Talk:GBA (disambiguation)

Requested move 13 April 2018

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: no consensus to move the page as proposed, per the discussion below; the primary topic redirect is reaffirmed at this time, although this can be revisited if relative usage shifts in the future. Dekimasuよ! 01:28, 20 April 2018 (UTC)

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GBA (disambiguation) → GBA – It is not reasonable that GBA redirects to a video game, forcing people looking for other GBAs to hop through Game Boy Advance to get to the others. I do get it that gamers might think so but they are not most of our readers Jytdog (talk) 12:56, 13 April 2018 (UTC)

• Oppose With all due respect, the amount of gamers who type in GBA is probably much larger than any of the other far more niche uses for the acronym. It is not a big deal either way, but I fail to see the proof that Game Boy Advance isn't the primary topic for GBA._{ZXCVBNM (TALK)} 13:47, 13 April 2018 (UTC)
• Oppose, "GBA" is a widely used acronym for the Game Boy Advance system, over any other acronyms. A quick google search of "gba" can prove that. ~ P*h3i (📨) 02:56, 14 April 2018 (UTC)

• "a quick google search" is probably the worst research method in the world to test for long-term significance. Not only does the sample size fail to include literary and reference resources from anything older than the last few years, but the results can be tainted by Google algorithms that display topics of interest to you, and your estimate of relative usage is also tainted by your internal biases. In other words, Google knows you're into video games and is giving you video game results, drawing from only recent years. -- Netoholic @ 06:10, 14 April 2018 (UTC)

• @Netoholic: While I do agree that Google searches are not a means of determining notability, a browsing history and cookie-less or Incognito Google search of "gba" will also net you exclusively items about the Game Boy Advance. "GBA" as an abbreviation is extremely common; it's the same as how "NES" redirects to Nintendo Entertainment System because it's widely referred to as that, while "GCN" takes you to the wide disambiguation as the GameCube is not as widely known from that abbreviation. Simply because most readers of Wikipedia don't play video games is no means that changes notability status. ~ P*h3i (📨) 08:27, 14 April 2018 (UTC)

• To editor P*h3i: - see below, this is the only Game Boy unit with a three-letter acronym which redirects to it. That demonstrates that something is wrong in this case. -- Netoholic @ 15:42, 14 April 2018 (UTC)

• To editor Netoholic: "GBA" is the only widely used acronym in the examples you've supplied. ~ P*h3i (📨) 01:14, 15 April 2018 (UTC)

• You've provided no evidence to support that view, but I have provided evidence contradicting it below. -- Netoholic @ 02:37, 15 April 2018 (UTC)

• Just do an incognito Google search of the above items, or literally any other test of notability. "GBP" is obviously better realized as Great British Pound. "GBL" is best realized as gamma-Butyrolactone. "GBA" is best realized as Game Boy Advance. All the evidence you've supplied thus far is either circumstantial, extremely poorly researched or simply just wrong. ~ P*h3i (📨) 04:53, 15 April 2018 (UTC)

• Support - The WP:PRIMARYTOPIC is "more likely than all the other topics combined—to be the topic sought when a reader searches for that term". In this case, such a common abbreviation means that none of the topics on the DAB page can make that claim and that none is primary for that abbreviation. The video game does not have long-term significance either, as it was manufactured for about 9 years, and has been discontinued for that time. Its significance is certain to wane, whereas older topics which are also legitimately be abbreviated "GBA" will still remain and more topics will come into being. There is simply no valid justification, and it is only the gamer fanbase which would ever consider this above so many other topics. This RM is not about downplaying Game Boy Advance, its about establishing that "GBA" has many other meanings and we're doing a disservice to readers. -- Netoholic @ 06:08, 14 April 2018 (UTC)

• @Netoholic: This argument is pretty much null. The fact that the system is old doesn't affect notability in the slightest. The GBA is literally rated "High-importance" on the WikiProject's scale. I also think you fail to understand that this is a video game system, not simply a video game. The fact that it has been discontinued making it non-notable is ludicrous; NES redirects to Nintendo Entertainment System and has been discontinued for a long time more than the GBA, and is one of the most influential machines ever created. By your logic, anything video game-related with a redirect should be disbanded, which is absolutely insane. ~ P*h3i (📨) 08:27, 14 April 2018 (UTC)

• This is inconsistent with other units in the Game Boy family, there is no call for this to be an exception:

• GB does not redirect to Game Boy
• GBP does not redirect to Game Boy Pocket
• GBL does not redirect to Game Boy Light
• GBC does not redirect to Game Boy Color
• GBM does not redirect to Game Boy Micro

GBASP does redirect to Game Boy Advance SP, but there is literally no other usage for that acronym. -- Netoholic @ 15:40, 14 April 2018 (UTC)

• @Netoholic: There is an extremely obvious call for the GBA to be an exception, the fact that the acronym is widely used. No one says "GBL" and refers to the Game Boy Light, but everyone says "GBA" to refer to the Game Boy Advance. I also think you fail to understand that the Game Boy Advance is not a variant of the original Game Boy; it is an entirely new console. Like your last argument, this argument is pretty much null. The Game Boy Advance is clearly the primary topic here -- just like "3DS" redirects straight to Nintendo 3DS. ~ P*h3i (📨) 01:12, 15 April 2018 (UTC)

• "everyone"? Jytdog (talk) 03:21, 15 April 2018 (UTC)

• Yes, everyone; see below. ~ P*h3i (📨) 04:53, 15 April 2018 (UTC)

• Abbreviations should be determined on a case by case basis as each abbreviation is unique. However since consistency was brought up here is why the other abbreviations don't just go straight to their gaming console counterpart:

• GB / Game Boy - The abbreviation GB is also used in reference to the United Kingdom aka Great Britain and that name is used heavily for their participation during the Olympics. In any case a sovereign country would take precedent over a gaming console as the primary topic. Another notable place is Green Bay, Wisconsin home of the Green Bay Packers NFL team. The terms Gigabit (Gb), Gigabyte (GB), etc. are also very notable more so than Game Boy.
• GBP / Game Boy Pocket - Because when most people search GBP they are searching for the British currency Pound Sterling. If they are not looking for the currency then the second primary topic of GBP would be Green Bay Packers NFL team. In addition to Game Boy Pocket there was also the Game Boy Player (also GBP). My note for Game Boy Light would also apply here.
• GBL / Game Boy Light - This is a variant of the original Game Boy. Hardware variants like these can be notable in their own right but are still overall considered to be part of the main product line (in this case Game Boy) because it doesn't have its own exclusive games and plays the same games as the original Game Boy.
• GBC / Game Boy Color - GBC just like GBP was used for multiple Game Boy products, while more commonly associated with Game Boy Color it can also stand for Game Boy Camera. Outside of the gamer universe it also is used by a very notable broadcasting group in the United States like Granite Broadcasting.
• GBM / Game Boy Micro - Name and abbreviation only notable when talking about the specific model/hardware the abbreviation wasn't widespread because the Game Boy Micro is a variation of the Game Boy Advance. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 09:11, 15 April 2018 (UTC)

• Oppose. The parenthetical "(disambiguation)" is useful to readers who use the autocomplete feature. It makes it clear that the page is not an actual Wikipedia article. Nine Zulu queens (talk) 07:11, 14 April 2018 (UTC)

• @Nine Zulu queens: A note -- this discussion is about whether "GBA" should redirect to "Game Boy Advance" or whether it should direct straight to the disambiguation; not whether the existing disambiguation should have the "(disambiguation)" title. ~ P*h3i (📨) 12:32, 15 April 2018 (UTC)

• Oppose, clear primary topic. The other GBA entries receive extremely low traffic so the majority of readers will not be hindered. The only other article that receives significant views is God Bless America, which doesn't even mention the acronym and shouldn't be on the dab page in the first place. Either way the Game Boy Advance article still receives ~5x more views than it. —Xezbeth (talk) 15:17, 14 April 2018 (UTC)

• Yeah, I've just removed God Bless America and K.F.C. Germinal Beerschot from the page as I couldn't find the term GBA in any reliable resources or their pages themselves. ~ P*h3i (📨) 04:53, 15 April 2018 (UTC)

• Oppose - Clear primary topic. Sergecross73 msg me 02:36, 15 April 2018 (UTC)
• Oppose - Game Boy Advance is the clear primary topic here. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 08:09, 15 April 2018 (UTC)
• Support – WP:PRIMARYTOPIC has two criteria (1) more likely than all the other topics combined and (2) long-term significance. Game Boy Advanced fails both. Given the long list of alternative subjects on this disambiguation page, I find it hard to believe that it is of more interest than all other alternative topics combined. Second, consumer technology has a relatively short half-life. This particular device was discontinued in 2010 and interest in it will undoubtedly decrease over time. Boghog (talk) 17:08, 15 April 2018 (UTC)
• Support this move, and repointing nearly all non-unique acronyms to the disambiguation pages. Since GBA means glucocerebrosidase in my world, it's a bit surprising to me that there are several editors who believe that a toy that was discontinued in 2010 is "obviously" the main use for this acronym, but I take the fact that their immediate thought and my immediate thought are different as more evidence that neither acronym is The One True™ meaning. WhatamIdoing (talk) 19:37, 15 April 2018 (UTC)
  • Calling the GameBoy Advance a "toy" is similar to calling Black Panther (film) a "kid's movie". Sure, that might be a large subset of the audience, but it understates the amount of mass appeal it has/had. Compare and contrast to a gene that is solely relevant for scientists. I am not convinced that it would be the primary topic for a majority of Wikipedia users, even if I appreciate that it has more significance within the scientific world._{ZXCVBNM (TALK)} 06:46, 19 April 2018 (UTC)
• Support While GBA is mainly known as the device, perhaps in 5 years the GBA gene will have more interest. I agree with Jytdog's proposal. --Frmorrison (talk) 16:47, 18 April 2018 (UTC)
  • Highly unlikely, considering there's still a massive amount of interest in the NES, a system far older than the GBA._{ZXCVBNM (TALK)} 06:42, 19 April 2018 (UTC)
• Oppose. Remember, in a redirect discussion it's not just the notability of the topic, but how likely the name of the title in question is to be used to refer to the article in question. Hence HRC doesn't redirect to Hillary Rodham Clinton. GBA is ubiquitously used for the Game Boy Advance. Red Slash 21:39, 18 April 2018 (UTC)

Agreed that HRC should not redirect to Hillary Rodham Clinton. By analogy, GBA should not redirect to Game Boy Advance. GBA is only ubiquitously used by gaming fanatics. Most people (ahem adults ;-) have never heard of this device. Why should someone looking for Glucocerebrosidase, or any of the other valid initialisms be redirect to an obsolete game console? Boghog (talk) 22:39, 18 April 2018 (UTC)

HRC is a great example. It goes to the disambig page. Yep. Jytdog (talk) 23:50, 18 April 2018 (UTC)

Discussion

• Some actual stats: per the redirect view stats, GBA actually gets only about 6 uses per day, fewer even than gba at 8. The views of GBA tracks very closely with views of GBA (disambiguation), showing that people are hitting the Game Boy Advance page and quickly clicking to the DAB page link rather than staying. -- Netoholic @ 16:48, 14 April 2018 (UTC)
  • Some more actual stats: this is a comparison on all pages' pageviews on the GBA disambiguation page that exceed 1,000 per day (very few). It's pretty clear that "Game Boy Advance" gets majority page views here, further proving that it's the primary topic in this context. In addition to this, your argument has no conclusive evidence -- these statistics could be non-correlative. ~ P*h3i (📨) 04:53, 15 April 2018 (UTC)
    • The popularity of the article doesn't really speak to the relevance of any given initialism. By that logic, RW should point to Ray Wilkins (which got more than 600,000 page views recently), but nobody would think that's such a good idea. WhatamIdoing (talk) 19:52, 15 April 2018 (UTC)
• Nobody disputes that in the bubble of gamerville, GBA is "game boy advance". The problem is that the world is much bigger than that bubble, and outside of that bubble, GBA means many different things. What happened with the main GBA redirect, and is happening in the !votes above, is the kind of thing that people make fun of Wikipedia for. Jytdog (talk) 03:14, 15 April 2018 (UTC)

• @Jytdog: Even outside the whimsical land of "Gamerville", "GBA" is considered the main colloquialism for "Game Boy Advance":

1. Comparison of links on GBA (disambiguation) that exceed 1,000 pageviews daily
2. An incognito/cookie-less Google search of "GBA" shows that Game Boy Advance is clearly the most popular use of GBA
3. An incognito/cookie-less search of the New York Times shows that the only result that has an existing Wikipedia article is the Game Boy Advance
4. An incognito/cookie-less search of Fox News shows that the only two results that have Wikipedia pages are Game Boy Advance (140k total pageviews in 90 days) and Glucocerebrosidase (6k total pageviews in 90 days (around 1/24 of the Game Boy Advance's))
5. An incognito/cookie-less search of The Washington Post shows that the only results with dedicated Wikipedia pages listed on the disambig page are pages relating to the Game Boy Advance

Surely this is enough proof? ~ P*h3i (📨) 04:53, 15 April 2018 (UTC)

Facepalm.

My Tor-browser search of NYT brought up as its first hit, an article on 23andme that referenced GBA as an acronym for Glucocerebrosidase. (How did you miss that? (not a rhetorical question)) It brought up several hits for the old basketball association, and others for things not in WP. Yes there were some for gameboy. Most of the hits were to articles about things that happened before Gameboy or Gameboy Advance existed.

That WaPo search was similar, and brought up the same number of hit of god bless america as game boy but you just did this. This is classic tendentious behavior.

I get it that video games are a big deal to some people. I get that. WP is far far bigger than the gamerville bubble. Yes it is quaint to see its natives so flabbergasted that the real world exists and has existed far longer than there have even been video games. Again, what is happening here is what people mock WP for. Jytdog (talk) 13:11, 15 April 2018 (UTC)

Oppose A Google search of "GBA" gives me two pages of Game boy Advance related websites. GBA should keep directing to Game Bo Advance.Blue Pumpkin Pie (talk) 15:10, 19 April 2018 (UTC)

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.