Talk:Deforestation and climate change

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Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 27 August 2019 and 6 December 2019. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Jacob Atkinson. Peer reviewers: Mfink1210, Hollygozinsky12345, Danidelponte.

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Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 14 January 2020 and 30 April 2020. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Ethuffma, Gmebrie3, Brealey6. Peer reviewers: Bbakkal, Rnakovsk, Jkwasser, Obee14, Evanalst93, Brmbuck, I Have No Authority, Gheraly.

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"Original research" cleanup tag

@DASonnenfeld: In November 2014, you added the {{original research}} cleanup tag to this article, but this article appears to have many sources already. What is the specific reason for this cleanup tag? Jarble (talk) 19:36, 10 May 2015 (UTC)

Updated. Main focus of this article now draws on one source, the van der Werf article in Nature Geoscience. This article would be strengthened by additional sourcing. Thank you, DA Sonnenfeld (talk) 09:58, 11 May 2015 (UTC)

Remove this article?

This article is very thin on both deforestation and climate change. In effect, only the opening text, repeated verbatim in the first section below the TOC, has any information on deforestation and climate change at all. The article on "deforestation" has more information on climate change than this one. The selection of measures and projects in sections 2 and 3 seems very arbitrary and most refer to a main article with far more information. Unless this article gets a complete overhaul, I vote to delte it. Pvanlaake (talk) 06:36, 29 June 2015 (UTC)

More context needed?

I feel like many of the sections in the article need more evidence or context. Such as the sentence after the intro paragraph which has good information regarding the affects of climate change but that information isn't linked to deforestation, so maybe adding more to that section or moving that sentence into a different part of the article would be better. Also, the section regarding the effects that deforestation should be expanded too, since as of now it only addresses biodiversity loss, albeit very briefly. Sections for effects such as changes in precipitation patterns as shown in this study done in 2013 predicting the changes in precipitation patterns due to deforestation of the Amazon, and the section that already exists regarding biodiversity loss should be expanded into more detail. Tsmalley8 (talk) 04:53, 5 November 2016 (UTC) 21:53 4 November, 2016 (America/Los Angeles)

References

Citation Links

A few of the citations link to error pages and one of them links to a page that talks about a study but does not link to the actual study that was conducted. Links 1 and 10 link to error pages, so either the citations are not correctly linked or the pages are no longer available. I believe that deleting and/or changing these links would strengthen the article and the topics that they are talking about, otherwise I believe that these sections should be deleted. Citation 3 links to an article that talks about a study that was conducted by a researcher at UC Davis. I think that a citation to the actual study, if it can be found, would be a better link to support the idea that is being discussed in that section and that study. Tsmalley8 (talk) 04:52, 5 November 2016 (UTC) 21:52 4 November, 2016 (America/Los Angeles)

More Images

The article only has one image talking about a plan to reduce deforestation in the Amazon. It would be easier to read the article if there were more images relating to what is being talked about. Such as, in the section that talks about reforestation and afforestation, there could be an image following these sections showing what it is talking about. I think having more images would strengthen this article. Natalieterrone (talk) 18:50, 20 September 2019 (UTC)

Notes

I really enjoyed reading this article and I liked how you guys used case studies from around the world to supplement reforestation and afforestation efforts. Furthermore, deforestation is a topic I am really interested in and have done multiple labs to help calculate and visualize deforestation using GIS and Remote Sensing software. With this being said, I added a general paragraph on a couple of the applications of this software to your entry to help supplement some of the efforts to mitigate deforestation. This could possibly be a route one member takes to add to their next entry because there are so many other applications of these softwares that are currently being used for deforestation research. (Look into LiDAR research)  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Lfabina (talk • contribs) 14:36, 2 March 2020 (UTC) 

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Reforestation

The numbers on amount of CO2 reduction per tree have been changed to SI units. I assumed the source for these numbers used short tonnes because 48lb*40 is almost 1 short ton. I would like to add that the source does not cite any research for the finding of these numbers. Kroeliebuschie (talk) 14:21, 1 March 2017 (UTC) Kroeliebuschie (talk) 14:21, 1 March 2017 (UTC)

General coverage and citation link errors

The research done on Deforestation and climate change replicates a general observation on the subject. Most of of your article accounts with facts found during research, but don't necessarily expand more than a few short generalized sentences, such as that on "climate warmth."Perhaps, finding more articles that are more scholarly based and critically reviewed could possibly help support on more coverage on such areas like "climate warmth." Some of the links were not able to open and came up as an error. Can you fix the issue of being able to open a link in order for me to view your other sources?Bludawg 1 (talk) 18:36, 15 October 2017 (UTC)

Additional Sources de Souza, Rodrigo Antônio, and De Marco, Paulo. “Improved Spatial Model for Amazonian Deforestation: An Empirical Assessment and Spatial Bias Analysis.” Ecological Modelling 387 (November 10, 2018): 1–9.

Tanner, Andrew M, and Johnston, Alison L. “The Impact of Rural Electric Access on Deforestation Rates.” World Development 94 (June 2017): 174–185.Jacob Atkinson (talk) 21:22, 1 October 2019 (UTC)

Requested move 24 October 2019

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: not moved (non-admin closure) comrade waddie96 ★ (talk) 11:15, 31 October 2019 (UTC)

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Deforestation and climate change → Deforestation and global warming – This article is entirely about recent deforestation, and its effects on the warming climate on Earth, aka Global warming. It is not about deforestation overall in Earth's history, nor about climate change more generally. Therefore it should match the main article, global warming. _{ZXCVBNM (TALK)} 09:33, 24 October 2019 (UTC)

• Opposed This same basic thing has been proposed at several climate pages. It's a bit disruptive to have these all over the place, so per WP:MULTI

(A) Would some uninvolved ed please hat this one?

(B) Let's have the discussion at the first place, which, to best of my knowledge, is located at Talk:Climate_change_adaptation#Requested_move_24_October_2019.

NewsAndEventsGuy (talk) 13:44, 24 October 2019 (UTC)

• Oppose, as the phrase "climate change" is historically overwhelmingly used to describe modern anthropogenic climate change. bd2412 T 18:06, 28 October 2019 (UTC)

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Counteracting Climate Change

With regard to this subheading, are there other efforts being made other than mass reforestation or afforestation? For example, are municipalities considering increased green space or tree stands within urban areas and planned communities with the intention of changing the way urban planning had been done in the past now that there is more knowledge of the effects of deforestation on climate change and the roles that people/communities play in this. This subheading may be able to offer more alternatives for actions that are being taken. Gmebrie3Gmebrie3 (talk) 19:48, 19 February 2020 (UTC)

Suggestions

I think that the article and the topic are very informative, and I like to read all deforestation arguments such as the relationship between deforestation and climate change. Besides, another argument about tropical deforestation and habitat losses for indigenous people and wild animals in Amazonians shows that deforestation has many dimensions. Nevertheless, I consider that the lead section of the article needs to be defined well and add more detail. Also, deforestation is not new land transformation and land cover sections need a historical perspective and explain well about historical deforestation activities of old civilizations. Besides, I think that almost all sections need more data, case studies, adding citations and improvements to support the arguments in the article. In addition, I have found some misused words; then, I edited them in the article. bbakkal 03:33, 2 April 2020 (UTC) — Preceding bbakkal 03:37, 2 April 2020 (UTC) comment added by Bbakkal (talk • contribs)

I did some small edits for grammar and sentence structure. This article is really well done but I do have a few suggestions. I agree with Jkwasser, I think it would be beneficial to show/have more photos of deforestation just to break up some of the text. Content-wise, I would suggest maybe adding how different regions of the world are dealing with Deforestation - a major issue in Latin America, Africa, and Australia. This could be helpful in building a case for deforestation and climate change. I also think some of the causes for deforestation are somewhat lacking especially urbanization and lumber industry. I also think the article would benefit from more information on the socio-economic effects of deforestation. Evanalst93 (talk) 21:32, 30 March 2020 (UTC) Evanalst93

The lead section is clear and concise. In general, it is a good start; however, I would suggest concentrating on statements that specifically link deforestation and climate change (like you did in your second paragraph) instead of having standalone paragraphs on deforestation and climate change since both topics have their own Wiki page already. Some other suggestions: (1) Merge causes and effects sections into one larger section (2) Improve clarity in writing (3) Look up papers on causes of deforestation from a telecoupled perspective to add some complexity to the true causes of deforestation (4) Expand on reforestation/afforestation subsections (5) Add pictures, more detailed caption on table. Jkwasser (talk) 18:28, 27 February 2020 (UTC)

This is clearly a topic of great importance, especially for the future as the climate continues to gradually shift warmer. I really enjoyed reading through the information that is on this page so far. It is off to a solid start and I think it will develop quite nicely. It would be good to see a few more images or graphs if that were possible to add. I think it would help make the page more aesthetically pleasing. It would also benefit from any charts that could display climate trends or something like that. This page flows nicely and has appropriate headings. I appreciate that this article is not all doom and gloom. I found that the “Counteracting Climate Change” section provided some hope for the future with the explanation of some of the things that are being done to combat deforestation and climate change. If there is further research done on different combative measures or practices, I think that section would benefit from the addition of that. Overall, I think this article is off to a good start. I look forward to reading it further in the future. Nice work! AbbringAustin (talk) 01:00, 1 March 2020 (UTC)

Overall, this article is concise and well written. The introduction is very well done. I think there are a lot of places where citations are missing or statements that need a citation - just to make the overall article stronger. I would also suggest that you start to expand in the "causes of deforestation area" Urbanization, lumber, and livestock are all important but they need citations that really talk about why they cause so much deforestation, maybe find case studies? In class, we have read about deforestation a lot in the global south and Latin America. I agree with Julie here, telecoupling will be helpful in thinking about this topic. I would also try and get into more direct causes and effects a lot of these issues are linked to larger issues. Maybe restructuring some of the topics could help. Nice job! Evanalst93 (talk) 21:53, 1 March 2020 (UTC) Evanalst93

The lead section mentions wildfires as one of the forms in which deforestation comes about but is not further expanded upon in the rest of the article. It might be worthwhile to include some data around wildfires in general about their general impacts. Or a discussion of controlled burns and how they actually help renew/prepare an area for new vegetation. For a more recent discussion of wildfires, you could maybe look into the bushfires in Australia and how they have impacted forest coverage, biodiversity, carbon dioxide and particulate matter levels which are concerns related to and exacerbated by climate change. There are some formatting/wikipedia things that I think could/should be removed like the boxes that say "this section does not cite any sources" when the section does actually cite sources. There are a number of statements made in this article that do not have sources that need to be cited as well. Obee14 (talk) 18:38, 2 March 2020 (UTC)

This article begins with a strong introduction. However, the last small paragraph doesn’t necessarily have context, especially to people who don’t fully understand why increased CO2 emissions lead to increased temperatures. There needs to be a transition from deforestation to temperature change. After the introduction, I think that it would be beneficial to add a section that outlines the history of deforestation to give the reader an idea of how much forestry we have lost and what a huge issue deforestation is. The “lumber industry” section would be more robust if the group added information of the different methods of deforestation used by lumber companies- clear cutting, seed tree cutting, and selective cutting. These different methods have significantly differing impacts on the destruction to the forest. Additionally, the fact that forests are a huge carbon sink is not mentioned, and is one of the intrinsic issues to deforestation and climate change, so this definitely should be an extensive section. The language used is typically concise and well-chosen, but the term “since” is used often and I would suggest avoiding this term in academic and scientific writing, except when using it to refer to time (i.e. “since 1990, …”). — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gheraly (talk • contribs) 22:28, 2 March 2020 (UTC)

I wrote in the talk section, the following review: This is a well written article with a strong structure that supports a solutions-based approach. I think that the writing style is concise and clear. Some areas for improvement that I see related to the content. First, there are many large claims made that are not scientifically sound. For example, we all know that deforestation greatly contributes to our changing climate because of the impact it has on the albedo, the carbon sink and the release of CO2 during clearing. But making the statement that “deforestation is one of the main contributors to climate change” has not been directly proven. If you have a source that does say this, I would highly recommend adding that source in. Secondly, I think that the entry is very strong with discussing the causes of deforestation. I think that it would only add to the page to have a section that talks about how deforestation impacts climate change and vice versa, how climate change contributes to deforestation. Overall a great article! Eb20 (talk) 01:07, 3 March 2020 (UTC)

I think you have done a great job improving your article throughout the semester. This wiki page now provides a comprehensive overview of numerous aspects of deforestation and climate change. I like that you mention ways to counteract deforestation and climate change, view the issue from the perspective of human dimensions of global environmental change, and provide a list of organizations that are working to address this topic. However, I think you could expand on the socioeconomic effects of deforestation. When you discuss this topic, I think it is important that you touch on the fact that many countries have fueled their economic growth through deforestation. This would best capture the complexity of the issue. In this section, you could describe Brazil’s use of the Amazon for cattle ranching to promote its economic growth and the controversy that has arisen from other countries’ and international organizations’ attempts to monitor their land use. Additionally, I think it would be helpful to discuss the impacts that the “policies, projects, and foundations” you listed have had. It is helpful to know these organizations exist, but their real utility comes from their results. Lastly, I would caution you all to be very careful with citing throughout the article. There are numerous paragraphs, or even sections, within the article that do not have any citations. These paragraphs could be removed via Wikipedia rules. Moreover, you should be certain to provide citations after all claims you make that are not general knowledge. There are multiple paragraphs that only have citations following the last section. More than likely, these citations should be at the end of every sentence. In terms of what I did to improve the article, I combined the section that defined deforestation with the introduction. It seemed clunky and awkward to me that they were not a part of the same section when they fit together so well. I also provided grammatical and wording edits throughout the article to improve its credibility and flow.I Have No Authority (talk) 03:13, 7 April 2020 (UTC)

Good job listing the primary drivers behind deforestation in the "Causes of Deforestation" section. Definitely a useful section to have for those who may not be aware of the many reasons why deforestation occurs. I know afforestation has its own Wikipedia article already, but maybe include more in that section about any drawbacks to foresting areas that have not historically had any tree growth. Many of the additions under the "Human Dimensions of Deforestation and Climate Change" section lack citations, so perhaps work on finding sources to attribute there. Overall, I would consider this article to be pretty well developed. Brmbuck (talk) 01:28, 8 April 2020 (UTC)

Peer Review (Human Dimensions)

This article covers a topic paramount to the fight against global environmental change. One statement that feels biased in the Lead, even though it is true, is “…the reduction of the most pressing threats to the diversity of life on Earth.” It may be worth checking if this statement must be made more neutral or even including that its groups like the WWF that perceive the issue to be one of the most pressing threats to biodiversity. The Urbanization section needs citations to back up the info stated there. Again, it seems to be slightly biased to one side. The Agricultural Expansion section also needs citations. “Decrease in climate services” could maybe be renamed to “Decrease in ecosystem services”? Also, watch for grammatical errors and redundancy. There are points in the article where words and phrases could be eliminated altogether such as “As the human population continues to increase throughout the years”. “Throughout the years” could be taken out. Another example is under “Agricultural Expansion” (“The number one largest cause”). The structure of the article is quite clear and flows well. Further, the sections are well-balanced. Peamarsh (talk) 04:21, 3 March 2020 (UTC)

I enjoyed the detail on what deforestation does to other countries. I think it is important to see how different the effects are on other countries and how much more negative impacts they have due to deforestation. I would like to see more information on what it does to the wildlife that live in these areas that are being deconstructed and also the people living around/in those areas. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ahdelgad (talk • contribs) 20:44, 1 April 2020 (UTC)

I think this article is extremely well put together. The detail put into this is incredible, and the links to outside sources make it extremely manageable. There are a few minor adjustments I would suggest to make this article more complete. I would start by completely removing the climate change section. This section is too bare and does not serve a purpose compared to the rest of the article. I also suggest adding more information for the lumber, palm oil, livestock ranching sections. These sections are very bare and do not provide enough information on cases involved. Rnakovsk (talk) 21:49, 1 May 2020 (UTC)

Cattle Ranching

I think this subsection could really be elaborated even more and connected to other issues surrounding this topic, specifically connecting it to the Amazon rainforest. Much of the Amazon is deforested due to cattle ranching and even more of it it due to soy production which is used to feed animal livestock.

I might also be really interested to talk about environmental racism and politics in this section as many activists have actually been murdered "mysteriously" when protesting the deforestation of the amazon rainforest. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:802:8380:D6D0:8FB:5649:90C5:2A0 (talk) 01:24, 8 April 2020 (UTC)

Caption of top picture

The caption says it is clear cut but the picture details say it was deforested by a storm. Perhaps it was clearcut after the storm? So maybe both are right? Chidgk1 (talk) 16:19, 15 April 2020 (UTC)

Overlap with other articles

I don't know whether you students working hard on this difficult article still have time to consider this but there seems to be a lot of overlap with deforestation and possibly also United Nations REDD Programme and Reducing emissions from deforestation and forest degradation. Chidgk1 (talk) 16:43, 15 April 2020 (UTC)

@Chidgk1: The article also seems to conflate the causes of deforestation with the effects of deforestation, such as biodiversity loss. Jarble (talk) 18:50, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

@Jarble: Yes I suppose unless there is any way the biodiversity lost due to deforestation caused by climate change then causes more climate change in a kind of feedback loop (in which case it should be mentioned how) then biodiversity loss belongs in another article not here - does anyone disagree? Chidgk1 (talk) 07:31, 4 February 2021 (UTC)

Uncertainty in % of global ghg?

Deforestation says "Tropical deforestation is responsible for approximately 20% of world greenhouse gas emissions" but this article says 11% for all deforestation. Is one wrong or is there really that much uncertainty? We need to write the uncertainty in the estimates I think but where is it? Somewhere in some IPCC report? Chidgk1 (talk) 17:28, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Merger proposal

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.

No consensus.

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I propose to merge Reducing emissions from deforestation and forest degradation into Deforestation and climate change. I think that the content in the Reducing emissions from deforestation and forest degradation article can easily be explained in the context of Deforestation and climate change, and the Deforestation and climate change article is of a reasonable size that the merging of Reducing emissions from deforestation and forest degradation will not cause any problems as far as article size is concerned. Chidgk1 (talk) 19:35, 4 November 2020 (UTC)

Isn't this a formal concept in international agreements and organizations? I am not sure I understand why it would make sense to merge these -- what value does it add? Sadads (talk) 12:35, 5 November 2020 (UTC)

Good question. I think currently both the articles need slimming down. Deforestation and climate change seems to have a lot of info which belongs in Deforestation, and Reducing emissions from deforestation and forest degradation goes into too much detail don't you think? So merging and slimming might result in a more interesting and focused article. Alternatively I could cancel this merge proposal and instead propose merging into United Nations REDD Programme. Or indeed merge all 3. Or much less work would be not to merge but merely try and link the articles better - for example improve the sentence in Deforestation and climate change which currently reads "One attempt towards fighting climate change globally is the Reducing Emissions for Deforestation and Forest Degradation (REDD+) efforts, and a few countries are already starting to implement and analyze ways to protect standing trees." Chidgk1 (talk) 16:01, 5 November 2020 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Wiki Education assignment: Digital Rhetoric and Writing

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 17 January 2022 and 30 April 2022. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Shaykip (article contribs). Peer reviewers: JunoBear, Magmurg.

Social

What will happen if there are no trees discuss the consequences and our responsibilities for afforestation 2401:4900:4E22:A890:792C:351C:EB7F:17B5 (talk) 09:47, 25 September 2022 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Media, Activism, and Social Movements

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 17 January 2023 and 17 May 2023. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): KeeLgd (article contribs). Peer reviewers: Enina24, Marcplummer82.

— Assignment last updated by Marcplummer82 (talk) 00:19, 31 March 2023 (UTC)

Source suggestions to be added

• Wang, Jingfeng et al. “Impact of Deforestation in the Amazon Basin on Cloud Climatology.” Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences - PNAS 106.10 (2009): 3670–3674.Web.

This is a peer-reviewed article published by a professor at MIT with all their references coming from Google Scholar, so it should be a reliable source. It covers the topic of deforestation effecting the movements and density of clouds. Atmospheric instability is a result of the effected clouds which causes heat flux, clouds being closer to the ground, and the possibility of no clouds forming in deforested areas.

• Song, Xiao-Peng et al. “Annual Carbon Emissions from Deforestation in the Amazon Basin Between 2000 and 2010.” PloS one 10.5 (2015): e0126754–e0126754. Web.

This is a peer-reviewed article published by a professor at TTU, so it should be a reliable source. It covers the topic of deforestation triggering climate change. The data collected from tracking the amount of carbon emissions in the atmosphere over the course of 10 years shows a rise in areas such as the Amazon basin where deforestation has occurred.

• Sampaio, Gilvan et al. “CO2 Physiological Effect Can Cause Rainfall Decrease as Strong as Large-Scale Deforestation in the Amazon.” Biogeosciences 18.8 (2021): 2511–2525. Web.[3]

This is a peer-reviewed article with some references that are recent, so it should be a reliable source for the topic of effects caused by deforestation. The increase of CO2 not only threatens the atmosphere and ocean but also vegetation. Areas that experience deforestation have the risk of their vegetation dying because of the decrease in rainfall. KeeLgd (talk) 19:29, 23 February 2023 (UTC)

I suggest also recent IPCC documents such as https://www.ipcc.ch/report/ar6/wg1/downloads/factsheets/IPCC_AR6_WGI_Sectoral_Fact_Sheet_Forestry.pdf

If you have any difficulty finding IPCC stuff or have other questions feel free to ask at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Climate change. Thanks for choosing this important subject. Chidgk1 (talk) 17:01, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

There are a few more possible sources at Wikipedia:WikiProject Climate change/Biodiversity Chidgk1 (talk) 17:09, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

— Assignment last updated by KeeLgd (talk) 02:54, 22 February 2023 (UTC)

References

Suggested Edit

The category Human dimension of deforestation and climate change as well as the subcategory Agriculture (listed under Human dimension) have already been discussed earlier in the article. Should we consider removing some of the information in the Causes of deforestation, Agricultural expansion and replacing it with the information in this category? Agricultural expansion is talked about a lot and should only be in one place in this article so that it doesn't seem like it's the only factor to deforestation and doesn't overpower the others. Some of the information stated toward the end of this article becomes redundant. KeeLgd (talk) 04:41, 8 April 2023 (UTC)

Yes, this all needs to be tightened up, repetition removed and overlap with deforestation be removed. EMsmile (talk) 07:56, 28 September 2023 (UTC)

Need citation for following wordings in bold

[Other effects caused by climate change and deforestation reacting together are soil erosion, water scarcity/flooding, and low mortality rates in specific regions.]. And [Solutions to slow down or potentially eliminate these issues are reforestation, afforestation, and agricultural change which could be funded by projects such as The Amazon Fund and UHN goals.]. Can anybody help? Thanks. ThomasYehYeh (talk) 00:13, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

Need relavant citation to support following

[The carbon emitted from the process of converting timber to wood products accounts for 15%^[45]]. The cited information here seemed irrevalent to me, and the said 15% seemed strange to me, maybe the wordings could be rephrased to give the readers a better understanding. Thanks. ThomasYehYeh (talk) 23:23, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

Student assignment

Hi User:Saul Shad if you work on this article please do not add content here that should rather be at deforestation. Students tend to always add new content, rather than work with existing content and e.g. reduce repetition and overlap with other Wikipedia articles... EMsmile (talk) 07:58, 28 September 2023 (UTC)

Scope of the article?

As climate change and deforestation already have their own articles this article seems to me to be going way out of scope.

I think it should only include the effects of deforestation on climate change and the effects of climate change on deforestation.

So I am tempted to delete the stuff about causes of deforestation other than climate change, and effects of deforestation other than climate change.

As this article is titled "Deforestation and climate change" not "Forests and climate change" I am also tempted to move the sections about reforestation to Reforestation#For_climate_change_mitigation

I would keep only the following sections:

"Decrease in climate services"

"Reduce emissions from deforestation and forest degradation"

Then I would hope someone else would add more e.g. from https://www.nationalgeographic.com/environment/article/amazon-rainforest-now-appears-to-be-contributing-to-climate-change and to quantify how much climate change is being caused by deforestation, and rewrite the lead

What do you think? Yes? No?

Feel free to suggest time consuming alternatives to the above if you are going to do it yourself.

Chidgk1 (talk) 11:52, 16 March 2021 (UTC)

@KeeLgd Any thoughts? Chidgk1 (talk) 14:33, 25 February 2023 (UTC)

@Chidgk1 I understand what you are saying in the sense of displaying to much information on branching subjects when this article is geared toward climate change in connection to deforestation. I will say that that some of the causes/processes of deforestation do contribute to climate change. For example, agriculture expansion contributes because of the construction, which releases CO2. I do think that in parts of the article the topic of deforestation and climate change start to become separated. For example, in the subcategory "Decrease in Biodiversity" deforestation is talked about through habitat loss and climate change is talked about through the rising temperatures, these two topics are now separate. They are two different issues that result in the same thing, yet this article is supposed to talk about how both of them connect together as a result of one another.

I think that either some information needs to be taken out or the summary paragraph needs to be reworded. The first sentence of the paragraph says, "Deforestation is a primary contributor to climate change.". Meaning that we should only be talking about how deforestation effects the climate. Not the effects of deforestation upon other subjects such as biodiversity and human mortality. ~~~ KeeLgd (talk) 16:03, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

I have changed the first sentence. You are right that some information needs to be taken out and I hope you will do so - if your prof does not credit you for removing info as well as adding info let me know and I will try to persuade them Chidgk1 (talk) 16:53, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

Hi User:Chidgk1 I am glad you have already commented on this in March, as I was about to say the same thing. I've been doing some work on the deforestation article (it had ballooned way out), now I come here and see a heap of overlapping content, e.g. in the area of "causes". This needs to be tidied up as we'll otherwise end up with a duplicate structure. So I propose to mover everything that is about deforestation in general over to deforestation and re-focus this article to only look at what deforestation does to climate change, and how climate change can lead to deforestation (through more wildfires, I guess). EMsmile (talk) 07:55, 28 September 2023 (UTC)

I've done some of that mop-up work, particularly in the sections on causes and effects. More still needs to be done in the section on control measures to take out digressing content and remove overlap with deforestation. You can tell that this article has been the topic of numerous student assignments... Their task is always to add new content, not to work with existing content, nor to condense, streamline, reduce overlap. This is how we end up with overly bloated articles and parallel structures which is a pity. EMsmile (talk) 09:19, 28 September 2023 (UTC)

Yes perhaps the student guidelines should particularly encourage them to work on stubs, especially if they could 5x expand them to allow them to submit to DYK if they wanted. Chidgk1 (talk) 12:27, 28 September 2023 (UTC)

Good work - it may be that parts of this country (Turkey) will become too dry for trees to grow or maybe we can switch to drought tolerant trees - I need to look into that. Chidgk1 (talk) 12:36, 28 September 2023 (UTC)

I've done some more work on this article (taking out outdated or poorly sourced content, linking with e.g. carbon sequestration). But the more I work on this article the more I wonder what its actual purpose is and if we really need it. Wouldn't we be better off adding climate change content to deforestation, and adding forestry content to carbon sequestration? What purpose exactly does this article serve? Maybe it's just an umbrella article that pulls a range of topics together, by using a lot of excerpts. Just to give people an overview. But details should rather be added to deforestation, carbon sequestration, reforestation etc. (I've never been a big fan of the articles that have a title of "climate change and xxx" or "xxx and climate change") EMsmile (talk) 08:51, 29 September 2023 (UTC)