Thornder

Welcome

Hello, Thornder! Welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. You may benefit from following some of the links below, which will help you get the most out of Wikipedia. If you have any questions you can ask me on my talk page, or place {{helpme}} on your talk page and ask your question there. Please remember to sign your name on talk pages by clicking or by typing four tildes "~~~~"; this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you are already loving Wikipedia you might want to consider being "adopted" by a more experienced editor or joining a WikiProject to collaborate with others in creating and improving articles of your interest. Click here for a directory of all the WikiProjects. Finally, please do your best to always fill in the edit summary field. Happy editing! Saebjorn! 03:37, 1 October 2009 (UTC) Getting Started Wikipedia Tutorial • The five pillars of Wikipedia How to: edit a page • upload an image Getting Help Frequently Asked Questions Where to ask questions or make comments Request administrator attention Policies and Guidelines Neutral point of view • Reliable sources Verifiability • Citing sources • No original research What Wikipedia is not • Biographies of living persons Manual of Style • Three-revert rule • Sock puppetry Copyrights • Policy for non-free content • Image use policy External links • Spam • Vandalism Deletion policy • Conflict of interest • Notability The Community Community Portal • Adopt-a-user program Assume good faith • Civility • Etiquette No personal attacks • Resolving disputes Build consensus • Village pump Signpost • IRC channels • Mailing lists Things to do Be bold in editing • Help develop an article Pages needing attention • Peer review Join a WikiProject • Translating articles Cleaning up: General • Spam • Vandalism Miscellaneous Categories • Disambiguity • Stubs User pages • Talk pages Useful templates • Tools • User scripts

Help

I currently am in the process of creating an article for an album. I think I figured out most of the editing process, but am still a bit unsure if I am headed in the right direction. I created a subpage under my username. If anyone could check it out for me and let me know what's up, I'd appreciate it. The page I am creating is located here: User:Thornder/FlattScruggsBonnieClyde

Thornder (talk) 05:53, 19 November 2009 (UTC)

It looks good, but I would recommend adding references to assert notability. Take a look at this page. =) Ks0stm If you reply here, please leave me a {{Talkback}} message on my talk page. 07:03, 19 November 2009 (UTC)

I agree with the person above me. For example, look at the "References" section in The Dark Side of the Moon. References help establish notability, a criteria that has to be met for something to have an article on Wikipedia. The references have to be made of reliable, third party sources. If you need help formatting references, you can ask with the helpme tag again, but take a look at WP:REF first. Killiondude (talk) 07:36, 19 November 2009 (UTC)

Two further points regarding our non-free content policy:

1. One of the criteria for non-free content is that it be low quality/resolution, so that it is not useful as a means of infringing copyright (ie. the image hosted here should not be suitable for use in producing counterfeit albums), whilst being of sufficient quality to serve its purpose in the article. I've taken the liberty of uploading a scaled down version of the image.
2. Non-free images should not appear in userspace, even in draft articles. Again, I've taken the liberty of fixing this by commenting out the image in the draft article. The comment tags can simply be removed when the time comes for the article to be made live. Note, however, that as the image is not used at present, it will be vulnerable to deletion if the article is not made live within seven days. But don't rush too much, make sure to find suitable references, as described above, before moving the article. The image can always be re-uploaded if necessary.

Regards, AJCham 08:19, 19 November 2009 (UTC)

According to the notability page, "album articles with little more than a track listing may be more appropriately merged into the artist's main article or discography article, space permitting." This might be more indicative of what I am trying to accomplish. While I won't argue this album probably isn't important enough to warrant a separate article (such as an album like DSOTM), a tracklisting might come in handy for some. Do you know of any discography articles that contain a merged album article I appreciate the comments and help on the image.Thornder (talk) 10:13, 19 November 2009 (UTC)

Earl Scruggs#Discography and Lester Flatt#Discography are the closest that there is. Ks0stm If you reply here, please leave me a {{Talkback}} message on my talk page. 13:27, 19 November 2009 (UTC)

Orphaned non-free image (File:The Story of Bonnie and Clyde Album Cover.jpg)

⚠

Thanks for uploading File:The Story of Bonnie and Clyde Album Cover.jpg. The image description page currently specifies that the image is non-free and may only be used on Wikipedia under a claim of fair use. However, the image is currently orphaned, meaning that it is not used in any articles on Wikipedia. If the image was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that images for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Wikipedia (see our policy for non-free media).

If you have uploaded other unlicensed media, please check whether they're used in any articles or not. You can find a list of "file" pages you have edited by clicking on the "my contributions" link (it is located at the very top of any Wikipedia page when you are logged in), and then selecting "File" from the dropdown box. Note that any non-free images not used in any articles will be deleted after seven days, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. Thank you. — ξ^xplicit 22:16, 19 November 2009 (UTC)

References

{{helpme}} The page in question is located here, as a user subpage: User:Thornder/FlattScruggsBonnieClyde. I discovered that Earl Scruggs' son played a large part in this record, providing writing credits to 4 of the 5 instrumental tracks on the record, as well as playing lead guitar. I also made note that the album alternates between vocal music and instrumentals. Also added producer and engineer credits, as well as a little release information. I think this bit of information might make this article slightly less deserving of speedy deletion. I'm not sure if there is anything else of note, any tips for finding references for albums such as this one? --Thornder (talk) 10:37, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

Hey Thornder. I was at first confused by your helpme request because you placed it above this section rather than in this section. In any event, the article is not likely to be speedy deleted in its present state, but it will probably be redirected and if you revert, taken to AfD. I don't think this will likely work as a stand alone article. I think you should make it into a redirect into the article on Earl Scruggs, as suggested previously, and add what details can be sourced there. As for sources, the first place to start often is Google Book and News (archive) searches. There's an LA times article you might use if you can access it here and there's a few books you can use here but all they provide is little more than passing mention of existence. A great free resource is Chronicling America but I didn't find anything there. A really fantastic but expensive resource is using Ancestry.com's database. They have a free 14 day trial which you can sign up for once, but all like all these services, you have to provide your information and if you forget to cancel they then charge you for a membership, so if you do sign up, be sure to cancel before the free trial ends. As you can see, there are quite a few relevant hits there. If there is a chance of finding enough verifiable material for a stand alone article, this might be your ticket. Cheers.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 17:04, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

Thanks, fuhghettaboutit. Quite helpful as far as finding references online. After reading the basics of redirecting, are you suggesting a redirect of "The Story of Bonnie and Clyde" to Earl Scruggs' wiki? And then adding whatever relevant information I included in the album's information into his article? I'm not sure if that's practical, since I don't forsee any of the info I mentioned being super-relevant to Earl Scruggs. Or would a redirect really be helpful? I'm kind of new to the whole wikipedia thing, bear with me please.--Thornder (talk) 09:07, 23 November 2009 (UTC)

I'm suggesting that if you can't find more sources to add that are more than passing mention of existence, then a stand alone article is probably not warranted as it can't have sufficient verifiable content. So instead of an article, it should just be a redirect to the main artist's page, where it would remain just an entry in his list of works, rather than listing the information you have in your subpage. Through a redirect from The Story of Bonnie and Clyde, anyone entering the name of the album by that title would reach Earl Scruggs' page where it is listed. Please see WP:NALBUMS. Cheers.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 13:30, 24 November 2009 (UTC)

Redirecting to the right spot, adding things

{{helpme}} Everyone above me has requested that I scrap what I have (no arguments there from me) and redirect User:Thornder/FlattScruggsBonnieClyde to the main artist's page. Should I redirect this to Foggy Mountain Boys, Lester Flatt, or Earl Scruggs? The only page of the three that mentions the record is the Foggy Mountain Boys one; therefore I think it should redirect there. But perhaps after this, I should include a link in each (both flatt and scruggs' pages) that points to a discography with the Foggy Mountain Boys, since they were notably present on these records, and the discography sections of their respective pages don't mention this? For example, under Lester Flatt's discography, it could say "Discography with the Foggy Mountain Boys" and have a link pointing to their discography section. Comments welcome!

A draft in your userspace doesn't need to be redirected anywhere, since it's not in the main article space. If you want to scrap it entirely, then it can be speedily deleted at your request. Is there an actual article you were interested in redirecting? Hersfold ^(t/a/c) 08:25, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

Well I was planning on putting it in the main article space at some point, but before I did I wanted to make sure things were ok. Obviously in previous conversations this article is something that would be deleted eventually, due to lack of notability. Hypothetically, if I made a redirect article for The Story of Bonnie and Clyde, what would the general consensus be as far as redirecting it? --Thornder (talk) 09:48, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

I never suggested you redirect your subpage and if that's the impression you got, I should have been more clear. I suggested that you red link in your post above should be redirected to Earl Scruggs if you can't find more source to verify a stand alone article. But you're right that that page didn't have the album listed; it does now as I've added it with a reliable source (with this edit).--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 13:31, 25 November 2009 (UTC)