User talk:Invertzoo/Archive 20

ARCHIVE PAGE 20: August 2009

Wikibeer

Thanks! – ClockworkSoul 01:28, 1 August 2009 (UTC)

Re:A piece of vandalism you caught

Sorry for my delayed response, he/she was using mutliple IP's, they'd already been banned a few minutes prior to those edits, block logs for IP include - [1] [2]. Jeff M | Talk2Me | BNosey - 19:03, 1 August 2009 (UTC)

nice to meet you last week

I just wanted to say it was nice to meet you last week at the conference. dm (talk) 20:11, 1 August 2009 (UTC)

Sure, there were a lot of people there and a lot of faces. Anyway, we were up at North-South Lake today and we found a fresh water gastropod in the lake. Of course, we have no idea what species. It was reported to be "slimy" when picked up. dm (talk) 03:39, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

Um, to some degree I have the same problem, there were so many good conversations. We met in the big room, we talked about your username and you told me the "how do you let the animals out" joke. We talked about the register of historic places project and museums a bit. In any case, I was going to suggest lunch at some point. Can you send me an email (go to my main page and you should see an email link on the left). dm (talk) 14:25, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

Ack! It was turned on, honest :) Not sure how that got reset. Sorry. dm (talk) 02:06, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

Honorary membership

Why thank you very much. An honour indeed! How can I live up to that? --Geronimo20 (talk) 23:50, 1 August 2009 (UTC)

Assessment

Like you, I think the A-class versus GA issue is obscure, and not at all well set out in guidelines such as here, here, here and here. Anyway, for what it is worth, here is my take. It boils down to how your project is going to handle quality control for its best articles. You don't have to assess an article at all before nominating it for FA. However, unless you really know what you are doing, you should first submit the article for FA peer review or put it through the GA peer review process. On the other hand, you can classify an article as A-grade youself, without going through any quality control process external to your project.

Yes that's what I figured, my take was the same as your take. Invertzoo (talk) 14:45, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

The main difference between A and GA class articles, as I understand them, is that GA-class articles need to undergo a review process external to your project, whereas A-class don't, and can be assessed by anyone. A-class articles are usually assessed by project members, who tend to have more focus on content, while GA-class are assessed by outside editors with more focus on style. Projects don't usually move articles through both GA and A levels on the way to FA, and in practice, GA has largely replaced A-class.

OK, that makes sense. That is what it looks like when you read the descriptions of the classes. A appears to be on the way to becoming vestigial. Invertzoo (talk) 14:45, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

However, the policy you adopt towards assessment is, to some degree, a matter for each project to decide. For example, you might decide to use A-class, but require such articles to go through a peer review within the project. The huge Military History project find A-class articles useful, and still use them (partially to take pressure off the external review processes). It is a matter of utility and assuring adequate quality control.

Makes sense. Invertzoo (talk) 14:45, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

There are some talk page discussions here, here and here. Fishing and Fisheries needs to start working articles up the quality ladder as well, so it will be interesting to see how we go! I think, for small projects like ours, forget about A class, but work articles up to GA before submitting them for FA. --Geronimo20 (talk) 23:13, 2 August 2009 (UTC)

I think that is what I would like to do too if other project members agree. Invertzoo (talk) 14:45, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

A couple more useful links are here and here. Notice Wikipedia has 6986 GA-class articles altogether, and only 470 A-class articles, underlining that A-class articles are pretty much out of fashion. --Geronimo20 (talk) 00:28, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

Great! Many thanks for that masterly analysis! I also wanted to say, your writing is always very clear and pleasing, I admire your transparent prose style. Invertzoo (talk) 14:45, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

GA review of Love dart

Hi Susan. I've finished the review for the Love dart article. You can read it here. Diderot's dreams (talk) 04:30, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

Looks like it's going very well to me. But specifically which references still need looking at? --Geronimo20 (talk) 20:38, 5 August 2009 (UTC)

• TWO – had a go at this
• THREE – is resolved, isn't it?
• FOUR – the cupid image was entered by User:helix84, who is not currently active. The email is enabled, so you could perhaps send an email. But is there really a problem? The uploader asserted it was their own work. The link to the statue could refer to an engraving in the statue inscription.
• FIVE – had a go at this

If there are one or two loose ends, you can just remove them from the article for now. --Geronimo20 (talk) 23:45, 5 August 2009 (UTC) Maybe you could use this image. --Geronimo20 (talk) 03:29, 6 August 2009 (UTC)

Done. Zonitoides sp. might need rewording. --Geronimo20 (talk) 16:21, 7 August 2009 (UTC)

OK! We did it! Love dart is our first Good Article at Project Gastropods! Phew! Thanks again, Invertzoo (talk) 17:52, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

You're welcome. Good luck with your next GA. Diderot's dreams (talk) 04:30, 11 August 2009 (UTC)

Socorro springsnail

Hi there - i see you've nominated this at GAN. I'm not reviewing it, but i thought i would suggest that a reviewer will object to one-sentence sections. Amalgamate these under more general or combined headings. Cheers. hamiltonstone (talk) 06:18, 5 August 2009 (UTC)

There is nothing bad with short section. All of these section should be in every complete article about gastropods. Unity style of sections keeps wikipedia clear and easily to understand. There is not much information not only available but even not known about every living species and this is one of them. Especially these two short sections are complete. Every reader immeditely can see, that nothing is missing in the article, when the article is clearly structured like this. --Snek01 (talk) 11:28, 5 August 2009 (UTC)

Well, that may be your view, but I think you will find it likely that others won't agree - I certainly wouldn't pass it at GA with all those headings: see also WP:LAYOUT - the section on body sections. Just to be clear, I am supporting all the content being included in the article, just not all the separate headings. hamiltonstone (talk) 11:59, 5 August 2009 (UTC)

That was not very informative message. Well, that may be your view, but I think you will find it likely that others won't agree. See also WP:LAYOUT - the section on body sections: "These headings clarify articles by breaking up text, organizing content, and populating the table of contents that users can choose to view (the default) or not to view." It is the purpose to inhibit the flow of the prose in these unrelated sections. It is the purpose to keep the same layout in all gastropod articles and if there is one sentence section in one of those 80 000 gastropod species, then it must be dissruptive for those who have fixed idea, that sections have to have a certain minimal number of characters. Such sectioning is de facto standard in ~5000 gastropod articles in wikipedia. --Snek01 (talk) 12:49, 5 August 2009 (UTC)

Hello Invertzoo, I have renewed a "stable" structure version, because stability is necessary for A status. It is stable not only from point of this one article about also in the context of other articles. After review(s) it can be as alternate version how various things could looks like. --Snek01 (talk) 12:25, 7 August 2009 (UTC)

Hi - i've left a message for Snek saying I thought your edits were a step forward. Hopefully this can get discussed at the talk page. I don't think consistency of headings between articles is necesasrily important for quality assurance. And the headings in existing GA organism articles, as I've said before, are less specific than the ones being used in Socorro springsnail. Hopefully some more editors can get involved in this discussion. hamiltonstone (talk) 12:48, 7 August 2009 (UTC)

Syrinx aruanus

Hello, I have preprepared Syrinx aruanus which would be very good for a DYK hook. --Snek01 (talk) 23:22, 5 August 2009 (UTC)

Yes, I agree that it would make a good DYK. Perhaps we can work on it together. I will try to work on it some more, even though I am rather busy now. Thanks for telling me about it.

Maybe we could say:

"Did You Know ... that with a shell length of up to 91 mm, Syrinx aruanus is the largest snail in the world?"

Best, Invertzoo (talk) 22:58, 6 August 2009 (UTC)

Or it could be:

"Did You Know ... that the largest snail in the world Syrinx aruanus eats polychaete worms?"

I have nominated it. --Snek01 (talk) 13:45, 7 August 2009 (UTC)

Reply about deletion of seashells template [3]

Hi! =) I posted my reply to your question underneath it in the same section. Craig Pemberton (talk) 03:51, 6 August 2009 (UTC)

Hello, Invertzoo. You have new messages at Hamiltonstone's talk page.
You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

shell width and length - (and the Native Hackberry)

Dear Zoo,

Congratulations on your recognition from Jimmy Wales. You deserve all the credit that comes your way.

When I was in the I.T. industry, I was mentored by a woman boss, ten years older than me. She was of great ability, and trusted me with a huge responsibility so early. Fortunately success came easily to me and my department. Much to the credit of this superb businesswoman. I see similar traits with you.

The shells of Velesunio ambiguous is one of my favourite relics sitting right next to the computer. I'm no passionate lover of molluscs as such, but a lover of all nature, great and small. The shell measures 85 mm long and 49 mm wide. When I picked up the shell, the stream was dry, and all was dead nearby. It seemed so barren and desolate that no river mollusc could ever live in Ashely.

We've had terrible droughts here in Australia. But these fascinating creatures can live in a harsh place like Australia where the rainfall is so unreliable. How they manage to breed and survive, when the river levels are so up and down is beyond me. Presumably they make good use of the best times. Australia is a land of great famine and drought, of terrible death and despair. But also it is a place of fecundity and extraordinary rebirth and spectacular new life.

Despite being keen on Australian spiders, I cannot identify the spider previously mentioned before. When small, few Australian children would know more of Australian spiders than me. And despite this experience, passion and knowledge, I just don't know what it was. Not enough published on the subject for me to answer the question.

Today I was in my element. Running through three southern rainforests. Searching for a rare plant, the Native Hackberry. It's not so rare in the far eastern tropics, or in the south pacific islands. But so far south here, it is very difficult to locate unless you have excellent advice. Finding rare things in situ is what I love to do.

After nearly stomping on a dangerous snake recently, I was extra careful when searching today. An extra bonus was finding a flock of giant parrots, the Yellow-tailed Black Cockatoo. These fabulous birds and I had a meaningful dialogue. I speak parrot, and they speak my language. They are very funny birds, full of wit and individuality. We get on well.

Within a few kilometres of its southern most limit of natural distribution I searched for this wonderful tree at Bass Point. Sometimes finding rare things is ridiculously easy, other times it's impossible. This was the case today. My goal was to find this extraordinary rainforest tree and put photos of it on Wikipedia.

My leg strength was impressive and powerful. Breathing good too. With this fitness I want to climb more New South Wales mountains before I get too old, such as Mount Imlay and Mount Dromedary.

kind regards PETE xxx

Poyt448 (talk) 09:18, 6 August 2009 (UTC)

Cladograms

You might be interested in taxonomy trees like this one. I've just discovered how easy they are to make. --Geronimo20 (talk) 17:27, 7 August 2009 (UTC)

Aplysia photo

http://www.flickr.com/photos/linsay007/1451047556/ --Snek01 (talk) 22:33, 7 August 2009 (UTC)

Transclusions

If you want to insert a copy of the article Wikipedia:Version 1.0 Editorial Team/Gastropods articles by quality statistics in another article, type the following:

{{Wikipedia:Version 1.0 Editorial Team/Gastropods articles by quality statistics}}

It's called a transclusion, and works with any article you want to transclude. Just replace the square brackets (which create a wikilink) with curly brackets (which create a transclusion). --Geronimo20 (talk) 21:12, 8 August 2009 (UTC)

DYK nomination of Syrinx aruanus

Hello! Your submission of Syrinx aruanus at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and there still are some issues that may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! Dabomb87 (talk) 03:56, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

Further reading

Hello, this is not correct: [4]. Further reading is not a subsection of References. Because in References there are only those ones used. --Snek01 (talk) 22:48, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

OK, thanks for the heads-up! Invertzoo (talk) 22:53, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

Shelling out a well-deserved award

		The Tireless Contributor Barnstar
		This barnstar, (fanfare), the first I have ever awarded, (louder fanfare), which also spins round and round, (deafening fanfare), is for giving super, substantial, sensible and solid strength to simple, slender stubs. Slime on! Anna Frodesiak (talk) 08:44, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

B&R tree

Hello, there is ommited clade Heterobranchia in many taxoboxes of Pulmonata. It is probably because the page Taxonomy of the Gastropoda (Bouchet & Rocroi, 2005) is not easy as overview and the "Contents" is not possible to use (because there is not such detailed structure of captions). So I asked Geronimo for the taxonomic tree. --Snek01 (talk) 23:43, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

Location info

I added some location information to File:2007 Limax maximus.jpg. Hope it's useful. Rl (talk) 06:10, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

DYK for Syrinx aruanus

On August 14, 2009, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Syrinx aruanus, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits your article got while on the front page (here's how) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Orlady (talk) 20:15, 14 August 2009 (UTC)

Re: Cavoliniidae

When I performed the undeletion of this article, I restored all copied that were in the database. There is no evidence to support your belief that some fleshed out article was reduced to a circular redirect as there is no evidence that said article has ever existed. All revisions of Cavoliniidae are visible in the article history since its original creation in May 2004. In addition there is no evidence of any kind of deletion having ever been performed on Cavolinioidea. As a result, I am not able to make sense of exactly what admin actions you are requesting be performed. --Allen3 ^talk 22:54, 14 August 2009 (UTC)

Gastropoda taxonomy

Hi Invertzoo. I notice you are concerned that information about clade/group/informal group status is not displayed in the taxonomy tree. An earlier version of the tree partially incorporated this information, but only for leaf or end nodes. You could display the information for all nodes by using superscript symbols, somewhat in the manner the fossil status is displayed. --Geronimo20 (talk) 23:13, 14 August 2009 (UTC)

A lot of activity!

I couldn't help but notice that wikiproject Gastropods is very active and fruitious recently! That's a really awesome thing! I feel even more motivated, and I believe much of this project's success is due to both your enthusiasm and hard work, Susan. I don't really know if I am the right person to say that, but Good Job! Besides the congratulations, I'm also writing to inform you that I'm editing those Bynesian Decay series of photos I menioned quite a while ago. I took me quite some time. I had some troubles to solve recently, so I didn't really had any good opportunity to deal with them. But in any case, as things are settling up, they should be around sooner or later. Best wishes!
--Daniel Cavallari (talk) 02:07, 15 August 2009 (UTC)

		The Article Rescue Barnstar
		Thank you for saving article Charles des Moulins. --Snek01 (talk) 14:59, 15 August 2009 (UTC)

Limax maximus

Hello Invertzoo, i took the photo under the awning of the sand-box of our kids. When i removed the awning the sand-box was unused for a longer time. -- 21:32, 18. Aug. 2009 (CEST) --LoKiLeCh (talk) 19:38, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

correcting format

Hi, got your message and sorry to say, I need a bit nore explanation of what you want me to do.

• when you mention {{italictitle}} before the taxobox for 'genus and species' articles, I am assuming you mean articles which do not have common names and thus should be titled in italics?
• your second point, do I gather you want me to check that the taxobox taxonomy I copy is correct according to B&R?
• what am I supposed to put on the talk page if the article doesnt need a photo?

{{WikiProject Gastropods|class=Stub|importance=Low|needs-photo=no}} or {{WikiProject Gastropods|class=Stub|importance=Low|needs-photo=no}} Clearly my Wikispeak needs work. Hope you're enjoying your time away. regards Seascapeza (talk) 06:50, 24 August 2009 (UTC)

correcting format 2

Hi again Invertzoo, Thanks for your responses. Very kind of you to say my articles are good and thank you also for your efforts in helping me understand how the wiki process works in more detail. I will certainly put the title in italics for those articles which require them -- my plan with most of the articles I am creating is to link the binomial to the common name since it is tragically true that most people are uncomfortable with the binomial system and prefer 'tasselled nudibranch' to Kaloplacomus ramosus for example. But when writing on the genera, obviously, common names are rarely applicable, so I will be using them from time to time, also when a species lacks a common name for one reason or another. In almost all of my mollusc articles I have used the B&R taxonomy, usually from the original article. I did not do that with the Trivia millardi article, merely copying the taxobox from another Trivia sp. that already existed. It had clades in the taxobox, so I assumed it was correct. Clearly, this needs to be checked next time, which I will do. I will do my best to remember the talk page addition also. best wishes to you in Southern California Seascapeza (talk) 03:24, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

Mitrella and other columbellid genera

Thanks for the invitation. It is not that I am anywhere near an expert in gastropods, but I am glad to help when so much is missing. Regarding Columbellidae it would be a good idea if people who have shells or live by the sea would download some pictures or drawings in Commons. There are next to none and it would be a good idea to illustrate the infobox of every genus with a picture. Xufanc (talk) 09:21, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

I agree with you 100%! I will make a note to that effect and put it on the project talk page. I must confess I do have a lot of shells, including a number of different columbellids, but I don't often have the time to sit down and make images. Thanks for your interest and help! Invertzoo (talk) 16:20, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

news

Talk:Socorro springsnail/GA1 and User talk:Casliber#Socorro springsnail review. --Snek01 (talk) 15:38, 31 August 2009 (UTC)

OK, I am available for help in this process. I cannot put in quite as many hours as when I am in NYC, but still I can work for a couple of hours each day, sometimes maybe more than that. I will try to check in often on this. Let me know immediately if something in particular comes up that I can help with. Best wishes, Invertzoo (talk) 16:15, 31 August 2009 (UTC)

Gastropod shell article

Hello, I have added a raw text to the gastropod shell article. Evaluate if such text, style, etc. is useful and feel free to copyedit it somehow or feel free to delete it if needed. I can continue adding few wikilinks and incorporating in appropriate sections later. Thanks. --Snek01 (talk) 19:45, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

I am a bit busy now but will try to get to this as soon as I can. Invertzoo (talk) 14:09, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

I went through it once and fixed it up a lot but I need to go through it again. Best, Invertzoo (talk) 21:53, 28 September 2009 (UTC)