Talk:My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy/Archive 1

Archive 1

Archive 2

Archive 3

Dark Fantasy track producer(s)

This track is officially produced by the RZA, No I.D. & Kanye West, not just RZA!! CHANGE IT IMMEDIATELY, here is the link

Fake album cover

THIS ALBUM COVER IS FAKE!!! Where is a prooflink? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mad player (talk • contribs) 16:57, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

Confirmed tracklist?

SOMEBODY PLEASE DELETE THIS SO CALLED "CONFIMED" TRACKLIST???,ITS OBVIOUSLY FAKE! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.127.103.153 (talk) 15:30, 21 July 2010 (UTC)

No longer Good Ass Job

On July 28, 2010, Kanye announced via his new official Twitter account that "The album is no longer called "Good Ass Job" I'm bouncing a couple of titles around now." - Please update the entire article to reflect this change.Freaky Face Films (talk) 18:23, 28 July 2010 (UTC) Its called MY BEAUTIFUL DARK TWISTED FANTASY http://www.prefixmag.com/news/kanyes-fifth-album-gets-a-name-my-beautiful-dark-t/44690/ —Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.100.159.20 (talk) 14:52, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

It's called "My Dark Twisted Fantasy". No joke. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.52.246.163 (talk) 19:40, 6 August 2010 (UTC)

Tracklist

Confirmed tracks are Monster, Power, Runaway, and Good Friday It is said that the artist Big Sean will feature on kanye west bonus track "See Me Now" also featuring Beyonce and Charlie Wilson —Preceding unsigned comment added by Cokafor1 (talk • contribs) 00:56, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

the tracklist's featuring acts are all fake —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.39.81.9 (talk) 06:03, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

Album name ≠ A Good Ass Job -Verified

According to Kanye's new VERIFIED Twitter account, A Good Ass Job is no more. Source: http://twitter.com/kanyewest/status/19758633594 WoodenFeet (talk) 18:41, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

Multiple Subjects

First off, there is no proof that the album is going to be called Dark Twisted Fantasy. Also, The part of the article saying that The title Good ass job is confirmed needs to be removed. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Joinuseveryweek (talk • contribs) 03:44, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

Updates: August 09, 2010

There have been some last minute changes (again) in the lineup:

According to Kanye via UStream, the album's release date has now been pushed back to sometime in Novemeber. Additionally, he states while "Dark Twisted Fantasy" is the tenative name for the album, it will not be a lock until the release date nears. West also revealed the titles of two potential singles ("Lost in the World" or "All of the Lights") that will follow "Power" and should be released within the next month.

(Kanye's UStream video): http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/8757510 (Article): http://hiphopwired.com/2010/08/08/kanye-west-pushes-back-album-and-reveals-possible-album-name-30097/

The Writer 2.0 ^Talk 12:18, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

EDIT REQUEST: TWO NEW SONGS AND G.O.O.D. FIRDAY

"Monster" featuring Jay-Z, Rick Ross, Nicki Minaj, and Bon Iver http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1646722/20100827/jay_z.jhtml

"Runaway" featuring Justin Bieber & Raekwon http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1646789/20100830/west_kanye.jhtml Runaway was sung on september 12th not august. please change asap. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.60.20.15 (talk) 21:11, 17 September 2010 (UTC)

""the song was released September 13th, not the 3rd. make the change please —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.189.37.123 (talk) 20:28, 13 September 2010 (UTC)

New song every G.O.O.D. Friday form now to Christmas http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1646259/20100823/west_kanye.jhtml

BY dasanik97

See Me Now's Guest Artists

Justin Bieber is not one of the guest artists on See Me Now. The guest artists are Beyoncé and Charlie Wilson. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Michaelpamon828 (talk • contribs) 04:38, 31 August 2010 (UTC)

Edit request from RomulusDubb, 26 September 2010

{{edit semi-protected}} Please change: | Cover = Nocover.svg

to: | Cover = Dark_Twisted_Fantasy-Kanye_West.jpg

because there is currently no album art available for this link. RomulusDubb (talk) 05:05, 26 September 2010 (UTC)

Not done for now: That image has been deleted from Commons as a copyright violation. It can be uploaded again to Special:Upload using the Non-free album cover licence rationale. But remember, only upload it to Wikipedia, not Commons. Thanks, Stickee (talk) 05:53, 26 September 2010 (UTC)

Edit request from Ultrakid, 27 September 2010

{{edit semi-protected}} Guests The guests that are confirmed to be on the album are Dwele, Pusha T, Tony Williams, Justin Vernon and M.I.A.

Confirmed Tracks Power ft. Dwele All of the Lights ft. Tony Williams Lost in the World ft. Justin Vernon Mama's Boyfriend Chain Heavy

Ultrakid (talk) 06:31, 27 September 2010 (UTC)

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Celestra (talk) 15:19, 27 September 2010 (UTC)

Edit Request: new release date confirmed. ==

this is supposedly the final release date and is firm. November 22nd.

http://www.hiphopdx.com/index/news/id.12385/title.kanye-wests-album-reportedly-gets-a-release-date —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.189.38.37 (talk) 23:50, 28 September 2010 (UTC)

All of the lights

All of the light features Drake from the snippet he has a verse to start the song —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.171.197.22 (talk) 09:22, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

Source? Red Flag on the Right Side 23:31, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

Look for the Drake - Young Sweet Jones 2 mixtape on hdmixtapes.com. Track 08 "Ghetto University" is All of the Lights. Or the Lime Light Exclusives 2 mixtape on youngmoneyhd.com. That version you can hear Kanye at the end. Just yesterday I think it was, All of the Lights and Lost in the World leaked. Drake's missing on AotL but this is supposed to be an early version. If you put the leak from yesterday and the version from Lime Light Exclusives 2, Kanye's verse matches up.--174.54.57.5 (talk) 04:25, 30 September 2010 (UTC)

HA! Told you drake was in the song maaaate —Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.178.172.28 (talk) 07:48, 17 October 2010 (UTC)

Edit request from 98.196.121.235, 29 September 2010

{{edit semi-protected}} This album is still untitled "I can't decide on my album title either uuuugh!!!!" less than 5 seconds ago via web (Kanye West twitter) 9/29/2010 98.196.121.235 (talk) 18:47, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

 Not done per WP:TWITTER `The Resident Anthropologist (talk) 01:47, 30 September 2010 (UTC)

Is this a misapplication of WP:TWITTER ? Shouldn't WP:SELFPUB hold instead. WP:TWITTER is for 3rd parties opinions, not people self publishing information about themselves. --Rajah (talk) 22:17, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

NO more GOOD FRIDAYs

http://rapfix.mtv.com/2010/09/30/kanye-cancels-good-friday/ —Preceding unsigned comment added by Dasanik97 (talk • contribs) 03:59, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

its only for this week its back next week though http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1649032/20100930/west_kanye.jhtml —Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.124.88.39 (talk) 08:19, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

Why does that madder? Red Flag on the Right Side 15:17, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

Release date has been confirmed

The release date for Kanye's untitled fifth album has been confirmed to be November 22, 2010. http://www.rap-up.com/2010/09/28/kanye-west-gets-a-release-date/ —Preceding unsigned comment added by Michaelpamon828 (talk • contribs) 02:48, 3 October 2010 (UTC)

MY BEAUTIFUL DARK TWISTED FANTASY OFFICIAL ALBUM TITLE

twitter.com/kanyewest UPDATE NOW!!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.100.159.20 (talk) 14:30, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

Please read the Wikipedia section on self-published sources at WP:TWITTER. Yvesnimmo (talk) 14:32, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

I dont care about that. The section needs to be updated. So go on now.. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.100.159.20 (talk) 14:48, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

Wikipedia has many rules, guidelines, and standards that need to be followed. One of these is that reliable and verifiable sources need to be provided for edits. The section doesn't "need to be updated", unless you can provide such sources. Yvesnimmo (talk) 14:51, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

I just did. several times in fact. heres the final time http://www.prefixmag.com/news/kanyes-fifth-album-gets-a-name-my-beautiful-dark-t/44690/ —Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.100.159.20 (talk) 14:54, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

and btw. twitter IS a credible source especially when i put the link from the tweet (which confirms the information or "SOURCE"!) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.100.159.20 (talk) 14:59, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

Twitter is never a reliable source. Yvesnimmo (talk) 15:06, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

Yes it is if it's about themselves Scarymuppet (talk) 15:19, 5 October 2010 (UTC):::

Artists do not have the final say on album details. It is ultimately up to the record label to decide such things. Yvesnimmo (talk) 15:26, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

Well either way, a credible source has been given. So if the change could happen. Us.. (As kanye fans) would greatly appreciate it) http://www.hiphopdx.com/index/news/id.12463/title.kanye-west-settles-on-my-beautiful-dark-twisted-fantasy-for-album-title

Lets also get something straight. Kanye has made it clear that NOONE tells him what to call the album, when to release it. and how it sounds. 808s & Heartbreak was a prime example of this. Again sources have been given. So you cant dispute the change any longer —Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.100.159.20 (talk) 15:33, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

What? How the fuck isn't Twitter a reliable source? It comes straight from the artist! This is bullshit. Just fucking move it, we all know it's the title.

Title is officially 'MY BEAUTIFUL DARK TWISTED FANTASY' reference:http://m.billboard.com/news/kanye-west-announces-dark-twisted-fantasy-1004118984.storyhttp://m.billboard.com/news/kanye-west-announces-dark-twisted-fantasy-1004118984.story

Next single

It is All of the lights. Also, the Runaway 40-minute film will be accompanied by the album reference:http://m.billboard.com/news/kanye-west-announces-dark-twisted-fantasy-1004118984.storyhttp://m.billboard.com/news/kanye-west-announces-dark-twisted-fantasy-1004118984.story —Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.177.64.251 (talk) 16:31, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

Monster...

According to Pitchfork, Monster is now included on the album. I'm wondering why is this being deleted, even with a link to the source? http://pitchfork.com/news/40428-kanyes-banned-itwisted-fantasyi-cover/

The portion of the article prevalent to this talk:

“ Also, we just got a press release that finally confirms a few long-rumored details about Twisted Fantasy, which is out November 22 on Roc-A-Fella/Def Jam. The G.O.O.D. Friday favorite "Monster" will definitely appear on the album. (No word on whether some other G.O.O.D. Friday tracks will make the cut.) Guests on the LP include Kid Cudi, Raekwon, Nicki Minaj, Jay-Z, Rick Ross, and Bon Iver's Justin Vernon. Producers include RZA, Pete Rock, and Q-Tip. No tracklist quite yet, but Kanye apparently finished up the whole thing yesterday. ”

Just wait until the tracklist comes out. Everyone will keep deleting it because Kanye said it's on Watch The Throne. Thats Why There Deleting It.

Main article: Watch the Throne

—Preceding unsigned comment added by Bend2pa (talk • contribs) 01:22, 19 October 2010 (UTC)

Cover art

According to a recent interview with MTV News here, there will be five covers for this album. Which one should be used in the infobox? I know multiple covers can be used (e.g. The Fame Monster), but I don't think using all five is allowed... I may be wrong. Thoughts? Yves (talk) 19:13, 19 October 2010 (UTC)

I see there's been a new cover revealed. I have decided to re-add the first cover because none of them should be of more importance than the other. Yves (talk) 18:38, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

Tracklisting

Okay, take your lazy asses to the iTunes store and see the official tracklisting for yourselves. Then you can put my hard work back where it belongs. K thanks. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.188.251.250 (talk) 04:41, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

The iTunes Store is not available in all countries. Also, your good faith addition was not sourced, which could be considered WP:OR and is valid reason for removal. Yves (talk) 04:45, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

http://twitpic.com/322c5p/full L Trey (talk) 11:21, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

Not a reliable source (see WP:TWITTER and below). Yves (talk) 17:42, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

I disagree. WP:TWITTER does not apply. Wikipedia:ABOUTSELF does. --Rajah (talk) 22:13, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

MBDTF

Can someone with Wikipedia knowledge make it to where "MBDTF" redirects to the album page? Because it's annoying to type out completely. Thanks!

64.188.251.250 (talk) 16:42, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

Y Done Yves (talk) 16:45, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

Itunes current tracklist is not official

Kanye denied the itunes page with 12 tracks is official.

"Kanye confirmed in an interview with MTV that the final tracklist has not yet been submitted, but will likely feature 13-14 tracks."

http://consequenceofsound.net/2010/10/23/is-this-the-tracklist-for-kanye-wests-my-beautiful-dark-twisted-fantasy/ —Preceding unsigned comment added by Gallo4jauregui (talk • contribs) 03:54, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

He did not specifically deny the iTunes Store track list, or reference it in any way. He mentioned they were in the process of deciding bonus tracks, hence the total of thirteen or fourteen. Yves (talk)

2nd cover

http://consequenceofsound.net/2010/10/23/is-this-the-tracklist-for-kanye-wests-my-beautiful-dark-twisted-fantasy/ post it along with tha 1st one/ —Preceding unsigned comment added by 120.56.170.176 (talk) 14:08, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

• Rolling Stone verifies that it's likely the second cover. DC T•C 15:05, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

Edit Request: Runaway length

{{Edit semi-protected}}

On the Runaway page, it says the album song is 8:00 minutes in length. Shouldn't that be added? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nathanchance (talk • contribs)

Not done: please be more specific about what needs to be changed. Where on the page should it mention that? Thanks, Stickee (talk) 12:35, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

"So Appalled" Guests RZA and CyHi Da Prynce

Okay, I need to make this straight. RZA's name does not have 'The' in front of it. And CyHi Da Prynce is the way his name is titled, not Prynce CyHi. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Michaelpamon828 (talk • contribs) 23:03, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

"The RZA" and "Prynce CyHi" are the way they are credited in the track listing on the iTunes Store. Artists can be credited differently in different tracks. The RZA sometimes uses the article in front of his name. Yves (talk) 23:22, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

100% complete tracklisting from 1st CD press

1. Dark Fantasy 2. Gorgeous 3. Power 4. All Of The Lights (Interlude) 5. All Of The Lights 6. Monster 7. So Appalled 8. Devil In A New Dress 9. Runaway 10.Hell Of A Life 11.Blame Game / The Best Man 12.Lost In The World 13.Who Will Survive In America? 14.Runaway (The Movie)

See Me Now might just be an iTunes exclusive album track.

Source? Yves (talk) 05:32, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

http://twitpic.com/322c5pTr1plefilter (talk) 06:43, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

A picture from WP:TWITTER is not a reliable source, because artists can write whatever they want. If this is the "1st CD press", then how does that mean this is "complete" or official? If this is indeed the official track listing, a third-party reliable source should be soon to publish it. For now, we cannot include this information in the article or treat it as more reliable than the current source. Yves (talk) 06:52, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

I won't argue with you because you're obviously a dick, but if a picture of the latest tracklisting provided firsthand by the artist doesn't constitute the most recent official version of the tracklisting, then I don't know what does (and don't give me that nonsense about the tracklisting not being 'final' or 'official' - this article has seen numerous iterations of this tracklisting and the only thing that qualified them for inclusion was that they were the latest available tracklistings).Tr1plefilter (talk) 08:03, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

Artists don't release albums; record labels do. Any final official track listing has to be approved by the label(s). This one is still from an unreliable source. Yves (talk) 08:09, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

Shouldn't Wikipedia:ABOUTSELF apply instead of WP:TWITTER as "Self-published and questionable sources may be used as sources of information about themselves, usually in articles about themselves or their activities" ? Seems like since his twitter is verified it qualifies under WP:SELFPUB --Rajah (talk) 22:15, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

Artists with verified accounts have tweeted things that turned out to be false, either as a joke or an unconfirmed piece of news. Nicki Minaj recently tweeted the release date of the track listing of her debut album, only for the date to be incorrect and the track listing is still unconfirmed and unreleased. Last Christmas, Katy Perry tweeted about her brother's coming out, which turned out to be false. It is ultimately up to the record label to confirm track listings. Further, the article is not about West, but one of his albums, which, again, has most, if not all, aspects covered by the label. Yves (talk) 22:23, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

Those are strawman arguments. You haven't addressed my point that anything which Kanye West tweets under his own verified Twitter account which meets the following five criteria can not fall under WP:TWITTER.

1. the material is not unduly self-serving;
2. it does not involve claims about third parties;
3. it does not involve claims about events not directly related to the source;
4. there is no reasonable doubt as to its authenticity;
5. the article is not based primarily on such sources.

It instead falls under WP:SELFPUB and is for the purposes of Wikipedia, a reliable source. As for: "Artists with verified accounts have tweeted things that turned out to be false, either as a joke or an unconfirmed piece of news". Well, the New York Times has printed things which turned out to be false, either as a joke or an unconfirmed piece of news. No source is infallible. But for the purposes of Wikipedia, "self-published tweets by sources about themselves or their activities", are considered reliable and worthy of inclusion in the relevant article(s). The fact that the article is not about West, but instead one of his activities is not relevant to the discussion as they indeed both fall under WP:SELFPUB, see: "Self-published and questionable sources may be used as sources of information about themselves, usually in articles about themselves or their activities."

I'm not arguing whether this particular tweet is valid or worthy of inclusion. I'm just pointing out that Twitter is reliable when it fits the criteria of WP:SELFPUB and you shouldn't be so quick to shoot down editors who wish to cite it. --Rajah (talk) 23:25, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

I am an editor who wishes to cite it, but I do not find it reliable. A tweet about an upcoming music release is not wholly reliable since it is not only up to the artist to decide details like this. There have been many situations in which artists have had conflicts with their record labels (for example the infamous My December situation, or similarly, the "Already Gone" controversy), and it is ultimately up to the label to decide these things. The track listing is a primary portion of the article, and using it would be basing that section primarily on the source. Also, point number four above could be argued: nothing says it's the final track listing of My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy. The caption simply reads, "We finally done! Toast!". Done what? A draft copy? A CD to be submitted to the label for final approval? It is not clear whether it is the final track listing that is being referred to in this picture. Yves (talk) 00:03, 31 October 2010 (UTC)

Additionally, not the entire track listing is visible. It also excludes featured artists, track lengths, writers, and producers. Yves (talk) 22:25, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

IMO, this is the only legitimate claim regarding that tweeted pic. I still think it can be included though with a disclaimer as to the obscuring of the last track name, along with a link to the source pic. --Rajah (talk) 23:25, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

It is not only the last track; the eleventh track is obscured, as well. And being a picture and not text, some letters may be ambiguous. The first track, for example, is confirmed by retailers as "Dark Fantasy", but this is not clear on the photograph: could it be "Dark Fanlasy" or "Dark Fantesy" or any letters the blur that is the second word can be interpreted as. Yves (talk) 00:03, 31 October 2010 (UTC)

The CD is sealed and watermarked by Universal Music Group. It says Revised on the disc, so it's changed from the iTunes tracklist. Kanye also stated "We finally done!", so I would say it is complete. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Phewcharyztik (talk • contribs) 09:50, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

We don't know that. It's a primary source. It could just be a random CD with a random track listing and a random sticker. Maybe it's not likely, but it still could be, which is why it cannot be used as a reliable source. We do not want to do any WP:OR. Yves (talk) 17:37, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

Well if none of this is reliable, then the whole track listing should be removed from this page until it is 'officially' confirmed by the record label or when the CD is actually released. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Phewcharyztik (talk • contribs) 15:29, 31 October 2010 (UTC)

Cut producers

Pete Rock, Q-Tip, Madlib & DJ Premier's tracks for the album were actually cut & will be appearing on the Watch The Throne album with Jay-Z instead. Here is the link Q-Tip did not co-produce All Of The Lights neither did Kanye on Devil In A New Dress.

Bonus tracks

Kanye talks about having 'See Me Now' & 'Mama's Boy' as bonus tracks for the album here in this link. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.135.62.210 (talk) 19:17, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

Runaway

I think it should deserve its own page now as the artwork has been released. http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs644.snc4/60443_437896384214_17667289214_5183539_2388715_n.jpg —Preceding unsigned comment added by DaraH46 (talk • contribs) 18:21, 21 September 2010 (UTC)