Qcne

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Draft: Invenio Origin

Hello, post your comment/rejection, I made changes to the draft and resubmitted the same day - it has so far not had any further notes with regards to being approved/rejected. Hence this message. I understand the workload is heavy, but thought I will reach out and check anyway.

Based on your comment, I was able to find citations other than Times of India for all but one of the mentions on my draft - a TV series that they have produced (MasterChef India - Telugu). The wiki page of the TV series itself also lists Invenio Origin as one of the production companies, however, I was not able to pin down which source the page mentions that the mention found approval there - however, I also did notice that the wiki page of this series has quite a few citations from Times of India for other points that have been mentioned.

The only article that explicitly mentions Invenio Origin as one of the producers of the show is on Times of India. There are a couple others that makes a generalised mention and I'm not sure how those websites rank at Wikipedia in terms of credibility, hence I refrained from citing them.

Would you suggest I remove the mention of this TV series for this particular language, or is one mention of TOI out of 13 overall citations acceptable?

Thanks a bunch! SouthBlrBoy (talk) 13:01, 16 May 2024 (UTC)

Hey @SouthBlrBoy. Had a look at the sources and the majority are brief mentions so don't provide WP:SIGCOV of the company.

It might be easier if you show me three sources that all meet the following criteria:

1. From reliable newspapers/magazines (not random blogs or IMDb)
2. Are independent of the company (not press releases or pure interviews with the CEO)
3. Provide significant coverage (not fleeting mentions)
4. Gives some kind of analysis, commentary, discussion, comparison, etc. Something other than just "This company exists."

The ottplay.com source is okay: it is mostly derived from an interview with the CEO but does provide some independent commentary. A couple more sources like that would work.

Getting these sources first would allow us to establish the notability of the company.

Hope that helps! Qcne (talk) 14:17, 16 May 2024 (UTC)

Just trying to make sure I know which problem I have to solve - You're saying you'd like to see more sources that meet your mentioned criteria for Invenio Origin overall, or for the specific citation issue I mentioned above? If I am understanding you correctly, you mean Invenio Origin isn't notable yet unless I can cite at least three sources that agree with your mentioned criteria? SouthBlrBoy (talk) 16:55, 16 May 2024 (UTC)

The latter, yeah. We need to see significant coverage of the company which is independent of what the CEO says. Two or three sources like that should do it. Qcne (talk) 17:06, 16 May 2024 (UTC)

Noted. Thanks. I shall revert on this soon and reach out in case I need any guidance. SouthBlrBoy (talk) 06:47, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Hello,

I noticed that Paramvah Studios has a citation of its own website (the very first citation). I wanted to cross check with you if such citation is acceptable, because Invenio Origin does have a decent website stating who they are and the work they do. SouthBlrBoy (talk) 07:16, 23 May 2024 (UTC)

Hello, hoping I could trouble you for a bit of guidance on the above? Looking forward to your reply. Thanks!! SouthBlrBoy (talk) 13:42, 29 May 2024 (UTC)

Hi @SouthBlrBoy, sorry. I missed that message.

Primary sources are permitted if they are sourcing straightforward facts, so for example it would be fine to cite the company's own website for its number of employees or founding date.

What primary sources don't do is establish notability, because it's just the company talking about itself.

Hope that helps, but let me know if you have any more questions! Qcne (talk) 14:17, 29 May 2024 (UTC)

Hi @Qcne,

I've added a couple of citations and made minor changes. Could you please check and advise?

One issue I seem to face is that I'm not finding articles directly and only talking about the company itself (other than few in Times of India which you mentioned cannot be cited), but at the same time, projects they are part of have all made news. Almost all of the articles I find online speaks of them via their work. Is there a way to still establish that Invenio Origin is notable, because from what I know, they are part of significant mainstream work in the Kannada film industry over the last few years and are among much sought after production companies. It's like I know they are notable, but I am wondering how it can be proven. SouthBlrBoy (talk) 12:58, 9 June 2024 (UTC)

Adding to the above point, this Wikipedia article says 'When evaluating the notability of organizations or products, please consider whether they have had any significant or demonstrable effects on culture, society, entertainment, athletics, economies, history, literature, science, or education.', and Invenio Origin is a production house that certainly has had significant effects in the field of entertainment, based on the content they have helped produce/co produce. SouthBlrBoy (talk) 13:05, 9 June 2024 (UTC)

Hey @SouthBlrBoy. We would need to see proof of this significant effect in the field of entertainment, for example an independent reliable source that clearly states this in some form of discussion/review/critical analysis piece.

Your new sources you've added are okay, I think it just about squeaks over the lines, I have accepted. You can add some WP:CATEGORIES. Qcne (talk) 08:09, 12 June 2024 (UTC)

Hey, thanks a bunch @Qcne! This makes it my first wiki article. Grateful to your guidance and support, it's been good learning. I shall add the categories soon. This discussion maybe removed/archived now, I suppose? SouthBlrBoy (talk) 13:41, 12 June 2024 (UTC)

It will be shortly, but feel free to post new topics on my page any time :) Qcne (talk) 14:31, 12 June 2024 (UTC)

Draft page for review

Hi @Qcne, you kindly offered to have a look at this draft once I'd rewritten it (it's the page for Kernow Asset Management, an asset management firm).

I've had a careful look through the pages you and another user suggested, and made sure to re-write using only statements that can be backed up by independent sources. Here's the finished draft - if you could have a look over it and let me know if you think this is OK I'd be very grateful:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Hcdmdigital/sandbox

Thank you! Hcdmdigital (talk) 14:00, 5 June 2024 (UTC)

Hi @Hcdmdigital.

I'll go through your sources one by one:

1. Single reference to KAM, so not significant coverage.
2. Duplicate of above.
3. My concern with this is the independence of the bit in this journal - it's full-on praise for KAM and reads more like a PR piece. It might work, I am 50/50.
4. Duplicate of above.
5. Single reference to KAM, so not significant coverage.
6. Duplicate of above.
7. Duplicate of the Hedge Fund Journal PDF.
8. Duplicate of above.
9. Mostly an interview with Alyx, but I think this is okay as a source. Not sure about it's independence as I mentioned earlier, but I am hedging towards it being okay to use.
10. This is routine business coverage / regurgitated press release (lots of "According to Wood" and "Wood said"). I'm not seeing much independent analysis here.

Hope that helps, but I don't think you're quite there yet. Qcne (talk) 14:16, 5 June 2024 (UTC)

Hi @Qcne, thanks very much for having a look, really appreciate it. We have some other sources, podcasts and conference appearances, would those be worth including to show evidence of more coverage? What would you suggest - is it worth going ahead with the sources you think are 50/50, or should we wait longer until there's been more significant independent coverage?

Thanks again for taking the time. Hcdmdigital (talk) 12:01, 20 June 2024 (UTC)

Hi @Hcdmdigital. Podcasts - depends on what the podcast is? If it's an interview with the founder or staff, then not independent. If it's a well regarded finance podcast (I'm thinking, NPR Planet Money) which discusses the business, then that could be okay. Conference appearances wouldn't prove notability. Qcne (talk) 12:16, 20 June 2024 (UTC)

Hi @Qcne - yes just interviews, so sounds like not worth including. In that case do you think it's worth going ahead as some of the sources are okay to use or is there just not enough independent analysis? Just to add in reply to your notes on the individual sources - the ones that are just single references (such as NBIM) were included more to back up the facts I was stating in the article. Again thanks! Hcdmdigital (talk) 12:19, 20 June 2024 (UTC)

Currently? not enough independent analysis unfortunately. Qcne (talk) 18:24, 20 June 2024 (UTC)

Declined Draft

Hello - I recently submitted a Draft for a page on Austrian Chef Sebastian Frank, that was rejected by you. Could you please let me know the details necessary to fix the draft for re-submission?

Thanks, Ben Benlovesfood (talk) 10:33, 13 June 2024 (UTC)

Hi @Benlovesfood.

Wikipedia is an encyclopaedia of notable topics, as defined by our special definition of notability (see WP:NPERSON). Your draft had a few problems:

1. There were no in-line citations at all, which is a hard requirement for biographies. We need to see every single statement cited this way. See WP:BLPRS. A tutorial for making these citations is available at WP:INTREFVE.
2. A lot of the draft seemed to be original research (stuff like the description of his vegetable dishes). We prohibit original research: any information in an article should just be a summary of a reliable source which states that information. So unless a, for example, well-known culinary reviewer has spoken about his ingredients you should remove it. Even if a culinary reviewer has described his ingredients, it should be quoted and cited and not written in the Wikipedia-voice like you have done here.
3. Finally, back to that notability criteria. We need to see multiple published sources that are independent of Sebastian that are reliable and ideally secondary to establish that notability.

Hope, that helps, but let me know if you have any more questions. Qcne (talk) 10:59, 13 June 2024 (UTC)

help

hello, why my article declined. what type of source issue it has? Zastarbaba (talk) 19:39, 24 June 2024 (UTC)

Hi @Zastarbaba. You only have two sources, both primary (they link to Google itself). We need significant coverage in secondary sources. Qcne (talk) 09:09, 27 June 2024 (UTC)

Draft Rejection

Hi @Qcne, I’ve rewritten the page Restaurant Chef Pillai as per your and another user’s suggestions. Here’s the finished draft—could you please review it and let me know if it looks okay?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Restaurant_Chef_Pillai Wiki.afrinleonad (talk) 11:36, 27 June 2024 (UTC)

Hi @Wiki.afrinleonad.

It still isn't great. "each offering unique dining experiences and innovative menus" "emphasizing fresh, locally sourced ingredients and traditional cooking methods" < this is just marketing-speak.

I am not sure if the restaurant is even notable, most of the sources are interviews Qcne (talk) 11:40, 27 June 2024 (UTC)

Draft Rejection - Encrypta

in reference to Draft:Encrypta

hey, i am very new to wiki, and that too for writing article in wikipedia. i have been observing this organization for months now, and really wanted to write this article. could you help me with suggestions on what to include and what to omit? KingMaker69 (talk) 18:46, 27 June 2024 (UTC)

Hi @KingMaker69. Sorry if my comments in the help desk were unduly harsh- we get hundreds of spammers a month.

To be blunt though, your draft was basically an advert for the organisation. Wikipedia has zero interest in promoting companies, in fact that is prohibited and could get your account blocked.

Instead an article should only paraphrase or summarise what reliable, independent, secondary sources state about a subject. That means:

- not press releases;

- not interviews with the founder/employees;

- not paid promo articles;

- not from the companies own website.

Take a read of WP:NORG to understand in more detail what we require. And let me know if you have further questions. Qcne (talk) 19:46, 27 June 2024 (UTC)

Gday Qcne

I would love to get some help aligning this with what it is mean to be. I did a lot of research toward this article. The article was mainly written by me, however I have used AI to clean up the spelling and grammar etc. Thanks in advance for any advice you can give. Scottnailon (talk) 12:59, 2 July 2024 (UTC)

Hi @Scottnailon. So, firstly, you need to convert your external links in the body of the text into proper in-line citations by following the tutorial at WP:INTREFVE. External links should only appear in the External Links section. You should get in-line citations that point to a footnote for every biographical statement, and this will automatically generate a reference list for you.

Going onto the tone though - it's really obviously been written by ChatGPT. Its full of promotional language, phrases, and words that you only really find in AI-generated text (I've reviewed hundreds of AI text and can spot this really easily now). Wikipedia articles must be written from a completely dispassionate neutral point of view. i.e. Robert Nailon's contributions to bodybuilding, particularly through his photography, have left an indelible mark on the sport you would only be able to state indelible mark if you are quoting a reliable, independent source which uses that exact phrase.

The entire draft needs re-writing to be in this utterly neutral tone.

Please check WP:NPOV and WP:PEACOCK for more information.

Let me know if you have further questions. Qcne (talk) 13:08, 2 July 2024 (UTC)