Wikipedia:Peer review/Circus Juventas/archive1

Circus Juventas

This article is the product of a good deal of work from last summer and now I'm aiming to take it to FAC. It's my first time here (and, if all goes well, at FAC) so any guidance re: prose, content, images is welcome. Thanks for your time and help!

Best, BobAmnertiopsis∴_ChatMe! 16:21, 23 June 2015 (UTC)

Comments from RO

Lead

• ranging in age from 3 to 21

How about, "ranging from 3 to 21 years old"?

 Done

• From there, the school's enrollment quickly expanded and the organization initiated a campaign to fund a $2.1 million permanent big top facility which opened in 2001 on Saint Paul parkland in the Highland Park neighborhood.

You're missing a comma before that last clause, which is non-restrictive.

 Done, I think.

• while noting the occasional mishap of the school's performers.

Is this worth expanding upon?

I reworded it to clarify that the reviewers have picked up on the fact that in shows, students have occasionally botched tricks. Does it read more clearly now?

History

• Betty Butler wondered, "Wouldn't it be great if we could do something in Minnesota ..."[4]

Drop the terminal ellipsis.

Does that work?

• around thirty more students were enrolled

It would be better to just state the total enrollment at this time than to say "30 more".

Going back to look at the sources to see what they say. Doing...

• the estimated cost of the project was quoted at $700,000 with a groundbreaking planned for April 1998.[9]

You need a comma before "with a groundbreaking".

 Done

• Ultimately, the project totaled $2.1 million[4] and by 2006, the school was $700,000 in debt.[14] It was, however, working

Words like "ultimately" and "however" are rarely useful or appropriate in formal writing.

 Done

• the circus school enrolled students from ages six to 21

We would normally spell out number lower than nine, but the juxtaposition of "six" and "21" is a little odd.

 Done

Facilities

• Is the facility really in a residential neighborhood?

Yep, it's a biggish neighborhood that also includes a golf course, municipal water park, and parkland. The circus is tucked away on a plot of this parkland.

Bleacher collapse

• sending seven people to the hospital

Were any of the injuries serious?

It's not given in any of the sources unfortunately.

Performances

• according to Dan Butler

This seems unnecessary.

 Done

Other engagements

• This needs some polishing, as it's difficult to list so many items and still retain the flow of good prose.

Music

• In 2005, upon discovering his affinity for the mandolin and fiddle, the Butlers asked if Ostroushko would volunteer to play a Celtic song at the permiere of their upcoming summer big top show, Dyrnwych.[51]

This is confusing, whose affinity did they discover?

 Done, let me know if it's still unclear.

Reception

• "[T]here is nothing child-like about the talent in this show. The budding stars fearlessly swing, flip, and soar through the air like pros."[56]

There's no need to bracket that "t", as typographical conformity allows for minimal change to quoted material such as adding or removing caps without the need for brackets.

 Done

• There's an issue with citation #18: ([1]). I think that date range is messing up the template.

 Done

Conclusion

This is a very well written and presented article. Scan for comma usage, though, as I see some missing ones, particularly those that set off nonrestrictive clauses. The "Other engagements" section reads too much like a list, so see if you can add some topic and transition sentences to polish the prose. Nicely done. Keep up the great work! RO^(talk) 15:33, 19 August 2015 (UTC)

Comments from Tim riley=

• Lead
  • "Today, Juventas is" – WP:DATED. You need to say something like "As of 2015 Juventas is…"
• History
  • Although you have introduced the Butlers in the lead, I think you would be wise to do so again in the opening of the main text: "The founders of Circus Juventas, Dan and Betty Butler, …"
  • "while Betty was an aerialist" – if this means simultaneously, fine; if it just means "and Betty…" I'd change the "while"
  • "so-called" – shouldn't be hyphenated here, as the phrase is not being used as an attributive compound.
  • "The Butlers kicked off" – perhaps a touch informal for an encyclopaedia article?
  • "A total of $627,183 were disbursed" – singular noun (total) with plural verb.
  • "Neighborhood STAR which sought to fund neighborhood initiatives" – repetition of "neighborhood" could be avoided by making the second one "local", perhaps.
  • The picture of the big top could do with alt-text
  • "to resolve the issue" – I'd be cautious about using "issue" as a synonym for "problem". The advice of Plain Words is shrewd: "Issue: this word has a very wide range of proper meanings as a noun, and should not be made to do any more work" – the work, for instance of subject, topic, consideration and dispute."
  • "estimated that 90% of work" – better as "estimated that 90 percent of work": see MOS:PERCENT
  • "As of 2010" – not sure of the import of "as of" here. Does it just mean "in"?
• Facilities
  • "bleacher" – evidently a term used only in America. A link, please.
  • There is a good deal of WP:DATED in this section. All the things in the present and future tenses will get out of date unless carefully maintained. I'm sure you are going to maintain them, but the matter will be raised at FAC, and you would be well advised to redraw them: " The additional space will house" -> "The additional space would house", "In response, the Butlers are considering" -> "In response, the Butlers said that they were considering" and so on.
  • "would likely cost $10 million, require a capital campaign to fund,[36] and likely not begin" – to avoid the repetition you might make one of the "likely"s a "probably".
  • "the school is performing a small expansion to their Highland Park space" – singular noun and verb with plural pronoun.
• Performances
  • "The school typically puts on two shows per year" – following the sound advice, "Prefer good English to bad Latin", I'd make "per year" "a year".
  • "put more focus into" – does one focus into things? "focus on" would seem more natural.
  • "integrating said acts" – the "said" grates rather. Perhaps just "the", "these" or "those"?
  • "new permanent big top facility" – how does a big top facility differ from a plain big top?
  • "real outlaws, lawmen, and singers, including Lillie Langtry" – Lillie Langtry was none of those three things.
• Other engagements
  • This is a very long list, and I rather lost the will to live half-way through. Could you give us the highlights and confine the rest to an efn footnote?
• Music
  • "came from local mandolin player Peter Ostroushko" – this puts me in mind of the advice of The New York Times style guide on the subject of the false title: "Do not make titles out of mere descriptions, as in harpsichordist Dale S. Yagyonak. If in doubt, try the 'good morning' test. If it is not possible to imagine saying, 'Good morning, Harpsichordist Yagyonak,' the title is false."

I hope these few comments are of some help. Tim riley talk 09:35, 25 August 2015 (UTC)