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Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/Humphrey Bogart on stage, screen, radio and television/archive1

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The following is an archived discussion of a featured list nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The list was promoted by PresN via FACBot (talk) 00:26, 24 April 2021 (UTC) [1].[reply]

Humphrey Bogart on stage, screen, radio and television edit

Humphrey Bogart on stage, screen, radio and television (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

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Nominator(s): — Maile (talk) 20:53, 12 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

This was a rescue of an un-sourced filmography created in 2005, with very little context or sourcing since then. Given that Humphrey Bogart was an iconic figure during his lifetime, and a film legend ever since, I decided to clean this up and source it. Let's see how it measures up by FLC standards. — Maile (talk) 20:53, 12 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Drive-by comments
  • Don't have time for a full review right now, but two things that immediately jump out are as follows:
    • There is no reason for the abbreviation "misc" to be used in a section heading - write the word in full
 Done — Maile (talk) 20:17, 13 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
    • Towards the end of the article, prose is suddenly abruptly replaced with bullet points. Turn these into proper prose.
 Done — Maile (talk) 22:41, 13 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Resolved comments from ~ HAL333 18:53, 28 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Comments from HAL
  • I wouldn't bold his name.
 Done unbolded — Maile (talk) 18:35, 15 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • A lot of the lede requires referencing.
Can you clarify? MOS:LEADCITE This lede is a recap of the rest of the article, which is extensively sourced. I've never been asked to source a lede before, but I've been advised to remove citations from ledes. — Maile (talk) 18:25, 15 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
For example, you need a source for his lifespan, the bit about the National Film registry, etc. Basically, just anything which isn't sourced later in the article. ~ HAL333 19:52, 15 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
I'll deal with this after I take care of your other suggestion to make it more interesting. But the National Film registry is already sourced in the body. I'll double check it all after the revamping of the lead.— Maile (talk) 20:54, 15 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
 Done — Maile (talk) 16:31, 16 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • For his life span, you can just put year-year
 Done — Maile (talk) 18:35, 15 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
 Done — Maile (talk) 16:31, 16 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • I'm not a fan of the chronological image placement. I would make the highest quality on the lede, place theatre images in the Broadway section, and Hollywood images in the film section.
 Done — Maile (talk) 20:48, 15 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • What makes Forgotten New York a high quality reliable source?
 Done - Replaced with a New York Times source. — Maile (talk) 18:41, 15 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • The Radio Gold Index ref is dead.
 Done - removed it; the other cite in that column still works. — Maile (talk) 18:35, 15 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

More later. ~ HAL333 15:39, 15 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

  • Is it Duke Mantee or Duke Manatee?
 Done - Excellent catch! It's Mantee, and I've corrected where it said otherwise.— Maile (talk) 19:59, 15 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Link Broadway in the lede.
 Done — Maile (talk) 20:48, 15 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
 Done — Maile (talk) 21:25, 15 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • I would link Brother Orchid in the lede caption. Same thing for some of the later captions.
 Done — Maile (talk) 17:13, 17 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Italicize "In a Lonely Place".
 Done — Maile (talk) 17:13, 17 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • You should make the roles sortable by surname.
 Done — Maile (talk) 20:57, 17 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • The director column should be removed. If any of that material is especially notable, I would add it to the lede.
 Done — Maile (talk) 20:57, 17 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Removed "his" from a film that he and his co-stars Ingrid Bergman and Paul Henreid
 Done — Maile (talk) 17:23, 17 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • He would again be nominated for the award for The Caine Mutiny (1954)[143] I would avoid "would".
 Done — Maile (talk) 17:23, 17 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • He posthumously received a star on the Hollywood Walk of Fame on February 8, 1960. Just the year would work.
 Done — Maile (talk) 17:23, 17 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • The United States Postal Service honored Bogart in 1997, at ceremony at Grauman's Chinese Theatre unveiling Bogart's stamp as part of the postal service's Legends of Hollywood series. --> "The United States Postal Service honored Bogart in 1997, at a ceremony at Grauman's Chinese Theatre unveiling Bogart's stamp as part of the "Legends of Hollywood" series."
 Done — Maile (talk) 20:57, 17 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

More comments soon. ~ HAL333 02:52, 17 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Resolved comments from ChrisTheDude (talk) 11:58, 28 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
;Comments (apologies if any of these duplicate ones raised above, I haven't read them all)
  • Not sure the lead should have five separate paragraphs, all of them pretty short - combine them into probably three
 Done — Maile (talk) 20:56, 27 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Source(s) for para 2 of the lead?
 Done already sourced in the body. — Maile (talk) 20:07, 27 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • "initially believed he was on the road to stardom when he secured a 1929 contract with Fox Film" - source?
 Done already sourced in the body. — Maile (talk) 20:07, 27 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • "were collectively a disappointment to him, and he returned to stage work in New York." - source?
 Done already sourced in the body. — Maile (talk) 20:07, 27 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • "The play, and his subsequent casting in the movie version, propelled him to stardom, and secured him a movie contract with Warner Bros." - source?
 Done already sourced in the body. — Maile (talk) 20:07, 27 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • "He formed Santana Productions in 1948, with the company's 1950 production of In a Lonely Place chosen by the National Film Registry in 2007 for permanent preservation as "culturally, historically or aesthetically" significant" - source?
 Done already sourced in the body. — Maile (talk) 20:07, 27 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Broadway theatre (1920–1935)" - isn't it spelt "theater" in the US?
 Done Please see Broadway theatre stage productions in the US are spelled this way, while movie theaters are the other way. — Maile (talk) 20:07, 27 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Occasionally Bogart made a few public fund-raising/patriotic appearances on film" - you don't need both "occasionally" and "a few"
 Done
  • "the National Broadcasting Company, later predecessor of American Broadcasting Company [ABC] in 1943–1945" - firstly "later predecessor" makes no sense. And secondly, I am no expert on US television, but aren't NBC and ABC rival networks? Rather than one being a predecessor of the other?
 Question: ChrisTheDude This is why the Blue Network is linked, and its article is well sourced. Perhaps you can suggest a better wording, and the history is pretty detailed. Please see the infobox there. NBC owned two networks, NBC and Blue Network, the later of which was launched January 1, 1927. In January of 1945 it was calling itself "The Blue Network of the American Broadcasting Company" and six months later was just calling itself American Broadcasting Company. The splitting off had something to do with Federal anti-trust violations, but I don't know the legal details. In December of that year, the FCC approved the licensing transfer from NBC to exclusively ABC. So, kind of complicated. I'm open to suggestion on the wording. — Maile (talk) 20:36, 27 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
How about "It was broadcast on the National Broadcasting Company's Blue Network (the forerunner of the American Broadcasting Company) (1934–35)". Nice and concise and also reduces the confusion level of a dumb British person :-D -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 20:44, 27 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
 Done — Maile (talk) 20:50, 27 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Air date column in the radio/TV table doesn't sort correctly (it puts all the ones that just show a year first, and then all the ones that show a month afterwards)
 Question: ChrisTheDude I noticed that also, but I'm not sure how to correct the technical side of it. Please suggest something. — Maile (talk) 20:47, 27 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Seems to be resolved now....... -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 21:38, 27 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
 Done Yes, I did some more research and came up with more accurate dates other than just the year. — Maile (talk) 21:49, 27 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
 Question: ChrisTheDude just scanning through what you wrote above. As noted in the above from HAL much (if not all) of what you are requiring as sourced in the lead, is actually quite well sourced in the body. Isn't the lead just supposed to be a recap of what is already sourced in thee article? Feedback on this please. — Maile (talk) 18:48, 27 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Apologies, you are quite correct. I was typing the comments as I read through the article and should have gone back and deleted those when I found the sources but I forgot to..... -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 18:52, 27 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks. I'll get to the rest of this. — Maile (talk) 18:55, 27 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]


Comments from Dank

  • Standard disclaimer: I don't know what I'm doing, and I mostly AGF on sourcing.
  • "Note that the opening and closing dates of the below productions are not listed.": It would be better to either remove that or say something about what data isn't available from the sources (apart from what you already say).
 Done — Maile (talk) 00:44, 5 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • FLC criteria:
  • 1. The prose is fine. I've done a little copyediting; feel free to revert or discuss. I checked sorting on some columns and sampled the redirects in the tables.
  • 2. The lead meets WP:LEAD and defines the inclusion criteria.
  • 3a. The list has comprehensive items and annotations.
  • 3b. The article is well-sourced to reliable sources, and the UPSD tool isn't indicating any problems (but this isn't a source review). All relevant retrieval dates are present.
  • 3c. The list meets requirements as a stand-alone list, it isn't a content fork, it doesn't largely duplicate another article (that I can find), and it wouldn't fit easily inside another article.
  • 4. It is navigable.
  • 5. It meets style requirements. The images are outstanding, but I don't know much about the finer points of copyright.
  • 6. It is stable.
  • Support, since this is close enough to the finish line. Well done. (I hope you'll drop by my plant list noms every now and then, but they tend to be long, so don't sweat it.) - Dank (push to talk) 00:31, 5 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Thoughts

  • The last time that IBDB came up on WP:RSN it wasn't positive [2]. That being said, I can look past this since it is ran by The Broadway League.
  • The AFI catalogue passes my bar due to how they list their sources
  • In a spot check of a listed movie, I don't see Bogart's name [3]

--Guerillero Parlez Moi 04:16, 14 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Guerillero regarding the Always Together AFI source, you have to look at the bottom right-hand side of the Credits tab. There is a little + sign you need to click, which unfolds more of the list. He's next to last at the bottom of the list as "character in movie". Must have been one of those cameo things, but he's there. Re IBDB, it's an official database of the National Trade Association for the Broadway Theatre Industry. Where human beings are involved, errors can happen, but human beings are ultimately who inputs all data on sourcing. — Maile (talk) 09:55, 14 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Support works for me -- Guerillero Parlez Moi 01:04, 15 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]


Source review passed; promoted. --PresN 22:41, 23 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]

  • Closing note: This candidate has been promoted, but there may be a delay in bot processing of the close. Please see WP:FLC/ar, and leave the {{featured list candidates}} template in place on the talk page until the bot goes through.
The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.
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