Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/delist/Agassiz statue
Agassiz statue edit
- Reason
- I actually really like this image, but the EV just isn't there. Right from the original nom it's been struggling for a place in an article. It was promoted after being shoved into San Francisco earthquake, but it's not there any longer. I can't really think of where it would really be valuable.
- Nominator
- jjron (talk)
- Delist — jjron (talk) 07:37, 22 April 2008 (UTC)
- Delist per nom + tilted and unsharp. Mfield (talk) 15:56, 22 April 2008 (UTC)
- Delist per nom. crassic![talk] 03:22, 23 April 2008 (UTC)
- Delist this does not illustrate anything very noteworthy since there are better pictures of the earthquake damage Thisglad (talk) 05:42, 24 April 2008 (UTC)
- Keep and info A slightly different crop of this picture has been in place in Louis Agassiz for at least the last year. I've switched it over to this version since it's substantially the same image but higher quality. If the editors on that page feel it is useful, then I'm willing to give it a pass on the EV, if only for the wonderful quip it affords. Matt Deres (talk) 03:59, 25 April 2008 (UTC)
- Honestly, I considered it for there, but how much EV does this have for an article on Agassiz? It's akin to a trivia section which are discouraged in articles - it's a trivia photo if you like. I can't even understand why there's a statue of him at Stanford when he spent his career in the US at Harvard (and it's never explained in anything to do with this photo). --jjron (talk) 14:17, 25 April 2008 (UTC)
- I don't actually disagree with your position, I'm just saying that in a case like this, the fact that it's been used in an article for several months implies that the editors of the article feel it has value, which is (ultimately) the point in deciding whether it has EV or not. Call my vote a "keep vote on behalf of the article editors" or something :-). Matt Deres (talk) 00:50, 27 April 2008 (UTC)
- Honestly, I considered it for there, but how much EV does this have for an article on Agassiz? It's akin to a trivia section which are discouraged in articles - it's a trivia photo if you like. I can't even understand why there's a statue of him at Stanford when he spent his career in the US at Harvard (and it's never explained in anything to do with this photo). --jjron (talk) 14:17, 25 April 2008 (UTC)
- Keep. The incident itself is actually famous, and photos of it (possibly this one) are being used time and again in science lectures the world over. It happened to temporally coincide with the overthrowing of some of Agassiz' ideas, which is why the meme got popular (beyond the photo's comic value of a statue of a man with his head buried in the sand). That's enough EV for me. Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 14:55, 26 April 2008 (UTC)
- Hmmm, I wonder which theories they would be that coincide with this. He's probably best known for his work on ice ages (still a lot of valid work there now), his anti-evolution/anti-Darwinism until his death in 1873 ('overthrown' in his lifetime), and his racial ideas (still pretty popular long after 1906). Still haven't been shown any significant link between this and any content. --jjron (talk) 15:24, 26 April 2008 (UTC)
- Actually, acceptance of Darwinian evolutionary theories was not universal at the time of Agassiz's death. It was not until the rediscovery of Gregor Mendel's work on genetic inheritance in 1900 (note the date) that the theory of natural selection gained a mechanism for descent. It was at that time that there was a sea change in biology and Agassiz became identified as part of the "old guard" and unfairly (IMO) mocked for not accepting a theory that (while ultimately correct) was not at all ironclad in his time. Matt Deres (talk) 00:59, 27 April 2008 (UTC)
- It was more a case of waiting for the 'old guard' to die out than any lack of acceptance. Agassiz was one of the last reputable scientists with a basically creationist mindset, along with a few other old-timers from there. We see that sort of thing often, not just in science, where new ideas have to wait for the embedded hierarchy to move on before the new ideas are 'officially' universally accepted. Mendel's work provided a mechanism and helped with the then resurgent Neo-Darwinism, but the vast majority of serious scientists had long before abandoned creationist notions (certainly before Darwin's death in 1882, and indeed before Agassiz's death as well) largely due to Darwin's insights, even if they didn't fully agree with Darwin's theories for how it worked. --jjron (talk) 06:03, 27 April 2008 (UTC)
- Actually, acceptance of Darwinian evolutionary theories was not universal at the time of Agassiz's death. It was not until the rediscovery of Gregor Mendel's work on genetic inheritance in 1900 (note the date) that the theory of natural selection gained a mechanism for descent. It was at that time that there was a sea change in biology and Agassiz became identified as part of the "old guard" and unfairly (IMO) mocked for not accepting a theory that (while ultimately correct) was not at all ironclad in his time. Matt Deres (talk) 00:59, 27 April 2008 (UTC)
- Hmmm, I wonder which theories they would be that coincide with this. He's probably best known for his work on ice ages (still a lot of valid work there now), his anti-evolution/anti-Darwinism until his death in 1873 ('overthrown' in his lifetime), and his racial ideas (still pretty popular long after 1906). Still haven't been shown any significant link between this and any content. --jjron (talk) 15:24, 26 April 2008 (UTC)
- Keep - it's got the wow, i.e. eyecatching. "Hystorical", too. ;-) --Janke | Talk 08:11, 29 April 2008 (UTC)
- Keep - per above ← κεηηε∂γ (shout at me) 08:57, 30 April 2008 (UTC)
- No vote. I sentimentally want this to stay featured, but it's not really encyclopedic for Louis Agassiz, the only real article in which the image appears. Spikebrennan (talk) 15:52, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
Kept MER-C 05:24, 3 May 2008 (UTC)