approach would be to add a referenced sentence or two about the existence of long skaldic poems. However, referencing the list of notable skalds would involve festooning the section with repetitive references to the various published overviews, and I'm afraid I disagree about the Skaldic Poetry project, since that is intended to be comprehensive. (By the way, that article needs updating; the new edition has been published.) Wikipedia formerly accepted the validity of lists within an article that aggregated items on which we had Wikipedia articles; compare the criteria for inclusion of notable people within an article on a locality: either the person has a Wikipedia article at which their connection with the place is documented, or they have a Wikipedia article but their connection with the place is not referenced there, in which case it needs a reference in the locality article, or they might merit an article and the redlink or unlinked name is referenced at the locality article. The lists in the Skald article meet the first condition. This is not at the core of my academic competence, and in particular I am completely unqualified to mess with the content on poetic meters, but a quick reading suggests the article could do with a brush-up; it appears to be presenting a hard and fast distinction between skaldic and eddic styles that is generally accepted to be quite fuzzy, and I don't see a clear statement that it's a modern, academic distinction. I don't have access to Straubhaar's Old Norse Women's Poetry: The Voices of Female Skalds, that library in my interlibrary-loan network has not yet resumed participation (or I would probably already have improved Steinunn's article), but I do have both Turville-Petre's and Hollander's commented translations of selections, plus a number of literary histories, and Kock's updated edition of the corpus (holy ****, Den norsk-islandske skjaldedigtning is a red-link both here and on is., that is shameful) as well as Corpus Poeticum Boreale (why am I not surprised), so I propose to do a partial rewrite beefing up the nerdiness of the references and making both lists into subsections where it will be clear that they derive from the referenced scholarship. Berig, you will then of course wince at some of what I've done, especially under etymology, and make it better. And hopefully someone else has Straubhaar's book. Does that sound like a plan to you both? If I do it, it will involve several hours of rewriting and previewing, so I wanted to ask before possibly edit conflicting or, worse, learning that you disagree with the wisdom of that approach to keeping the lists. Yngvadottir (talk) 00:13, 3 March 2021 (UTC)

Really nice to hear from you, Yngvadottir, and yes, it sounds very much like a plan. Chiswick Chap (talk) 08:53, 3 March 2021 (UTC)

@Yngvadottir:, I agree with Chiswick Chap. I would really appreciate if you improved the article, and if I should find something I think should be modified, I will do my best to help out!--Berig (talk) 13:49, 3 March 2021 (UTC)

Great, I shall give it a try. Sorry it's taking me so long to carve out a block of time. Yngvadottir (talk) 09:57, 4 March 2021 (UTC)

Ok, Chiswick Chap and Berig, I think I'm done. As I said, this is not one of my core competences, but I think it's better than it was, and I kept the German references to two :-) There is a marked divergence between how the skalds are seen from a Norwegian point of view as court poets and how they're seen in sagas about Icelanders, where they do a whole lot more than praise the powerful. And it was surprisingly hard to nail down when the tradition ended, and I never did find out how many skalds are listed in Skáldatal. But I did my best to reflect the sources, including the relatively recent emphasis on women poets as such, and the only place where I really nerded out was on the Hlaðir jarls. I cut back the Norwegian encyclopaedias to one but kept the Chicago lecture. I wound up using American English but keeping the spelling "metre", and with sadness, treated the Icelandic patronymics as last names in following refs. I hope it isn't too horrible. Yngvadottir (talk) 12:39, 12 March 2021 (UTC)

Þakka þér kærlega fyrir! Chiswick Chap (talk) 12:45, 12 March 2021 (UTC)

Excellent!--Berig (talk) 12:58, 12 March 2021 (UTC)

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Summaries

Hello. I have noticed that you often edit without using an edit summary. Please do your best to always fill in the summary field. This helps your fellow editors use their time more productively, rather than spending it unnecessarily scrutinizing and verifying your work. Even a short summary is better than no summary, and summaries are particularly important for large, complex, or potentially controversial edits. Thanks! Walter Görlitz (talk) 16:32, 3 March 2021 (UTC)

You must be thinking of somebody else, as I'm rather careful with edit summaries. The last 100 edits that I've done, for instance, all have them. Chiswick Chap (talk) 16:38, 3 March 2021 (UTC)

Terribly sorry. I see that the gutting of an article was all fully explained, primarily in short form comments. Walter Görlitz (talk) 16:49, 3 March 2021 (UTC)

That's very kind of you to reply so handsomely, thank you. Chiswick Chap (talk) 16:50, 3 March 2021 (UTC)

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Turtle

I'll get back to you to do turtle. Right now, I want to make sure beaver passes this time. LittleJerry (talk) 19:20, 6 March 2021 (UTC)

Ok no beaver jokes then... Chiswick Chap (talk) 21:25, 6 March 2021 (UTC)

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John Richard Clark Hall

Hey there, just thought I'd drop a line and see if you'd be interested in giving this article another look as part of its FAC nomination. It could use a set of eyes at this point, and, certainly, you probably know more about the subject than anyone else on here. With that said, no worries if you've got too much on your plate already! Cheers, --Usernameunique (talk) 07:40, 13 March 2021 (UTC)

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No need to manually archive ...

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:J._R._R._Tolkien&curid=21967427&diff=1010602705&oldid=1010067995 is unnecessary as there is a bot present to do the archiving. Unless there's a good reason to manually archive before the thresholds are met, please do not do so. Walter Görlitz (talk) 06:01, 14 March 2021 (UTC)

Noted. Chiswick Chap (talk) 09:31, 14 March 2021 (UTC)

Mind you, I had just done a major rework of the article, so many of the old comments were made obsolete - if ever there was a good time for archiving, this was it. Chiswick Chap (talk) 17:17, 19 March 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of The Lord of the Rings: film versus book

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Irene Papas

@Chiswick Chap: Hello. I believe that the recent addition on the Irene Papas article is a step towards the wrong direction. My advice would be to add a WP:WHITELOCK. Right now we are essentially disregarding all the old rv we have performed on the subject. This information is trivial and not facts after all, neither her maternal and paternal towns/villages are associated with Arvanites. Irene Papas made a hypothetical statement once, just like she has also stated jokingly that she is both Romia (feminine form of "Romios"; medieval name of the Greeks) and Roman (due to having a second residence in Rome). I don't think such information should be included in the article to gratify a small minority. Demetrios1993 (talk) 14:58, 17 March 2021 (UTC)

Thank you for your opinion. I exactly haven't included it to gratify the POV minority: I've added it to stop them causing constant hassle and adding uncited claims, i.e. it's there to take the wind out of their sails. Do hope this is clear. By the way, the article already has pending changes protection. I suppose we could ask for semi-protection but I doubt it'd be granted here. Chiswick Chap (talk) 16:19, 17 March 2021 (UTC)

Ok, just noticed that it disappeared with that coding you placed. Also noticed her paternal surname that is mentioned there. A sidenote. It's one of those things that is actually exaggerated and comes up every time when i debate with that POV minority in other platforms about that very same subject. Lelekou comes from a Turkish word, not an Albanian one. Turkish leylek means stork, and it is used in Greek with the same meaning, as well as a Greek nickname that means tall man. In Greek we have words such as lelekas/λέλεκας and leleki/λελέκι. Furthermore, we find it as a surname with a number of versions, such as Lelekis/Λελέκης, Lelekas/Λελέκας, Lelekos/Λελέκος, Lelekakis/Λελεκάκης, Lelekopoulos/Λελεκόπουλος, etc.. From personal experience i can also tell you that it is found on the island of Kalymnos (eastern Aegean). Demetrios1993 (talk) 18:55, 17 March 2021 (UTC)

If you can find proof of the demography and etymology, it might help, though the work would be close to WP:Synthesis as far as the article is concerned unless it can be cited to a reliable source discussing Papas herself. Unfortunately in a world full of 'fake noos', I doubt the problem will go away any time soon. I suspect the best answer would still be a footnote explaining why the Albanian sources are no use, and semi-protection. Chiswick Chap (talk) 19:01, 17 March 2021 (UTC)

This is mostly shared as general information for your knowledge. By the way, i did share the etymology above. Her paternal surname comes from a very common Greek word that is a Turkish loanword. We also have demographic data about her paternal and maternal places of origin, namely Chiliomodi and Preveza respectively. They are listed as Greek settlements. For example, look at an ethnographic map from 1878 containing Preveza at the very southern tip of that colored map. The Pink color represents Greeks, Orange represents Greeks and Albanians, and Light Yellow represents Albanians. That's for her maternal side who was from Preveza. For her paternal side, who was from the village of Chiliomodi we have this map, with the Purple and Blue colors representing Greek-speaking populations, while Red representing Albanian-speaking populations. Even though Chiliomodi isn't listed on the map, by comparing between google maps and that old ethnographic map, you can see that it is located between the settlements of H. Vasilios (Agios Vasilios) and Athikion (Athikia), namely within a pocket of Greek-speaking villages surrounded by Albanian-speaking ones in northeastern Peloponnese. And that's how Papas' comment in that Italian interview is explained by the way, since she would be surrounded by albanophonic villages, but hers wasn't. Nonetheless she made a statement that wasn't in the slightest a fact, just an assumption based on her slightly darker skin color. As if Greek-speaking inhabitants and what used to be (very few exist today) Albanian-speaking inhabitants of Peloponnese are any different in appearance. They aren't. My own mother is from the very same region as her, and thus i know a lot about the different settlements. By the way, just to give you a perspective of that last map; it was published by Alfred Philippson who toured the Peloponnese in 1889 writing "Zur Ethnographie des Peloponnes, Pettersmans Mitteilungen" (1890). This author managed to count the Arvanites of the Peloponnese and the Hermione Islands (Hydra, Spetses, etc.) at 90,253, in a total population of 730,000 of the same area, or 12% of the total population and 9.5% of the Peloponnese. Anyway, even though i agree that the problem will hardly go away with this, let's leave the note. But, even though it is a note, at least the surname reference is obvious WP:OR/WP:SYNTHESIS and i don't see a reason to include it. Demetrios1993 (talk) 20:11, 17 March 2021 (UTC)

You're certainly right that all of that is unusable as it stands. Chiswick Chap (talk) 20:16, 17 March 2021 (UTC)

So, you are ok with the removal of the surname reference (lejleku) from the note? Demetrios1993 (talk) 20:43, 17 March 2021 (UTC)

Is that where you were trying to get to? Wow. Actually, Wikipedia articles are at liberty to provide etymology, of surnames or anything else; and it certainly isn't original research if reliably cited: the issue here is that it would be wrong, whatever the dictionary says (i.e. the Albanian word must derive from the other languages) if what you say is correct: but stating uncited "facts" without sources is, I repeat, no good whatsoever, on talk pages as well as in articles; and your talk of comparing maps is as pure OR as anything I've ever seen - Papas might have believed her father was Albanian for reasons other than his name, e.g. she may have half-recalled some childhood conversation about his family migrating across the border, we've no idea; so no matter how Greek his name it wouldn't prove his Greekness. I've removed the note as unsafe. Chiswick Chap (talk) 11:41, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for removing it. I know what i shared is deemed WP:OR, hence why i stated that this was mostly for your knowledge. I am not trying to add any of these to the article. In any case, i have only seen etymologies on articles that have to do with settlements or regions. If it ever came to it, here is a source i found from a blogspot (it is serious, but probably it will be disregarded as a mere blogspot) that deals with the etymologies of Greek surnames (i have already shared the relative information above). Papas' rationale most likely had to do with the fact that her father's Greek-speaking village was part of a pocket of villages that were surrounded (literally) by Arvanite-speaking villages, hence her statement (my father was perhaps from Albania. Maybe I am Albanian, or half Albanian. The Peloponnese is full of Albanians). Anyway, thanks again for your time and assistance. Sidenote: You gave me a slight impression that you were bothered by my comment. To clear things up, i didn't meant to appear confrontational, quite the opposite. Demetrios1993 (talk) 14:05, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

Sexuality in The Lord of the Rings

Hi there @Chiswick Chap: I genuinely did not have the intention of being condescending or rude in the Talk:Sexuality in The Lord of the Rings. I did not know that you were the prime author of the article, but only saw that you were addressing the needed improvements. Not that I doubted their notability or authority, but I thought that some authority ought to be mentioned. Did not intend for the boldface of those individuals to be interpreted as shouting or anything like that. Just hoping to improve the article and clear the air! I find the research very fascinating and an interesting read! PerpetuityGrat (talk) 20:02, 17 March 2021 (UTC)

Many thanks for the note, glad to hear it. Chiswick Chap (talk) 20:03, 17 March 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Christianity in Middle-earth

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Christianity in Middle-earth you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Vaticidalprophet -- Vaticidalprophet (talk) 08:41, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

DYK for A Companion to J. R. R. Tolkien

On 18 March 2021, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article A Companion to J. R. R. Tolkien, which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that the publication of A Companion to J. R. R. Tolkien in 2014 by Wiley-Blackwell has been described as proof that Tolkien had finally attained acceptance by the literary establishment? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/A Companion to J. R. R. Tolkien. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page (here's how, A Companion to J. R. R. Tolkien), and if they received a combined total of at least 416.7 views per hour (ie, 5,000 views in 12 hours or 10,000 in 24), the hook may be added to the statistics page. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.

 — Amakuru (talk) 12:02, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Christianity in Middle-earth

The article Christianity in Middle-earth you nominated as a good article has been placed on hold . The article is close to meeting the good article criteria, but there are some minor changes or clarifications needing to be addressed. If these are fixed within 7 days, the article will pass; otherwise it may fail. See Talk:Christianity in Middle-earth for issues which need to be addressed. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Vaticidalprophet -- Vaticidalprophet (talk) 09:41, 21 March 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Christianity in Middle-earth

The article Christianity in Middle-earth you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Christianity in Middle-earth for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Vaticidalprophet -- Vaticidalprophet (talk) 09:41, 22 March 2021 (UTC)

Demerging

I have a perfect right to discuss policy issues. You do not need to get involved. This is hounding. You are not assuming good faith. Please stop this behaviour.--Jack Upland (talk) 21:56, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

You, I, and every man have that right. As for the rest of what you've just said, nonsense. We discussed the question at Goldberry and Haleth pinged me (see for yourself, it's there in the record) at the obviously-related Village Pump discussion you are talking about, so I joined in: I have very little interest in policy and I hardly ever join such timewasting discussions, preferring to get on with creating and developing articles, as you well know: over 75% of my edits are in article space. I've no idea where else you're talking about policy and I'm not interested. That is not hounding and you have no right whatsoever to make allegations of that kind, nor to tell me to stop, on the basis of exactly no evidence: that would indeed be a clear example of bad faith, but it's yours, not mine. Chiswick Chap (talk) 22:09, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

And in turn, I was pinged to the discussion (just like I had been here) by Joe Roe, who in my opinion made the reasonable deduction that a discussion was started about a dispute over a unilateral decision by an editor (me) who boldly went against local consensus (a weak one at that) to demerge the page, not long after you made the same points on the Goldberry talk page and the discussion took a turn for the unpleasant. Jack Upland, it is troubling that you are accusing others of not assuming good faith, when you have clearly made incivil remarks against others in this talk page or the discussion ones. Haleth (talk) 01:12, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Wikipedia's 20th birthday!

... and a billion edits ...

Your GA nomination of Balrog

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Balrog you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Casliber -- Casliber (talk) 19:40, 21 March 2021 (UTC)

Revert

First off, thank you for all of your work on Wikipedia articles.

I will be referring to this revert of yours.

Your full statement for that edit was: "See also: not really; there's no danger of actual confusion, and there are numerous other beasties with vague resemblances or names with the s-word in them. If you think there's a confusion issue then a cited paragraph with photo would be in order"

However, I am currently only interested in this part of your statement: "If you think there's a confusion issue then a cited paragraph with photo would be in order"

Can you please show where Wikipedia's guidelines state this. I checked MOS:SEEALSO and MOS:NAVLIST and neither mentions anything like "cited paragraph with photo would be in order". Thank you.Mgkrupa 23:27, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

All I'm saying is that a decent bit of article text would be much better than a see also list. Arguments from policy always go in circles because there are so many to choose from, but I note that per policy, whenever a see also item appears in the main text, the see also item is removed as a duplicate, i.e. the text takes precedence, as it should. I note also that no policy advocates listing unnecessary items, and I think this one falls into that category: Wikipedia isn't an identification guide. If it were really necessary to the sense of the article, then we'd want to have a short cited mention of it, as I said; we do this in zoology articles where confusion is frequent, not I think the case here. Chiswick Chap (talk) 09:19, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Arwen

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Arwen you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Guettarda -- Guettarda (talk) 23:40, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Arwen

The article Arwen you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Arwen for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Guettarda -- Guettarda (talk) 15:01, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Balrog

The article Balrog you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Balrog for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Casliber -- Casliber (talk) 14:01, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Peer review of John Thirtle

Ho, just to let you know that I have put forward John Thirtle (which you reviewed as a GAN) for a peer review, prior to nominating it as a Featured Article candidate. If you wish to add any comments or suggestions, please feel free! The link is Wikipedia:Peer review/John Thirtle/archive1. Regards, Amitchell125 (talk) 17:41, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Barrow-wight review

Hi, just want to make sure you saw that I started the Talk:Barrow-wight/GA1 review a couple days ago. Looks like the bot never alerted you here. -- RoySmith (talk) 19:02, 28 March 2021 (UTC)

Gosh, thanks! Indeed I knew nothing of it. Many thanks for taking it on: I'll get to it promptly. Chiswick Chap (talk) 20:44, 28 March 2021 (UTC)

Turtle FA

I'll start work on turtle soon. I have a few other things I'd like to take care of first. LittleJerry (talk) 00:03, 30 March 2021 (UTC)

Probably do it next week. I'm going work on tammar wallaby for the next couple days. LittleJerry (talk) 20:21, 1 April 2021 (UTC)

spiritual tourism

Hello...Religious tourism and spiritual tourism are two different topics, and articles and books specifically address the definition of each and the difference between the two. The article on religious spirituality discusses all these issues in one format, and I feel that it is necessary to create an independent article stating the characteristics of spiritual tourism and its difference from religious tourism...The best regards — Preceding unsigned comment added by Aye1399 (talk • contribs) 11:59, 6 April 2021 (UTC)

Nobody's stopping you. Chiswick Chap (talk) 13:46, 6 April 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for the brilliant welcome!

just wanted to say a massive thanks for inviting me to the community and for noticing my username! thanks a bunch and ill do my best to remember to put the 4 ~

--AncalagonTheBookworm (talk) 10:52, 8 April 2021 (UTC)

Commas

Hello hello. Good evening. Would you mind if I put the commas back on those church articles? Did you change your mind about the commas in the article for St Alban's Church, Acton Green, because you read MOS:COMMA?

Cheers, Overtone11 Overtone11 (talk) 17:43, 8 April 2021 (UTC)

The 3rd one you were correct. The other two were right as they were in British usage for Brit. churches. Remember that the MoS can only offer basic generalised guidance on common cases, not cover everything else. All the best, Chiswick Chap (talk) 19:56, 8 April 2021 (UTC)

I'm British, so I'm only going on what I know of British English. The style guides and punctuation and grammar books on my bookshelves say nothing about making an exception for the case you mention in the edit summary for St Alban's Church, that "‎that's its name". Could you flesh out your argument a bit because I may be misunderstanding you. Cheers, Overtone11

Thank you for reading the comment.

The first comma (often omitted) is part of the proper name of the church. The MoS does not mandate a comma between a name and the verb that follows it. Thus "St John's Smith Square", with comma or without, is the proper name of the institution and it is not followed by a comma --- i.e. there are different kinds of comma, and only those that delimit dependent clauses and the like need to be paired. Chiswick Chap (talk) 08:11, 9 April 2021 (UTC)

Translating Beowulf

I'm about to have a crack at reviewing your article. Thanks--it looks very interesting. Drmies (talk) 16:09, 10 April 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Translating Beowulf

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Translating Beowulf you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Drmies -- Drmies (talk) 16:21, 10 April 2021 (UTC)

explanation

on surya Namaskar you write: "The origins of Surya Namaskar are vague; Indian tradition connects the 17th century saint Samarth Ramdas with Surya Namaskar exercises, without defining what movements were involved."

i checked the quote and it did not define "what movements were involved". is that what you meant to say when you wrote "without defining what movements were involved"? Catchpoke (talk) 22:44, 10 April 2021 (UTC)

"without" in British usage indeed means the negative of "with". I'd always supposed this to be universal in English, how interesting to find it's seemingly not; but even if it's a tad unfamiliar, it's hard to imagine that anyone would suppose it meant "with". I think it might be better, if copy-editing is indeed needed (not very much, as my English is careful, and the article has been formally reviewed), if a British copy-editor were to attempt the task. Chiswick Chap (talk) 08:23, 11 April 2021 (UTC)

References

DYK for Martin Rundkvist

On 11 April 2021, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article Martin Rundkvist, which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that last summer, Martin Rundkvist discovered 22 gold foil figures (example pictured) while excavating a "Beowulfian" mead hall in Sweden? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Martin Rundkvist (2nd nomination). You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page (here's how, Martin Rundkvist), and if they received a combined total of at least 416.7 views per hour (i.e., 5,000 views in 12 hours or 10,000 in 24), the hook may be added to the statistics page. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.

Cwmhiraeth (talk) 00:01, 11 April 2021 (UTC)

Findhorn Ecovillage

Hi, we just got caught in an edit conflict and I'd just gotten through filling the meaty and complicated citation template so I felt forced to save it. Sorry for any inconvenience. Hope it can be fixed. 92.24.246.11 (talk) 19:16, 12 April 2021 (UTC)

No worries about the article. Welcome to Wikipedia! Always best to keep a copy in a subpage of your user page, or in a text or Word file, if doing anything very complicated - or just build it up in stages, of course. All the best, Chiswick Chap (talk) 19:18, 12 April 2021 (UTC)

Cheers! I've dipped in before, so it wasn't horribly complicated, but I often mess it up a few times before being able to save. :) Thanks for sorting it out. 92.24.246.11 (talk) 19:20, 12 April 2021 (UTC)

E-owulf

Chiswich Chap, Kiernan has gone free and online--the website has a lot of ins and outs and I haven't seen all of it, but here is the text. Note that the line numbering is different--he ends up with 3,184, I'm not exactly sure where he differs from the "standard" version that you had cited. Andy Orchard summarizes some of the arguments for and against emendation; a much-discussed passage is around line 389, where Wulfgar tells Beowulf he can come on in--maybe you can read this in Google Books. I don't know how far you are in your Beowulf studies but his book is a standard. Klaeber's edition is now in its fourth installment, redone by Bjork, Niles, Fulk. Citing that edition or Kiernan's is preferable to citing Slade's website. Take care, Drmies (talk) 21:18, 12 April 2021 (UTC)

Many thanks. I've added Kiernan. Luckily he offers a 'traditional' numbering mode so there's no tangle. Chiswick Chap (talk) 12:29, 14 April 2021 (UTC)

Turtle

I'm working on Indian roller for a couple days. I'd get back to you when I'm ready. We can use this subsection for coordination. LittleJerry (talk) 22:14, 12 April 2021 (UTC)

I'll get to turtle when we get the roller nominated for GA. LittleJerry (talk) 20:54, 22 April 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Translating Beowulf

The article Translating Beowulf you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Translating Beowulf for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Drmies -- Drmies (talk) 23:41, 12 April 2021 (UTC)

Publication date of Jansson's Gollum illustration

Hi! I was just reading our article on Gollum and was intrigued by the image File:Large Gollum by Tove Jansson.jpg. When I looked at the image page, though, I noticed that the publication date was given as 1979, but that date contradicts the accompanying article text, as well as the rest of the description of the image describing it as "early". I haven't read the earlier Hobbit that apparently didn't elaborate on Gollum's size and having seen the Bakshi film before reading either The Hobbit or The Lord of the Rings I never would have assumed him to be large, but his small size is mentioned (or at least assumed) many times in the latter novel, which was published more than twenty years before 1979, so I guess it's just a typo, but would you mind checking? Hijiri 88 (聖やや) 12:29, 14 April 2021 (UTC)

Yes, you're right. Jansson did the illustrations from 1960 for the 1962 Swedish edition Bilbo: En hobbits äventyr. Chiswick Chap (talk) 12:31, 14 April 2021 (UTC)

Thanks! Yeah, that's still later than the revised Hobbit and the first printing of LotR, but not by so much that it couldn't be assumed she was working with an earlier text; in 1960 I imagine the vast majority of Hobbit copies floating around were still the earlier one, and I'd hate to imagine an illustrator being required to read an as-yet-untranslated Two Towers (1959-1961?) to produce images for The Hobbit. Hijiri 88 (聖やや) 00:43, 15 April 2021 (UTC)

She certainly didn't; and the TT that you know incorporates JRRT's changes to make it clear that Gollum wasn't huge. Chiswick Chap (talk) 08:17, 15 April 2021 (UTC)

Yehudi lights

Hi, I noticed that you are responsible (according to "Who Wrote That?" tool) for the section of Yehudi lights which reads "Pilots noted that in a crosswind, the nose of the plane would not point directly at the enemy, but could be, say, 20 degrees off, to compensate for the wind. Since making the beams bright enough at such a wide angle was impracticable, pilots were instructed to fly on the curving approach path which keeps the nose pointed towards the enemy at all times, rather than a straight-line path with the nose pointed upwind."

I think this is interesting and I followed the links to the PDF referenced. What I found is that the strategy was much simpler than you make it sound. Instead of pilots being instructed to fly a specific curve (which would need to be plotted, I'm not sure how, and would vary as the crosswind varied) they were "instructed to 'home' on the target". This much simpler proposition than sticking to a curving approach path—essentially they're being told to disregard the crosswind and just keep the nose pointed at the target. The "slightly curved course" is a consequence of that simple rule. I think your wording implies that the pilots were told to follow a curved path, which would I suppose be practical (see Oboe (navigation)#Technical_details) but only if the desired path could be calculated/located easily and not be subject to change when the wind changed.

I didn't want to just jump in and reword your text. Let me know what you think. Theoh (talk) 00:52, 16 April 2021 (UTC)

Well spotted. I've turned the sentences around to make this clear. Chiswick Chap (talk) 09:12, 16 April 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Rivendell

The article Rivendell you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Rivendell for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Ardenter -- Ardenter (talk) 19:21, 21 April 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Rings of Power

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Rings of Power you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Guettarda -- Guettarda (talk) 03:00, 25 April 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Rings of Power

The article Rings of Power you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Rings of Power for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Guettarda -- Guettarda (talk) 12:21, 26 April 2021 (UTC)

Scorpion scheduled for TFA

This is to let you know that the above article has been scheduled as today's featured article for May 31, 2021. Please check that the article needs no amendments. A coordinator will draft a blurb - based on your draft if the TFA came via TFA requests, or for Featured Articles promoted recently from an existing blurb on the FAC talk page. Feel free to comment on this. We suggest that you watchlist Wikipedia:Main Page/Errors from the day before this appears on Main Page. Thanks and congratulations on your work. Gog the Mild (talk) 10:35, 27 April 2021 (UTC)

Salvaging.

> thanks for the thought...

-) You're right. Merge needed. Thought my rv would be correct from having looked at the edits I was reverting. (Re. https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?oldid=1019592890)--50.201.195.170 (talk) 21:36, 27 April 2021 (UTC)

But in your summary, you wrote "I already restored the one that was deleted". You actually restored one of the several that were deleted, most of which remain so.--50.201.195.170 (talk) 03:30, 1 May 2021 (UTC)

Ah, if that's so then the others will obviously need to be restored too. Chiswick Chap (talk) 04:18, 1 May 2021 (UTC)

Khraniteli

When I moved your hook for Khraniteli into the queue, I found it incomprehensible. So I changed it from

• ... that Tom Bombadil, dropped by Peter Jackson, appears in a Russian film of The Lord of the Rings?

to

• ... that the character Tom Bombadil, omitted by Peter Jackson in his later version, appears in a Russian film of The Lord of the Rings?

I am just mentioning it here in case you object to the change. Cwmhiraeth (talk) 06:01, 28 April 2021 (UTC)

Thank you! Chiswick Chap (talk) 07:19, 28 April 2021 (UTC)

DYK for Khraniteli

On 30 April 2021, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article Khraniteli, which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that the character Tom Bombadil, omitted by Peter Jackson in his later version, appears in a Russian film of The Lord of the Rings? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Khraniteli. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page (here's how, Khraniteli), and if they received a combined total of at least 416.7 views per hour (i.e., 5,000 views in 12 hours or 10,000 in 24), the hook may be added to the statistics page. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.

Cwmhiraeth (talk) 00:01, 30 April 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of The Silmarillion

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Your GA nomination of The Silmarillion

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Martin Rundkvist

Thoughts on nominating this article at FAC? At this point, I don't see how the article could be significantly improved. --Usernameunique (talk) 18:32, 12 May 2021 (UTC)

That's very bold. I don't think it's as straightforward a case as Clark Hall, but I'm glad that the article has made the transition from AfD case to FA candidate in your mind. If you're confident, why not. Chiswick Chap (talk) 18:36, 12 May 2021 (UTC)

It's bold, but I think the work we did put any good-faith arguments about notability to rest. In some respects, this article reminds me of Sutton Hoo Helmet (sculpture)—another AfD to FAC example—where I wasn't entirely confident about its chances at FAC (there, due to size; here, due to history), but where I ultimately nominated it because I thought it was at or close to the best possible version of itself. So fingers crossed, but I'll probably put this one up too. --Usernameunique (talk) 19:12, 12 May 2021 (UTC)

Excellent. Well I'll be happy to help. Chiswick Chap (talk) 20:30, 12 May 2021 (UTC)

Octopus sourcing

LittleJerry, Cwmhiraeth - the article has accreted a considerable volume of material since FAC, quite a lot of it cited to wobbly sources reporting on primary science a) for universities (i.e. the 'Harvard news' sort of science-based puffery) b) for popular science sites on the web c) for light magazines reporting on fascinating and disgusting science facts, from New Scientist (just about bearable) to Wired and worse d) books for the general public doing much the same. All of these, I think, would get a roasting at FAR, not a pretty thought. We ought to replace these with either the original primary science reports, or better, find scientific review articles or updated textbooks that discuss the findings in a decent secondary way. Chiswick Chap (talk) 08:36, 14 May 2021 (UTC)

I'm sure you're right. :) Cwmhiraeth (talk) 09:07, 14 May 2021 (UTC)

All contributions appreciated; good work all round. I've fixed a dozen of the worst of the atrocities. The Thomas Carefoot / A Snail's Odyssey source is borderline flaky, it'd be nice to get rid of its multiple appearances. Chiswick Chap (talk) 09:14, 14 May 2021 (UTC)

Thank you (again)

For the excellent work on Tolkien's legendarium and associated articles. I particularly enjoyed Tolkien and the modernists and Tolkien's frame stories. By the way, is your list of your Tolkien diagrams complete? I think this one is missing (and this one and this one), but maybe that is intentional? Carcharoth (talk) 09:29, 15 May 2021 (UTC)

Thanks, and I've added [the first one, edit conflict]... I fear that whereas getting LOTR to GA means a better experience for millions of readers every year, work on literary aspects of the legendarium may give pleasure to thee, me, and old Falstaff's dog... still, I'm glad there are three of us! Chiswick Chap (talk) 09:35, 15 May 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Errantry

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Your GA nomination of Errantry

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Turtle FA

Okay, I'm ready. I'm going to start on Anatomy and morphology. You can work on Taxonomy/Evolution. For cultural depictions, I think we should stick to examples given by general sources like this and [1] or peer-reviewed cultural articles. We probably shouldn't cherrypick a source that just happens to mention TMNT. See what I did for Wolf, Orangutan, Zebra and Beaver, for examples.

The book "Biology of Turtles" is available on zbooks. I could email you a file if needed. I also think we should use US English since there are no native species in the UK. But I promise we'll use UK English next time. LittleJerry (talk) 22:38, 2 May 2021 (UTC)

LittleJerry: Welcome back. I already did a chunk of work on phylogeny and culture back in, ah, December. On Culture, why don't you cut any sources you think inappropriate now, to show me what you mean exactly? I'll have another look soon. Chiswick Chap (talk) 09:10, 3 May 2021 (UTC)

I guess I could write the culture section. Could you work on a "Distribution and habitat" section. Lifecycle (egg-laying and growth) can be merged with reproduction ("Reproduction and lifecycle) and diet added to behavior. LittleJerry (talk) 18:04, 8 May 2021 (UTC)

OK, why don't we start like that, and then maybe we can switch about if we feel like doing a bit on the other sections...? Chiswick Chap (talk) 18:07, 8 May 2021 (UTC)

Should I continue to write for anatomy or wait for Brownkr to respond? LittleJerry (talk) 20:50, 8 May 2021 (UTC)

I think you continue, it'll probably work out. Students tend to sign up for multiple options, and there are choices both in this article and in other articles. If not, you can share your notes with him and do the culture etc instead. Chiswick Chap (talk) 21:04, 8 May 2021 (UTC)

I'm not sure I really want to wait for Brownkr to get to finishing the head subsection. Should we just work on the article wherever we want and let him decide what he can do? LittleJerry (talk) 17:41, 15 May 2021 (UTC)

LittleJerry: I guess so; it often happens that students do nothing until their deadline, then fire their section edits and forget – which doesn't really matter, if it's usable we use it, if not we don't. I think we just get on and see what happens. Chiswick Chap (talk) 17:58, 15 May 2021 (UTC)

LittleJerry: It's looking a bit better already... Chiswick Chap (talk) 12:06, 10 May 2021 (UTC)

LittleJerry I think we're OK to edit now tho not sure what that student is up to ... the bot rescued 2 of the refs ... maybe we can guess where he got the others from! I've fixed many small issues and have updated the phylogeny and written a bit on Culture and Conservation. Chiswick Chap (talk) 20:10, 11 May 2021 (UTC)

Okay then, but I would like to rewrite the Culture section. If that's okay. LittleJerry (talk) 20:16, 11 May 2021 (UTC)

Rewrite ... that's quite a word choice. The section has many reliably-cited and certainly relevant facts already. Revise, extend, reorganise even. Chiswick Chap (talk) 21:06, 11 May 2021 (UTC)

Well, I'm just not a fan of the sources. Like I said above I feel we should use general sources like this and this and look at examples they use, instead of cherrypicking from different online sources. Hog Farm and Nikkimaria have pointed out the problems with doing this. LittleJerry (talk) 23:28, 11 May 2021 (UTC)

LittleJerry: Hm, well, let's see what you come up with then. I feel however that the images are well-chosen and the text covers the right areas under basically the right headings. Chiswick Chap (talk) 07:18, 12 May 2021 (UTC)

I'll get back to culture later. For now, I'll work on feeding. LittleJerry (talk) 14:50, 12 May 2021 (UTC)

I've purged the flakiest of the sources and the associated text. Chiswick Chap (talk) 18:01, 13 May 2021 (UTC)

BTW I've completed a first pass on the topics you suggested. I notice that two major topics for marine turtles, swimming (hydrodynamics etc) and migration, are barely mentioned. Do you have a suitable book chapter you can send me? The serious textbooks are extremely expensive. I can make a start from some of the journal papers.

There's a chapter "The Endless Journey" in Orenstein's book. I'll try to get a scan. The book "The Biology of Sea Turtles" is also available on zbooks. LittleJerry (talk) 13:49, 12 May 2021 (UTC)

That's great. I'll see if I can find it on zbooks. Chiswick Chap (talk) 14:11, 12 May 2021 (UTC)

I notice, too, the old issue of the difficulty (aka impossibility) of separating "anatomy and morphology" from physiology and function, e.g. the clumsily-named "Limbs and tails" is actually about locomotion, which would be the natural title for the section, were it not for people's desire to fit it into "anatomy", which it obviously isn't. Maybe we should just go right ahead and change this. "Anatomy and physiology" is still awkward (and not the whole story, swimming isn't physiology exactly) but at least an improvement; "Form and function" would actually be more truthful. Chiswick Chap (talk) 07:48, 12 May 2021 (UTC)

Feeding is more complex than I thought. There's a lot to unpack. I think I'm going to structure it like we did for bat. LittleJerry (talk) 18:23, 12 May 2021 (UTC)

Yes, ch. 8 of Wyneken, Godfrey, Bels is fascinating. As for Bat .. ah, I see .. yes, a paragraph on meat-cutting and one on plant-grinding jaws would be in order. But I don't think we need a terribly long summary for the article. Chiswick Chap (talk) 18:27, 12 May 2021 (UTC)

Could you write a "thermoregulation" section? LittleJerry (talk) 00:21, 17 May 2021 (UTC)

Give it a go. Chiswick Chap (talk) 08:39, 17 May 2021 (UTC)

LittleJerry: my copy of Turtle by Louise M. Pryke has just arrived. Its 160 small pages provide a detailed history of the natural history of the turtle in the world's cultures (with quite a good overview of the biology too). It'll be more than enough for the Culture section, indeed it could be the foundation of a substantial revision of Turtles in culture, with its many citations. I'll read it through and potter about the subject a bit. Chiswick Chap (talk) 14:52, 19 May 2021 (UTC)

Cool! I'll rewrite the subsection on eggs and hatching. LittleJerry (talk) 19:43, 19 May 2021 (UTC)

OK; the temperature thing is related both to development and to the effect of climate change on turtle conservation. Chiswick Chap (talk) 08:26, 21 May 2021 (UTC)

As far as main topics are concerned, I think all we need are circulation, senses and defense. I'll write the last one and am still waiting for Faendalimas on circulation. LittleJerry (talk) 22:59, 23 May 2021 (UTC)

Ok, I'll have a nose around Senses. Chiswick Chap (talk) 07:08, 24 May 2021 (UTC)

Turtle FA cont'd

Wyneken's book has a part on the heart and circulation. Perhaps you could add it? LittleJerry (talk) 01:30, 25 May 2021 (UTC)

Added. I note that biochemists use "respiration" for aerobic and anaerobic processes discussed in the section; it might be best to say "breathing" and "pulmonary system" for the section about lungs and breathing above. Further, the two sections are quite closely linked; we might want to integrate them. Chiswick Chap (talk) 08:54, 25 May 2021 (UTC)

LittleJerry: The material you added to 'Senses' about eyes at the top of the head, from Parker & McKenzie 2019 - the citation needs a page number. Chiswick Chap (talk) 08:20, 26 May 2021 (UTC)

I thought you added it? It was in the distribution section and I moved it up. LittleJerry (talk) 21:51, 28 May 2021 (UTC)

Well we need to fix it somehow.

Anyway, I'll just add a few more bits of information and I think we're ready for GAN. If we are going to use File:How the Turtle Gets its Shell.svg we should probably add information from the cited article. LittleJerry (talk) 21:58, 28 May 2021 (UTC)

It's in the text already but I've added some more. I'm much happier with it now, and I agree, we're ready for GAN. Chiswick Chap (talk)

I'm thinking the "migration" subsection might be be too specialized for this article and is more suited for the sea turtle article. LittleJerry (talk) 16:47, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

Not really, it's a major feature of the group, just as bird migration is a key aspect of that group even though plenty of species are sedentary. They're also the only reptiles that migrate long distances... I've added a bit on non-marine turtle migrations also. Chiswick Chap (talk) 17:28, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

Went ahead and nominated it. LittleJerry (talk) 20:30, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

Jonathan Tayron

Hello there! I must thank you for your advice and your welcome message. I will definitely review the information you provided!

Thank you! Chiswick Chap (talk) 10:26, 31 May 2021 (UTC)

Akane Yamaguchi

Hello. Help copy edit. Thank you. Vnosm (talk) 12:33, 23 May 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for thinking of me, but you need the copy-editing task force. Chiswick Chap (talk) 12:37, 23 May 2021 (UTC)

Robert Kaske

Thanks again for the review! And, for that matter, for your willingness to indulge in my penchant for digging deep. --Usernameunique (talk) 09:33, 27 May 2021 (UTC)

TFA

Thank you today for your share in Scorpion, about "an iconic group of deadly predators"! --Gerda Arendt (talk) 06:19, 31 May 2021 (UTC)

Thank you Gerda, your work both on articles and encouraging other editors is beyond price. Chiswick Chap (talk) 09:10, 31 May 2021 (UTC)

Discussion at Talk:Scorpionism § Proposed merge of Scorpion sting into Scorpionism

 You are invited to join the discussion at Talk:Scorpionism § Proposed merge of Scorpion sting into Scorpionism. {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 23:03, 31 May 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Khraniteli

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Your GA nomination of Tolkien's legendarium

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Your GA nomination of Goldberry

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G.A.s for asanas

Hello Chiswick Chap

We encountered each other in the past on the asana articles and I noticed you are interested in bringing them up to GA. Since you've done so much on them and because I haven't reviewed most of the articles in the series, I would recommend you do what you did on trikonasana, with regards to my latest feedback, to the other articles in the series. Maybe I can review them when they are GAs or maybe sooner. Warmest regards. Catchpoke (talk) 21:53, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

Do you think we should create an asana (manual of style) guideline? Catchpoke (talk) 22:03, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

On your first point, maybe, I'll take a look. On the second, no, the total number of articles has been stable for a while now, and frankly there has been little editing to them; further, I went through them to assess GA potential and have brought all that I felt worth bringing to that status. So basically it's not worth a style guide to tidy up some Variations sections. Chiswick Chap (talk) 04:35, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

John Thirtle now at FAC

Hello Chiswick Chap, just to let know that John Thirtle, which you reviewed when it was a GAN, is now a FAC, please feel free to leave any comments here. Regards, Amitchell125 (talk) 12:40, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Chiswick Mall

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Your GA nomination of Chiswick Mall

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Your GA nomination of The Man in the Moon Stayed Up Too Late

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Your GA nomination of The Man in the Moon Stayed Up Too Late

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Your GA nomination of Théoden

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Your GA nomination of Théoden

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Your GA nomination of Time travel in The Lord of the Rings

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Your GA nomination of Time travel in The Lord of the Rings

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Your GA nomination of Denethor

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Briefly...

Have been aware of some of the latest editing imbroglios, but been too busy to follow it properly (and I see I am actually nearly a month behind!). Thought I should pop in even if only briefly, and see if you would like these two links: Woke of the Rings and The Woke J.R.R. Tolkien. I probably shouldn't say too much more! I may view the talks afterwards as I think they are put up on YouTube for anyone to see. Carcharoth (talk) 23:42, 2 July 2021 (UTC)

Carcharoth ridiculous... and Birns has graced it with his presence. It's a thing when discussion is based on mob think rather than logic, it couldn't happen on this project. Chiswick Chap (talk) 05:03, 3 July 2021 (UTC)

Turtle

A notice, due to the bot's shortcomings handling co-nominator situations, that I've begun reviewing Turtle at GAN. It's a pretty strong article so far -- good work. Vaticidalprophet 13:21, 3 July 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Denethor

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Your GA nomination of Beowulf in Middle-earth

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Your GA nomination of Man (Middle-earth)

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Your GA nomination of Man (Middle-earth)

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Promotion of Martin Rundkvist

Congratulations, Chiswick Chap! The article you nominated, Martin Rundkvist, has been promoted to featured status, recognizing it as one of the best articles on Wikipedia. The nomination discussion has been archived.

This is a rare accomplishment and you should be proud. If you would like, you may nominate it to appear on the Main page as Today's featured article. Keep up the great work! Cheers, Gog the Mild (talk) via FACBot (talk) 00:07, 6 July 2021 (UTC)

Thank you very much. Chiswick Chap (talk) 04:33, 6 July 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Insect flight

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Your GA nomination of Beowulf in Middle-earth

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Your GA nomination of Beowulf in Middle-earth

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Regarding Template:Yoga

Hello again. I replied to your criticisms of my proposed changes to Template:Yoga a while ago, but you've not yet replied back. I'd appreciate a reply at Template talk:Yoga so that things can move forward and I can draft a version of the template that we might both agree is an improvement. Scyrme (talk) 22:16, 9 July 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Treebeard

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Your GA nomination of Peter Jackson's interpretation of The Lord of the Rings

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The article Peter Jackson's interpretation of The Lord of the Rings you nominated as a good article has been placed on hold . The article is close to meeting the good article criteria, but there are some minor changes or clarifications needing to be addressed. If these are fixed within 7 days, the article will pass; otherwise it may fail. See Talk:Peter Jackson's interpretation of The Lord of the Rings for issues which need to be addressed. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Some Dude From North Carolina -- Some Dude From North Carolina (talk) 02:41, 13 July 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Peter Jackson's interpretation of The Lord of the Rings

The article Peter Jackson's interpretation of The Lord of the Rings you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Peter Jackson's interpretation of The Lord of the Rings for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Some Dude From North Carolina -- Some Dude From North Carolina (talk) 12:21, 13 July 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Insect flight

The article Insect flight you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Insect flight for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Dunkleosteus77 -- Dunkleosteus77 (talk) 15:41, 14 July 2021 (UTC)

How is Tom Bombadil several items?

Not asking to fight about it, I'm hardly a fan with a theory. Just read about the guy decades ago and forgot about him till he ran by in a dream the other day and one of my "slumber party" exclaimed "That's Tom Bombadil!" So I looked him up when I awoke, partially bringing us here today and partially reassuring me he was a character, not an item. Strange character, of course, likely not literally "just one man", but surely some sentient masculine being of sorts. If "item" means something else in literary England, you might have a point. Anyway, I agree the section is clear enough about its purpose as a list, three cheers to you! InedibleHulk (talk) 19:13, 15 July 2021 (UTC)

Er, the items in question were the "primary" mentions by Tolkien of Bombadil, not the guy himself. Whatever. All the best, Chiswick Chap (talk) 19:25, 15 July 2021 (UTC)

I'd have never even thought to think of the mentions, thanks. InedibleHulk (talk) 19:30, 15 July 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Shelob

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Shelob you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of BennyOnTheLoose -- BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 01:20, 16 July 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Shelob

The article Shelob you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Shelob for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of BennyOnTheLoose -- BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 20:22, 16 July 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of The Sea-Bell

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article The Sea-Bell you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Some Dude From North Carolina -- Some Dude From North Carolina (talk) 21:00, 16 July 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of The Sea-Bell

The article The Sea-Bell you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:The Sea-Bell for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Some Dude From North Carolina -- Some Dude From North Carolina (talk) 13:22, 17 July 2021 (UTC)

Insect flight has been nominated for Did You Know

Hello, Chiswick Chap. Insect flight, an article you either created or to which you significantly contributed, has been nominated to appear on Wikipedia's Main Page as part of Did you know. You can see the hook and the discussion here. You are welcome to participate! Thank you. EnterpriseyBot (talk!) 12:01, 18 July 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Yoga using props

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Incomplete DYK nomination

Hello! Your submission of Template:Did you know nominations/Duke of Sussex, Acton Green at the Did You Know nominations page is not complete; if you would like to continue, please link the nomination to the nominations page as described in step 3 of the nomination procedure. If you do not want to continue with the nomination, tag the nomination page with {{db-g7}}, or ask a DYK admin. Thank you. DYKHousekeepingBot (talk) 03:31, 26 July 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Yoga using props

The article Yoga using props you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Yoga using props for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Simongraham -- Simongraham (talk) 06:21, 26 July 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of England in Middle-earth

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Your GA nomination of England in Middle-earth

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Your GA nomination of Tolkien's frame stories

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Your GA nomination of Bacchi Tempel

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Your GA nomination of Tolkien's frame stories

The article Tolkien's frame stories you nominated as a good article has been placed on hold . The article is close to meeting the good article criteria, but there are some minor changes or clarifications needing to be addressed. If these are fixed within 7 days, the article will pass; otherwise it may fail. See Talk:Tolkien's frame stories for issues which need to be addressed. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Haleth -- Haleth (talk) 03:01, 1 August 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Tolkien's frame stories

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Template:Yoga

Please see talk page of "Template:Yoga". I like to believe you know the topic well. I had a concern and want someone, who knows the topic better, to address it. I presume you are the right person because the template edit history shows you have been watching it. In case you are not the right person, then please get someone else to fix that template please. I leave it in your capable hands, and I am out of both here and that template. Thanks in advance. 58.182.176.169 (talk) 21:59, 2 August 2021 (UTC)

FAC

I'll nominate turtle for FAC this coming week. There are some other things I would like to take care of this weekend. In the meantime, I think all we need is a cite for the last part of the second paragraph of the breathing subsection and perhaps some of the cites in the culture subsection could be replaced with Pryke. I'm pretty sure she mentions the fable, TMNT and the Mock Turtle. LittleJerry (talk) 22:21, 16 July 2021 (UTC)

Ok, I'll take a look. Chiswick Chap (talk) 06:20, 20 July 2021 (UTC)

LittleJerry Well, the fable is cited to Aesop, but I've added Pryke; the myth is already cited to Pryke; the Mock Turtle very properly to Carroll himself - Pryke doesn't seem to cover it, oddly; and TMNT to New York Times; added Pryke there too. I didn't know I was doing respiration but I've fixed the passage. Chiswick Chap (talk) 06:33, 20 July 2021 (UTC)

Thanks, I'll nominate it tomorrow. I need to make some changes to the giraffe article first. You can do it sooner if you wish. LittleJerry (talk) 20:29, 20 July 2021 (UTC)

Need your help at the FAC page. LittleJerry (talk) 11:59, 22 July 2021 (UTC)

Well, I've had a go. All the sources need to be checked before we request another source check, which had better pass without a glitch. Chiswick Chap (talk) 12:56, 22 July 2021 (UTC)

There's a cite error for citation 2. LittleJerry (talk) 13:48, 25 July 2021 (UTC)

The citation had been duplicated (long ago) but the bot only added archive data to the first one ... now merged. Chiswick Chap (talk) 13:52, 25 July 2021 (UTC)

Reproduction, breathing and suborder differences should be good now. I think the whole Anatomy, Behavior and Reproduction sections are cleared. Any text leftover from before we started should be checked. LittleJerry (talk) 02:44, 26 July 2021 (UTC)

LittleJerry, well that seems to be that for this attempt, let's call it off now. I think that starting from a wobbly text is simply too dangerous for FAC, one needs to start afresh and be clear, tidy, and careful from the outset - it's much less work and it yields a better product. If you want to polish the article up and push it through peer review, I guess I can lend a hand. Chiswick Chap (talk) 15:20, 7 August 2021 (UTC)

Okay, then I have withdrawn the nomination. LittleJerry (talk) 17:01, 7 August 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Host–parasite coevolution

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Host–parasite coevolution you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Jens Lallensack -- Jens Lallensack (talk) 21:01, 4 August 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Host–parasite coevolution

The article Host–parasite coevolution you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Host–parasite coevolution for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Jens Lallensack -- Jens Lallensack (talk) 11:41, 6 August 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Bacchi Tempel

The article Bacchi Tempel you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Bacchi Tempel for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Whiteguru -- Whiteguru (talk) 06:41, 7 August 2021 (UTC)

DYK for Insect flight

On 7 August 2021, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article Insect flight, which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that unlike most other insects, dragonflies have direct flight, the muscles being attached directly to the wing bases (pictured)? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Insect flight. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page (here's how, Insect flight), and if they received a combined total of at least 416.7 views per hour (i.e., 5,000 views in 12 hours or 10,000 in 24), the hook may be added to the statistics page. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.

Cwmhiraeth (talk) 12:02, 7 August 2021 (UTC)

sculing

I do not know where this rule "must have the same term" comes from. However, the article sculling does not talk about the sculling draw stroke that canoists use, which is what the sentence is about, while the sculling draw stroke is listed, and explained, in the article canoe paddle strokes. Did you look at the two articles? I think it is clearly more informative to a reader to have a link to an article that explains the term being used, whatever the name of the article is. Please reconsider your reversion. Would you feel different if there was a redirect from sculling draw stroke to canoe paddle strokes? AJim (talk) 04:20, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

WP:EASTEREGG. I've created and linked a redirect. Chiswick Chap (talk) 08:29, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

DYK for Duke of Sussex, Acton Green

On 13 August 2021, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article Duke of Sussex, Acton Green, which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that the Duke of Sussex has been providing drinks in Acton Green for over a century? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Duke of Sussex, Acton Green. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page (here's how, Duke of Sussex, Acton Green), and if they received a combined total of at least 416.7 views per hour (i.e., 5,000 views in 12 hours or 10,000 in 24), the hook may be added to the statistics page. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.

Cwmhiraeth (talk) 12:04, 13 August 2021 (UTC)

DYK for Acton Green, London

On 13 August 2021, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article Acton Green, London, which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that the Duke of Sussex has been providing drinks in Acton Green for over a century? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Duke of Sussex, Acton Green. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page (here's how, Acton Green, London), and if they received a combined total of at least 416.7 views per hour (i.e., 5,000 views in 12 hours or 10,000 in 24), the hook may be added to the statistics page. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.

Cwmhiraeth (talk) 12:04, 13 August 2021 (UTC)

Acton Green and granularity

I know you must live around there, but I get the feeling that Acton Green is not particularly well-defined as a neighborhood. I could find only limited sourcing describing it as a neighborhood, and no maps showing its boundaries. The pdf in the article shows more of a planning area. To me it seems more of a gradient within South Acton, "the residential area in the vicinity of Acton Green (the Common) that is in South Acton". In my neck of the woods, I've often found that one can get very granular when talking to people who live there with me, but it doesn't translate well when I go to find the edges. It's vague. Abductive (reasoning) 14:03, 13 August 2021 (UTC)

Abductive: It's rather sharply delimited to the north and to the west by railway lines, to the east by the estate boundary of Bedford Park, and to the south by the green (the common) itself. Chiswick Chap (talk) 14:08, 13 August 2021 (UTC)

What streets are the estate boundary? I ask in order to check if the coordinates I put in the article need adjusting. Abductive (reasoning) 18:57, 13 August 2021 (UTC)

West is Ivy Crescent, Weston Road... North is Bridgman Road, Fletcher Road, Southfield Road... East is St Alban's Avenue... South is the common itself i.e. Acton Green, with Hardwicke Road, Bolton Lane, Colonial Drive. Chiswick Chap (talk) 20:18, 13 August 2021 (UTC)

My coordinates are pretty good, then. Thanks. Abductive (reasoning) 00:43, 14 August 2021 (UTC)

DYK nomination of Jonathan Carr (property developer)

Hello! Your submission of Jonathan Carr (property developer) at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and some issues with it may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) at your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! Pamzeis (talk) 15:41, 13 August 2021 (UTC)

Pamzeis, thanks for review, I've replied there. Hope that's OK, I've never been too sure of DYK practices. Chiswick Chap (talk) 15:50, 13 August 2021 (UTC)

Possible assignment for you.

How about expanding the "Cultural references" for gorilla using this book? LittleJerry (talk) 17:23, 15 August 2021 (UTC)

Give it a go. Chiswick Chap (talk) 17:32, 15 August 2021 (UTC)

Queen Anne Revival architecture

A couple of weeks ago you created the dab page Queen Anne Revival architecture along with your work on British Queen Anne Revival architecture. This created around 100 links to the dab page. I am trying to sort these out based on whether the building/architect is UK or US/Canada/Australia etc but could you take a look and check I have not linked to the wrong one.— Rod ^talk 15:37, 22 August 2021 (UTC)

OK, it's worth it as the old links only had the option of linking to a multi-topic page. Chiswick Chap (talk) 15:40, 22 August 2021 (UTC)

I've done most of the links on this list but there are some left & a few odities I wasn't sure what to do with:

• Queen Anne Revival redirect
• Category:Queen Anne Revival architecture in the United Kingdom
• Index of architecture articles
• Category:Queen Anne architecture

Help appreciated.— Rod ^talk 15:51, 22 August 2021 (UTC)

Done a bit of dabbing and labelling. Chiswick Chap (talk) 16:10, 22 August 2021 (UTC)

Hi User:Rodw and Chiswick Chap. I revisited Rodw's disambiguations to find all U.S. places and use links to Queen Anne architecture in the United States article instead. This was for 20 or 30 articles or so, presumably getting rid of about 30 or so links from U.S. places to the term "Queen Anne Revival". Please see Talk:New World Queen Anne Revival architecture. For the U.S. there are _many_ thousands of articles in , all or most of which link to "Queen Anne architecture in the United States". I did not create that article, but someone did in general agreement with you that what is termed "Queen Anne" in the U.S. is not really old Queen Anne but rather is a revival. I am not sure, but I suspect the usage in the U.S. of "Queen Anne" rather than "Queen Anne Revival" is valid and preferable, even though one might make the argument they "should" all be called Queen Anne Revival (but they are not called that, and you can't fight general usage...). I would be happy to participate in some central discussion if there is to be a proposal to change all the U.S. usages, but please for now let's leave all the U.S. ones linking to the "in the United States" article, okay? Thank you to both of you for your good work. --Doncram (talk) 22:43, 22 August 2021 (UTC)

Yes, in the US it's not a "revival" of anything, anywhere, but originally a marketing term for an eclectic new style. I've commented at the other pages. I suppose Rod overlooked the US page, hence all the wrong links. It would be much better to discuss all this before! Johnbod (talk) 23:28, 22 August 2021 (UTC)

My Edits in Hamid Naderi Yeganeh

Dear Chiswick Chap, today I was exploring some math art pages and I found you. Congratulations for your impressive contributions. I am a new user in Wikipedia and the main reason I wanted to edit Wikipedia was to add a few useful sections to Hamid Naderi Yeganeh. It is about a few years that I've learned about Hamid Naderi Yeganeh's art and I became extremely interested in his work. After I created my account, I added a few sections to Hamid Naderi Yeganeh. After a few minutes I received a message saying that my edit was possibly vandalism. I got surprised since my edit was very useful and valuable and was from authentic references. I tried to add the sections for the second time more cautiously. My edits was reverted again and this time I became accused of using multiple accounts. I don't know why I became accused of having multiple accounts but I guess that's because I imitated the edits of other editors in Hamid Naderi Yeganeh. Since I'm new to Wikipedia I needed to learn a few things from previous editors. Now I became so disappointed since believe me my edits were very useful and valid but they became reverted without a logical reason. I'm sure they undid my edits without scientifically reviewing it. I'm sending you this message because I would like to ask you to take a look at my edits: (this revision is the most perfect version: 1040033504). I vehemently believe that they are valuable and they can give the readers vital information about Naderi Yeganeh's art. They undid my edits twice without reviewing them. I think that's unfair because it took me a few hours to make those edits and I tried my best to do them accurately. I eagerly look forward to hearing your opinion about my edits. Math CRXVC (talk) 02:10, 23 August 2021 (UTC)

Hi, I'm sorry you had a rough start. Editors are constantly looking out for vandalism and they can get it wrong, especially with new accounts where they have no history to help them. You certainly can edit the article; I'd advise you to start small with little fixes that nobody would object to, and small additions, very carefully cited to the best sources, so you are as safe as possible. Restoring deleted materials is a bold move; probably best to discuss that first on the article's talk page, as it looks argumentative. All the best, Chiswick Chap (talk) 05:14, 23 August 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Chiswick High Road

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Chiswick High Road you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Lectrician2 -- Lectrician2 (talk) 18:01, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Chiswick High Road

The article Chiswick High Road you nominated as a good article has been placed on hold . The article is close to meeting the good article criteria, but there are some minor changes or clarifications needing to be addressed. If these are fixed within 7 days, the article will pass; otherwise it may fail. See Talk:Chiswick High Road for issues which need to be addressed. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Lectrician2 -- Lectrician2 (talk) 01:41, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Chiswick High Road

The article Chiswick High Road you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Chiswick High Road for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Lectrician2 -- Lectrician2 (talk) 12:02, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Your GAN, Ljuva karneval!

Hi, Chiswick Chap. Recently I've begun reviewing GAN in the literature section, so as to reduce the backlog there. I skipped this article because its sources are in Swedish, which I don't speak. So I want to ask you if you'd be okay with me reviewing it (possibly using google translate or asking for you to translate sections when/if needed) or if you'd rather I skip it so someone else with knowledge of the language might review it at a later point in time. Thanks, Isabelle ^🔔 16:21, 24 August 2021 (UTC)

Isabelle Belato, I'd be delighted if you did it. Of course I'll lend a hand with anything in Swedish. Chiswick Chap (talk) 16:24, 24 August 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for the reply. Unless someone decides to pick it up, I'll start a review in the next day or so. Isabelle ^🔔 16:29, 24 August 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Ljuva karneval!

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Ljuva karneval! you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Isabelle Belato -- Isabelle Belato (talk) 02:41, 26 August 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Ljuva karneval!

The article Ljuva karneval! you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Ljuva karneval! for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Isabelle Belato -- Isabelle Belato (talk) 16:01, 30 August 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Vishnudevananda Saraswati

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Vishnudevananda Saraswati you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of The Rambling Man -- The Rambling Man (talk) 21:01, 30 August 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Vishnudevananda Saraswati

The article Vishnudevananda Saraswati you nominated as a good article has been placed on hold . The article is close to meeting the good article criteria, but there are some minor changes or clarifications needing to be addressed. If these are fixed within 7 days, the article will pass; otherwise it may fail. See Talk:Vishnudevananda Saraswati for issues which need to be addressed. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of The Rambling Man -- The Rambling Man (talk) 09:40, 31 August 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Vishnudevananda Saraswati

The article Vishnudevananda Saraswati you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Vishnudevananda Saraswati for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of The Rambling Man -- The Rambling Man (talk) 20:02, 2 September 2021 (UTC)

Future GA Reviews.

Hi! I recently reviewed your Chiswick High Road article and I found it very well written. If you have any other GA nominations in the following category's, just tell me in my talk page and I will be happy to review it.

Art and Architecture (Preferably Architecture)

Engineering and Technology (Preferably Transport)

Geography & Places

Lectrician2 (talk) 16:14, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Ack du min moder

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Ack du min moder you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Kusma -- Kusma (talk) 19:01, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Source material collection

Hi Chiswick Chap, thank you for amazing articles that you've produced! I always wondered how people find source materials, either academic source or from media for their articles. I'd like to know what are some of the methods that you personally find useful. I, as an IP, generally use google scholars for finding academic source materials (along with of course, few googling to get some sources from media). But what other methods that you personally use? Curious to know, Thanks! 2A0E:1C80:E:0:0:0:0:18 (talk) 19:22, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Yes, the same. Then read the books and papers, follow the major authors. The newspapers for current developments. The usual things. Chiswick Chap (talk) 22:58, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Proverbs in The Lord of the Rings

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Proverbs in The Lord of the Rings you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Pax Verbum 06:25, 30 August 2021 (UTC)

On a side note, if this is a topic that really interests you, you may be interested in David Rowe's book, The Proverbs of Middle-earth -Pax Verbum 07:13, 30 August 2021 (UTC)

Hello again! I've finished going over the article and left a couple of comments on GA section 3. I will wait 7 days before finalizing the review to give some time to respond and address those comments. Overall an interesting topic that I enjoyed quite a bit. Thank you! -Pax Verbum 05:48, 5 September 2021 (UTC)

DYK for Jonathan Carr (property developer)

On 5 September 2021, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article Jonathan Carr (property developer), which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that Jonathan Carr's 342 bankruptcy petitions set a record? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Jonathan Carr (property developer). You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page (here's how, Jonathan Carr (property developer)), and if they received a combined total of at least 416.7 views per hour (i.e., 5,000 views in 12 hours or 10,000 in 24), the hook may be added to the statistics page. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.

Cwmhiraeth (talk) 00:02, 5 September 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Proverbs in The Lord of the Rings

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Your GA nomination of Ack du min moder

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Your GA nomination of Proverbs in The Lord of the Rings

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Your GA nomination of Yoga in Russia

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Your GA nomination of Yoga in Russia

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Your GA nomination of Yoga in Russia

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Your GA nomination of British industrial architecture

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Your GA nomination of British industrial architecture

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Your GA nomination of Khecarī mudrā

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Your GA nomination of British industrial architecture

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Pryke Book

For the Pryke Book. Do did get a physical copy or use the web verison? If the physical version, then could you correct the page numbers I added (cites 63, 160, 166) Thanks. LittleJerry (talk) 13:11, 14 September 2021 (UTC)

Done those three. Chiswick Chap (talk) 13:23, 14 September 2021 (UTC)

Smaug

Do you think we should add a section to the Smaug article comparing his defeat to Achilles' heel?MagicatthemovieS (talk) 17:06, 16 September 2021 (UTC)MagicatthemovieS

Source? None of the scholarly books on my shelf make the comparison. Chiswick Chap (talk) 17:26, 16 September 2021 (UTC)

All the books on page 1 of this Google search and the first book on page 2.MagicatthemovieS (talk) 20:21, 16 September 2021 (UTC)MagicatthemovieS

https://www.google.com/search?q=achilles+heel+smaug&source=lnms&tbm=bks&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjWtN7IqITzAhW9VTABHSMMDvQQ_AUoAXoECAEQCw&biw=1536&bih=722&dpr=1.25

OK. I've used Pearce, who (with care) is a helpful viewpoint on Tolkien. Chiswick Chap (talk) 07:32, 17 September 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Tolkien and race

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Your GA nomination of Interlacing in The Lord of the Rings

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Your GA nomination of Sexuality in The Lord of the Rings

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Your GA nomination of Interlacing in The Lord of the Rings

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Tolkien film article and possible scientist articles

I only just noticed Khraniteli, that is amazing! Also loved Chiswick High Road (I spent several years travelling to work on a bus that ran along the entire length of that road). Quick request, if you are interested in evolutionary biologists. The latest laureate at Heinrich Wieland Prize is Thomas Boehm, who I think is an evolutionary molecular biologist (OK, on closer inspection, he is a molecular geneticist, maybe even an epigeneticist, but that work is relevant to evolutionary theory). There is no en-Wikipedia article, but there is an article in the German Wikipedia. Do you think an article is possible here? (Maybe ditto for the 2019 laureate - the other redlinks may be more difficult). Carcharoth (talk) 10:36, 20 September 2021 (UTC)

Thank you for the warm words, it's much appreciated. I'll take a look at Boehm, we can surely translate the DE article at least. Chiswick Chap (talk) 10:50, 20 September 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Sexuality in The Lord of the Rings

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Turtle

I think everything's fixed. Should I re-nominate? LittleJerry (talk) 22:38, 20 September 2021 (UTC)

Talk page item seems not to have been addressed ..... Chiswick Chap (talk) 03:05, 21 September 2021 (UTC)

I deleted it. LittleJerry (talk) 11:55, 21 September 2021 (UTC)

Then at least you need to respond to the talk page comment explaining the resolution of the issue (why was deleting the 2nd mention correct?). Chiswick Chap (talk) 12:04, 21 September 2021 (UTC)

I brought it back and rearranged the wording. The user didn't read the entire section, though, as it went on to show several studies placing turtles closer to archosaurus. LittleJerry (talk) 12:42, 21 September 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Other Minds: The Octopus, the Sea, and the Deep Origins of Consciousness

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Your GA nomination of Ontogeny and Phylogeny (book)

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Your GA nomination of Konstantin Mereschkowski

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The Lay of the Children of Húrin

I removed the first sentence because was out of place. It was unnecessary, being contained entirely within the next section of literary analysis verbatim. I did not remove any information, simply improved the clarity of the style. Captgouda24 (talk) 20:10, 21 September 2021 (UTC) Captgouda24

Ah, I see what's happening... you are giving mentions that are just slightly misleading. There, you meant "in the second subsection" but said "next"; here you meant "The Lay of CoH" but just said "CoH" without linking the axtual target --- a different book and article --- so I had to go and search for it. Well, restore your edit; the section would benefit from an introduction but that isn't it. All the best, Chiswick Chap (talk) 08:27, 22 September 2021 (UTC)

Captgouda24 You may like to know that you managed, for the second time, to accidentally delete the citation that remained in use, 2 sections down; you were saved by the bot that rescued and repaired the citation from the article history. Deleting links of course triggers a tag next to your edit, which (you may note) serves as a possible-vandalism alert to all other editors. They then put "deletion" and "removal of citation" together and go to the article to try to work out what happens, Twinkle or Huggle in hand. Chiswick Chap (talk) 08:27, 22 September 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Konstantin Mereschkowski

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Your GA nomination of Other Minds: The Octopus, the Sea, and the Deep Origins of Consciousness

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Your GA nomination of Ontogeny and Phylogeny (book)

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Your GA nomination of Konstantin Mereschkowski

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Your GA nomination of The Compatibility Gene

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Your GA nomination of Bedford Park, London

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Your GA nomination of Bedford Park, London

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Your GA nomination of The Compatibility Gene

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Your GA nomination of The Compatibility Gene

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Your GA nomination of Character pairing in The Lord of the Rings

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A barnstar for you!

	The Original Barnstar
	I noticed today that Professor Corey Olsen: A) Has a Wikipedia page B) It's actually, like, good, well-written and sourced and everything - apparently due to your hard work a few months ago. Thank you! I really enjoy his classes, it's great to see him represented here with such a nice page. Wikignome Wintergreentalk 00:20, 14 October 2021 (UTC)

Thank you very much, it's appreciated. Chiswick Chap (talk) 08:11, 14 October 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Character pairing in The Lord of the Rings

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Your GA nomination of Pine processionary

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Your GA nomination of Pine processionary

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Your GA nomination of Droste effect

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Your GA nomination of Droste effect

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Your GA nomination of Droste effect

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Promotion of Turtle

Congratulations, Chiswick Chap! The article you nominated, Turtle, has been promoted to featured status, recognizing it as one of the best articles on Wikipedia. The nomination discussion has been archived.

This is a rare accomplishment and you should be proud. If you would like, you may nominate it to appear on the Main page as Today's featured article. Keep up the great work! Cheers, Gog the Mild (talk) via FACBot (talk) 00:06, 29 October 2021 (UTC)

Turtle culture article

Could you add mention of Franklin the Turtle in Cultural depictions of turtles? I know its in Pryke's book. I don't have the physical copy so page numbers are different. LittleJerry (talk) 13:23, 1 November 2021 (UTC)

Happy First Edit Day!

Many thanks! Chiswick Chap (talk) 14:56, 5 November 2021 (UTC)

Precious anniversary

Precious

Nine years!

--Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:56, 11 November 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Animal migration

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Your GA nomination of Animal migration

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Eyal Shifroni as a recognized expert

Hi Chiswick Chap, hope all is well. Could you elaborate on how Eyal Shifroni is a recognized expert? Nothing against them, but I genuinely cannot find any independent sourcing establishing this to be the case. Best, Eddie891 ^Talk _Work 23:01, 11 November 2021 (UTC)

OK I've removed it. Chiswick Chap (talk) 05:10, 12 November 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Magic in Middle-earth

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Does Bellis perennis have any subspecies?

Hello, I am here to ask that does Bellis perennis have any subspecies? BloxyColaSweet (talk) 21:48, 12 November 2021 (UTC)

I'm not an expert on that species, but B. perennis perennis is listed on GBIF ... so there must be others. The GBIF species page lists numerous subspecies but apparently as synonyms of the species itself, looks as if you'll have to investigate it all a bit. Chiswick Chap (talk) 11:10, 13 November 2021 (UTC)

Colin Duriez

I shall find some reviews in Mythlore and JTR when I get a moment.--Verbarson (talk) 15:51, 15 November 2021 (UTC)

Verbarson – Ah, good. I've had a nose about, and there is nothing on him at all academically, so we can't in all conscience list him as a "Scholar/Biographer" as per the template. Serious biographers like Garth get scholarly reviews. Early Mythlore was more or less fan-based; it has become much more serious in recent years so it's usable for notability. Chiswick Chap (talk) 15:54, 15 November 2021 (UTC)

And something must be done about Sexuality in The Lord of the Rings#Tolkien's background - it makes it sound as if he barely spoke to a woman in his life! Passionate love affair? Romantic re-union after guardian's ban? Life-long marriage? Inspiring dance at Roos? Four children? Devotion to BVM? Not a hint, not even his wife's name. It's completely unbalanced. I'll get round to that as well.--Verbarson (talk) 16:35, 15 November 2021 (UTC)

That was certainly uncollegiate, and "I'll get round to that as well" hints at inappropriate motives on your part, something that I will remember. The article is reliably sourced and does no editorialising. As it happens I have great respect for Tolkien and his personal life, and I'll note that the article is no sort of attack upon his person. Since I always try to take suggestions constructively, I'll just say that there is no reason why we shouldn't add some background about him, and I'll take a look at that now. Chiswick Chap (talk) 16:44, 15 November 2021 (UTC)

I apologise. I have no intention of being either uncollegiate or inappropriate. I observed that the background given, while entirely accurate in its facts, omitted any part of Tolkien's life that had an overt connection with female sexuality or heterosexual relationships. Given the topic, I felt that this was an unbalanced view of Tolkien. While I agree that he can be seen as both stodgy and sexist, I believe that there are other important aspects to him that should also be considered. As for "I'll get round to that", I was merely intending (as a good editor should) to make the proposed changes myself, rather than expecting you, or someone else, to do the work. I see that you have added a balancing paragraph, for which I thank you.--Verbarson (talk) 19:15, 15 November 2021 (UTC)

Many thanks. It's certainly an improvement to the article. Chiswick Chap (talk) 19:48, 15 November 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Magic in Middle-earth

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Your GA nomination of Heroism in The Lord of the Rings

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Your GA nomination of Heroism in The Lord of the Rings

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Your GA nomination of Magic in Middle-earth

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Your GA nomination of Heroism in The Lord of the Rings

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DYK for The Great War and Middle-earth

On 21 November 2021, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article The Great War and Middle-earth, which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that Sam Gamgee was modelled on Great War batmen? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/The Great War and Middle-earth. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page (here's how, The Great War and Middle-earth), and if they received a combined total of at least 416.7 views per hour (i.e., 5,000 views in 12 hours or 10,000 in 24), the hook may be added to the statistics page. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.

Ritchie333 ^{(talk) (cont)} 00:02, 21 November 2021 (UTC)

		Hook update
		Your hook reached 5,673 views (472.8 per hour), making it one of the most viewed hooks of November 2021—nice work!

theleekycauldron (talk • contribs) (they/them) 03:19, 22 November 2021 (UTC)

Angelfish cladogram

Hi. I emailed you an article. Would you be able to make a cladogram based on Figure 2? Thank you. LittleJerry (talk) 00:37, 22 November 2021 (UTC)

LittleJerry - le voici, as they say in France. Chiswick Chap (talk) 17:04, 22 November 2021 (UTC)

Angelfishes	Holacanthus tricolor Holacanthus bermudensis Holacanthus ciliaris Holacanthus clarionensis Holacanthus limbaughi Holacanthus passer Holacanthus africanus

Your GA nomination of Stolta Stad!

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Your GA nomination of Stolta Stad!

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A Barnstar

	The Dante Barnstar
	This is absolutely fantastic. It really is. Thank you for all your contributions to Wikipedia. Liam2520 12:20, 22 November 2021 (UTC)

Aw, thank you! Chiswick Chap (talk) 12:54, 22 November 2021 (UTC)

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Your GA nomination of Stolta Stad!

The article Stolta Stad! you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Stolta Stad! for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Kyle Peake -- Kyle Peake (talk) 09:21, 23 November 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Ge rum i Bröllopsgåln din hund!

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Your GA nomination of Ge rum i Bröllopsgåln din hund!

The article Ge rum i Bröllopsgåln din hund! you nominated as a good article has been placed on hold . The article is close to meeting the good article criteria, but there are some minor changes or clarifications needing to be addressed. If these are fixed within 7 days, the article will pass; otherwise it may fail. See Talk:Ge rum i Bröllopsgåln din hund! for issues which need to be addressed. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Kyle Peake -- Kyle Peake (talk) 12:01, 24 November 2021 (UTC)

'Rvv' re. Children of Hurin

'You have made the grammar less clear, less active, and more complex'. I contend that the passages in question read rather as though they were written in a sort of weird modern shorthand or Orwellian 'Newspeak' and, for that reason, stood out strangely on your page. I'm not going to undo your reversion or get into some tedious slanging match, given that you obviously care deeply about the page and are tigerish in its defence and, furthermore, that we are unlikely ever to agree about this. I was merely trying to be helpful: I hardly think my contribution rated as vandalism.
By the way, nice to see a fellow West Londoner on Wikipedia. yours in good faith Flobbadob (talk) 08:24, 25 November 2021 (UTC)Flobbadob

Many thanks. Obviously vandalism was nothing to do with it. I'll take another look at it. Chiswick Chap (talk) 09:31, 25 November 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Ge rum i Bröllopsgåln din hund!

The article Ge rum i Bröllopsgåln din hund! you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Ge rum i Bröllopsgåln din hund! for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Kyle Peake -- Kyle Peake (talk) 09:41, 25 November 2021 (UTC)

DYK for Borocera cajani

On 29 November 2021, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article Borocera cajani, which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that Borocera cajani produces a form of wild silk that has been harvested for hundreds of years? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Borocera cajani. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page (here's how, Borocera cajani), and if they received a combined total of at least 416.7 views per hour (i.e., 5,000 views in 12 hours or 10,000 in 24), the hook may be added to the statistics page. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.

— Maile (talk) 00:02, 29 November 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Solen glimmar blank och trind

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Your GA nomination of Solen glimmar blank och trind

The article Solen glimmar blank och trind you nominated as a good article has been placed on hold . The article is close to meeting the good article criteria, but there are some minor changes or clarifications needing to be addressed. If these are fixed within 7 days, the article will pass; otherwise it may fail. See Talk:Solen glimmar blank och trind for issues which need to be addressed. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Kyle Peake -- Kyle Peake (talk) 20:01, 29 November 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Solen glimmar blank och trind

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A Voyage to Arcturus

Your edits are mostly unobjectionable, but deleting the mention of the Gnostic demiurge is somewhat obfuscatory -- see the previous discussion on Talk:A Voyage to Arcturus... AnonMoos (talk) 20:35, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

AnonMoos - Thanks. Do you have a reliable source for it? Chiswick Chap (talk) 20:39, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Hvila vid denna källa

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Your GA nomination of Hvila vid denna källa

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Your GA nomination of Sean B. Carroll

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Your GA nomination of Hvila vid denna källa

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Your GA nomination of Sean B. Carroll

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DYK for Ge rum i Bröllopsgåln din hund!

On 9 December 2021, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article Ge rum i Bröllopsgåln din hund!, which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that Bellman's song "Ge rum i Bröllopsgåln din hund!" describes "one of the wildest weddings in Swedish literature"? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Ge rum i Bröllopsgåln din hund!. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page (here's how, Ge rum i Bröllopsgåln din hund!), and if they received a combined total of at least 416.7 views per hour (i.e., 5,000 views in 12 hours or 10,000 in 24), the hook may be added to the statistics page. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.

— Maile (talk) 12:02, 9 December 2021 (UTC)

Queen Galadriel

This phrase actually does occur once in the Lord of the Rings, as established in the talk page archives, but it's not really one of her common titles. AnonMoos (talk) 18:30, 12 December 2021 (UTC)

That would seem to be a very good reason not to use it. Tolkien went through literally thousands of drafts, and he tried out countless names and appellations (in many languages) for all his characters. Chiswick Chap (talk) 18:33, 12 December 2021 (UTC)

I'm not advocating that the category should be added to the article page, but the phrase occurs one time in the published form of the Lord of the Rings, not just drafts... AnonMoos (talk) 21:32, 12 December 2021 (UTC)

Noted. That just means that the chaos of the drafts continues with the "final" versions (yes, also multiple), it's "drafts" too. Chiswick Chap (talk) 09:58, 13 December 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Splintered Light

The article Splintered Light you nominated as a good article has been placed on hold . The article is close to meeting the good article criteria, but there are some minor changes or clarifications needing to be addressed. If these are fixed within 7 days, the article will pass; otherwise it may fail. See Talk:Splintered Light for issues which need to be addressed. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Olivaw-Daneel -- Olivaw-Daneel (talk) 02:21, 13 December 2021 (UTC)

Promotion of Beowulf and Middle-earth

Congratulations, Chiswick Chap! The article you nominated, Beowulf and Middle-earth, has been promoted to featured status, recognizing it as one of the best articles on Wikipedia. The nomination discussion has been archived.

This is a rare accomplishment and you should be proud. If you would like, you may nominate it to appear on the Main page as Today's featured article. Keep up the great work! Cheers, Gog the Mild (talk) via FACBot (talk) 00:06, 14 December 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Paganism in Middle-earth

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Your GA nomination of Tolkien and the Great War

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Your GA nomination of Paganism in Middle-earth

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Your GA nomination of Tolkien and the Great War

The article Tolkien and the Great War you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Tolkien and the Great War for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of KeeperOfThePeace -- KeeperOfThePeace (talk) 15:41, 16 December 2021 (UTC)

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article The Vital Question you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Dunkleosteus77 -- Dunkleosteus77 (talk) 23:01, 10 December 2021 (UTC)

Barnstar for you!

		The Arthropod Barnstar
		For your invaluable contributions to practically every insect page people are likely to visit, which probably makes you one of the world's most widely-read authorities on insects. AryKun (talk) 12:33, 17 December 2021 (UTC)

Gosh, thank you very much! Chiswick Chap (talk) 12:37, 17 December 2021 (UTC)

Advaita Vedanta and yoga

Hi Chiswick Chap. I've got a question for which I can find surprisingly little info: what is the relation between Advaita Vedanta and yoga? That is, what did Shankara think of yoga, what influences can be found in his commentaries? And how was the later AV tradition influenced by yoga (see Madaio (2017), Rethinking Neo-Vedanta). Regards, Joshua Jonathan -Let's talk! 13:03, 18 December 2021 (UTC)

Y: Gosh, a vast subject way beyond my pay grade. However, Patanjali implicitly assumes quite a bit of dualist Samkhya philosophy, with its distinctions like mind/manas, intelligence/buddhi, and ego/ahamkara, without really talking about these aspects of nature/prakrti. Samkhya's goal of liberation/kaivalya at least fits closely with Patanjali's view. Advaita obviously sits uneasily with all this; if Advaita "was" Shankara then the answer would be, well, the traditions are different, even opposed; but post-Shankara Advaita certainly was influenced by yoga. All the best, Chiswick Chap (talk) 13:31, 18 December 2021 (UTC)

The Moon in fiction

He is venting spleen. He remade Mercury in fiction in his own image and likeness (removing comics, film and games) and took umbrage when I said it was restricted to several encyclopaedia of science fiction. I am tempted to remove the tag. --Whiteguru (talk) 22:02, 18 December 2021 (UTC)

Thanks. Noted. Chiswick Chap (talk) 09:08, 19 December 2021 (UTC)

Doga (yoga)

Do you think Doga (yoga) title name should be primary and moved into Doga? 2001:4455:1A9:E100:C48:A690:9151:1BDF (talk) 23:58, 21 December 2021 (UTC)

I doubt if it can be justified as the primary topic. Chiswick Chap (talk) 07:30, 22 December 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Decline and fall in Middle-earth

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Decline and fall in Middle-earth you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Cerebellum -- Cerebellum (talk) 14:01, 22 December 2021 (UTC)

Plan on making a page for Manx cuisine?

Since you did a page for the cuisine of the Channel Islands, do you plan on making one for the Isle of Man's cuisine as well? It is the only Crown Dependency without one now, and their chips, cheese and gravy could use a page and image.Vesperius (talk) 23:05, 23 December 2021 (UTC)

Vesperius: Thanks for the thought. I don't, never having visited the place, but you are correct that an article would fit in the scheme of things. As someone who evidently has some familiarity with the cuisine, you might like to copy the general style of the Channel Islands article and create at least a Start of an article... Chiswick Chap (talk) 09:09, 24 December 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Decline and fall in Middle-earth

The article Decline and fall in Middle-earth you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Decline and fall in Middle-earth for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Cerebellum -- Cerebellum (talk) 13:21, 24 December 2021 (UTC)

Moon in fiction and List of appearances of the Moon in fiction

A suggestion:

Moving masses of content to another Wikipedia article is Okay. Thanks for starting List of appearances of the Moon in fiction.
But WP:Copying within Wikipedia still applies. It should have been noted in the history pages, and at the talk pages of both articles. Do better next time, please.
Merry Christmas and Happy New Year! 7&6=thirteen (☎) 13:01, 27 December 2021 (UTC)

7&6=thirteen - another user deleted the content and went on editing for several months, having changed the purpose of the Moon in fiction article. I went into the history and rescued the deleted content, noting the fact in the first edit comment of List of appearances. So, your remarks could be better directed, really. The alternative, which I did consider, was to revert the Moon in fiction to its pre-deletion state, but as you've found, that would have been a contested action. I think the result, that we now have a passable text article as well as the list, isn't a bad one, and we were dealing with a "determined" editor. All the best, Chiswick Chap (talk) 13:18, 27 December 2021 (UTC)

As yes. A determined user; who tears up the tracks.

I still have not recovered from the desecration of Mountain dog.

The other user finger pointed at you.

In any event, I was only trying to fix the problem, not fix the blame. Three cheers. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 15:46, 27 December 2021 (UTC)

GAN Backlog Drive – January 2022

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