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Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Born to Run/archive1

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Born to Run

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Born to Run (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

As of 18 August 2024, 09:04 (UTC), this page is active and open for discussion. An FAC coordinator will be responsible for closing the nomination.
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Nominator(s): – zmbro (talk) (cont) 14:45, 17 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

This article is about... Bruce Springsteen's third studio album Born to Run. A make a break record for the singer-songwriter, it's easy to say he made it (very well). Now regarded by many as his magnum opus (although this editor would argue Darkness on the Edge of Town or Nebraska), I rewrote this article from the ground up and after its GAN it went through a helpful peer review and I believe it's now ready for the star. I'm looking forward to any comments or concerns. – zmbro (talk) (cont) 14:45, 17 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Support by Nick-D

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It's great to see an article on a major popular music album here instead of the more common FACs on modern pop. I'd like to offer the following comments:

  • " was designed to break him into the mainstream" - bit clunky
  • "the band and producers spent six months alone working on the title track" - seems like trivia for the lead
  • I would say otherwise because it displays how "prolonged and grueling" the sessions were; plus, most songs did not take that long to record, especially at the time. – zmbro (talk) (cont) 23:49, 21 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Springsteen's lack of direction and confidence" - this appears out of the blue after text that stresses that Springsteen was ambitious about the record
  • Removed confidence
  • "Springsteen was sent multiple mixes as he was on the road and rejected all of them, approving the final one in early August." - this needs to be tweaked: if he rejected all of them how could he have approved one?
  • "such as a road can take you anywhere" - I suspect that a 'that' is missing here
  • Fixed
  • ""Born to Run" uses an automobile to escape from a depressing life" - this is unclear
  • "The success of Born to Run revitalized Springsteen's career" - this is unclear given the article previously stresses that the album led Springsteen to move from relative obscurity into stardom.
  • Same issue with that. 'Saved' seems appropriate if it's what the sources used (though it's hard to believe that Springsteen wouldn't have had a decent chance of making a successful music career given his skills). Nick-D (talk) 10:30, 25 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Had the album been performed live in total before 2008?
  • Not that I could find. Setlists for the Born to Run tours are hard to find. I know he has performed all the songs from Born to Run quite often since 1975, but the album itself in order front to back I could not find. – zmbro (talk) (cont) 23:49, 21 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Support Apologises for my slow response here - I was travelling and the pings fell through the cracks. Those changes look good, and I think that the FA criteria are met. Nick-D (talk) 11:25, 17 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Comments by ChrisTheDude

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  • "By 1974 his popularity was limited to United States East Coast" => "By 1974 his popularity was limited to the East Coast of the United States"
  • "Low morale plagued Springsteen's team, including both his manager, Mike Appel, and the E Street Band" => "Low morale plagued Springsteen's team, including both his manager, Mike Appel, and his backing band the E Street Band"
  • Changed to "backing group" so we're not saying band twice
  • "Bittan had a background in symphony orchestra" => "Bittan had a background in symphony orchestras"
  • "Bittan mostly replaced Federici on the album, whose sole contribution" => "On the album Bittan mostly replaced Federici, whose sole contribution"
  • "The stunt generated interest the track" => "The stunt generated interest in the track"
  • "a long saxophone solo from Clemons, which he spent 16 hours replaying to Springsteen's satisfaction;[71] he dictated almost every note played" - it's ambiguous who the "he" is in the last part
  • Clarified it's the latter
  • "The seven known outtakes from the album included" - using "included" doesn't really work when you then list all seven. Change "included" to "are"
  • "The song contains autobiographical elements to Springsteen's youth" - don't think the grammar works here. Maybe "The song contains autobiographical elements related to Springsteen's youth".......?
  • "Following his demise, death and destruction continues across the streets" => "Following his demise, death and destruction continue across the streets"
  • "Springsteen's guitar strap dons an Elvis Presley pin" - I don't think an inanimate object can really "don" something. Maybe "On Springsteen's guitar strap is an Elvis Presley pin"
  • Changed to "An Elvis Presley pin appears on Springsteen's guitar strap,"
  • "The cover was included in a Rolling Stone readers poll" => "The cover was included in a Rolling Stone readers' poll"
  • "receiving both critical praiseand from former Columbia Records president Clive Davis" => "receiving praise both from critics and from former Columbia Records president Clive Davis"
  • "and moved different studios" - should this be "and moved to different studios"? "and moved between different studios"? I doubt he physically moved the studios........
  • Clarified 'between'

Ceoil

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Placeholder. Was part of the PR and intend to continue the review, but it may be a few days. Ceoil (talk) 21:45, 1 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ceoil Friendly reminder :-) – zmbro (talk) (cont) 18:50, 10 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
For the co-ords re this timing out; I'm a likely support but haven't had the chance to re-look since the PR. Ceoil (talk) 20:50, 10 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Moise

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Placeholder for me too. I'll try to start my review soon. Moisejp (talk) 06:14, 6 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I should be able to get started this weekend. Moisejp (talk) 04:29, 10 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Comments (as usual, I'll add them as I go along, in some cases one at a time):

  • "The band went back and forth between studio recording and live performances." This could be clearer. What exactly does "go back and forth between" mean here? Does live performances that aren't in the studio mean concert performances? Maybe it means some kind of jamming (because it says Springsteen used these to develop new material)? Moisejp (talk) 06:51, 11 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Yes concert performances. To me it's clear but I can see how you got confused. Clarified.
  • "Bittan had a background in symphony orchestras and had previously known of Springsteen's music, but Weinberg had not and had experience with various rock bands and Broadway productions." A bit awkward overall. "Weinberg had not" presumably is only referring to "had previously known of Springsteen's music" but it's not totally clear. In a way "experience with various rock bands and Broadway productions" emphasizes the rock/Broadway vs. symphony, which may suggest "Weinberg had not" is also about the symphony, which sounds like an unusual thing to say. Moisejp (talk) 07:03, 11 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Separated them into different sentences.
  • "The songs themselves feature introductions that set the tone and scene for each." Maybe specify the kind of introduction this is referring to, I imagined you meant extended musical bits before the singing starts. Moisejp (talk) 14:17, 13 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Added "musical"

Comments by Wehwalt

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No, I'd say this is the realest Springsteen album. Before he really went commercial and then political ....

My comments:

  • "The album cover, featuring Springsteen leaning on E Street Band saxophonist Clarence Clemons's shoulder, is considered iconic and has been recreated by various musicians and in other media." I'm not sure recreated is the word. Maybe (not sure) imitated?
  • Changed to imitated
  • "By 1974 his popularity was limited to East Coast of the United States," Should be a "the" in there.
  • Fixed
  • "the then upcoming artist Billy Joel" this should probably have a hyphen somewhere in it.
  • Fixed
  • "the label conceded" Maybe "the label agreed"
  • Done
  • "From the Churches to the Jails, The Hungry and the Hunted, War and Roses, and American Summer.[23]" is it worth mentioning that some of these are lyrics in the completed album?
  • "an early version" a demo?
  • "By January 1975, the band had been working for over a year with only one finished track." Maybe " ... the one finished track"?
  • Removed the 'only'
  • "and the highway as a means of escape and coming-of-age journey ... "Jungleland" I'm not quite clear on who uses the highway as a means of escape/comes of age in "Jungleland".
  • The source has the song listed in quotes; I assume the authors grouped it there since the song takes place on a street and tells the story of the Magic Rat and his unnamed girlfriend. Think I should just separate it in a new description? – zmbro (talk) (cont) 20:50, 13 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • "the songs on Born to Run are not specifically tied to New Jersey and New York" none of them? Really?
  • "According to Masur, the Rat was gunned down by his "own dream"." Why does that need Masur? That's what the lyrics say, "the Rat's own dream guns him down". And the quote makes it sound like it's Masur's words, not Springsteen's.
  • The quote after "symbolizing" is Masur's. Reworded to clarify.
  • "Following his demise, death and destruction continue across the streets until they are left in complete devastation" "they wind up wounded, they're not even dead"?
  • Removed 'death and'
  • "an article by Henry Edwards in The New York Times that slandered both himself and Born to Run." Slandered is a pretty strong word. Is it justified here?
  • The Greil Marcus paraphrase would probably be better as a direct quotation. If you're going to paraphrase at that level of detail, you are probably better off with a quote.
  •   Not done Will come back to this one. I'm sure Ceoil won't approve of the full quote so I wanna get his opinion (I also can't access the source for whatever reason atm). – zmbro (talk) (cont) 20:50, 13 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Was the album nominated for any awards at the time of its original release?
  • Is the action of the state assembly to try to make the song Born to Run the state's unofficial rock theme worthy of mention?
That's it.--Wehwalt (talk) 20:30, 10 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ippantekina

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My review will be focusing on prose exclusively. Ippantekina (talk) 05:22, 13 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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