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Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/4th Army (Kingdom of Yugoslavia)/archive1

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The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was archived by Ian Rose via FACBot (talk) 00:30, 14 June 2015 [1].

4th Army (Kingdom of Yugoslavia) edit

Nominator(s): Peacemaker67 (crack... thump) 09:44, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

During the lightning-quick Axis invasion of Yugoslavia in April 1941, the 4th Army earned the dubious distinction of having virtually fallen apart due to fifth column actions and Croat desertions even before the Germans crossed the Drava. A whole regiment rebelled and took over a largish town. After the 14th Panzer Division drove 160 km and captured Zagreb on 10 April (along with 15,000 soldiers and 22 generals) in a single day, the Germans facilitated the proclamation of the notorious fascist puppet state, the Independent State of Croatia. The mostly Serb remnants of the 4th Army continued to withdraw into the Bosnian interior until the capture of Sarajevo on 15 April. The article passed Milhist A-class review in January this year, and I believe it is comprehensive and meets or is close to meeting all the FA criteria. Cheers, Peacemaker67 (crack... thump) 09:44, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Images are appropriately licensed and captioned. Nikkimaria (talk) 01:33, 15 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose. I think you have a good base for an article, but I don't think it's there yet. World War II is not my area of expertise, and I'm really bad at geography. I was lost by this article. Note that I didn't read through the Operations sections because I think there was enough in the rest that needed to be fixed.

  • It would be nice to have a map that shows Yugoslavia in relation to the rest of Europe.
  • I think you are going to need a section on background. This should have, at minimum:
    • A paragraph or two on what was going on in Europe at this time that made Yugoslavia think that it was going to be invaded. Specifically talk about WWII.
    • More detail on what the 4th Army District was. The background is missing - all I know is that it hgad three divisional districts that were further subdivided. I don't know where it is or why it was in place.
    • How many troops were in the existing 4th Army District, and how did that compare to the population in general or the army size overall?
    • Tensions between Serbs and Croats?
    • Why were these locations chosen for defense over others?
  • I think you need to Anglicize the titles of the generals. I assume Bridgadri deneral is a Brigadier general. I'm not sure what Armijski translates to.
  • Was there a reason why barbed-war or anti-tank ditches hadn't been developed?
  • Are there numbers on the size of the 4th Army, and what the exact percentage of Croats vs Serbs was?
  • The composition and deployment plan sections and even the mobilisation section are primarily lists. They really ought to be in text.
  • Are Dr. Nierhorster's websites considered reliable sources? Why use those over books or papers?

I look forward to reading it again when you've had a chance to make some changes. Karanacs (talk) 15:39, 11 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Skepticism. I don't know enough to oppose ... all I can say is that, especially starting with the second section, the data gets in the way of the storyline. One thing you might try is to break this article in two ... turn as much as possible into a list, and then let's see if what's left becomes more readable. Another approach would be to stick with one article, but move a lot of material into tables or endsections. Also see the A-class review for more discussion on the point. - Dank (push to talk) 14:18, 13 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I am going to withdraw this nomination, I get the impression these Yugoslav army articles will not fit the FL or FA criteria regardless of how I design them. I believe they are structured well and provide all the information someone who wants to know about the 4th Army would expect. I note that there are very few Army-level articles at MILHIST A-Class, let alone FA, and I probably should have taken the obvious message from that fact. I think I'll just stick to MILHIST A-Class. Thanks for the feedback, I will continue to improve it, but I don't think I'll bring this back here. Regards, Peacemaker67 (crack... thump) 23:55, 13 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Ian Rose could you do the honours? Thanks, Peacemaker67 (crack... thump) 23:58, 13 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Yep, will do. I had been on the verge of archiving it (and one or two others in the list) for lack of commentary last week but we've at least had some feedback now. Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 00:29, 14 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.
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