User talk:Al Ameer son/Archive 17

Al Khawalid

Thank you for your review and comments. I'm planning to nominate the article for GA or FA at a later time. First I want to expand the history section further. I will do that as soon as I get one of the following books:

• Mahdi Abdalla Al-Tajir (1987). Bahrain, 1920–1945: Britain, the Shaikh, and the Administration. ISBN 0-7099-5122-1
• Mohammed Ghanim Al-Rumaihi (1975). Bahrain: A study on social and political changes since the First World War. University of Kuwait.
• Emile A Nakhleh (1976). Bahrain: Political development in a modernizing society. ISBN 0-669-00454-5

I've read a summary for the first two and it contains very important information about Al Khawalid in 1920s (then known simply as the Khalids). The third is said to discuss internal Al Khalifa politics. Mohamed CJ (talk) 19:06, 15 July 2013 (UTC)

Yea, it seems google books doesn't have any readable versions of those books unfortunately. Anyway, I hope you could get access to whatever you need for an FA. I still think the article has a 95% chance of passing GAR though. Keep up the great work as always ya Mohammad ;) --Al Ameer 19:19, 15 July 2013 (UTC)

GA takes ages before you get a review. I'll probably be done with it and nominate it for FA before that. A Bahraini researcher promised to lend me his Al-Tajir (1987) book. He said he'll search for it in a pile of boxes in his home this Ramadhan. He's the same guy who provided me with Tree of Al Khalifa, which costs £1,500 [1]. Google provides the first 40 pages of Al-Tajir, but all of the important stuff are after that. You too keep it up and good luck with Gamal Abdel Nasser FA. Nasser's FA is sure to make every Arab proud of it (and of you!), especially at those times. Mohamed CJ (talk) 19:40, 15 July 2013 (UTC)

The backlog at GAN is pretty ridiculous, so you're probably right about going to FA directly. Thankfully you know a very valuable researcher! Good luck with all your projects, and thanks for the kind words of encouragement. Ramadan kareem ;) --Al Ameer 20:35, 15 July 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Mahmoud Badr

Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 00:03, 17 July 2013 (UTC)

Nasser

(Funny—I thought your talk page looked familiar.) I saw your GOCE request for Nasser's copyedit, and I had it on my list of things to do but saw that you removed it recently. If you add it back to the list, I'd be happy to take a look. I've intended to read it anyway (and was actually reminded to do so when reading about Pan-Arabism via the Hariri DYK nom). Depending on time, I may be able to expand to a peer review. Let me know what you think. czar · · 05:37, 17 July 2013 (UTC)

Honestly, the only reason I removed it was the daunting backlog. I thought it would take forever so I just opted for a peer review, even though a thorough copyedit would be preferable. I didn't want to have a situation where the article would be going through a peer review and a copyedit simultaneously, so I just chose the peer review. However, since you're willing to give it a go, I'd be more than happy to repost it at the copyedit requests. I want to nominate it for FA before late August if possible. I'll be bogged down in my studies afterward. --Al Ameer 06:31, 17 July 2013 (UTC)

I'm moving in a few weeks and I'll be in a similar situation to you late August, so I'm aiming to tackle it this weekend. czar · · 06:42, 17 July 2013 (UTC)

That would be great, I just re-posted the article at the requests page. Thank you Czar ;) --Al Ameer 06:56, 17 July 2013 (UTC)

I started the copyedit, but wanted to check before continuing how you felt about me paring down the content significantly as I edit in order to reduce its overall length. I wouldn't do it if it'd be unwelcome, but I think it'd help the article (per my peer review comment). czar · · 02:51, 26 July 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for starting the process. Because Diaa started the review, I'd like to address his remaining concerns first. I should be done with them tomorrow. As for cutting down the article significantly, I'm actually concerned that important information is going to be sacrificed. One of the reasons Nasser's article is substantially longer than most is because he ruled his country for 18 years, much longer than any of the other presidential FA's and he was a hugely monumental figure for Egypt and the Arab world. I would also point out that there are two other FA's where the article prose is around 80-90KB (Ronald Reagan and Nikita Khrushchev). Anyway, when I posted the article for copyedit I anticipated that some parts of the article would be cut down or summarized, but I thought it wouldn't be more than a few thousand KBs' worth. I'm not completely against it, but would like some kind of communication about what you want to cut down. Right off the bat, I probably won't have any problem with reducing or summarizing large parts of the article that deal with Nasser's life before the Presidency and maybe some of the subsections for the Legacy section. I was also going to request that you cut down the lead a bit, but I prefer we discuss lead changes at the end of the copyedit. If you'd like to start work on the pre-presidency part of the article (including significant prose reduction), please do so. I'll be done with Diaa's concerns by then and we could discuss changes going forward. --Al Ameer (talk) 04:34, 26 July 2013 (UTC)

Looking out for your FA, I thought it'd be worth considering before the FA comments inevitably come and I'm already finished. Just because I was curious, I looked into Reagan and Khrushchev. (I had used a few U.S. President FAs for editing guidance already.) Both of their FAs made a big stink about length (Reagan, Khrushchev near bottom). Reagan's prose was 50 kB and has since grown to 80. Khrushchev's prose has been stable around 85 then and now. Some comments alluded to other FAs up to around 80, though 85 is definitely on the high end. Gerald Ford was 22 and is 66 now. Nasser is at 98 now and it'll likely lose a few k just in copyedits. I'll communicate if I think a section can use clearcutting, but after skimming a few times through, I doubt I will. It's more that sections that already have dedicated articles should struggle for concision (for the reader's sake), but you and I both don't want to leave anything important out. We'll take it a step at a time. The lead isn't that bad on length, but we can discuss at the end. I'll start with pre-presidency.  czar · · 14:23, 26 July 2013 (UTC)

Sounds good, and I appreciate your suggestion regarding the FAR. Ultimately, I think this article will be one of those that hovers between 80 and 85 KB, but who knows. It could end up being smaller if we could summarize passages down considerably without sacrificing key points or particularly interesting facts, opinions, quotes, etc. --Al Ameer (talk) 18:05, 26 July 2013 (UTC)

I was waiting for the editing to die down, but doesn't look like that's happening. I want to do the bulk (if not the rest) of the copyedit tonight. I don't know how you feel about the lede's recent rewrite, but I imagine any edits should go to the talk page for discussion. Don't want to be self-selecting, but this appears to be the kind of lengthiness-begets-lengthiness that happens when an entry is really long (one more little fact won't hurt anyone, right?) I haven't checked whether all of the edits are supported in the article. Can you take a look? For all intents and purposes, I felt the previous lede covered the material concisely and without undue emphasis. czar · · 17:38, 30 July 2013 (UTC)

I restored the old lead for now. We could discuss modifications when we reach that stage of the copyedit. I told the IP who made the goodfaith edits that he/she should bring any concerns to the talk page (or a separate section at the review page) for the time being. Feel free to continue your work. --Al Ameer (talk) 18:07, 30 July 2013 (UTC)

Terrorism

Dear Al Amir,

I noticed you have defended Fata against israeli wikipedian attacks. You suggested that terrorism articles are "sufficient", however, if you compare Islamic Terror and Jewish Religious Terrorism articles, you can clearly see there still remains much bias. The latter over-emphasizes "zealotry", while ignoring the facts. Perhaps you might improve the article. Have a Great Day! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.211.153.194 (talk) 23:03, 17 July 2013 (UTC)

Not exactly sure what you're saying, but if you're referring to my removal of the "terrorism" category from Fatah, that's because there's already a category "Organizations formerly designated as terrorist" which I described as being "sufficient." I'm not interested in trying to even things out between various articles related to terrorism, if that's what you're asking. --Al Ameer 00:22, 18 July 2013 (UTC)

Peer review of nasser

Hi. I responded to your peer review request for Nasser please check it out.--Diaa abdelmoneim (talk) 22:05, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

Thanks Diaa, I looked over your questions, which I will try to get answers to. It shouldn't be more than a couple days (probably less) before I address them. --Al Ameer 22:19, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Ziad al-Hariri

Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 04:18, 24 July 2013 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Mansur al-Atrash

Hello, I just wanted to introduce myself and let you know I am glad to be reviewing the article Mansur al-Atrash you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by GA bot, on behalf of FunkMonk -- FunkMonk (talk) 11:18, 24 July 2013 (UTC)

• Haha, I had no hand in writing the above message, but well, yeah, review is ready! FunkMonk (talk) 09:00, 26 July 2013 (UTC)

The Bugle: Issue LXXXVIII, July 2013

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Thanks

Thanks for the feedback on People's Movement (Tunisia). It was interesting finding out a bit about the subject. The political scene sounds chaotic, but I suppose that is inevitable after a revolution. Let's hope they settle on a fair and workable arrangement before too long. Aymatth2 (talk) 20:04, 29 July 2013 (UTC)

Request

First, nice article you've written on Salim Hatum (my new plan, is to write articles for the Regional Command of the Arab Socialist Ba'ath Party – Syria Region members who don't have their own Wiki page, so you're article helps me here :D). .... Secondly, I'm not able to remove the Syrianhistory.com tags from the pictures, but would you bother to upload this picture of abd karim al-jundi and a this, a picture of the Ba'ath Party's constitution??? If you did, thanks :)--TIAYN (talk) 08:15, 30 July 2013 (UTC)

Oh, and I noticed you used the book Syria's Peasantry, the Descendants of Its Lesser Rural Notables, and Their Politics in the Satum Hatum article, the whole book is available online here. --TIAYN (talk) 13:57, 30 July 2013 (UTC)

Thanks, it's been on my to-do list for a while. I'll write up the second half later today. The syrianhistory.com logos are very frustrating. Tthe images are free, but I guess the website doesn't want us to use them. I'll try to edit the logos out, but most of the time I'm not able to without really distorting the picture. I think the photo of al-Jundi is doable, I'll upload it after I make the modifications. You should also ask FunkMonk for help: he's better skilled in this kind of thing. And thanks for the link to Batatu, I was actually sent a scanned copy of the book by Yazan a while back. --Al Ameer (talk) 17:20, 30 July 2013 (UTC)

Thanks, I'll ask FunkMonk about the pictures. Happy editing. --TIAYN (talk) 19:51, 30 July 2013 (UTC)

Intro to Gamal Abdel Nasser article

Hey brother,

Your (huge) contribution to the Gamal Abdel Nasser article is to be praised. Really brings the substance of the page to life!

I have just made what I felt to be very most necessary rewording to the intro to the article, which (in my opinion) suffered in some respects from imperfect prose, and a slight degree of disorganisation. I think that you will approve of the edits.

HOWEVER, one thing that it was impossible to miss whilst conducting this necessary edit was the sheer length of the intro, which is basically a mini-biography of the man's career. As you, and other contributors, had dedicated so much time and effort to making the intro what it is, I obviously felt compelled not to change this approach, and the intro remains as expansive as before. Nonetheless, I feel that it might be worth considering trimming it down - determining which are the major points, and which specifics can be collated as themes for the intro, rather than as individual points.

Do you have any thoughts on this?

Thanks. 31.52.29.222 (talk) 17:34, 30 July 2013 (UTC)

Thank you, when I first drafted the lead, it was only supposed to be a temporary solution. The article is currently undergoing a peer review and copyedit (See here.) We're trying to nominate it to Featured article status. I've been told by the reviewer that the lead length isn't that bad, but I personally would like for its size to be reduced a bit if possible. Also, I want to remove some items and add other items to it. The entire article will likely be trimmed because it's currently far larger than any Featured article on a head of state. Feel free to start a your own section at the peer review page if you have other concerns. And thanks for working on the Nasser era. A lot of the stuff that might be copyedited out of the article on Nasser will likely be transferred there. Cheers! --Al Ameer (talk) 17:51, 30 July 2013 (UTC)

As for your edits to the lead, I appreciate it, but because the article is currently going through a copyedit/review, I will to revert back to the previous lead for now. If there are parts you feel we should add or remove, please bring it to the talk page or in a separate section of the review page. --Al Ameer (talk) 17:57, 30 July 2013 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Mansur al-Atrash

The article Mansur al-Atrash you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Mansur al-Atrash for comments about the article. Well done! Message delivered by GA bot, on behalf of FunkMonk -- FunkMonk (talk) 06:38, 31 July 2013 (UTC)

Saladin

Pls accept my sincere apologies but I have had to inadvertently undo a lot of your (constructive) edits here, in order to remove another users unconstructive edits. I will attempt to reinsert your edits now but unfortunately because the previous edits weren't dealt with early the only way to fix them was to restore an older version before you made your changes. Anotherclown (talk) 09:19, 13 August 2013 (UTC)

Mahmoud Badr

Just because your political views differ, it does not give the right to edit the controversy surround him. There isn't a more reliable source than the man, himself, speaking. Please keep your political views out of Wikipedia. I understand you are big fan of Gamal Abdul Nasser, but that does not give the right to harass anyone you don't agree with.--Utaibimt (talk) 12:21, 17 August 2013 (UTC)

(talk page stalker) Actually you are very wrong. Per WP:SELFPUBLISH "Never use self-published sources as third-party sources about living people, even if the author is an expert, well-known professional researcher, or writer." Also per WP:ABOUTSELF you can't use self-published sources for exceptional claims. If this information is important enough to be included in the article, then it would have been published by reliable sources. Mohamed CJ (talk) 13:23, 17 August 2013 (UTC)

Also per WP:BLP "Contentious material about living persons (or in some cases, recently deceased) that is unsourced or poorly sourced – whether the material is negative, positive, neutral, or just questionable – should be removed immediately and without waiting for discussion." So what Al Ameer was doing is applying WP policy, not serving his own political views or harassing anyone. Mohamed CJ (talk) 13:26, 17 August 2013 (UTC)

In addition to what Mohamed said, please read WP:Original research. You cannot claim something to be controversial on wikipedia (especially a BLP) without the backing of reliable secondary sources. The section is obviously original research and propaganda and I don't know how removing it one time is "harassment." Also, I'm not a "big fan" of Nasser although though I support what he generally stood for and represented. I'm also not a supporter of Badr, Sisi or the Brotherhood by any means, so please do not jump to conclusions and assume bad faith on my part (or Mohamed's for that matter). --Al Ameer (talk) 17:25, 17 August 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Hassan Mamoun

Alex Shih^Talk 12:04, 19 August 2013 (UTC)

Without wishing to burden you,

since you did much of the Gaza article, you might be interested in Associated Press 'Archaeologists race to save Gaza's ancient ruins,' Haaretz Aug. 20, 2013 . If you can't get it on Haaretz, I have a copy saved, but sine it's the Associated Press, no doubt you can catch it there. Best.Nishidani (talk) 15:35, 20 August 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for the link Nish (Haaretz works), I'll get to this today or tomorrow. --Al Ameer (talk) 16:42, 20 August 2013 (UTC)

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Newsreel

Hi, I think your talk page message to me got lost in other messages, and got archived. I'll try to cut the footage, but I'm not sure to do it without quality loss. I think this[2] user might be better at that. FunkMonk (talk) 20:24, 24 August 2013 (UTC)

Thanks, I'll shoot Ras a request then. Ideally, I'd like to find a downloadable video of him speaking instead of a newsreel, but we have to work with what we got I guess. --Al Ameer (talk) 17:43, 25 August 2013 (UTC)

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