Wikipedia talk:Don't be the Fun Police

Stuff

Me (Tryptofish) objecting to having too many images with funny captions. Um, wait, um...

• Useful imagery may possibly be found at User:EEng#Alle-wiki-gory. EEng 18:39, 11 June 2021 (UTC)

  Already added one from there. I think this is an essay that could benefit from having lots of pictures. Especially if they also had sarcastic captions. ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants Tell me all about it. 19:32, 11 June 2021 (UTC)

Thoughts about the direction to take with this essay

As I said in the discussion that came up with the idea of creating this essay, [1], my thinking is that it would be a good thing, eventually, over time, to get the community to regard this kind of conduct as a type of disruptive conduct. As such, I'd suggest developing this page with that long-term goal in mind.

I realize that there's a paradox in me saying this. Here we are, saying don't be the Fun Police, and here I am, about to say we shouldn't have too much fun. Yup, that's on me.

But I think, personally, that it is a mistake to make this too much into a "humorous essay". I also think it would be a mistake to use it for venting, especially if the targets are identifiable as particular editors. Instead of making the goal to get editors who agree with us to say "yeah, that's hilarious", it should be to get editors who disagree with us to say "you know, I hadn't thought of it that way before, but I'm starting to see your point." --Tryptofish (talk) 19:32, 11 June 2021 (UTC)

You're raising a good point, but I don't think that treating this essay the same way as one would an essay on NPOV or BLP is really entirely necessary. What we can do to make a "serious" point is to make sure that serious point is made very early in the essay in a serious way. Perhaps even in the intro. Then, referring back to that point with some humor is really just a poignant reminder of that point (the humor will, quite literally, make it easier for the reader to absorb and agree with the point).

As for the ranting nature, you're absolutely right, that needs to go entirely, unless there's a way of condensing it into a single section where the ranting nature seems appropriate, but I doubt that. That quality is nothing more nor less than a result of how tired I was when I wrote it. I knew if I just let my brain wander I'd end in rant mode, but I'd touch on some things that would be good to elaborate on later. ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants Tell me all about it. 19:37, 11 June 2021 (UTC)

Sure, understood, and I'm saying that to EEng's revisions as well as to yours. But I think, for example, that having too many images with too many funny captions is the wrong way to go. When I rewrote the lead section, I made an effort to start off acknowledging the "other side". None of this means going so far as NPOV – that's why it's an essay. And of course, this is all just in the "start" stage. But I'm hoping to get us all thinking along the lines of what I raised. --Tryptofish (talk) 19:45, 11 June 2021 (UTC)

Tea Party supporters

@Malvolio: you're probably right. I wasn't thinking about getting serious traction with this when I wrote that, above, and I was only half-serious when I wrote it, anyways. ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants Tell me all about it. 20:21, 11 June 2021 (UTC)

My MPants, are you mad? --Tryptofish (talk) 20:26, 11 June 2021 (UTC)

Well, now that you mention it, I do own a lot of hats and have a fondness for tea parties... ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants Tell me all about it. 20:42, 11 June 2021 (UTC)

• What I'm thinking right now is to lead off the end of the lede. The lede ends by saying "this is disruptive" so I think inserting a section right after that, (more or less) soberly explaining why and how it's disruptive would be a good way to establish that this essay actually has a legitimate point. ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants Tell me all about it. 21:14, 11 June 2021 (UTC)

red shortcuts

Given my recent experience moving an essay, I would highly suggest we leave those shortcuts red until we're sure this is ready to be moved into mainspace, or sure than it should stay in userspace. ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants Tell me all about it. 19:39, 11 June 2021 (UTC)

I fully agree. I can just imagine the howls over "cross namespace redirects" if we prematurely made them blue. --Tryptofish (talk) 19:41, 11 June 2021 (UTC)

Next steps

I've been fussing with this page for a while, and I think I've done all that I can for now, and I think it's getting to where it's pretty good. Although there's no hurry, we could perhaps start thinking about moving it from user space to WP: space.

If we do, I'd like to make a case for calling it WP:Don't be the Fun Police, rather than WP:The Fun Police. What I see as a problem with the shorter title is that it might sound like these "police" are something fun, which is the opposite of what we intend. And Category:Wikipedia civility essays has a lot of essays that follow the "don't do this" pattern. --Tryptofish (talk) 20:39, 19 June 2021 (UTC)

I agree with all of this. And thank you for putting so much effort into sorting out and expanding upon my late-night rantings. This turned out to be a better essay than I'd hoped it would be. ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants Tell me all about it. 06:07, 20 June 2021 (UTC)

I'm gonna do it now. I just had a run-in with a Malvolio, and I'm very ready to... something or other. --Tryptofish (talk) 19:44, 22 June 2021 (UTC)

I agree that is a better title.-- Pawnkingthree (talk) 20:03, 22 June 2021 (UTC)

Good, I'm glad. And...  Done. --Tryptofish (talk) 20:04, 22 June 2021 (UTC)