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Wikipedia:Categories for deletion/Log/2006 July 14

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July 14

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Category:Sites of Special Scientific Interest in Preseli & South Pembrokeshire to Category:Sites of Special Scientific Interest in Pembrokeshire

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The result of the debate was rename as nominated --Kbdank71 14:36, 25 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Preseli & South Pembrokeshire are two defunct district councils that were combined to Pembrokeshire when Dyfed was broken up. Althaugh the Countryside Council for Wales, who designate SSSIs, uses old districts I propose to move it to just Pembrokeshire as that would be in line all the other subcategories of Pembrokeshire as the category includes both former districts anyway. see talkpageAgathoclea 23:48, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

  • Rename, if only to remove ampersand. David Kernow 23:48, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename per nom. Choalbaton 01:11, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename according to this proposal, don't see any reason why this needs to be this specific, I doubt it will become a large subject and can simply be explained in the body of the articles if need be.(Sloman 08:39, 16 July 2006 (UTC))[reply]
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Category:Andrew W. K. albums to Category:Andrew W.K. albums

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The result of the debate was rename as nominated --Kbdank71 14:36, 25 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Official website, album covers, etc. all omit the space between "W." and K." Dylan 22:35, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

  • Rename per nom. It should be consistent with article name also. --musicpvm 00:10, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    • Comment: In the spirit of full disclosure, I only recently changed the article name from Andrew W. K.. Dylan 00:23, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Australian plants to Category:Flora of Australia

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The result of the debate was merge as nominated --Kbdank71 14:34, 25 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Proposal is to merge Category:Australian plants into Category:Flora of Australia. These categories have essentially duplicate scopes, and flora is the term used for plants for Wikipedia categories, as per Category:Flora by country. Kurieeto 22:30, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

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Category:Television meterologists

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The result of the debate was delete. --RobertG ♬ talk 07:54, 24 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

transfer from PROD. Prod does not and should not handle categories - 132.205.45.148 22:26, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

There is already a category for this: Category:Television_meteorologists; This page was probably a typo, and then ignored.
User:RobJ1981 20060714062956
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Category:Flora and fauna of Hong Kong to Category:Biota of Hong Kong

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The result of the debate was rename as nominated --Kbdank71 14:30, 25 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Biota is the flora, fauna, and any other life of a region. Category:Flora and fauna of Hong Kong is a sub-cat of Category:Biota by country, but almost all other sub-cats of Category:Biota by country use the "Biota of x" wording. This renaming is proposed for reasons of consistency and clarity. Kurieeto 22:25, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

  • Rename for consistency with other categories. --musicpvm 00:10, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Historical African monarchies to Category:Ancient Empires of Africa

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The result of the debate was no consensus --Kbdank71 14:29, 25 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The names are almost synonymous. Schzmo 22:07, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

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Multiracial categories

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The result of the debate was delete --Kbdank71 14:25, 25 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

These categories are POV and not useful. Everyone is multiracial and to illustrate this I found it on the article about Edward Furlong while working on classification of vegetarians, and the only evidence of his multiracial status is that he is in two categories for European hyphenated Americans. Chicheley 19:50, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

  • Eh... is it worth a merge to the appropriate Category:People by ethnic or national origin subcats? If not, baleet. Luna Santin 20:47, 14 July 2006 (UTC) (see below) Luna Santin 23:03, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete per nom. Category:Multiracial people was deleted last month, so these should not be exceptions. --musicpvm 00:15, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete both per nom. Casper Claiborne 10:11, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep both. Where is your evidence, Chicheley, that "everyone is multiracial"? If that's true then couldn't we say "everyone is German" and delete all the German ethnic categories? Denying the existence of race is a racist POV that you and a few other editors have been forcing down everyone else's throats as a way of denying the existence of real multiracial people. I am very offended that these categories keep getting deleted while other categories that pretend to sort everyone into SINGLE ethnic and racial groups survive. They are equally valid. Finally, if Edward Furlong isn't multiracial, you and everyone else in this forum knows that the appropriate solution is to remove him from the category, not to delete the entire category.--M@rēino 15:55, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    • Since Choalbaton has accused me of violating WP:CIVIL, I am striking the offending comments. I apologize for offending him and, if it is the case, for offending Chicheley. I want to clarify that I do not think that Chicheley is racist, but that I do think that the policy of denying the existence of race as a social construct that neutral research tools like Wikipedia should cover is racist. --M@rēino 18:16, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
      • I do not accept that that is a meaningful apology or a withdrawal of the accusation. On the contrary, it is a repeat of the accusation against me, musicpvm, Casper Claiborne, Choalbaton and the other editors who have voted to delete these categories. It is intimidation and I would ask you to completely withdraw your use of the "racism" slur. Chicheley 22:29, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
        • I refuse to back down from what is morally right. That would be succumbing to your intimidation. --M@rēino 15:52, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    • If somebody is multiracial, place them into multiple racial categories. For example, Mariah Carey is in Category:Irish-Americans, Category:African-American singers, and Category:Venezuelan-Americans. But it does not make sense to place every mutiracial entertainer in the world into a multiracial category. Categories like this can and do create conflict. Before Category:Multiracial people was deleted, I saw several disagreements at entertainers' take pages about whether they should be included in the category or not. The majority of African Americans have multiracial ancestry, so should they all be placed in the category? This is just one question that arises. List of multiracial people already exists, so I don't see a use in an additional category. --musicpvm 00:33, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    • Accusing people of racism for disagreeing with you on a categorisation matter is a very serious breach of Wikipedia:Civility and Wikipedia:No personal attacks. Choalbaton 01:16, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep per Mareino. --Shortfuse 00:15, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete per nom. Choalbaton 01:13, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep if you can get a list of irish people, african american people, etc, why not people of mixed race? Colorfulharp233 21:20, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    • Ireland is a country, not an ethnic group. Category:Irish-Americans however is an ethnic category, and should be deleted, along with every other ethnic category. Chicheley 22:37, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Merge to appropriate subcats of Category:People by ethnic or national origin, or else delete. Luna Santin 23:03, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete U.S. centric. Reflects U.S. census definitions. Would people have felt differently about such a category in the days when it was Apartheid South Africa that was interested in defining people as mixed race, ie "coloured"? 11:58, 17 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Delete both, the Multiracial Americans cat was also deleted. The criteria isn't clear enough and "race" isn't clearly defined (these lists/cats tend to treat "Latino" as a race, even tho it isn't). List of multiracial people and the Multiracial Brits cat should probably be deleted too. Crumbsucker 09:43, 18 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    • Your argument might have worked for the previous iterations of the multiracial cats, but this cat is, and has always been, defined by reference to the OTHER Wikipedia race cats. Therefore, its criteria is of exactly the same clarity as the other race cats. --M@rēino 12:47, 18 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete both per nom. Angus McLellan (Talk) 19:09, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete both -- based on prior precedents. --William Allen Simpson 16:31, 23 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete, based on precedent, nomination, science and logic. Vizjim 20:32, 24 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Warmia-Masuria to Category:Warmian-Masurian Voivodship

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The result of the debate was rename to Category:Warmian-Masurian Voivodeship --Kbdank71 14:18, 25 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

To fit the naming scheme at Category:Voivodships of Poland.--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus Talk 19:55, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

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Category:Stock charts to Category:Images of stock charts

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The result of the debate was rename. --RobertG ♬ talk 07:56, 24 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

This image category needs to indicate its purpose is so in its name. Kurieeto 18:55, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

  • Support yep, the original category name would imply a group of articles about the different kinds of charts -- MrDolomite | Talk 19:49, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename per nom. Chicheley 19:52, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename per nom. David Kernow 23:52, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Excellent cadavers

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The result of the debate was rename to category:People murdered by the Mafia --Kbdank71 20:52, 24 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Ambiguous. "High profile cases" can go into the Category:Assassinated Italian people or Category:Assassinated Italian politicians. Intangible 18:39, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

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Transport in South America

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The result of the debate was no consensus --Kbdank71 20:47, 24 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Comment - Latin American governments would appear to use “transportation” (e.g., Ministry of Transportation) as the neutral term (rather than “transport”.) [1] Local entities such as Sociadad Poruaria [2] also use “transportation” (e.g., Minister of Transportation) and probably know more about how English is used in their region than the Esperantist 20 year-old Czech ESL user of British English (Darwinek?--see profile) who proposed this rename vote. (If reference footnotes don’t work, the same information is available at the top of this linked page.) W.C. 03:25, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Destroyers of the United States Navy to Category:Destroyers of the United States

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The result of the debate was no consensus --Kbdank71 20:45, 24 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Rename per consensus on WP:SHIPS about reorganization of Category:Ships by country. See below vote on Category:Royal Navy battlecruisers for more extensive description. If you vote against this proposed rename, please participate in discussion on WP:SHIPS to come up with a better proposal. TomTheHand 17:02, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

  • Support as discussed on WP:SHIPS. --Spot87 17:06, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support as discussed on WP:SHIPS. --Victor12 17:14, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment Category:Destroyers of the United States has a rather unfortunate name :-) Bluap 18:26, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    • Could you please elaborate as to why that is an unfortunate name? --Spot87 18:48, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
      • I believe he's joking that it sounds kind of like a category for people or things which want to or are capable of destroying the United States ;-) TomTheHand 18:51, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
      • My fault, I understand now. --Spot87 18:53, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
        • Prediction: This category will be used for POV labeling of disliked politicians. Film at 11. Nevertheless, Support if consistent per WP:SHIPS. --Dhartung | Talk 06:58, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Hmm. Looking at WP:SHIPS, I can see there's some problems with the current categorization scheme; I appreciate any efforts to fix that. I'm thinking it would make sense to go for something like Category:Naval ships by country >> Category:Naval ships of the United States >> Category:Destroyers of the United States. That said, would Category:Naval destroyers of the United States be more specific? Or would that just be silly, as an overall scheme? Luna Santin 21:03, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    • Yes, I agree that that structure would be a good plan; I think I will implement it alongside my current plan, Ships by country -> Ships of the United States -> Naval ships of the United States -> Destroyers of the United States. I believe "naval destroyers" sounds awkward, and it's a term that I've never heard used. I don't think that there's any need to disambiguate, as I doubt anyone will create a legitimate "destroyers of the US" cat planning to put in people who are trying to destroy the US ;-) I believe the context will make it clear that the category is about naval vessels: it will contain ship articles and will be a member of ship categories. TomTheHand 21:08, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
      • Okay, so maybe I'm being dumb, on that one. =) It'd be even worse on some of the other ones (naval battlecruisers?). Otherwise, that all sounds good to me, seems like those should work fine in parallel. Support rename, just so's we're all squared off. Luna Santin 22:04, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support as this is indeed consistant with current standards, including WP:Ships discussions. Josh 20:41, 18 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose GraemeLeggett 16:28, 19 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose per GraemeLeggett Jooler 18:04, 19 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Important comment from nom to closing admin We're revising our plan for the renaming of ship categories, as the renames proposed here have provoked a lot of attention and gotten a lot of new people involved in the planning process. My other nominations from this day have clearly failed, but this one is less clear-cut; I'd like to withdraw my nomination and request that this rename not be performed. In the future a different series of renames may be proposed and will be based on the consensus of a larger group of people. TomTheHand 14:05, 21 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose per Graeme.--KrossTalk 06:49, 23 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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category:Life in the United States

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The result of the debate was delete. --RobertG ♬ talk 07:58, 24 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

This category has only just been created. It is much to vague. There are sufficient top level U.S categories already. There is a lot of overlap with Category:American society, which is a standard category. Sumahoy 15:38, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

  • Delete Sumahoy 15:38, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete Every subcategory of Category:United States itself is at least partially relevant to "life in the United States", broadly interpreted, so they could all be added to this category, making it a duplicate of its parent. Twittenham 15:45, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete Pointless category. Cloachland 16:11, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete per nom. Golfcam 16:25, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete per nom. Chicheley 19:51, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Wikipedians by time period

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The result of the debate was delete --Kbdank71 20:41, 24 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

All Wikipedians are in the 2000s. I don't understand the point of this either. I'm a Wikipedian in the 2000s, and I could still be a Wikipedian in the 2010s and the 2020s (if the project lasts that long). --Schzmo 15:30, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

  • Delete! Please! TomTheHand 15:35, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete It lacks any useful purpose. --Victor12 16:12, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete per nom. Cloachland 16:12, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete per nom. Chicheley 19:52, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • weak keep. I've seem much worse. The idea seems to be that you add a category for each year you've been active. Ceartainly more pertinent to Wikipedia that "Wikipedians by pet" or similar nonsense. dab (ᛏ) 20:40, 24 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Newspapers published in Canada

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The result of the debate was rename as nominated --Kbdank71 20:44, 24 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The following are generally titled "Newspapers in region". I think these titles would benefit by being made more precise, with a suggested renaming to "Newspapers published in region".

--Kurieeto 15:14, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

  • Oppose. Currently wording is fine. Ardenn 15:42, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename all per nom. The proposed name describes the contents accurately, while the current names do not. Twittenham 15:46, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename all per nom. Cloachland 16:13, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename all per nom. Chicheley 19:47, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • For what it's worth, the similar American "newspapers by state" categories are named in the format "Newspapers of State". However this is decided, either those should be renamed too, or these should be renamed to the "of" format instead. There should be a clear standard for this type of category, rather than Canadian ones and American ones following different standards, but as long as the need for a standard is maintained, I have no preference as to which format should be that standard. Bearcat 21:55, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    • A lot of the old category names are sloppy and we are now moving towards more accurate names. Chicheley 09:58, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename Category:Quebec newspapers to Category:newspapers in Quebec for consistency. -- User:Docu
  • Keep Category:Canadian student newspapers for consistency with other by country categories. -- User:Docu
  • Keep current name for all other categories listed/Oppose rename. "published" renders category names needlessly long. -- User:Docu
    • Comment Please don't cast separate votes in this way as it creates a misleading at-a-glance impression of how the discussion is going, which may have an influence on who chooses to comment after you. Chicheley 09:59, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename all per nom. Casper Claiborne 10:12, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename all per nom. --Shortfuse 00:19, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename all per nom. Choalbaton 01:14, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose The current ones are fine. Adding of the word published is redundent because when someone sees something like "Newspapers in Prince Edward Island", they would assume that the majority of readers are from PEI, and therefore it must be published in PEI. The one catogory that may need a change is Category:National newspapers in Canada maybe to something like Canadian National Newspapers, which again would sugest readers in Canada, and that it must be published in Canada.-Royalguard11Talk 17:47, 18 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename all per nom. The current names are sloppy. ReeseM 02:15, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Royal Navy destroyers to Category:Destroyers of the United Kingdom

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The result of the debate was keep --Kbdank71 20:38, 24 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

See the below proposed deletion of Royal Navy battlecruisers for the reasons for this merge. TomTheHand 14:08, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

  • Support as discussed on WP:SHIPS. --Spot87 17:04, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support as discussed on WP:SHIPS. --Victor12 17:14, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment someone should add a definition to the latter, so that it does not become populated with people accused of attempting to destroy Britain.--M@rēino 15:59, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    • Done. TomTheHand 13:32, 18 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
      • There are a series of templates for ship category definitions 'cathead X of|Foo' that work well for this. Added it to this cat. Josh 20:44, 18 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support as above. Sorry, looking back into this one, the category is correct as is. Josh 20:44, 18 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose categorisation works well at moment, no need to fix it.GraemeLeggett 16:39, 19 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose per GraemeLeggett Jooler 18:03, 19 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose Destroyers of the Royal Navy, maybe as a category name, but not of the United Kingdom (strictly speaking, I believe the RN is the British Navy, as apposed to that of the United Kingdom -- I may be wrong on that, though. Ratarsed 19:59, 19 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose per User:Jooler, User:GraemeLeggett Emoscopes Talk 10:17, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose. The Royal Navy is the proper name for the Brit's navy.--KrossTalk 06:48, 23 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    • Note that I was not trying to claim that "Royal Navy" was not the proper name for the navy, but rather to remove the proper name for the navy from the categories; the Royal Navy is a rare exception for which the proper name is currently being used, and naming by country would be more accessible to people who are unfamiliar with the subject. TomTheHand 13:01, 23 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Royal Navy battlecruisers

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The result of the debate was keep --Kbdank71 20:35, 24 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

For the past several weeks we've been discussing a reorganization of the Category:Ships by country structure. Part of the plan is to categorize by country instead of by navy, so this category is made redundant by Category:Battlecruisers of the United Kingdom, which is fully organized according to the proposal (therefore there is no need for a merge, just a deletion. TomTheHand 13:34, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Please see discussion here or a summary of the proposal here if you are interested. See Category:Battlecruisers of the United Kingdom for an example category that has been put together according to the proposal. This has been in discussion for about three weeks on WP:SHIPS and I believe we have consensus there. TomTheHand 13:39, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Oh, one last thing. If you vote against this, it would be greatly appreciated if you could drop by WP:SHIPS and help us improve the proposal. I am aware of the disadvantages of naming these categories by country. However, we've discussed the disadvantages of naming by navy as well, and I believe naming by country is a better decision for reasons discussed on WP:SHIPS. TomTheHand 13:57, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

  • Delete As discussed on WP:SHIPS. --Victor12 16:12, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose both It isn't empty and there are 28 categories of Royal Navy ships. Cloachland 16:14, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    • It is redundant; everything that it should contain is contained in the new Category:Battlecruisers of the United Kingdom. Everything that BC of UK does not contain should not be in there. There are 28 categories of Royal Navy ships, which will all be renamed, merged, and/or deleted, per extensive discussion on WP:SHIPS. If you care strongly about ship categorization, please head over to WP:SHIPS and help us come up with a better proposal. Please don't oppose the delete based on such a cursory glance. TomTheHand 16:34, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete As discussed on WP:SHIPS. --Spot87 16:40, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose I am aware of the discussion on WP:Ships. GraemeLeggett 16:27, 19 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose per GraemeLeggett Jooler 18:03, 19 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose per User:Jooler, User:GraemeLeggett Emoscopes Talk 10:16, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Transport in Africa

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The result of the debate was no consensus --Kbdank71 20:25, 24 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Comment - English language Wikipedia articles are written for a global Internet audience rather than for a local audience. As we can see from countless examples in British magazines and newspapers, British authors writing for a British audience don’t suddenly change to another variety of English when addressing North American issues after all. In the same sense, then, these Wikipedia articles need not switch varieties of English for every change in locale. The majority of the global Internet audience largely does not use British English. And this is can be seen for example by examining the government website of China for example. (Also, China’s literacy rate is over 90%, whereas the high population regions where the British variety can be found, that rate is 47% such as in Pakistan, meaning the latter's online readership is very likely to be comparatively much smaller.) The government of China's official site uses “theater” and not the British “theatre”, “center” and not “centre”. Even British newspapers like the Guardian use both nouns “transport” and “transportation” (i.e., “transportation system”). Some examples of "transportaion" from the British press include "...risks posed by the transportation of the weapons at 2.4 in a billion..." in Randerson's "Trident convoys carry risk of nuclear blast" (2006, July 6, in The Guardian), as well as "...the smooth transportation of 40,000 fans daily from Dublin..." in Donegan's "Ireland labours over Ryder Cup roadworks" (2006, July 8 in The Guardian). W.C. 18:53, 21 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Oppose for reasons stated. I would consider renaming those where local usage favors transport. These should be discussed individually. -- Samuel Wantman 06:08, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose per SamuelWantman. --Cultural Freedom 2006-07-20 08:00 (UTC)
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People by Chinese city

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The result of the debate was rename/merge as nominated --Kbdank71 20:14, 24 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

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Category:Spanish Prime Ministers to Category:Prime Ministers of Spain

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The result of the debate was merge. --RobertG ♬ talk 08:01, 24 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Merge into the standard category. Chicheley 10:49, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

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Category:Former Federal ministers of Nigeria to Category:Federal ministers of Nigeria

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The result of the debate was merge as nominated --Kbdank71 20:11, 24 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

We don't normally divide between past and present. Ministries change often, and unless you already have a detailed knowledge of Nigerian politics, in which case you don't need separate categories, there is no way of knowing whether or not the allocation of articles is up to date, rendering the split useless either way. Chicheley 10:21, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

  • Merge as above. Chicheley 10:21, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Merge per nom. Twittenham 15:48, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Merge per nom, although I'm beginning to wonder if this and similar categories ought to carry a one/two-sentence explanation that those listed might be current or former, for the sake of (relative) newcomers to the encyclopedia...?  Regards, David Kernow 00:07, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Fam-Lay

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The result of the debate was delete. --RobertG ♬ talk 08:02, 24 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

This is a category for a minor rapper. It has existed for over a month, and the only article it contains is the one about the rapper. --musicpvm 05:25, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

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Wikipedians with an age

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The result of the debate was delete --Kbdank71 15:26, 24 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

All of the subcategories of Category:Wikipedians with an age were deleted last month, leaving only the parent category and a joke subcategory. Delete them both to discourage recreation of this ill-advised series of categories. - EurekaLott 04:29, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

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More demonyms

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The result of the debate was rename as nominated --Kbdank71 15:42, 24 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The following should be renamed per previous discussions.

--musicpvm 03:29, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Against - There is a difference between people from a certain place and denizens. For instance, many of the Milwaukeeans may not have been born in the city but played a significant role in its development and had were likewise impacted by the community. Sulfur 03:52, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Also against - "People from X" place de-characterizes each city. --KHill-LTown 04:23, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Comment, all of these categories are in Category:People by American city so there is absolutely no reason they should be exceptions to the naming convention used by the 400 other subcategories. I don't see how somebody can significantly contribute to a city without having lived a portion of their life in the city. And if they have lived a portion of their life in a city (even if they were not born in it), it is not incorrect to say "People from". Some of these demonyms of the smaller cities are also extremely ambiguous. If you think every one of the subcategories in Category:People by American city should be renamed to ambiguous demonyms, then propose a mass renaming of all 463 categories, but it makes no sense for these 50 random categories to be inconsistent with the others. --musicpvm 04:44, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support. While Las Vegans is used, I never heard Newburghians in all of my years living up there. If Newarkers was used, it was not a term in common usage. So one wonders how valid some of these demonyms are. In any case, 'People from' always works and since most categories already use this I see no reason not to change to the more common form. One critical factor for an encylopedia is how it treats details in a consistant manner. Let's not lose sight of what this decision is a part of. Vegaswikian 04:59, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • What's with adding state name disambiguations to some of the category names? How many Schenectadies and Ypsilantis and Spokanes are there? - EurekaLott 05:02, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    • I don't mind removing the state from the three you mentioned, but I thought that without the state name, they would be amibiguous (not because there are other cities with the same name but because they are not major U.S. cities and most people may be unaware of where they are located). --musicpvm 05:29, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose - per Sulfur. -Nogood 05:56, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Strong support – most of these terms take me a second to figure out, and I am very familiar with U.S. geography. Nearly all of them also do not appear in their city's articles or anywhere else on Wikipedia. I greatly prefer names that are instantly recognizable when browsing, and predictable, so that they can be found through search or by typing the URL directly. ×Meegs 09:08, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support all. Little Rockers. Haha. --*kate speak 09:15, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support all per nom. Ease of use should be the first priority. Osomec 09:37, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename all So far as most non-locals are concerned most of these, when seen at the bottom of a category, could just as easily be a religious sect or a fraternal society as a place. Chicheley 09:54, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Strong support all: Per nom. Also, half of these don't even sound like words and sound unencyclopedic. Duluthans gets very few hits on Google. I live in Tampa and I've never heard the word Tampans in my life. —Wknight94 (talk) 10:43, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename all per nom. -- Darwinek 11:31, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename all per nom. I strongly support. User:Arual 13:50, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Rename all per nom. Kurieeto 13:56, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Strong Oppose. I'm opposed to renaming these friendly (and encyclopedic) names for residents of various cities to a sterile, mechanical version. If this passes, the Wikipedia will be striving toward becoming boring. —  Stevie is the man!  Talk | Work 13:59, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose per Stevietheman. Long live the demonym!--M@rēino 14:25, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose Due to the convention of using common names. However, wherever a denonym is used the People from Foo form should also exist as a category redirect. That way, non-local users can quickly find what they are looking for, even though they may be unfamilier with local terminology. -- ProveIt (talk) 14:40, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment - I concur. Sulfur 22:05, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • No it doesn't. You're all only thinking about one set of circumstances - people typing the category name in the search box. I hardly ever type categories in the search box, but when I see a category on the bottom of an article I like to be sure what it means. Golfcam 01:40, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Why must we make Wikipeda a sterile corporatized document just because a few people are too stupid to understand what people in communities call themselves? —  Stevie is the man!  Talk | Work 15:45, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename all per nom. --Moreau36 14:46, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment: Actually, let me qualify my support a little. How are you deciding which city should have the state afterwards? Schenectady, New York is the only city named "Schenectady" in the whole world - in fact, I've seen newspaper articles written about that fact. So, if we don't need "Florida" in Category:People from Miami, Florida even though there's a city called Miami, Ohio, then we certainly shouldn't need the "New York" in Category:People from Schenectady, New York. —Wknight94 (talk) 15:22, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename all per nom. I concur with both the redirect compromise and the state-name-suffix point made by EurekaLott. Only the largest cities tend to have certain demonyms anyway; my small hometown has three that I've heard, each only rarely. --Dhartung | Talk 06:54, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    • Very valid point. If there are multiple demonyms, which do you use? People of avoids this problem. Vegaswikian 08:37, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename all per nom. Casper Claiborne 10:13, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose. demonyms are take up less space and reduce language 'sterility' Mayumashu 12:27, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • If the decision is to rename, then keep all existing categories as {{categoryredirect}}s, or else count mine as an oppose vote. — Instantnood 19:21, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename all Accessibility trumps style. Choalbaton 01:21, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename all But really I favor a less specific form like "people connected with". Golfcam 01:37, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename all per nom. I'm in favour of a common style. It makes sense to me that we prioritise a common global style for speakers of English above the local knowledge of any minority. And the current guideline at Wikipedia:Categorization_of_people#By_residence does suggest a subsidiary option of using demonymns. --Mereda 15:16, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename all per nom. Sumahoy 17:41, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename all to improve accessibility and understanding and prevent time wasting discussions about which demonym is correct. Hawkestone 23:29, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename all Encyclopedias are supposed to be bland. Twittenham 12:00, 17 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment. I already said I oppose this, but if this is ultimately approved, I would suggest that the demonyms, which are encyclopedic/notable in their own right, need to be referred to in text on the new "People from..." category pages. To remove the demonym categories without some accommodation would be a slap in the face of the people who live in these places. —  Stevie is the man!  Talk | Work 16:03, 17 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Comment Stevietheman's suggestion sounds like it would be a good addition to the guidelines. I'd be happy to carry that idea across to Wikipedia_talk:Categorization_of_people if this batch of renaming gets a consensus.--Mereda 17:43, 17 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I third this; thanks to the number of less-than-straightforward demonyms, "People from X" seems a better kind of standard to adopt, but each "People from X" category should mention a corresponding demonym (and a redirect made from a category with that demonym as its name). David Kernow 14:25, 18 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Jumping in before this discussion closes and gets archived, I've put an idea for new guideline wording at Wikipedia_talk:Categorization_of_people#By_residence:_more_demonyms. --Mereda 11:43, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

"San Diegans" must stay in honor of "Anchorman."

  • Rename all to achieve consistency and accessibility. TomTheHand 16:11, 17 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename all to achieve uniformity. Nonomy 21:19, 17 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support, as it will keep things more consistent. I hate having to guess at category names. --Elonka 23:47, 17 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename, convert all the demonym categories listed to {{category redirect}}s. --RobertG ♬ talk 09:04, 18 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename all. I know of nobody that calls themselves a "Newarker". Also for consistency. --Kbdank71 17:46, 18 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename all per nom. ReeseM 02:19, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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tax evaders

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The result of the debate was keep --Kbdank71 15:21, 24 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

It only makes sense to have these categories when people are actually convicted for this. So I suggest renaming them to include that as such. Intangible 03:10, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

  • Oppose all -- all the criminal categories require convictions, including murderers. Just make a note on the category. --William Allen Simpson 03:24, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    • I support this explanation.--M@rēino 14:28, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose all As a general rule the categories do not require convictions. It is anachronistic to emphasis due process as in most times and places precious little due process has occurred. It also ignores deaths before trial and the articles about unidentified criminals. As tax evasion is a matter between citizen and state, perhaps the concept of "unconvicted tax evader" is less meaningful than "unconvicted murderer", but the current form should remain for consistency. Osomec 09:41, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    • I do not, however, support this explanation. That would allow someone to add "American tax evader" to every American Revolution patriot's bio.--M@rēino 14:28, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
      • That might upset Americans, but they were rebels, not the demigods American mythology (aka American history), makes them out to be, and they did evade taxes, which were little more than a token contribution towards the cost of their own defence. How can you be a patriot of a country that doesn't exist. Americans' were far too prone to get carried away with their own rhetoric then, and haven't improved in the slightest in that regard in the following 230 years. Twittenham 15:51, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
        • That's not nice. Golfcam 16:29, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
          • Well, it is true. And I am a US citizen. --Shortfuse 00:24, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose Adding convicted makes it sound more like they are all guilty, but some of them might have been innocent anyway, like that Russian guy with the name that starts with K. Golfcam 16:29, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Very Strong Oppose All Pointless. Unneeded. Creating a "Convicted" catagory will prompt the creation of an "Unconvicted" catagory for each country. Which is: Pointless. Unneeded. --Shortfuse 00:24, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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unhyphenated-American

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The result of the debate was no consensus --Kbdank71 14:48, 24 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Speedy Rename -- There are 50 with hyphen and 46 without. The current by country standard is with hyphen for -Americans --William Allen Simpson 17:38, 13 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

  • Oppose all There is no such standard and these do not meet any of the speedy renaming criteria. Chicheley 21:21, 13 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Moved from speedy --William Allen Simpson 02:55, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    • comment -- Apparently, Chicheley, you haven't been paying attention.
      1. Over the past few months at CfD, we've consistently named all categories "ethnic-country" with a hyphen, and "country ethnic" with a space, and after extensive discussion, adopted a POLICY: Wikipedia:Naming conventions (categories)#Heritage.
      2. Speedy renaming of a single hyphen is according to Wikipedia:Category deletion policy#Speedy criteria, which is also POLICY: 4. Non-conformance with "by country" categorization conventions specified at Wikipedia:Naming conventions (categories). These are "by country" categories.
      --William Allen Simpson 03:14, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
      • I actually support these renamings, but if you had been paying attention you would know that it is still controversial. This isn't the first time you have pushed procedure to the utmost in an attempt to support your own preference. Chicheley 09:49, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    • There is nothing remaining to be controversial (about naming). The controversy is over. Folks exercized patience, covered this topic regularly over a period of more than 4 months (starting long before you began as editor), and went through all the long and tortuous steps for amending the policy. My goodness, the category naming convention policy itself was written and agreed in about a month last year! This was positively sluggish by comparison. --William Allen Simpson 14:41, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
      • You foisted that change through yourself with the support of all of 2 other users. A lot more than 2 users have objected to hyphenisation on this page recently. Combined with your recent behaviour on the limited access roads/freeways/motorways issue, this shows a high-handed contempt for people who disagree with you. Chicheley 16:02, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Move and category redirect all (both hyphenated and unhyphenated) to Category:Fooian-American people since top category is Category:American people, to which Category:Americans {{category redirect}}s. Sorry, William; I have read Wikipedia:Naming conventions (categories)#Heritage again more carefully, I now support the nominated renames/redirects according to that convention. To clarify, are we categorising Fooian-Americans as American nationals who have a self-identified Fooian heritage, and Fooian Americans as Fooian nationals with a self-identified American heritage? --RobertG ♬ talk 09:14, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    • Comment. Since some of these categories have been swapped already, I shan't run the category redirect bot again on them until this one reaches a consensus. --RobertG ♬ talk 08:40, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
      • He recently pushed that through himself, with little support. If you oppose the amendments, please vote against them, as is your right. Chicheley 16:06, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support. This is an excellent idea; it brings the Wiki convention in line with the American journalistic and literary convention.--M@rēino 14:29, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Based on statement of support by Chicheley, I'm going forward with Speedy. -- William Allen Simpson 14:41, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    • I have objected to the speedies, and will object to any others of this type as William Allen Simpson implemented the so-called policy change himself with insufficient support. Chicheley 16:03, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose all per Chicheley --Moreau36 14:46, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose all I will not have William Allen Simpson exploiting my good will in his continuing attempts to find short cuts to get what he wants. Chicheley 15:55, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename all because they are "hyphenated Americans", but please don't use speedy. I don't like speedy renaming because I don't visit this page often enough to check all the items out before they go through. Golfcam 16:27, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose all because the change achieves nothing of value. —  Stevie is the man!  Talk | Work 20:06, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename all to achieve consistency. I guess I can see how someone could logically say "no, we should make them all hyphen-less," but how can you say that we should leave half of them hyphenated and half of them not? TomTheHand 20:15, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    • Jeez, I just noticed that hyphenating is official Wikipedia policy. How are people voting oppose, and why was this moved from speedy rename? TomTheHand 20:19, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
      • As I have already explained the "policy" was recently created by the nominator of this group, who has a tendency to game the system, with the support of a grand total of 2 other users. Far more than two people have voted against adding the hyphens on this page recently. It is an invalid policy and should be scrapped. Chicheley 10:16, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
        • So explain to me how it's better to have 50 hyphenated categories and 46 unhyphenated ones, and do so in a fashion that makes me believe you're not just disagreeing with the nom because of a grudge. TomTheHand 13:06, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
          • It is not better, and there is no grudge, but I wish to prevent abuse of the system. Chicheley 14:09, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
            • I understand, and I apologize for my harsh language. I wasn't looking at this from a larger perspective; I just think the rename is a genuinely good idea and I didn't think it was a good idea to oppose it to make a point. TomTheHand 15:27, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support But if a third attempt is made to speedy these I will restore my opposition. Chicheley 14:09, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename all per nom. Choalbaton 01:24, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment Will the articles be moved as well? Every one of the articles is named without a hyphen, so I don't see why the categories should be named any differently. Also, the 50/46 numbers are incorrect as many category redirects were swapped before this nomination. --musicpvm 01:32, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    • Yes, the articles that differ will be renamed as well, and do not need to go through Cfd (just use move). --William Allen Simpson 07:43, 23 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose all as article names are not hyphenated. Angus McLellan (Talk) 19:03, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose All I didn't check on all of them, but I do know that many of these names correspond to how the articles on the subjects are named. For example, Chinese American does not have a hyphen. --- Hong Qi Gong 15:58, 21 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment - And here's a great reason why we should not have the hyphen: The US Census does not use it! [2]
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Category:Buckwheat Boys songs

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The result of the debate was no consensus --Kbdank71 14:39, 24 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

One-article category Stev0 07:35, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

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  1. ^ Ministry of Foreign Relations. (2005, December 9). Lifesavers program launched with demobilized persons. In Sustainable economic growth and generation of employment. Retrieved on July 19, 2006. See "...The program, which was presented by the Ministry of Transportation...".
  2. ^ Sociadad Poruaria de Santa Marta. (n.d.) The Minister of Transportation, Andrés Uriel Gallego inaugurated the coal dock of Carbosán Ltd.. In News section. Retrieved on July 19, 2006.
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