Talk:Education in Cameroon/Archive 1

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Archive 1

copied verbatim

Latest comment: 7 years ago8 comments3 people in discussion

I added the lead section but the bulk of the text of this article is copied verbatim from this website: http://www.cameroonweb.com/CameroonHomePage/education/?lang=en It should be completely rewritten.--OddsBodkins (talk) 22:52, 17 January 2017 (UTC)

This article was improved using documentation from Luca Martinelli, Case study Cameroon in WikiAfrica Primary School Feasibility Study, ed. Iolanda Pensa, lettera27 Foundation and Africa Centre, November 2012, CC BY-SA. --Iopensa (talk) 08:44, 22 May 2013 (UTC)

iolanda, it would be better to provide a real link to the works. your edits after 2011 have proper references, none of them as far as i can see from luca martinelli. if you could clearly state on the talk page which of the contents is from your book it would be great, i volunteerly add it to the article to cover your conflict of interest here. --ThurnerRupert (talk) 21:46, 10 November 2013 (UTC)

The text (the entire text I used to upgrade the article) comes from Luca Martinelli, Case study Cameroon in WikiAfrica Primary School Feasibility Study, ed. Iolanda Pensa, lettera27 Foundation and Africa Centre, November 2012, CC BY-SA. I copied and pasted it because it is under cc by-sa. I can and i think it is a good text for the article. The text was meant to go on Wikipedia (this is why it was already structured as a Wikipedia article). we needed it for the feasibility study - but since we were already doing it - we made it for Wikipedia. We did it this way in the interest of Wikipedia. Making the feasibility study and producing within it content for Wikipedia does not have any conflictual interests. If I use a text under cc by-sa (which I can use and it can be further modified) I have to provide attribution. So by removing the attribution, you are violating repeatedly the attribution; please refer to the text of the license which states "you must attribute the work". This is even a moral right. --Iopensa (talk) 22:26, 10 November 2013 (UTC)

do i need to buy the book to verify this? --ThurnerRupert (talk) 07:30, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

WikiAfrica Primary School Feasibility Study, ed. Iolanda Pensa, lettera27 Foundation and Africa Centre, November 2012, CC BY-SA on Wikimedia Commons, pp. 82-85. --Iopensa (talk) 09:36, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

hi iolanda, many thanks for the upload, really appreciated! by using a verbatim copy of the text you exceeded my level of knowledge on how to include this correctly. i am unsure about the following things:

how to correctly cite a verbatim copy containing other references from your book added by you. especially automated detection of copyright violations should not deliver a verbatim copy as "yes, its a copyright violation" (aka "false positive) in this case. my current feeling is that the book should explicitly be there in the references, even if you added the text. i tried to ask on [link? the mailing list].
as the cited paragraph is not original research, how a citation is correctly handled if this verbatim copy of the text is changed.
why your upload is marked as "draft", while you suggest here that it is finished?

--ThurnerRupert (talk) 10:40, 17 November 2013 (UTC)

The text is marked as "draft" because I think it needs some revision of the English.

Something like 1'000 articles have been created or improved using content in cc by-sa released by institutions within the project Share Your Knowledge; the cc by-sa license on websites is machine readable; I presume also the license of Wikimedia Commons is machine readable. In more than 2 years we never had problems related to false positives, i presume because of the machine readable license. This situation (because of the upload on Wikimedia Commons) should be similar; when the license is included online in the proper way it should not make a text detectible as a copyright violation or it should reduce the risk.

I am not sure that this situation really relates to attribution and copyright issues. The reason why you erased the line in the references is because of "lettera27 self promotion" (as your object clearly states) and later because of my own self-promotion (object "promotion of own book. please use talk page to explain better why / what is from there"). I checked on Wikipedia Terms of use. It states "You may import text that you have found elsewhere or that you have co-authored with others, but in such case you warrant that the text is available under terms that are compatible with the CC BY-SA 3.0 license (or, as explained above, another license when exceptionally required by the Project edition or feature)("CC BY-SA").[...] You agree that, if you import text under a CC BY-SA license that requires attribution, you must credit the author(s) in a reasonable fashion [my emphasis]. Where such credit is commonly given through page histories (such as Wikimedia-internal copying), it is sufficient to give attribution in the edit summary, which is recorded in the page history, when importing the text. The attribution requirements are sometimes too intrusive for particular circumstances (regardless of the license), and there may be instances where the Wikimedia community decides that imported text cannot be used for that reason". I am not aware that attribution to works different to the Wikimedia projects is commonly attributed in the edit summery; for this reason I added the attribution in the bibliography and I trust the reference I added on the page was reasonable. Due to this specific circumstances - which again I do not have the impression that relate to attribution or copyright issues, but rather to your systematic assumption that I am promoting my personal interests and the interests of institutions I have worked for or you assume I worked for – I think it is better to not attribute the work in the article. This is simply due to the fact that I do not think this discussion is leading anywhere, I don't think it is contributing to Wikipedia nor to what Wikipedia is meant for. The paradox of this exchange is that you declare that "by using a verbatim copy of the text you exceeded my level of knowledge on how to include this correctly". My impression is that also quite a bit of the work I have been focusing on on Wikipedia in the last years do not necessarily fit your level of knowledge (this is why questions and discussions can be so great for all sides) but this does not necessarily mean that what I did or do is wrong. --Iopensa (talk) 16:18, 17 November 2013 (UTC)

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