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About disambiguation pages

Is a disambiguation page which only links to deleted/non-existent pages eligible for speedy deletion under G8? CoolSkittle (talk) 14:19, 13 October 2018 (UTC)

Hi CoolSkittle. I would say no, Wikipedia:Criteria for speedy deletion#G8 does not apply. But some administators may use G8 in some cases. Do you have an example in mind? PrimeHunter (talk) 16:36, 13 October 2018 (UTC)

It is eligible under G6, not G8. Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 16:42, 13 October 2018 (UTC)

I would look at "View history" to see if the disambiguation page is recently created or past dated. If new, another editor may be preparing to add the linked pages, and so I would recommend keeping. Otherwise if the page has no recent activity, then proceed with deletion. Regards, JoeHebda (talk) 18:39, 13 October 2018 (UTC)

signature

hey sorry follow up question, can you give me code for a highlighted talk? i have code for my name highlighted but i the hightlight in a different color, also is it against policy to just have your name and no talk like thishandatoe 15:03, 8 October 2018 (UTC)? thanks

It's fine to not have a talk link. -A lad insane (Channel 2) 18:45, 8 October 2018 (UTC)

You could use something like [[User_talk:Handatoe|<span style="background-color: #ffffcc; color: #005500">talk</span>]] which produces talk with a green word on a light yellowish background or you could use other colours. Just make sure you're using foreground and background colours with enough contrast between them. For example, I'd suggest using a lighter pink and darker blue in the userpage link, like this: handatoe ([[User:Handatoe|<span style="background-color: #ffccff; color: # 000066">handatoe</span>]]). The darker background will make the foreground look slightly lighter than it is, which might be useful if you want to put the next to some non-highlighted link and not have one look noticeably darker than the other. – Pretended leer (talk) 19:28, 8 October 2018 (UTC)

thanks man <span style="background-color: maroon">[[User:UserBob|<span style="color: greenyellow">UserBob</span>]] (talk) 13:46, 11 October 2018 (UTC) but it's still code

@Handatoe: On your preferences page, under the box where you set your signature, you need to turn on the "Treat the above as wiki markup" box. Otherwise, the code will simply display as plain text. – numbermaniac 01:23, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

"Invalid CSRF format?"

I recently attempted to upload an image, under the photos of deceased persons section, and filled out the copyright form as best I could based on my understanding (it is my understanding that someone more experienced and with the proper user permissions looks it over before giving the file the final "okay"), however as soon as I finished filling out all parameters and hit the upload button, a little pop-up said that it couldn't work because of an "Invalid CSRF format". What is this and how do I fix it? WesSirius (talk) 02:35, 12 October 2018 (UTC)

How long did it take you to fill out the box? Sometimes, if you leave it alone for a couple hours and come back to it, then try to submit an edit or upload, you'll get an "Invalid CSRF token" error. It's happened to me when trying to make an edit with Twinkle on articles that have been open for a while. – numbermaniac 01:24, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

Adding a character on Wikipedia

Dear helper

I know one an aspiring character , he is a journalist and econmeist He has been very successful in his work as he now almost the CEO of a company , as he writes for for an Arabic well known E newspaper red by Arabs around the globe , he has PHD in accounting and he is going to start his own business very soon as will he has been on TV interviews and radios many times , he has more than 5,000 followers on twitter — Preceding unsigned comment added by Abdulrahim AJ (talk • contribs) 02:44, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

You will find the notability criteria at WP:BIO. --David Biddulph (talk) 02:48, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

When I see the words "aspiring", "almost", and "very soon", in your question, I suspect the answer must be "No, not yet. Wait until he is notable." Maproom (talk) 08:12, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

machine

i alos whant to make doremon117.237.217.7 (talk) 02:20, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

Sorry, IP user, I have no idea what you are asking. Please make your question clearer. --ColinFine (talk) 09:00, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

NRMA VS NRMA INSURANCE

Hi all,

I work for NRMA Insurance ( IAG) and trying to set up our own NRMA Insurance wiki page. At the moment there is an NRMA page which relates to Motoring and Services / Roadside assistance.

Its very confusing as people see NRMA as the same brand but really they are different.

How do I go about a separate NRMA Insurance page as the reality is that it should be two different pages. There is info about NRMA Insurance on the motoring and services page and have tried cutting and passing it before to create a NRMA Insurance page but it doesn't let me.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

Nick — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nrmainsurance (talk • contribs) 05:18, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

See Insurance_Australia_Group for the parent company. See NRMA Insurance for the block log of repeated attempts to create the article. You will have to make a good case to get an article created. Regards, Ariconte (talk) 06:17, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

You are blocked until change Username, as names are for individuals, not companies or groups of people. Also read WP:PAID to learn the extra steps required when a person is employed by what they want to write about. David notMD (talk) 09:41, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

Editing

How do we change edit to edit source on the plant earth research page? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Robertoeford (talk • contribs) 03:01, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

Note: this appears to relate to The Wikipedia Adventure, rather than to an article. --ColinFine (talk) 13:25, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

Revenues including references for (international) companies

Hello hosts,

I usually edit in the german wikipedia, so please forgive me my language skills.

In some of the english articles about companies, I'd like to translate into german, no revenue is shown. I'd prefer to add this information in the english articles before translating them with notables references.

As sources I only know Bloomberg and maybe Forbes, but could you recommend me a general approach to fill in this gap in the articles? Maybe there's already a Wikipedia Help page about this question?

Specific example: DigitalOcean

Many thanks for the help. Best regards --Hundsrose (talk) 15:59, 11 October 2018 (UTC)

Hi Hundsrose, as far as I know all companies that are traded on stock exchanges (listed companies) are required to make their annual reports and audits available to the public. According to the English Wikipedia's rules about using primary sources such basic uncontroversial facts and statistics can be sourced from the company's own publications. However if the subject is a private (unlisted) company such information is often simply not available at all. Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 18:10, 11 October 2018 (UTC)

Hello Roger (Dodger67) (talk), thanks for the fast reply and your hints. Is there a place where can I figure out if a company is traded on a stock exchange or do I have to rely on the company webpage? I guess DigitalOcean is not stock listed, but I would like to be sure about that. And also in this case, is there a way to add similiar public information for wikipedia articles about companies to be more transparent? Thanks for the help. --Hundsrose (talk) 18:35, 11 October 2018 (UTC)

Hello, Hundsrose. Bloomberg is an excellent source of information about the structure of a business, and they say that DigitalOcean is a private company. That means their stock is not traded on stock exchanges. This company blog post from early this year says that an IPO is part of their long term planning, but I can see no evidence that it it has happened or is imminent. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 22:36, 11 October 2018 (UTC)

Hello Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it, I can't see the information that DigitalOcean is a private company from the Bloomberg page: DigitalOcean Snapshot. Maybe you can assist me once more? The blog is not only interesting because of their IPO plans. In the first section, the author claims: "We are rapidly approaching $200M in annual recurring revenue ..." . One of the points for the notability of new company articles in german wikipedia is a revenue of minimum EUR100M (about $115M). Would you understand this sentence as a revenue bigger than $115M and therefore notable in german wikipedia (also in case the blog counts as reference source)? --Hundsrose (talk) 23:41, 11 October 2018 (UTC)

This Company Overview from Bloomberg identifies the company as private, in the categories at the bottom of the page, and also in the URL. Contrast this with the Bloomberg listing for Ford Motor Company which includes the stock market ticker and various stock price statistics at the top of the page. Companies traded on stock exchanges are always listed this way. As for the issues regarding German Wikipedia, I cannot offer much help because I do not know their standards. It is up to them whether they accept a self-published blog's statement about that company's revenue as a reliable source. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 00:38, 12 October 2018 (UTC)

Hello Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it! Thanks for the eureka effects. My questions have been answered :) --Hundsrose (talk) 13:28, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

Where to appeal a decision

An administrator has deleted an article I wrote because he says I have taken material from non-free sources without permission. I believe he is mistaken. Where should I bring this up so that a third party with authority would look at it and compare what I wrote with the quite different text I am accused of borrowing from? Thank you. deisenbe (talk) 11:19, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

You may ask the deleting administrator on his/her talk page. —AE (talk • contributions) 11:23, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

There is already a lengthy debate about extent of copyright infringement at Deisenbe's Talk page, so taking it up with the Administrator (Editor?) who triggered the Speedy Deletion does not move the problem forward.David notMD (talk) 14:13, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

The question was also asked and answered at #Where to bring a matter up above below. --David Biddulph (talk) 15:51, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

Archived.— Vchimpanzee • talk • contributions • 21:27, 25 December 2018 (UTC)

User page deleted?

Hello, I think my user page no longer exists. I can log in via my pc, but have seen a notice saying the page no longer exists. I'm afraid I don't know what to do. Can you help? *ptrs4all* (talk) 15:31, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

Hello, your user page has not been deleted you can see it here User:*ptrs4all*. Theroadislong (talk) 15:41, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

Thank you. I think I got myself in a pickle!*ptrs4all* (talk) 16:56, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

Where to bring a matter up

Someone I believe an administrator has claimed that an article I wrote (which he deleted) made unfair use of non-free material. I believe he was mistaken. Without going into the details, where should I bring this up so as to, in essence, appeal what he did, to have someone else look at it? Thanks. deisenbe (talk) 16:35, 12 October 2018 (UTC)

I see that this has already been discussed at length here, where, it seems to me, all your complaints have been fully answered. Maproom (talk) 16:44, 12 October 2018 (UTC)

... and the 2 articles in question have been listed at WP:Copyright problems, so will be investigated there. --David Biddulph (talk) 16:49, 12 October 2018 (UTC)

My complaints have NOT been fully answered. I want someone to actually look at the 80% that I am alleged to have copied, put what I wrote next to what I supposedly copied from, and tell me where the copying is. Is it that I took the list of ten monunents they are focusing on from their Web page even though what I wrote about each monument is, with a few exceptions, original?

I would like to add that this whole thing has been brought up in a discorteous, even insulting way, as if I were some cockroach who crawled out of the woodwork to steal things and waste your time. I don’t believe I deserve that treatment, nor is it the way I understand WP editors are supposed to interact.

Finally, my question here has not been answered. Specifically where may I defend myself? Thank you. deisenbe (talk) 17:31, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

Since the articles, as already mentioned, are listed at WP:Copyright problems, somebody who is experienced in copyright matters and uninvolved in the previou discussion will investigate the issue (and actually look at the content you are alleged to have copied). --bonadea contributions talk 17:35, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

Need help designing / editing an infobox

Hi all, I need some guidance on how to design an infobox from scratch or edit an existing one. I am currently going through these pages - Manual of Style/Infoboxes, Wikipedia:Template namespace and Help:Designing infoboxes but was hoping if somebody could give me an easier way of doing it.

My purpose is to make an infobox for Indian parliament committees along the lines of this one - Template:Infobox U.S. congressional committee. I need to change the template data and corresponding documentation to ensure that the references are lined up according to the indian data and should not link back to the american ones. How to do that ?

Hoping for an easy answer. Cheers --Politicoindian (talk) 22:45, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

Code of conduct when covering corporate scandals

Hi, I've started a new article on the Danske Bank money laundering scandal, as it's obviously notable by now. I also think an objective article on this is badly needed and would ask for anyone interested to help build the article. My only question is, if there are any specific codes of conduct when covering corporations? As an article on the topic of corporate fraud it looks similar to the Wells Fargo account fraud scandal. Thanks. Blomsterhagens (talk) 21:32, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

Hello, Blomsterhagens. I'm not sure what you mean by a Code of Conduct. The constraints are the same as for any other article: find reliably published sources, independent of the subject if possible, and report only what is in those sources. Do not use any language which might be seen as evaluative (positive or negative) unless you are explicitly quoting a specific source. Do not attempt any sort of argumentation or conclusion except what is actually in a single source (i.e., avoid original research). Include sources from all sides of the issue, giving appropriate weight if there is more material available on one side or another. --ColinFine (talk) 22:51, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

adding citation (and then adding the citation to the reference list)

I am not clear how to addition citations when I edit and then how to add those citations to the Reference section in the formation of the reference section (see case reports).

David

Welcome to Wikipedia, and thanks for wanting to make it better and for wanting to add citations for your additions. Please read WP:REFB, it is the getting started guide for referencing. If you have additional questions, please don't hesitate to ask. RudolfRed (talk) 23:36, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

Page update

Hi I was hoping you could update the Saracens Past players page on your site, I was a member of the Saracens Squad during the 1997/8 season

I am mentioned in the Statbunker page http://rugby.statbunker.com/competitions/getCompClubSquad?comp_id=41&club_id=54

I am George Luck — Preceding unsigned comment added by George Luck (talk • contribs) 23:24, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

Hello George. We don't appear to have a page (or rather Article) titled 'Saracens past players' (which is why an attempt to link it shows in red): the nearest I can find is Section 5.4 of the Saracens F.C. article, called Notable former players – is this what you meant?

If so, you'll notice that every one of the names in that list is a blue wikilink to a complete Wikipedia article about that player, and to have such an article means the person concerned is "notable" in the special Wikipedia sense, which is that enough material for an article about them has been found in several published Reliable sources. Such material needs to be discussion or description extended over several paragraphs, not just passing mentions or inclusions in lists, which are useful for confirming individual facts, but not for demonstrating notability. The particular criteria that would apply to you as a Rugby player are detailed at Wikipedia:Notability (sports).

As far as I can tell (though I haven't checked every article), all of the players in the list have also represented their countries at international level. The link you've provided seems on investigation to show only that a "G. Luck" played in one game for Saracens, for 43 minutes, in the 1997-8 season.

I'm sure that there are many other past Sarries players who, like you, are not in that list: Wikipedia does not usually attempt to list every single person who falls into any given category, because it is not intended to be a comprehensive directory (see Wikipedia:Not), and because it would often be either enormously difficult or outright impossible to do so. {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 90.217.102.65 (talk) 01:54, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

How to access Twinkle?

I have enabled Twinkle but how can I access it?Md.Ali25 04:24, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Hello again Md.Ali25 and it's good to see you continuing to ask questions.

In the desktop interface, Twinkle manifests as a tab named "TW" with a pull-down list in the top menu of the page. It looks, though, like you may be using the mobile interface, which I generally avoid. I just tried it on mobile and I can't find any evidence of Twinkle functions. So, for you to access it, I am going to suggest that you go to the bottom of the page and select "Desktop" to switch views. — jmcgnh^{(talk) (contribs)} 04:58, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Page move request

Hi,

I work at the History of Cinema Museum in Dubai, UAE. The previous nae of the museum was Dubai Moving Image Museum. We need to have the previous page moved to History Of Cinema Museum. All company documents show the new name. Please allow us to submit the said documents as proof. Further more the new website is https://hocmuseum.com/ All other content on the page should remain the same. We need to make the Wikipedia move to boost SEO for our new site. I have tried to make the page move request using the instructions on Wikipedia but I cant understand the instructions.

Kindly assist with this.

Regards — Preceding unsigned comment added by HOCMuseum (talk • contribs) 06:16, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Hi HOCMuseum and welcome to the Teahouse. I've moved the page for you. Joseph2302 (talk) 06:52, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Although your username is the name of a company, which is not permitted. You'll need to change it, see instructions at Wikipedia: Changing username. Also, the purpose of Wikipedia isn't to help your SEO. Joseph2302 (talk) 06:54, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Erase and Forget - notability question

Hi, I would be grateful for feedback from experienced editors on draft submission Erase and Forget for a film, which I've just had rejected. This is a film that screened at two major film festivals and was nominated for an award at one. As evidence of notability I included full length reviews from third party sources including The Guardian, Financial Times, The Times, Frieze magazine etc. The person who the film is about, Bo Gritz, is also notable and has a lengthy Wikipedia page.

I don't know what more I can add to this, other than more reviews, but after 18 years of programming cinemas, I can easily pick out other films on Wikipedia that are arguably less notable! Would be grateful for any tips on this. With many thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by JKHBlair (talk • contribs) 22:16, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse, JKHBlair. Please limit yourself to debating the notabilty of this specific topic. If you start saying "but films X, Y and Z are even less notable!" then your fellow editors are highly likely to react very negatively. Please abandon that line of argument, since you are an advocate for including this film. I cannot access the Financial Times review but the two Guardian reviews are possible indications of notabilty. A problem is that the subject of the film, Bo Gritz, is widely perceived by reliable sources as a fringe, extremist figure in U.S. politics. I think that I am stating the obvious, and you should be aware that such articles will get a heightened level of scrutiny, for very good reasons. So, use only the very best reliable sources for your draft article, and consider adding this content to the Gritz biography instead, if other editors concur that a separate article about this film is not appropriate at this time. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 04:54, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Thank you for your reply Cullen28 and I apologise for my initial response. It took me completely by surprise that the Erase and Forget page would be rejected so quickly - within an hour or two of submission - while the other page I'm working on takes so long to be reviewed! However, I am still learning the ways of all this. I will attempt resubmission as there are more third party reviews that can be added that I hope would show notability of Erase and Forget - from Sight and Sound which is the key film criticism magazine in the UK, Time Out, Evening Standard newspaper etc. There are also interviews on BBC World Service and Russia Today, which I hadn't added as was concerned they would be viewed as 'promotional'. Several of the independent reviews mention that the film functions as a subtle analysis of some aspects of recent and contemporary American politics, so I can also make that clearer in the entry as I think this may be a reason for it having its own page. It's not a biography. Thanks for your advice. JKHBlair (talk) 09:53, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Ishango bone

I would like to contest the statement that the line of primes is there by "coincidence", I would like to show you a photo of how they might have discovered "different" numbers ( what we call primes ) just by arranging similar, roundish objects into rectangles. How does one submit a photo ? Cheers, Martin Dymond — Preceding unsigned comment added by The Nit (talk • contribs) 12:32, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Hey The Nit. This first thing to establish is where you are getting this information from. If it is from a source that meets Wikipedia's standards for reliability, usually things like newspapers, magazines, books and scholarly journals, then it may be appropriate to include in an article. If however, this is your own theory or one from a generic website or similar forum by non-experts, then it is most likely not appropriate for inclusion at this time. GMG^talk 13:09, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

HG

How hard is Huggle? Thegooduser Let's Chat 🍁 20:32, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

Greetings Thegooduser and Welcome to the Teahouse. Even though I have not used Huggle, you can learn more about it here. Regards, JoeHebda (talk) 13:16, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Question about links to Wikipedia articles

Let's say I'm writing an article about a Harvard professor, and in the first paragraph I link to Harvard's article, then I find myself referring to Harvard many times, including the information table and photos descriptions, how many times should I link?

Thanks in advance! AGF (talk) 00:00, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Agf2, Good question.

This advice may help: MOS:REPEATLINK

Generally, a link should appear only once in an article, but if helpful for readers, a link may be repeated in infoboxes, tables, image captions, footnotes, hatnotes, and at the first occurrence after the lead. S Philbrick(Talk) 00:16, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Thanks for the answer. AGF (talk) 14:35, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Concerning RfAs

Hello, I'm Rebestalic.

I'm here for the fourth time (I'm a mainstay, am I not?) with the question: why are RfAs so stressful and so much like political campaigns?

Seriously. Why?

Thank you, Rebestalic (talk) 06:28, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Hey Rebestalic. This is a subject where you're probably going to get very different answers from different people depending on who you ask, and although that is a feeling among many users that the process is less than ideal, there is little agreement on why and how one might go about improving it.

What can be said with some certainty is that the smaller the project is, the more congenial their RfA process is. For example, the English Wikiquote only has about 500 active users, and it's RfAs are comparatively low key affairs. Projects like Wikibooks, don't even really have a specialized process for requesting administrator rights, and instead have a single page for requesting any right, including administrator and bureaucrat (the users who assign administrative privileges).

So it's fairly easy to draw the conclusion that, for whatever reason, the larger a project gets, and the more users participate in these types of discussions, the more contentious they tend to be, for whatever reason, and as the largest such project, the English Wikipedia would be singularly affected by such a phenomenon. GMG^talk 13:28, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

I totally agree with the above, and the politics analogy is apt. Mayoral campaigns in big cities are ridden with dirty tactics and high emotions, whereas I know a mayor from a rural town (<100 inhabitants) who literally drew the short straw when inhabitants decided who would be the only candidate that year (being mayor of a small town brings almost no pay, so it is just a hassle that goes to anyone hates paperwork the least). A lot of people have a lots of ideas about RfA reforms, but many of those proposals are radically opposite to each other. Tigraan^{Click here to contact me} 16:14, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Would it be possible to add artist Adolpho Simeon to Wikipedia?

Would it be possible to add artist Adolpho Simeon to Wikipedia? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mary Anne Beauchamp1 (talk • contribs) 16:27, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Hello, Mary Annr Beachamp1, and welcome to the Teahouse. The process of "adding [someone] to Wikipedia" is better described as "writing an article about": there are lists of people or other entities, but they are nearly always lists of people or entities which Wikipedia already has articles about.

So your question comes down to "Could Wikipedia have an article about Adolph Simeon?" The answer depends entirely on whether there is enough material about him, written and published independently of him and his associates, to base an article on: the Wikipedia jargon for this is whether he is notable. For this purpose, nothing written or published by Simeon or his associates would count (including anything based on an interview with him): we need places where people who have no connection with him have chosen to publish material about him in some length.

If there are no such sources, then he is not currently notable as Wikipedia uses the term, and no article on him will be accepted, however it is written. If he does meet the criteria, then an article can be written about him. There are three ways you might make that happen: each has some disadvantages. The least work for you is to add an entry to requested articles; however, there is no guarantee that a volunteer editor will be moved to take up your suggestion, and many suggested articles language there apparently forever. The option that involves most work from you, but is surest if you make the effort, is to write it yourself. Creating a new article is one of the harder tasks, and I would advise you to take it slowly, and start by editing existing articles as you get to know Wikipedia. The essay your first article is invaluable if you decide to take that path.

The third option, in between the other two, is to enlist another editor to work with you on it: probably the best way to do that is to ask at a suitable WikiProject: maybe WikiProject Arts, or there may be a more specific one that fits. --ColinFine (talk) 18:00, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Change Title

May I ask how can I change the title? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Yoshiaki Yuki (talk • contribs) 18:14, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

To change the title of a page, the process is to move it. --David Biddulph (talk) 18:22, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

... but if you were thinking of moving your sandbox to mainspace as an article,you certainly mustn't move it, even if you were able to. It has no wikilinks and more importantly no references. Please read the advice against autobiography. If you want to write an article about another subject, please read the advice at WP:Your first article. - David Biddulph (talk) 18:26, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Regarding adding image to an article

Please help me with the detailed process of adding image to an article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Uniquesweet (talk • contribs) 19:29, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse, Uniquesweet. Please read Help:Pictures and feel free to ask more specific followup questions. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 20:11, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Is this ok?

If someone posted this to another editor's talk page to seek their help is it ok or is it canvassing or something else?

"Someone seems to be ignoring criticism and filling a certain talk page with naval gazing. I'm pretty sure that's a violation of some rule or another. I'm not saying there's enough umbilical scar tissue observation at the moment to justify an ANI thread, but the way things are going... Well, let's just say there seem likely to be multiple methods of halting the momentum of that talk page."

It seems to me like they are are trying shut down discussion, not trying to broaden participation, especially since the editor they posted it to is already involved. Morgan Leigh | Talk 22:59, 13 October 2018 (UTC)

As long as you know when to stop, you can get away with almost anything at Wikipedia. It's not the mistake which is a matter of being blocked or banned, but persisting in that mistake. Exceptions: outing and legal threats. Tgeorgescu (talk) 14:00, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

Tgeorgescu, you are presently involved in disputing me in the same matter as the quoted user so I don't think it's appropriate for you to answer this question. Morgan Leigh | Talk 23:16, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

Try the following good advice, from a well respected editor - ":As long as you know when to stop, you can get away with almost anything at Wikipedia. It's not the mistake which is a matter of being blocked or banned, but persisting in that mistake. Exceptions: outing and legal threats." -Roxy, in the middle. wooF 07:35, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Roxy, you are also presently involved in disputing me in the same matter as the quoted user so I don't think it's appropriate for you to answer this question. Morgan Leigh | Talk 22:32, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Yes I know, but it is really really good advice. Honestly. -Roxy, in the middle. wooF 22:34, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

problem with administrator

Hi, I have a problem with an administrator, who removes my text for Royal Air Force Museum London. He feesl I am soapboxing and adding promo material. I understand his concern, so I have changed the text.

However, now he wrote: Please stop your disruptive editing. If you continue to add soapboxing, promotional or advertising material to Wikipedia, you may be blocked from editing.

However, he wrote this after I had modified the article and removed - as best as I could - anything biased toward promotions. It would be nice if he could help me instead of threaten me.

Can anybody please help?? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Krishendrix78 (talk • contribs) 12:52, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

@Krishendrix78: Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. Have you tried explaining your position to the administrator directly? You may do so on the article talk page or their user talk page. 331dot (talk) 12:56, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Thank you so much, 331dot. I have explained this situation, but I fear he may block me if I protest. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Krishendrix78 (talk • contribs) 12:59, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

@331dot: I think Krishendrix78 is referring to Mean as custard, who is not an administrator. —AE (talk • contributions) 13:04, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

@—AE: Thank you —AE, and I apologise for getting this wrong. Also, I do not wish to get mean as custard into trouble. I would simply like to get this resolved. Thanks again to you and 331dot

No I am not an administrator, and have no power to block people. The warning beginning "Please stop your disruptive editing. . ." is a standard template message to editors who persist in adding promotional material after being given earlier advice to the contrary. . . Mean as custard (talk) 13:20, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

(Redacted)--David Biddulph (talk) 13:57, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

@David Biddulph: don't do that again.—CYBERPOWER (Chat) 15:44, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

• Hey Krishendrix78. Long story short, your additions were overtly promotional, and while they may be appropriate for an official website, are not appropriate for Wikipedia. Moreover, please review our guidance on conflicts of interest, which you appear to have, and take care to abide by it. If you like, you may request that volunteers make edits on the article's talk page. GMG^talk 15:47, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

I feel disappointed and disheartened about the constant removals of my content... I wish somebody would show me how the items below are promotional, when they only show what the new exhibitions and facilities at the Museum are about. Can somebody please help me explain what else I am supposed to do? I don't want this to be a promotional article - and I do not feel it is - but I am lost as to what it is that I can do to improve this article. Can somebody please help me?

Extended content

The Royal Air Force Museum’s purpose is to tell the story of the RAF through its people and collections. It is a National Museum, a Government non-departmental public body (NDPB) and a registered charity. The Museum works closely with the RAF, its sponsor organisation at the Ministry of Defence. It has two sites open to the public at Colindale, North West London, and Cosford, in the West Midlands. The Royal Air Force Museum London comprises several exhibitions spread over 6 hangars: Hangar 1 with two new exhibitions, RAF Stories and RAF First to the Future: RAF Stories, The First 100 years 1918-2018 of the RAF. This exhibition tells the story of the RAF’s first 100 years, from its creation in 1918 as the world's first independent air force. It explores the different roles of the people of the RAF, alongside the amazing revolutions in technology. Through engaging displays the exhibition attempts to broaden the traditional view of the RAF toward that of a diverse and constantly evolving organisation. RAF – First to the Future invites visitors to explore the work of today's RAF and how the service is preparing for the future. Hangar 2 (the Grahame-White Factory): First World War in the Air exhibition: The story unfolds from the earliest days of flight here on the site of The London Aerodrome, through four years of World War to the formation of the independent Royal Air Force in 1918. This exhibition was awarded 'Best Heritage Project', voted by the public, in the 2015 National Lottery Awards.[5] Hangar 3 and 4: Historic Hangars These hangars focus on the aircraft of the Second World War and the Cold War. Centrally placed are four original Battle of Britain fighter aircraft, the Hawker Hurricane, the Messerschmitt Bf 109, the Supermarine Spitfire and the lesser known Fiat CR.42. It also holds the Wings over Water exhibition, an large number of helicopters and numerous Cold War jet aircraft. These hangars have recently been refurbished with life-size silhouettes of different RAF aircrew who are, in their own way, connected to a specific aircraft in the collection. Hangar 5: The Bomber Hall Battle of Britain: the iconic Junkers Ju 87 Stuka, Heinkel He 111 and Bristol Blenheim show the bomber element during the Battle of Britain. On target: Bomber Command, from the vulnerable Fairey Battle to the famous Avro Lancaster and the mighty Avro Vulcan. Friendly Invasion: explains how the American Eighth Air Force operated from Britain to attack targets over Nazi Germany. Hangar 6: Age of Uncertainty The RAF in an Age of Uncertainty explores the story of the RAF from 1980 to today. Visitors are able to find out more about the RAF’s different roles in the Falklands Conflict, Operation Desert Storm in Iraq, the liberation of Kuwait, and recent operations in the Balkans, Afghanistan and Libya. This Hangar is also the home for a modern STEM centre, incorporating several classrooms, reaching a wider range of schools than previously possible, and using a cross-circular approach to include STEM as well as history. As of 2010, it had close to 100 aircraft, including the Avro Lancaster S-Sugar, which flew 137 sorties. It also includes the only complete Hawker Typhoon. Recently added are a Westland Sea King helicopter, flown by HRH Prince William, a Gnat fast jet trainer of the Red Arrows, and a full-scale mock-up of the F-35 Lightning II stealth fighter. The different hangars are connected through a roundabout, which circles around an open grass area, suited for outdoor activities, and a green meadow landscape. The main entrance point is Hangar 1, which is accessible through a pedestrian gateway. The Museum also features a new restaurant, which has been built within a 1930s mess store building. Next to it is a children's play area with mini RAF aircraft, vehicles and buildings. A volunteer centre has been created within Building 69, originally a parachute packing RAF building. The Museum's archives, containing many thousands of paper documents, books and photographs are situated on the top floor of Hangars 3/4/5. Access to the archives is possible by making an appointment to visit the Reading Room.[6] There is a large car park at the site, including charge points for electrical vehicles. There are reasonable public transport links, with Colindale tube station on the Northern Line, about 600 m away. A recent project is the RAF Stories online app, which connects with visitors and audiences. This project will collect and share 'digital scrapbooks' created and curated by anyone who has a RAF story to share - whether their own, of family members or partner organisations. A changing selection of these stories will be made available for visitors to explore in the new exhibitions, as well as offering the opportunity to add their own story to the archive.

— Preceding unsigned comment added by Krishendrix78 (talk • contribs) 16:34, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Krishendrix78, your content is entirely unreferenced and is unacceptable just on that basis. Please read our policy Verifiability. It also includes promotional language such as:

"It explores the different roles of the people of the RAF, alongside the amazing revolutions in technology. Through engaging displays the exhibition attempts to broaden the traditional view of the RAF toward that of a diverse and constantly evolving organisation." This type of advertising language belongs on the museum's website and not in an encyclopedia article.

It is never appropriate to use promotional language like "amazing" and "engaging" in Wikipedia's voice. Please read our policy Neutral point of view. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 17:13, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Krishendrix78, two things:

First, encyclopedias do not cover given subjects, they cover what has been written about given subjects by reliable independent secondary sources. That means, with the exception of absolutely mundane indisputable facts, we have no interest whatsoever in what the institution has to say about itself.

Second, if you are employed by the museum in a position which is administrative, or a staff position that in any way involves communication or public relations, your contributions are considered WP:PAID contributions. If that is the case, your additions to the article and even your post here are in violation of the WMF's legally enforceable terms of use. Before you go any further, you need to comply with the requirements described at PAID. John from Idegon (talk) 17:50, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Hi John, I thought I am complying as I now have the template as paid by RAF Museum on my bio page? Can you tell me anything else that I am supposed to do? --Krishendrix78 (talk) 18:11, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Ignoring for the moment restrictions on PAID editors, as noted above, all of the content that you want to add is without references. Is there published content about the Royal Air Force Museum London not written by someone from RAFM? That is what is allowed. NONE of this Hanger 1, Hanger 2, archive, parking lot stuff. David notMD (talk) 21:36, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

@Krishendrix78: I don't know if you'd be willing to listen to my advice, but I am a retired UK museum professional (with a Museums Diploma, a postgrad qualification from the Leicester Museum Studies course, and 30 years curatorial experience under my belt, plus 8 years experience of editing on Wikipedia.) Please don't feel downhearted - you are editing the world's biggest encyclopaedia, now with over 5 million articles in English, alone. There are bound to be policies, guidelines and styles of doing things that you don't yet understand, or may have fallen foul of. But it's great to see that in your four days here you've wanted to improve the encyclopaedic content of the organisation you work for...and thanks for now declaring that relationship. (It's something to be really proud of, not ashamed of, isn't it?) But I fear you might have rather enthusiastically blundered your way in, expecting perhaps that you can write on Wikipedia in the same tone, voice and detail as that which you use to write blog posts on behalf of the RAF Museum itself. That is not how we work, and I do urge you to stand back and read dispassionately whatever you write from now on. And most importantly, do listen to the advice of other experienced editors here. Unfortunately, continued failure to do that does tend, eventually, to be construed as 'disruptive editing' and can lead to editors being blocked if they continue (see Wikipedia:Disruptive editing for details). But you are listening, and that's really great. So, please try imagining, not that you're a potential visitor wanting to know whether a trip to the museum is worthwhile (I'd would use your own website for details of all your facilities, exhibitions and playground information etc), but instead that you are a schoolboy in India wanting to find out key facts about this museum, and what other Reliable Sources have written about it. Every single sentence you add which contains a new factual statement needs a citation to support it. It doesn't have to be an online resource, but if it is, that child in India can check it for themselves. If content you've added hasn't been written about by independent sources, just delete it, please. Forget what you know - write only about what others have written about. For example, the page on my own museum (Derby Museum and Art Gallery) only lists its key galleries and collections. Back in 2010/11 when I dared make my first few edits here, I was tempted to add details on all the other ones (some of which I created or curated), but there were no independent sources, so this and this were the only edits I personally ever made to my organisation's page (and one of those wasn't supported with a reference, I now note). But I did write about individual items in our collections. That was our strength and my fortunate position as a museum curator with a developing interest in Wikipedia. I had the definitive resources to hand (and I even published about them, and encouraged others to write here about them). These are the things I would like you to be contributing to here, not writing promotional content about the museum itself. It almost a waste of your talents and position. This is where you are in an amazingly fortunate position and have a huge opportunity to disseminate knowledge and information, (providing you don't go and get yourself blocked by ignoring advice!) I wonder: are you aware of the GLAM-Wiki Partnership? This is a project to bring museums and Wikipedia closer together and to utilise museum resources and volunteer editors to increase the available knowledge. And have you ever heard of WP:Editathons, in which museums host events for Wikipedians to come together to write about the museums collections, using resources often only available there? Just forget about writing about the museum - you're probably too closely connected to see the conflict of interest and non-encyclopaedic style of writing you've been using. But there's an even great opportunity to promote neutral content (and images, please!!!!) about your collections which are simply too good to miss. If you need any further advice, feel free to contact me via my Talk page. Regards, Nick Moyes (talk) 00:32, 16 October 2018 (UTC) PS: As you asked for pointers to what you were doing wrong, here are a few you should address, which I found at a quick skim through:

• In 2009 the museum took delivery of a FE2b World War I bomber, which had been in production for the museum for over 18 years and is one of the few examples of this aircraft in the world.
• The Battle of Britain Museum (later Hall) was opened by Queen Elizabeth the Queen Mother in November 1978, the event attended by many former fighter pilots.
• On 3 October 2016 the Battle of Britain Hall was permanently closed after being in existence for some 38 years.
• TRIVIA: Changes include: new exhibitions and commercial facilities in the hangar that previously hosted the Battle of Britain Collection, a new restaurant facility (in Building 52), a new car park adjacent to Grahame Park Way, relocation of the fibreglass Hurricane and Spitfire gate guardians to the main gate, a new exhibition in what was the 'Milestones of Flight' hangar, and landscaping of the old car park to create a grassed recreational area at the centre of the site. The landscaping work is intended to evoke in the visitor a sense of the former Hendon airfield in what has become a heavily urbanised area.
• TRIVIA: To facilitate the exhibition changes, a number of aircraft exhibits have been relocated on site whilst others been transferred to or from Cosford.
• PROMOTION: Through engaging displays the exhibition attempts to broaden the traditional view of the RAF toward that of a diverse and constantly evolving organisation.
• WRONG VOICE/PROMOTION: The story unfolds from the earliest days of flight here on the site of The London Aerodrome, through four years of World War to the formation of the independent Royal Air Force in 1918.
• TRIVIA, uncited: These hangars have recently been refurbished with life-size silhouettes of different RAF aircrew who are, in their own way, connected to a specific aircraft in the collection.
• WP:PEACOCK (i.e. non-encyclopaedic in tone): On target: Bomber Command, from the vulnerable Fairey Battle to the famous Avro Lancaster and the mighty Avro Vulcan
• PROMOTIONAL/NON-ENCYCLOPAEDIC: Visitors are able to find out more about the RAF’s different roles in the Falklands Conflict, Operation Desert Storm in Iraq, the liberation of Kuwait, and recent operations in the Balkans, Afghanistan and Libya.
• TRIVIA/NOT IN CITED SOURCES: This Hangar is also the home for a modern STEM centre, incorporating several classrooms, reaching a wider range of schools than previously possible, and using a cross-circular approach to include STEM as well as history.
• NOT IN CITED SOURCE: As of 2010, it had close to 100 aircraft, including the Avro Lancaster S-Sugar, which flew 137 sorties. It also includes the only complete Hawker Typhoon ...
• TRIVIA: The different hangars are connected through a roundabout, which circles around an open grass area, suited for outdoor activities, and a green meadow landscape. The main entrance point is Hangar 1, which is accessible through a pedestrian gateway.
• TRIVIA/PROMOTION: Next to it is a children's play area with mini RAF aircraft, vehicles and buildings.
• TRIVIA/PROMOTION: Access to the archives is possible by making an appointment to visit the Reading Room.
• WTF: There is a large car park at the site, including charge points for electrical vehicles.
• PROMOTION?: A recent project is the RAF Stories online app, which connects with visitors and audiences. This project will collect and share 'digital scrapbooks' created and curated by anyone who has a RAF story to share - whether their own, of family members or partner organisations.

Hope this helps you appreciate the concerns we had. Oh, and do have a read of Referencing for Beginners to understand why the included information on your references are not really as good as we might like. See Wikipedia:Bare URLs for more advice on this. Please don't be downhearted by the seeming criticism. You are indeed most welcome to contribute here -we're simply trying to ensure you do so in the most effective and appropriate way possible. Cheers, Nick Moyes (talk) 00:32, 16 October 2018 (UTC)

How do you know if something is fake or real?

How do you know if when someone edited a article, you know if it is real or not? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Babushka egor (talk • contribs) 18:01, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

We don't play "fake or real". All editors have to WP:CITE WP:SOURCES. Tgeorgescu (talk) 18:04, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

@Babushka egor: What Tgeorgescu means by those two rather scary-sounding abbreviations (which we love to use here!!) is that content that is added to an article that is not supported by a reliable source (see this link for an explanation) is liable to be swiftly removed. If there is doubt about the quality of a source, this can be discussed either on an article's talk page or at this internal discussion page. Occasionally, we do get pranksters trying to put up false pages, but these are likely to be very quickly deleted. Should you find one such page, you can propose it for deletion by adding this template to the top of the page: {{Db-hoax}}. Oh, I've also just noticed your page called Draft:Should Cetaceans Be Kept In Captivity?. You should probably be made aware that we don't accept essay-type articles in this online encyclopaedia, so please don't be too disappointed it was turned down. And finally, may I gently remind you to sign every talk page message with four keyboard tildes (like this: ~~~~)? It really helps us know who said what, and when they said it. Hoping this all helps. Regards, Nick Moyes (talk) 00:45, 16 October 2018 (UTC)

Article approval process

Hello. An editor has come by to check out a new draft article I have worked on (more or less from start to finish). He noted one URL usage problem that I've corrected. He also noted something more as a concern but not as something that needs to be changed necessarily.

Is there an admin/editor out here in Teahouse-land whose primary work within WP is to encouragingly review and offer constructive guidance, re: new draft articles? I've attempted to be adopted to no avail. They aren't at work here often, apparently, but I looked at the list for someone who described what they did as 'being very helpful in offering supportive guidance at any point through publication.' Are you out there?

Thanks! PaulThePony (talk) 14:40, 14 October 2018 (UTC)Paul

Hello, PaulThePony, and welcome to the Teahouse. This is probably about Draft:Andrea Scrima. If you want more opinions, you can post here: Wikipedia:WikiProject Articles for creation/Help desk. While you can link to the German Wikipedia that way, many of us prefer another method: {{Interlanguage link}}. It renders: Literaturverlag Drosch. Maybe the commenter mistook them for links to some other website (as I did, initially). – Finnusertop (talk ⋅ contribs) 14:50, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

Your counsel is much appreciated, Finnusertop. It is good to know where to get the appropriate kind of help. I will look into utilizing this: {{Interlanguage link}}. Is this employed only in source edit mode or is it available also using VE? Again, thank you. PaulThePony (talk) 06:46, 15 October 2018 (UTC)Paul

Hi, PaulThePony. Yes, it works in VE as well. Click "Insert" in the top menu, select Template and type Interlanguage link. – Finnusertop (talk ⋅ contribs) 18:02, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Beautiful, Finnusertop. Thank you very much! PaulThePony (talk) 02:37, 16 October 2018 (UTC)Paul

misspelled header tag

In Wikipedia Beta, Arthur Herman Gilkes has a header tag "British eductionist", at least in mobile view. This obvious misspelling should be corrected to either "educationist" or "educationalist", whichever is appropriate, but I don't know how to do it, especially from a mobile phone. Editing the article doesn't reveal the source; is it in Wikidata (which I'm not familiar with)? --Thnidu (talk) 17:47, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Yes, it was in Wikidata & I've corrected it. --David Biddulph (talk) 17:55, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

@David Biddulph: Thanks. --Thnidu (talk) 02:59, 16 October 2018 (UTC)

{{Div col}} Column template

In the Platoon Cast paragraph the {{Div col}} template works in the Show preview when editing but does not work for the whole article. The same problem does not split the column for Richard Edson for his Partial filmography list. Both lists start with {{div col}} and end with {{div col end}}. I have noticed this before and want to be able to fix issue if I see it again. Thanks.Eschoryii (talk) 23:56, 15 October 2018 (UTC) For some reason the "div col" and "div col end" templates do not show up in my question "{{ }}"? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Eschoryii (talk • contribs) 00:05, 16 October 2018 (UTC)

The reason that the "div col" and "div col end" templates weren't showing up in your question is that they were being used to format the display. I have used the {{tl}} template to display and link rather than transclude the templates in your question. --David Biddulph (talk) 00:33, 16 October 2018 (UTC)

As far as your original question is concerned, I don't understand what you're asking. For each of the paragraphs which you mention, the display is split into 2 columns, or more if using a small enough font size. This applies if the display window is wide enough, but obviously not if you use a browser window too narrow to display 2 columns. --David Biddulph (talk) 00:41, 16 October 2018 (UTC)

Thanks Eschoryii (talk) 03:27, 16 October 2018 (UTC)