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Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/NWA World Historic Welterweight Championship/archive1

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The following is an archived discussion of a featured list nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The list was archived by PresN via FACBot (talk) 00:34, 3 June 2016 (UTC) [1].[reply]

NWA World Historic Welterweight Championship edit

NWA World Historic Welterweight Championship (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

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Nominator(s):  MPJ-US  04:32, 4 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

I am nominating this article now because my other FLC "has gained substantial support and reviewers' concerns have been substantially addressed." as the rules state - five supports, no objections qualifies as substantial I think.

So I bring to you another wrestling championship list, this time I am excited about it as it's a special list to me. I am hoping to turn this into a Good Topic and potentially Feature topic over time by bringing the champion articles (Mephisto, La Sombra, Volador Jr., Negro Casas and Mascara Dorada) to Good Article status as well. But no Good Topic without this list. It is the sum total of all I have learned over the past 15 FLCs I have gone through, each of them used to create a better, higher quality starting point for my lists.  MPJ-US  04:32, 4 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Comments by GaryColemanFan

  • I appreciate that the background to the title is complicated. I'm hoping you can help clarify a few issues:
  • Was CMLL ever part of the NWA? If not, why would they have billed their title as an NWA championship?
    • Yes they were, from the mid-1950s until 1989 they were members of the NWA. The NWA World Welterweight Championship actually pre-dated them joining the NWA and was not given the NWA prefix until the mid-1950s. When they left the NWA they simply kept the titles around.  MPJ-US  19:51, 15 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
  • Did anything prompt the CMLL's decision to rename the title? It seems like they just ignored the request for a few months and then suddenly decided to go along with it.
    • I think the repeated requests finally just made them decide to go "alright we're out", but I have no source on what actually promoted the timing of their decision.  MPJ-US  19:51, 15 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
  • Why did CMLL decide to name their new title an NWA championship? Isn't that what started the whole problem a few months earlier? Is the NWA concerned about the new title's name?
    • Oh lord I could write long, complicated essays on why CMLL does the weird stuff that they do. Problem is there is nothing solid on that, they announced it as the "CMLL World Historic Welterweight Championship", but when the belts were presented later they were the "NWA World Historic Welterweight Championship" for unexplained reasons. And I have not seen anything published about the NWA objecting to those names - In Mexico the NWA is basically Blue Demon Jr. and since CMLL gave up the titles he can claim victory and then kinda just forgot about it.  MPJ-US  19:51, 15 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
  • Was there an actual announcement of the title change, or was it just a slight change in Mephisto's introduction (like how Sparky Plugg just became Bob Holly one week)?
    • Yes CMLL announced the three new NWA World Historic championships in a press conferenceand that the first champion for each was the previous "NWA World" champions for each division. At that time there were no new championship belts, when the championship belts were actually seen they said "NWA" not "CMLL" and CMLL pretented that was the plan all along.  MPJ-US  19:51, 15 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
  • The second sentence is a little long and complicated. Is it possible to rephrase so that it isn't joined by two "when"s?
  • The "prior" seems redundant, as it's already stated that the other requests happened "previously".
  • Has the title been defended outside of Mexico and Japan?
    • I have not seen any reports of title matches outside those two counties.  MPJ-US  21:12, 17 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
  • Does CMLL run shows in Japan, or are the matches in Japan part of an agreement with another promotion?
    • They co-promote with NJPW so it's CMLL/NJPW shows
  • Is it standard to link CMLL in each of the references? It seems like overkill.
    • Probably not, I think that's just a sign of them being added over time without checking what was previously linked, I will address that. now. MPJ-US  21:12, 17 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know that all of my questions would necessarily need to be added in the article, but some clarification could help readers. GaryColemanFan (talk) 15:59, 15 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]

  • @GaryColemanFan: - based on my answers, is there anything that needs to be added to the article? most of the complex back history is in the article on the original title.  MPJ-US  19:51, 15 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
    • Thank you for the clarification.
    • Is it possible to add a hatnote stating something like "For the history of the title it replaced, see NWA World Welterweight Championship"?
    • In the sentence "The championship was initially announced as the CMLL World Historic Welterweight Championship, but when the belt was unveiled, it was called the NWA World Historic Welterweight Championship", the citations should come after "CMLL World Historic Welterweight Championship", since the source doesn't give the NWA Historic name (which is not controversial and wouldn't need a citation, as it's the current name).
    • In the sentence "CMLL had held the NWA World Welterweight Championship for over 53 years even after leaving the NWA in 1989,[4] when the relationship...", it seems like ending the first sentence at "1989" would work, so that it's not so much information in one long sentence.
    • Do you have a reference for the traditional welterweight classification?
    • Other than that, I think all I've got left are the last four questions ("prior", where defended, CMLL shows in Japan, and linking CMLL). GaryColemanFan (talk) 04:20, 17 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
  • @GaryColemanFan: answered a few questions, did come copy edits. Did it hit the spot?  MPJ-US  21:16, 17 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support - Well-written, complete, and in keeping with the format and standards of similar Featured Lists. GaryColemanFan (talk) 22:07, 17 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Unfortunately, this nomination has been open for 2 months without a lot of comments, and I'm going to have to close it in order to keep the queue moving. --PresN 15:38, 2 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

  • Closing note: This candidate has been archived, but there may be a delay in bot processing of the close. Please see WP:FLC/ar, and leave the {{featured list candidates}} template in place on the talk page until the bot goes through.
The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.
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