Talk:Pride (LGBTQ culture)/Archive 3

Archive 1

Archive 2

Archive 3

Gay pride in other months

Until recently gay pride was also celebrated in November in SC. I don't know why. I just know I performed at a Gay Pride Festival Brunch right after Halloween a few years ago. Trixie Bizarre (talk) 23:01, 2 June 2021 (UTC)

Yes, it would be interesting if someone could find a suitable source for when and how the notion of a "Pride Month" became established, rather than different pride events happening on different dates throughout the year. It is certainly not a worldwide phenomenon (contrary to many US websites who don't bother to check), and the article currently just says it "occurs", as though it's a force of nature. Was Clinton's declaration in 1999 based on an existing concept promoted by US pride groups? - IMSoP (talk) 15:35, 3 June 2021 (UTC)

I think Pride month should have its own article

I think pride month should have its own article because it isn’t exclusively a gay thing anymore.CycoMa (talk) 03:02, 14 June 2021 (UTC)

Requested move 30 September 2021

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Not moved, though feel free to submit a WP:MR (non-admin closure) Invinciblewalnut (talk) 03:27, 21 October 2021 (UTC)

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Gay pride → LGBTQ pride – Pride is about all of LGBTQ, not just gay people. Aalaa324 (talk) 17:01, 30 September 2021 (UTC)— Relisting. Havelock Jones (talk) 12:58, 13 October 2021 (UTC)

@Aalaa324: Can you demonstrate that LGBTQ pride is the WP:COMMONNAME? EvergreenFir (talk) 17:25, 30 September 2021 (UTC)

https://prideinlondon.org/ https://www.loc.gov/lgbt-pride-month/about/ https://youth.gov/feature-article/june-lgbt-pride-month https://www.adl.org/education/resources/tools-and-strategies/lgbtq-pride-month-and-education-resources https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/presidential-actions/2021/06/01/a-proclamation-on-lesbian-gay-bisexual-transgender-and-queer-pride-month-2021/ https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/1553118X.2020.1750017

• Oppose per WP:COMMONNAME.--Ortizesp (talk) 14:48, 1 October 2021 (UTC)
• Support, but it should probably be consistent with the main page on the general topic (the page LGBT), so it should probably be "LGBT pride". And if the main page LGBT ever gets moved to LGBTQ, THEN it'd make sense to put the Q in the other page titles. Paintspot Infez (talk) 02:25, 3 October 2021 (UTC)
• Comment Given common usage is just pride perhaps 'Pride (LGBT)' is best?—blindlynx (talk) 19:51, 3 October 2021 (UTC)
• Comment: Agree with blindlynx. The WP:COMMONNAME is just "Pride", e.g. Pride flag, Pride parade, San Francisco Pride. I like "Pride (LGBT)" for disambiguation. –Olivaw-Daneel (talk) 12:38, 5 October 2021 (UTC)
• Weaker-than-average oppose - while usage of the term "gay pride" certainly encompasses the entire LGBTQ community, this still appears to be the common name. This very likely won't be true in the future; however, Wikipedia is not a crystal ball. Bneu2013 (talk) 12:47, 8 October 2021 (UTC)
• Oppose for now per WP:COMMONNAME. "Gay pride" is about 20 to 40 times more frequent than LGBT pride in books (LGBTQ pride is the lowest of the lot). LGBTQ pride is steadily increasing, but Gay Pride is far more frequent, even in the most recent sources. Maybe one day, but not yet. Mathglot (talk) 01:58, 9 October 2021 (UTC)
• Oppose. "Gay pride" is by far the WP:COMMONNAME of this topic. feminist (+) 13:51, 13 October 2021 (UTC)
• Oppose per Mathglot. Gay Pride is the common name, even though I personally think LGBT pride would be more encompassing. Isabelle ^🔔 13:53, 13 October 2021 (UTC)
• Alternative I really think it should be moved to Pride (LGBT) and just have the common names listed in the LEAD (also known as gay pride, LGBT pride, queer pride, etc.) ~Gwennie🐈｟💬 📋｠ 22:06, 13 October 2021 (UTC)
• Oppose per Mathglot's analysis + WP:TOOSOON. Crossroads ^-talk- 05:33, 14 October 2021 (UTC)
• Support Pride (LGBT). The overwhelming common name in modern usage is neither Gay pride or LGBT pride, but simply pride, as can be seen at Pride parade and the vast majority of individual events in Category:Pride parades. Outside of a historical context or the few events that specifically use the phrase, gay pride feels very dated.--Trystan (talk) 13:17, 14 October 2021 (UTC)
• Support Pride (GSRD) or Pride (LGBTQI). Taylor 49 (talk) 19:36, 18 October 2021 (UTC)
• Oppose The term "gay pride" has been the term of choice for the first 30 of the 50 years of gay pride history. After about the year 2000 there were other terms, but none have been as popular as gay pride. Also, internationally, the term "gay" is a lot easier to translate across languages and culture than the term "LGBT", so there are many non-English speakers who recognize the term "gay" when the acronym "LGBT" is just too much to translate. The term LGBT is popular now, but it also is under pressure as a new term, just as GLBT was the more popular letter order before and LGBTQ is gaining in popularity now. The best term may change in the future but I do not think now is the time for changing it for pride events. Blue Rasberry (talk) 22:08, 18 October 2021 (UTC)
• Weak oppose, although I would weakly support Pride (LGBT) as an article title too. "Gay pride" is more common than "LGBT pride" doing a quick search, but I think that "Pride" without a qualifier is used more often (although it's difficult to do a search for this online). Strongly oppose Pride (GSRD) or Pride (LGBTQI) as per longstanding community consensus on using 'LGBT' on LGBT-related articles on Wikipedia (this may change to 'LGBTQ' in the future, but GSRD is too much of a neologism and LGBTQI is not as commonly used). —AFreshStart (talk) 21:11, 19 October 2021 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Origin of Term Pride Edit Request

I wanted to request a particular edition to the article discussing "Gay Pride" I wanted to ask if it's possible to include the origin of Pride used in 1967 after the Black Cat police raid and subsequent demonstration from 1967 in Los Angeles. The organization formed at the time was called P.R.I.D.E.(Personal Rights in Defense and Education) and thought it would be appropriate to add that to the article since PRIDE is not first encountered at Stonewall. Pzappia (talk) 21:50, 1 June 2022 (UTC)

 Not done: That certainly isn't impossible, but that would require consensus. For future reference, edit requests are designed for editors to explicitly ask other editors to insert or modify material (e.g "please change Mickeal Jackson to Michael Jackson); not a general request to add content to an article. Cheers! —Sirdog (talk) 01:12, 2 June 2022 (UTC)

Requested move 31 May 2022

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Moved to LGBT pride. This is the most widely agreed upon title. (non-admin closure) — Ceso femmuin mbolgaig mbung, mellohi! (投稿) 01:42, 8 June 2022 (UTC)

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Gay pride → Pride (LGBT) – As several editors noted in the previous discussion, the WP:COMMONNAME today is simply "Pride". ;; Maddy ♥︎(they/she)♥︎ :: talk  18:52, 31 May 2022 (UTC)

• Oppose, not convinced. And Gay pride is a better title as per WP:NATURAL IMO.--Ortizesp (talk) 19:58, 31 May 2022 (UTC)
• Support, this is the common name. Pride month, Pride Parades, pride festivals are what they are referred to. Sheehanpg93 (talk) 20:30, 31 May 2022 (UTC)

  Adding my support to LGBT pride Sheehanpg93 (talk) 14:47, 1 June 2022 (UTC)

• Support to either the proposed title or LGBT pride. The concept of pride this article is about is not limited to gays but concerns other sexual minorities as well. JIP | Talk 21:03, 31 May 2022 (UTC)
• Support to either the proposed title or LGBT pride. "Gay pride" is not a precise title at all. 7szz (talk) 00:09, 1 June 2022 (UTC)
• Support (strongly) moving to "LGBT pride" (or the proposed title), for reasons listed by others above. Paintspot Infez (talk) 02:28, 1 June 2022 (UTC)
• Oppose. WP:CONCISE. Showiecz (talk) 04:19, 1 June 2022 (UTC)
• Support LGBT pride to widen the scope appropriately while also avoiding awkward unnatural titling. Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 05:06, 1 June 2022 (UTC)
• Support LGBT pride is the logically title here. ♡RAFAEL♡^(talk) 09:27, 1 June 2022 (UTC)
• Strongly Oppose This discussion literally just happened a year ago and closed with Not moved.Not moved should be used when a consensus has formed to keep the current title and not rename the article(s) in question. For instance, a proposal to rename Bob Dylan to Squeezy Joe would likely result in everyone (or nearly everyone) agreeing that the proposed move should not take place; this notifies other editors that they should probably not propose this move in the future until and unless circumstances change. If an article title has been stable for a long time,[9] and there is no good reason to change it, it should not be changed. Consensus among editors determines if there does exist a good reason to change the title. If it has never been stable, or it has been unstable for a long time, and no consensus can be reached on what the title should be, default to the title the article had when the first major contribution after the article ceased to be a stub was made.WP:TITLECHANGES Ethanpet113 (talk) 12:34, 1 June 2022 (UTC)

  This discussion is about moving to a different title, as I mentioned in the proposal. Now there also seems to be a consensus forming in favour of the original proposal – "LGBT pride" – demonstrating that Wikipedia:Consensus can change. ;; Maddy ♥︎(they/she)♥︎ :: talk  12:32, 1 June 2022 (UTC)

  • See also archived talk https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Gay_pride/Archive_1#Proposal:_Move_to_%22LGBT_pride%22 Ethanpet113 (talk) 12:45, 1 June 2022 (UTC)
• Comment: I think if we were to move to LGBT pride or not move per WP:NATURAL, the lead should still list Pride first as the most common name. ;; Maddy ♥︎(they/she)♥︎ :: talk  12:36, 1 June 2022 (UTC)
• Support. The overwhelming common name in modern usage is simply pride, as can be seen at Pride parade and the vast majority of individual events in Category:Pride parades. Outside of a historical context or the few events that specifically use the phrase, gay pride feels very dated.--Trystan (talk) 13:47, 1 June 2022 (UTC)
• Oppose moving to "LGBT pride": according to Google Ngrams, "gay pride" is still far more common.[1] Cheers, gnu57 13:58, 1 June 2022 (UTC)

  The argument here is that "Pride" is the common name. "LGBT pride" and "Pride (LGBT)" are both options for disambiguation of "Pride". In the case of disambiguation, we not only need to look at what is the most common, but what accurately disambiguates the title. "Pride (LGBT)"/"LGBT pride" are clearly more appropriate than "Gay pride", given the wide variety of identities represented by Pride. ;; Maddy ♥︎(they/she)♥︎ :: talk  14:11, 1 June 2022 (UTC)

• Strongly Support a change to Pride (LGBT). Pride is certainly the common name and I think this option best threads the needle btwn the common name and necessary disambiguation. LGBT Pride would at least disambiguate more accurately than the current name. The current name is neither the most common nor the most accurate of the available options and it should be changed. Elektra.of.argos (talk) 15:56, 1 June 2022 (UTC)
• Support change to Pride (LGBT). “gay pride” is a pretty blatantly outdated/incorrect term since the concept is typically understood to include all minority sexual/gender/etc identities. Seems like common sense to me. Dronebogus (talk) 16:10, 1 June 2022 (UTC)
• Disambiguator comment: There is an RM discussion currently open about potentially moving LGBT to LGBTQ. If that is done and this proposal is also adopted, the disambiguator should be "LGBTQ". —⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 17:23, 1 June 2022 (UTC)
• Support. ~ AntisocialRyan (talk) 22:02, 1 June 2022 (UTC)
• Support LGBT pride per above. X-Editor (talk) 02:41, 2 June 2022 (UTC)
• Support per last discussion—blindlynx 15:48, 2 June 2022 (UTC)

• Support LGBT pride instead. SWinxy (talk) 23:45, 2 June 2022 (UTC)
• Support Pride (LGBT+) (with reservations) I believe that Queer Pride, or Pride (Queer) would make more sense in the long run. The reason being that no matter how many letters we add to LGBTQIA+, this discussion will always be evolving. Queer is an independent, inclusive, term that that is not connected to any one sexuality, gender or attraction. As someone who does not identify as LGBT, but does identify as Queer, I feel that the cause of Pride and been bogged down by the lack of a single unifying term. It's nauseating to have to spell and say LGBTQ+ every time in conversation, and since the derogatory connotation behind Queer has been effectively eliminated, this is what feels most progressive to me. But alas, that is just my two cents.

DashJustice (talk) 00:43, 3 June 2022 (UTC)

Queer is still less common per WP:COMMONNAME, even though it’s also my personal preference. Also, using “queer” as a homophobic/barely re-appropriated term wasn’t that long ago, relatively speaking, and still might be distasteful or “vulgar” (per above) to older readers/users. Dronebogus (talk) 01:17, 3 June 2022 (UTC)

• Support Like others have said the term most commonly used now is "pride" rather than "gay pride." Also pride is meant to be an event for increasing awareness of LGBTQ+ people in general. Labeling it "gay pride" is plainly wrong. There are ace/aro people who are celebrated at pride and straight trans people, for example.Herravondure (talk) 00:54, 4 June 2022 (UTC)
• Support LGBT pride, instead of the original proposal. —Sundostund (talk) 18:22, 4 June 2022 (UTC)
• LGBT Pride not the disambiguated format, but not opposed to keeping the current title either. Reywas92^Talk 03:51, 6 June 2022 (UTC)
• Support LGBT Pride per above. Iamreallygoodatcheckers (talk) 05:20, 7 June 2022 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Giant criticism section

I get that this is a controversial subject and criticism should be mentioned, but fringe should not be over represented and the main article for gay pride should not be overwhelmed with these fringe views in opposition to it without some balance. overall, the section seems pointless at times and over bearing in detail. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.27.204.252 (talk • contribs) 05:53, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

Which parts/sources do you think are fringe/undue weight? Dronebogus (talk) 13:17, 18 August 2022 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 2 March 2023

change “cable TV station” (first paragraph) to “cable TV channel” or “cable TV network”. A station is a physical location that broadcasts, the link goes to an article about a channel (actually a network that exists over different channels in different countries). 2600:1010:B1AC:30E6:C96C:7A1B:A888:9A56 (talk) 01:48, 2 March 2023 (UTC)

 Done M.Bitton (talk) 02:24, 2 March 2023 (UTC)

LGBTI+

Essa é uma das siglas mais aceitas. LGBT não representa toda a diversidade. 2804:214:8629:82D9:1:0:B18E:4895 (talk) 11:57, 28 June 2023 (UTC)

Pride and Protest

Having a long and proud history of protesting against the powerful, Pride should have some common ground with the like-minded groups. So, instead of taking corporate money, they might have supported the right of groups protesting against powerful people.

Given Just Stop Oil events, would not a section on Pride and Protester be useful and of interest? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2.24.196.97 (talk) 07:30, 5 July 2023 (UTC)

Pride Terminology origins

The sources that Brenda Howard, Robert A. Martin, and L. Craig Schoonmaker had anything to do with the word "pride" are quite dodgy or non-existent. It looks like Howard had less to do with the use of the word pride and seem she may have been more about being one of the founders of Christopher Street Liberation Day. Are there more reliable sources and details for the claim they had anything to do with inventing or popularizing the word "Pride"? Myotus (talk) 18:19, 16 July 2024 (UTC)