User talk:Peter Isotalo/Archive 12

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You're receiving this message because you have reviewed or nominated a good article in the last year. (t · c) buidhe 05:15, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

Regarding wikisource

Hello, I've taken your advice regarding moving the translated text of the Piri Reis map over to Wikisource. My progress is here: https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Index:PiriReisMap_Akcura_1935.pdf

I've done scans of the whole English section of Akçura's translations plus notes. I believe that the next step is to mark all my text as "proofread"? But I'm a little unsure and therefore seeking some guidance. For example, Akçura leaves some explanatory notes on some pages and his editor leaves some citations to the research that Akçura talks about. These are noted in the print copy as [1], (2), or (3) and they restart on each page. Presumably, I'm meant to used some kind of more cohesive system like linked footnotes for the whole document, but also I think I'm not meant to do that at this step? Any guidance is appreciated. Rjjiii (talk) 02:29, 2 August 2023 (UTC)

Looks good to me. Regarding the notes, I would recommend dealing with them as if they were normal <ref>-type notes and just ignore the print original's numbering. The point, after all, is to recreate the original text, not the specific limitations of the original paper print layout.

I edited a work from the late 18th century on Swedish Wikisource where the content was technically more notes than content (since it is a reproduction of lectures). Check it out here to see how it was realized. Peter ^Isotalo 22:16, 2 August 2023 (UTC)

Cog (ship)

Hi Peter Isotalo. You add references for "Ellmers 1994" to Cog (ship), but no such work is defined in the article. Could you add the required cite to the Sources section, or let me know what works this refers to? -- LCU ActivelyDisinterested ∆transmissions∆ °co-ords° 15:25, 12 August 2023 (UTC)

@ActivelyDisinterested, it's a chapter in Gardiner & Unger (1994), just like Runyan. I don't think it's functional to list the chapters as separate works, though. No idea how to handle this through the sfn templates, I'm afraid. Peter ^Isotalo 15:50, 12 August 2023 (UTC)

Short form refs like {{sfn}} or {{harv}} are hyperlinks to proper citations. So there must always be something for them to link with. The {{harvc}} template is useful in these situations.
* {{cite book |editor1-last=Gardiner |editor1-first=Robert |editor2-last=Unger |editor2-first=Richard W. |date=August 1994 |title=Cogs, Caravels and Galleons: The Sailing Ship, 1000-1650 |series=Conway's History of the Ship |location=London |publisher=[[Conway Maritime Press]] |isbn=978-0851775609}}
** {{harvc |first=Timothy |last=Runyan |year=1994 |c=Cog as Warship |in1=Gardiner |in2=Unger}}
** {{harvc |first=First name |last=Ellmer |year=1994 |c=Chapter name |in1=Gardiner |in2=Unger}}
Will display as:

• Gardiner, Robert; Unger, Richard W., eds. (August 1994). Cogs, Caravels and Galleons: The Sailing Ship, 1000-1650. Conway's History of the Ship. London: Conway Maritime Press. ISBN 978-0851775609.
  • Runyan, Timothy. "Cog as Warship". In Gardiner & Unger (1994).
  • Ellmer, First name. "Chapter name". In Gardiner & Unger (1994).

Or as you have done with Runyan you can list it separately with a full cite, but without something to link to it's not a valid reference. It generates an error message, which is tracked in Category:Harv and Sfn no-target errors. These messages are off by default, the category also contains directions to turning them on. -- LCU ActivelyDisinterested ∆transmissions∆ °co-ords° 16:15, 12 August 2023 (UTC)

@ActivelyDisinterested, thanks for the technical explanation. The linkage between notes and refs is a nice feature but those templates are too inflexible for my taste. I'm not a fan of having multiple sets of notes either. I'll specify sources with appropriate exactness but I'll leave it to others to figure out what templates they want to use. Peter ^Isotalo 16:35, 12 August 2023 (UTC)

What you've done works fine. Inline, text, templates it's all a matter of taste, but you're right the templates are less flexible. You could have always just use Gardiner & Unger 1994 with the page number, the author of the chapter isn't always necessary. -- LCU ActivelyDisinterested ∆transmissions∆ °co-ords° 16:40, 12 August 2023 (UTC)

@ActivelyDisinterested, I honestly don't think the templates are a matter of taste for me. I'd love to use them but they're just too complicated and inflexible. They should be more modular and allow for variation in detail as needed. And above all not force me into the weird Wikipedianism of separating comments from refs.

I would never want to leave out the name of the author of a text in an anthology. It's extremely relevant info in my view. Peter ^Isotalo 16:50, 12 August 2023 (UTC)

TFA

Thank you today for Medieval cuisine, introduced (in 2007): "Grab a trencher, pass the frumenty and dunk a sop or two in the nearest cup o' wine, because here's a culinary delight sweeter than a galley worth of hypocras! It all began with my accidental discovery of the none-too-humble subtlety when reading Timeline. From then on my fascination with medieval cookery just kept growing, and the result was a full-fledged gastronomical orgy of academic indulgence. I've plowed well over a thousand pages of literature by now, and considering how delightfully scrumptious the topic is, there's bound to be more in the form of various sub-articles."! -- Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:23, 1 October 2023 (UTC)

Du är en pärla, Gerda. ^_^ Peter ^Isotalo 15:48, 1 October 2023 (UTC)

Franska köket

Hej! Om jag förstod det rätt du och en person till översatte artikeln Franska köket från engelska. Ett utmärkt jobb! Jättebra artikeln! Jag själv har lagt till en lista med populära franska rätter i artikeln och ska så småningom lägga till en lista med franska efterrätter och bakelser.

Anledningen till att skriver till dig är att jag har en fråga. I artikeln finns det en lång lista med ingredienser som används i det franska köket. De flesta av ingredienserna är mycket vanliga överallt som tex potatis, lök, äpple, päron osv.

Jag förstår inte riktigt vitsen med den långa listan. Borde inte listan kortas till ovanliga ingredinser tex? Vad tycker du?

Ha det bra! Bzwabi (talk) 20:06, 22 November 2023 (UTC)

@Bzwabi, jag plockade bort "Ingredienser" helt. Den funkar liksom inte som rubrik om den inte är generell och sammanfattande. Att försöka göra punktlistor av det hela är ju hopplöst eftersom de i grunden är godtyckliga. Peter ^Isotalo 20:34, 22 November 2023 (UTC)

Jag håller med.

Tack för hjälpen! Bzwabi (talk) 16:05, 26 November 2023 (UTC)

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Translation help

Hi, I am quite new here, I am not sure if this is the right forum. I was wondering if you could help me with a translation? I have already done the work, but it won't let me publish. Any advise? Oliviahageus (talk) 15:11, 15 December 2023 (UTC)

@Oliviahageus, sure thing. What are you translating and which article do you want to put the text in? Peter ^Isotalo 17:04, 15 December 2023 (UTC)

Oh sorry, I had no idea you replied! Hope you can still help!

There are two translations, one is for Institutet för framtidsstudier and one is for their CEO, Gustaf Arrhenius (filosof) Both of them are in Swedish but I would like to add the English translations, how do do this?

There should be a draft in the translation page for the Institutet för Framtidsstudier - can you see that one or should I send you a copy?

Thank you again for your reply and many apologies for the late answer!! Had completely given up on solving this

/Olivia Oliviahageus (talk) 12:04, 21 March 2024 (UTC)

Slavery. Etymology section

Hi, I had to revert your edits back once again and added the explanation in the 'Etymology. Once again' section in the article's Talk page. You're welcome to join the discussion there so as to clarify what you feel is unclear prior to changing something in the article itself, which was actually composed after the discussion in the Wiktionary Scriptorium in 2022. Thanks Fuzzy Barsik (talk) 19:38, 26 December 2023 (UTC)

@Fuzzy Barsik, I've clarified my edits on the talkpage, but I just want to stress that discussions on Wiktionary do not determine content on Wikipedia. The issue here is overly complicated prose and non-standard notation. The etymology section is simply hard to understand and your reverts aren't helping. Peter ^Isotalo 01:31, 27 December 2023 (UTC)

A cup of coffee for you!

I really like your audio samples for many sounds in IPA. It gives me a lot of idea of how they sound like ʁ sound, it doesn't exist at all in my language and tells me how it sounds. I also like the audio samples for words in Swedish too. You're so cool with these RushingGold (talk) 16:12, 29 December 2023 (UTC)

@RushingGold, thank you for the kind words. And the coffee! 😊 Peter ^Isotalo 22:35, 29 December 2023 (UTC)

January 2024

Please don't make changes in article content while the item in question is open to be discussed on the article's talk page, as you did at Swedish Empire. SergeWoodzing (talk) 13:28, 14 January 2024 (UTC)

Don't accuse me of POV for a fairly minor copyedit. Peter ^Isotalo 15:03, 14 January 2024 (UTC)

We all have the right to assert POV. None of us have the right to disregard article talk. --SergeWoodzing (talk) 20:41, 14 January 2024 (UTC)

I have brought the issue up on the talkpage, clearly explained my reasoning, asked about sources and tried to engage with you.

WP:AGF applies to you as much as anyone. You're an experienced editor and you've interacted with me before. This is completely uncalled for. Peter ^Isotalo 21:49, 14 January 2024 (UTC)

I try to assume good faith, I really do, but it's hard to find good faith when someone makes major slant changes to the text of an article, which then are reverted and immediately reverted again by that someone back to what that someone wants to have, before that someone uses the talk page. All this flying in the face of closed move discussions on that talk page of which that certain someone was fully aware. --SergeWoodzing (talk) 11:41, 15 January 2024 (UTC)

I'm not seeing anything like good faith from you, only snark and hostility. I'm going to ignore your talkpage comments completely unless you take the issue seriously.

I think there's enough to make a civility complaint already and if you try to intervene in the article without engaging in sincere discussion, I'll ask others to examine your behavior.

I don't want you posting here again in this matter. Peter ^Isotalo 16:53, 15 January 2024 (UTC)

Audio recording

Hi again, Peter Isotalo, I am here to ask how record audio for words, pronunciations, articles, etc. Can you please tell me how do you create those. It will be really helpful by contributing through audios. I came to you for this because of your cool phoneme pronunciations like ka aka. Since you are an expert at this since 2005, it would really help me ^ω^. RushingGold (talk) 23:03, 23 January 2024 (UTC)

Get a microphone, download an audio editing app (I use Audacity), record (listen to your recordings until you're satisfied with the results) and upload. Peter ^Isotalo 18:27, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for telling for audio recording. I think I have an audio editing app but I need to buy microphone. Microphone is kinda expensive so gotta save some money for it. RushingGold (talk) 13:09, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Vasa at TFA in two years?

I see the keel for Vasa in February or March, 398 years ago. I see you're still helping to maintain the article. Would it make sense to run this at TFA in two years? If so, I'll add it to TFAP for then. - Dank (push to talk) 01:48, 11 February 2024 (UTC)

@Dank, laying down the keel isn't really of much interest, I'd say. There's no exact date so it might as well be any date.

The two recognized dates are August 10 1628 (sinking) and April 24 1961 (the recovered wreck broke the surface). Those two are always highlighted by the museum as important anniversaries. Peter ^Isotalo 07:16, 11 February 2024 (UTC)

Okay, I'll keep 2028 in mind then. Thanks. - Dank (push to talk) 13:34, 11 February 2024 (UTC)

@Dank, 'til then! 😊 Peter ^Isotalo 14:30, 11 February 2024 (UTC)

WP:TPG

Re [1] and [2], you're repeatedly falling short of the guidelines at WP:TALK#USE:

• What point are you trying to make here? Right off the bat you're being combative and accusing someone of WP:POINT.
• Are you arguing that we start duking it out in this article over the merits of one vs two sets of notes? Obviously not what I said, and completely unhelpful.
• It's an honest question so heed your own advice. No it wasn't, and you heed the advice.
• I'm very frustrated by this situation and I'm honestly worried about pointless disruptions. I'm sorry to hear you are frustrated. Inflammatory communication is going to make things worse, not better. Remember there is no deadline, and if you need to take a moment before coming back to the discussion, nothing is going to be irreparably broken in the interim.
• Other than debating principles, I'm not "debating" anything, I was pointing out terrible advice given by another editor lest someone take it seriously.
• What are you suggesting we do? Finally, there's a reasonable and actionable question that is to the point and doesn't have the problems contained in the rest of your posts. You should have started and finished with only that. Once you've struck the violations, I'll reply. VQuakr (talk) 06:06, 19 February 2024 (UTC)

@VQuakr, if you don't want to reply, that's your choice. Peter ^Isotalo 06:08, 19 February 2024 (UTC)

If you can't accept one on one feedback, the next step is ANI. Maybe take a minute to process what I'm telling you: you're being excessively combative and it is working against you. VQuakr (talk) 06:11, 19 February 2024 (UTC)

@VQuakr, I feel like your accusing me without taking into account any of the history of the issue. I tried to express genuine concern and frustration over what I honestly believe could be a very disruptive process. It's not because of the content issue per se but because it seems like people are gearing up to use the article simply to promote a largely subjective ref standard on principle.

I've tried to explain over and over again what I see as problems with a two-note standard and feel I'm being ignored or shouted down by a user who refuses to listen. I've done this for well over a year now because this matter started over at galley and has now moved on to Vasa.

I find your post to be very aggressive and threatening in tone and I don't want further discussion about this here. Peter ^Isotalo 06:30, 19 February 2024 (UTC)

Notice of Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents discussion

There is currently a discussion at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. The thread is Ongoing incivility by Peter Isotalo. Thank you. VQuakr (talk) 20:56, 19 February 2024 (UTC)