User talk:Hatchens/Archive 1

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Disambiguation link notification for April 18

Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. An automated process has detected that when you recently edited New York State Route 454, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Holbrook (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver). Such links are usually incorrect, since a disambiguation page is merely a list of unrelated topics with similar titles. (Read the FAQ • Join us at the DPL WikiProject.)

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Rectified! Thank you User:DPL bot. - Hatchens (talk) 12:31, 25 April 2020 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for April 25

An automated process has detected that when you recently edited Selkirk and Galashiels Railway, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Berwick (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver).

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Rectified! Thank you User:DPL bot. - Hatchens (talk) 12:31, 25 April 2020 (UTC)

Spelling and common terms

Don't link common terms like countries. See Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Linking#What generally should not be linked. Spelling should either by in the way that it is used in that country or whatever was used first. See Wikipedia:Manual of Style#National varieties of English. CambridgeBayWeather, Uqaqtuq (talk), Sunasuttuq 13:00, 3 May 2020 (UTC)

Thank You CambridgeBayWeather. - Hatchens (talk) 13:33, 3 May 2020 (UTC)

Message from Schehreh

Dear Reviewer, "Baran Nikrah" is a famous narrator and influencer in Iran. As a star and celebrity, she invited to many radio and TV programs, One of the most recent ones is: https://www.telewebion.com/episode/2257578

http://www.pririb.ir/portal/newsview/32128/%DA%A9%D9%88%D8%AF%DA%A9%D8%A7%D9%86-%DA%A9%D8%A7%D8%B1-%D9%85%D9%88%D8%B6%D9%88%D8%B9-%D8%A7%D9%85%D8%B4%D8%A8-%D9%85%D8%A7-%D8%A7%DB%8C%D8%B1%D8%A7%D9%86%DB%8C%E2%80%8C%D9%87%D8%A7

One of the works that she is part of that in Iranian national TV is "Shab Gard" which shows every night right now. Please have a look at the following link, at the begging of each episode she has a section: https://www.telewebion.com/program/66968

Her page in Instagram is one of the most active pages in Iran with around one million followers (over 900k and it is quickly growing): https://im.nitroapp.ir/report/baran_nikrah/instagram https://socialblade.com/instagram/user/baran_nikrah

This Wikipedia page would help to minimize fake news about her. So it would be nice of you if you change your mind and take back your "Delete" tag.

Thank you for your time and consideration, Best regards Saeed https://scholar.google.de/citations?user=l6eNITkAAAAJ&hl=en — Preceding unsigned comment added by Schehreh (talk • contribs) 14:25, 5 May 2020 (UTC)

Kindly accept and follow the public consensus after the AfD. - Hatchens (talk) 01:38, 6 May 2020 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for May 19

An automated process has detected that when you recently edited American Staffing Association, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page CPA (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver).

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Rectified it by using Dab solver. - Hatchens (talk) 15:34, 19 May 2020 (UTC)

Welcome to the GOCE!

Hello Hatchens, and welcome to the Guild of Copy Editors! We are glad that you have decided to help us in our mission to improve the quality of writing on the English Wikipedia. Here are some links that you might find helpful to get started on your copy-editing journey:

• A how-to guide to Wikipeda copyediting
• Wikipedia's Manual of Style (MOS), a helpful guide to refer to while copy editing
  • A simplified version of the above
• A quick guide to writing on Wikipedia

You can help with copy-editing requests if you already have familiarity with the MOS and considerable English copy-editing skills, or start with articles tagged for copy editing to gain experience.

Thank you so much for joining the GOCE, we appreciate it!

For the GOCE, -- puddleglum^2.0 02:41, 1 June 2020 (UTC)

Thank you Puddleglum2.0

Pending changes reviewer granted

Hello. Your account has been granted the "pending changes reviewer" userright, allowing you to review other users' edits on pages protected by pending changes. The list of articles awaiting review is located at Special:PendingChanges, while the list of articles that have pending changes protection turned on is located at Special:StablePages.

Being granted reviewer rights neither grants you status nor changes how you can edit articles. If you do not want this user right, you may ask any administrator to remove it for you at any time.

See also:

• Wikipedia:Reviewing pending changes, the guideline on reviewing
• Wikipedia:Pending changes, the summary of the use of pending changes
• Wikipedia:Protection policy#Pending changes protection, the policy determining which pages can be given pending changes protection by administrators.
  

Mz7 (talk) 23:40, 22 June 2020 (UTC)

Thank you Mz7. -Hatchens (talk) 15:54, 23 June 2020 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Times of Assam (2nd nomination) Comment

Hi Hatchens, Have a look at the revision history on this discussion, I think the creator/objector is trying to make a comment look like it is coming from you? JW 1961 Talk 17:31, 25 June 2020 (UTC)

Thank you, Joseywales1961 to bring this into my attention. Let's take an appropriate step. -Hatchens (talk) 05:04, 26 June 2020 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for July 18

An automated process has detected that when you recently edited Lorenz Saladin, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Swiss (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver).

(Opt-out instructions.) --DPL bot (talk) 06:16, 18 July 2020 (UTC)

Rectified manually. -Hatchens (talk) 11:24, 18 July 2020 (UTC)

Move

Hi, just as a heads up, we don’t disambiguate unless there’s two articles. The NC SECU is thus far the only SECU that’s been deemed notable enough for someone to want to write an article. Also, because of its sheer size, even if there were others that had articles and were notable, there’s an extremely strong argument it’d be the primary topic so we wouldn’t move it anyway. Just wanted to let you know why I reverted the move. TonyBallioni (talk) 05:13, 19 July 2020 (UTC)

Hey, Thanks TonyBallioni. Option 1: Let me get the disambiguation page ready first and then get it checked from you? or Option 2: We build a new SECU (of an XYZ state) page to support this? Do you think, if we can open a discussion thread under the talk section of NC SECU with regard to this? So that people from other states can join in. -Hatchens (talk) 05:16, 19 July 2020 (UTC)

I don’t really think a disambiguation page is needed. NCSECU is arguably the most significant entity of this type, and we don’t have any other articles on similar organizations in other states. You could start an WP:RM on the talk, but like I said, you’d need to establish that it wasn’t the primary topic, which I think would be hard since this is the second largest natural member credit union in the US. By that alone it has a very strong claim to primary topic status for this name. TonyBallioni (talk)<

@TonyBallioni, Thank you once again for providing the clarity. I just did a quick wiki search. Can you look at these; S.C. State Credit Union and Washington State Employees Credit Union - both of them quite similar to NC SECU (State Employees Credit Union). If we do create a disambiguation page, then I guess it's possible to club all these three articles (including NC SECU) as all of them are governed by the mandates provided by National Credit Union Administration. And, also in due course of time, someone can/may build pages for SECU New Mexico, SECU California, SECU Maryland and club them together (in future). Just a thought from my end. Kindly advise. -Hatchens (talk) 06:26, 19 July 2020 (UTC)

Notice of noticeboard discussion

There is currently a discussion at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you. Randfiskin (talk) 09:52, 29 July 2020 (UTC)

Dear Randfiskin, Thank you for tagging me. I will keep myself updated with respect to ongoing discussion at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard. -Hatchens (talk) 12:52, 29 July 2020 (UTC)

deletion of Page Diwakar Bhattarai

My page was deleted under No third-party WP:RS available. But, Their are references in google that proves the genuinely of the person background.I request for re-evaluation or any suggestions i can get for approving the page.--Hellone69 (talk) 04:26, 31 July 2020 (UTC)

Note

Hi Hatchens. To avoid issues of outing, in general I would avoid posting external links to the social media profiles of other users on Wikipedia, even if their username resembles their real name. If it is not possible to make your case without this kind of off-wiki information, I recommend instead emailing a functionary, e.g. via the OTRS queue paid-en-wpwikipedia.org or via Special:EmailUser. Thanks, Mz7 (talk) 18:49, 10 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you Mz7. I have noted down your information and will follow the same. -Hatchens (talk) 02:51, 11 August 2020 (UTC)

Twinkle is a very useful tool

You should, if you have not already, implment it. I think it is a gadget. It allows you, once you have sufficent evidence to support any suspicions, initiate many things including sock puppet investigationsm wanring editors, reporting vandals, tagging articles and so much else.

As an aside, sockpuppetry discovery is an arcane art, best initiated with good evidence by the ordinary editor, evidence presented as (eg) diffs, and then left to the gang who handle these matters. The investigations happen at their own pace. With evidence one is not criticised, even of one is in error. Without evidence one may be subject to criticism after a couple of misses. Ticking the boxes for checkuer and notification of users is a choice I have never quite got used to. I choose not to notify estalblished sock farms, and to toss a coin for others. Checkuser will never lknk IP addresses to user names. In simple cases where WP:DUCK applies I don't ask, especially if the duck is quacking into a megaphone. IN mire complex cases I tend to tick it, or to sugget in my report that thsi be left to the clerk's discretion

Twinkle can do big and powerful things, so one can get one's self into trouble. Make sure you cean up your own messes!

I trust that answers your question Fiddle Faddle 14:04, 15 August 2020 (UTC)

Pardon the talk-page-stalk, but, just wanted to chime in to say that I totally agree with this note. I recently started using Twinkle and it is has totally transformed some house-keeping actions. I use it primarily to mend disruptive edits and post warnings and such. Have not used it for sockpuppetry etc., since, I think that requires some additional investigation effort, that I have not been able to invest. But, the tool is just beautiful for housekeeping.

Also, agree about potentially being powerful - have been super cautious about that one for the fear of doing something that can get me into trouble. Cheers and Goodluck. Ktin

Btw, I see that all three of us are already using reply-link, I just picked that up very recently, and that has made a few things very comfortable too. Just that the script misbehaves every so-often (failed replies, garbled indentation). Not sure if you folks have seen that. Otherwise great! (talk) 15:16, 15 August 2020 (UTC)

Ktin, reply link sometimes falters Fiddle Faddle 15:34, 15 August 2020 (UTC)

Timtrent, Yes, I do use Twinkle and the RedWarn also. But, I have mostly used it for AfDs and tagging articles. I'm not comfortable with giving warnings to editors because I still need to read and learn Wikipedia rules and regulations. Besides that, I have burned my finger once at this page - Guhathakurta family of Barisal. A newbie/UPE suspect - Arnab2305 (now known as Mahakaal2003) moved this article without reaching a general consensus. So, he complained about me to an admin and he later warned me with a block. I just backed off. - Hatchens (talk) 15:38, 15 August 2020 (UTC)

Redwarn allows a great dal of power. There are often discussions about editors who have gone too far with it. I think the scope for making errors is greater. I have never fond the need to deploy it. But I have been here since the age of steam Fiddle Faddle 15:44, 15 August 2020 (UTC)

Timtrent, now you know how cautiously I work. hehehehe. With power, there comes great responsibility. - Hatchens (talk) 15:46, 15 August 2020 (UTC)

Talk page archival

Since you are relatively new here, I thought you might like to see how one can, if one chooses, set up talk page archival, which you wil wish for since I suspect your talk mage will become unwieldy

<!-- Start of archiving code -->
{{User:MiszaBot/config
|archiveheader = {{talk archive navigation}} <!-- template put on the top of archive pages by the bot -->
|maxarchivesize = 100K
|counter = 1
|minthreadsleft = 0
|minthreadstoarchive = 1
|algo = old(7d)
|archive = User talk:Hatchens/Archive %(counter)d
}}
<!-- End of archiving code -->

will set up archiving for you. Counter is for the archive sub-page, which it will create automagically for you if you deploy the code. It archives any conversation which has more than seven days idleness (yoi can change the value). It wil open new archives itself when required.

<!-- Start of archiving box with list of archives -->
{{archives|search=yes|bot= ‎Lowercase sigmabot III|age=7|auto=short}}
<!-- End of archiving box with list of archives -->

puts an archive index and search box on the talk page. Until the first archive run there is a red 'create' button there, whch you can ignore and trust the scheme. You can see them hiding in the source code on my talk page and many other editors' pages. It also works for articles, but consensus is required for a busy article talk page. Ignore the apparent discrepancy between Miszabit and Lower case Sigmabot! Fiddle Faddle 15:59, 15 August 2020 (UTC)

Timtrent, yeah, I'm game for it. Could you help with deploying it? - Hatchens (talk) 16:02, 15 August 2020 (UTC)

Hatchens, Since I have your permission I will do this for you. You will see what I have done in page history in a couple of minutes Fiddle Faddle 16:03, 15 August 2020 (UTC)

Timtrent, Cooool! :-) - Hatchens (talk) 16:05, 15 August 2020 (UTC)

 Done Fiddle Faddle 16:07, 15 August 2020 (UTC)

Timtrent, Thank you so much! It means a lot. It would be easy for everyone to trace up things. - Hatchens (talk) 16:11, 15 August 2020 (UTC)

Hatchens, I am a firm believer in total transparency, for good things and less good things. Nothing is ever lost in the page history, yet archiving is a gesture of good faith Fiddle Faddle 16:12, 15 August 2020 (UTC)

Non COI and Non Paid-Edit Self-Certification

Hi there,

I recently saw paid edit banners on two of the articles created by me Mark Vanhoenacker and Skyfaring: A Journey with a Pilot‎. My self-certification post is still on my User page and Talk Page per our earlier exchange for CB Insights.

In specific, I wish to self-certify that:

• I have no conflict of interest with these topics that I edit on, including these two articles.
• Furthermore, I am not paid for any of my online actions including any of my Wikipedia edits, including any of these two articles.

Ktin (talk) 16:31, 15 August 2020 (UTC)

Your e-mail

Hi, I do not communicate off-wiki. Please contact me on my talk page if you need my help. Sandstein 16:28, 15 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi Sandstein, first of all, thank you for your support at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Cyber Peace Foundation (CPF). The creator of the article (Randfiskin) has created two more articles - 1) Vogue Institute of Art & Design - (AfD discussion is ON) and 2) V-NOVA (AfD is closed). I have a serious doubt that this particular ID is involved in WP:UPE. Since the day when his/her ID was blocked... after putting an allegation against me at WP:ANI. He/she has abandoned his ID. No more edits have been performed since August 1, 2020. Your wise counsel is required in this matter. - Hatchens (talk) 16:33, 15 August 2020 (UTC)

Hatchens, if the user remains inactive, I don't see any grounds or need for action. If they resume editing, and do so in a promotional manner, you can call administrators' attention to the matter at WP:ANI. Sandstein 16:40, 15 August 2020 (UTC)

Sandstein, thank you. I will do as per your advice. - Hatchens (talk) 16:50, 15 August 2020 (UTC)

Baseless aspersions of paid editing

Why are you accusing long-term editors of being paid editors without any evidence? Doc James (talk · contribs), have you seen how these accusations are flying around? Because stuff like this makes me inclined to stop editing after 13 years. Sandstein (talk · contribs), is this just normal for Wikipedia now? CC Ktin (talk · contribs) II | (t - c) 11:22, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you ImperfectlyInformed for reaching out. I apologize for the inconvenience. I understand you are angry at me. Please feel free to report at WP:ANI. I'll meet you there. -Hatchens (talk) 12:30, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Please explain what you think about WP:ASPERSIONS first. Do you agree with this finding from ArbCom?

An editor must not accuse another of misbehavior without evidence, especially when the accusations are repeated or severe. This especially applies to accusations of being paid by a company to promote a point of view (i.e., a shill) or similar associations and using that to attack or cast doubt over the editor in content disputes. If accusations must be made, they should be raised, with evidence, at appropriate forums such as the user talk page, WP:COIN, or other appropriate places per WP:COI. Editors are however reminded that Wikipedia places importance on the ability of editors to edit pseudonymously. When investigating COI editing, the policy against harassment takes precedence; it requires that Wikipedians must take care not to reveal the identity of editors against their wishes. Instead, examine editors' behavior and refer to Wikipedia:Checkuser.

Passed 10 to 1 at 19:04, 12 December 2015 (UTC) II | (t - c) 13:20, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

ImperfectlyInformed, dude, are you ok?. Please report me at WP:ANI as you have suggested earlier and put all your complaints (against me) there. I promise I'll reply. Hatchens (talk) 13:44, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

No, ANI is for "This page is for discussion of urgent incidents and chronic, intractable behavioral problems". I'm still learning if this is intractable. If you continue to violate Wikipedia's core policies over a sustained period, I will report you to ANI. But it's important that I give you a chance to redeem yourself and accept Wikipedia's core policies. Do you agree with Arbom's findings that "accusations of being paid by a company to promote a point of view (i.e., a shill) or similar associations and using that to attack or cast doubt over the editor in content disputes. If accusations must be made, they should be raised, with evidence, at appropriate forums such as the user talk page, WP:COIN, or other appropriate places per WP:COI", and that you violated that by accusing me of being a paid shill w/o evidence in your AfD nom? II | (t - c) 13:48, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

ImperfectlyInformed, Ok, so now I am not being taken to WP:ANI? Oh Lord! (Sigh). You just broke my heart. And, you giving me a chance to redeem? Aah, so nice of you. But, I guess I let it pass this time. As far as, whatever I need to agree or disagree is a concern, either I'll do it at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/BlueFocus Communication Group or at WP:ANI. So, let's meet either of the two places. Shall we? Hatchens (talk) 13:59, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Snark about your wild accusations of being paid shills to everyone who constructively edits or creates articles is just further ammunition if/when this does end up at ANI. Sounds like you don't think you need evidence to run around baselessly calling people paid shills? That's your final answer? II | (t - c) 14:02, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

ANI notice

There is currently a discussion at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you. See Wikipedia:Administrators'_noticeboard/Incidents#Baseless_aspersions_of_paid_editing_by_User:Hatchens II | (t - c) 14:26, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

ImperfectlyInformed, Thank you. I'll be there. - Hatchens (talk) 15:01, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

I have a firm suggestion for you

You have arrived at AN/I pretty determinedly. You insisted on being taken there. My firm suggestion is for you to make a credible and real statement that you understand that the behaviour that got you there is inappropriate and commit to removing that behaviour from your repertoire. Having made your statement, stop arguing, and prove by your actions that the behaviour has ceased. You should have done this at once, when challenged. Suicide by AN/I is a pretty poor way to go. Suicide by Arbcom is even bloodier. Fiddle Faddle 15:10, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Timtrent, Yes sir! I got it. Either I will survive or I will die. But, if we abruptly close it, then we will never able to find other IDs involved in this UPE thing. Trust me. I'll not disappoint you. - Hatchens (talk) 15:16, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

I suggest you neither "survive nor die", but surrender with good grace. Your crusade at AN/I is not one you can win. All you can do is choose to lose well and mend fences Fiddle Faddle 15:27, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Timtrent, Yes Sir. I got it! Hatchens (talk) 15:30, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

A couple of reference analysis templates will help

Where Ihave an AfD to propose, or an AFC draft to decline where I perceive that there may be a reaction different from a purely objective analysis I find these templates useful. {{Source assess table}} and {{Source assess}} because they concentrate my mind first on whether to nominate/decline at all, and second on how to inform the discussion. They create a useful datum, and can be deployed at AfD. I have done so in awkward cases, so far only as nominator.

They do take effort, and there is a script if you prefer. I use steam power and hand cranking. I was trying to find an example of where I;ve used it recently, but my memory has failed Fiddle Faddle 11:48, 14 August 2020 (UTC)

Timtrent, I have seen the deployment of these tables in a couple of AfDs. But, I was not aware of how to use it "contextually". But, now I'm definitely going to give a try to it to bring in more clarity. Thank you so much for helping me out. - Hatchens (talk) 11:52, 14 August 2020 (UTC)

I have an incorrect draft at User:Timtrent/sandbox. Incorrect because Times of India entertainment pages are NOT reliable. I modified the final version.

When I use it I always refer to the permalink I have analysed. Fiddle Faddle 12:04, 14 August 2020 (UTC)

Got one: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Bader Samir Tayeb Al Awadhi where it is very effective Fiddle Faddle 12:52, 14 August 2020 (UTC)

Timtrent, yes, you got one. That's what I was trying to recall. I told ya, saw the deployment of these kinda tables. Let me refer to your User:Timtrent/sandbox and this Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Bader_Samir_Tayeb_Al_Awadhi. Now, definitely I am gonna use it. Thank you once again. This is a great help. - Hatchens (talk) 12:58, 14 August 2020 (UTC)

Only use them where you just KNOW there's going to be trouble, or they get devalued Fiddle Faddle 13:01, 14 August 2020 (UTC)

Timtrent, Ok! got it. According to my editing history, I always end up with troubles. LMAO. - Hatchens (talk) 13:15, 14 August 2020 (UTC)

I'm interested in this rich seam of beverage merchants you are mining. I suspect UPE very strongly and have passed my suspicions to a great editor team who check that stuff out. I've also warned the editor concerned who seems to have been here longer then I have, but has made very very few edits until recently Fiddle Faddle 14:04, 14 August 2020 (UTC)

Timtrent, Thank you for appreciating my effort. It means a lot. I started Wiki editing with one and only one intent... get these people out WP:UPE. Of course, my effort is like a drop in the ocean. But, I have to do it for the sake of young minds who come and read these pages and derive a certain notion. What if those notions are incorrect and bad for our society?

Frankly speaking, I'm not at all interested in creating any new article because Wikipedia is already has a lot of articles in the first place. All we need to do is... structure them, detect the anomalies - if there is any, then take a call for an AfD. So, a democratic process kicks in and general consensus is reached. And, for all this, I do need support from a seasoned editor like you and other "great editor team". I'm human, and bound to make mistakes. But, I'm sure, will not repeat those. - Hatchens (talk) 14:52, 14 August 2020 (UTC)

I only create articles when the fancy takes me. I work mostly in AFC nowadays, and a find I have some skill in mediating in disputes.

Do create the occasional article, edit a few others. It gives editors humility to be able to do this. We all need humility

UPE at present seems to be Nigeria and the Asian sub-continent in the main. Fiddle Faddle 15:12, 14 August 2020 (UTC)

I did 3 articles to date. But, I guess...You're right. I will surely go for some in the near future. Let's see what excites me. And yes, humility is must. But, I guess, I am used to be insulted over here. LOL.

As far as the WP:UPE is a concern, IDs from Nigeria are very easy to tackle because of their poor language and editing skills. But, the IDs from South Asian Subcontinent - especially India and Bangladesh are actually in my focus. They are not just editing Indian/subcontinent subjects or entities... they are often found to be editing American and European entities with expertise in using the existing grey areas of WP:GNG, WP:RS, and WP:VERIFY. If you dealing these subcontinent people, please do note - they have two sets of reactions - 1) Either, they will point you as the villain of their lives, do some sob story and call out some senior editor or admin or 2) they will go full ballistic and start showing off their knowledge with regards to Wikipedia guidelines in a very aggressive manner. And, we all know these rules can always be interpreted in multiple ways. It always depends on what perspective you are taking into consideration. So, I do consider this as a learning. Let see how long I can survive the onslaught. - Hatchens (talk) 15:30, 14 August 2020 (UTC) - Recusing myself from this particular statement which might have hurt the sentiments of others. I apologize for that. For more details on this, kindly visit WP:ANI discussion. -Hatchens (talk) 06:03, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Hatchens, The trick is knowing when to ask for help from someone with a bigger hammer, and then to bow out gracefully on a personal level. One of the latter type just went straight to Arbcom. Imagine how successful that was! Fiddle Faddle 15:33, 14 August 2020 (UTC)

Timtrent, In my case, when that latter type (User:Randfiskin) went to WP:ANB - it was quite helpful for me. I got decent support from the admins over there. Eventually, the ID got blocked for couple of days, and the funny part was ... This particular ID didn't come online or did any edit for 2 weeks. And, if you look at it... I guess the it has been abandoned for the time being. This proves how nefarious these people are in their wiki activities. - Hatchens (talk) 15:43, 14 August 2020 (UTC)

It proves... something. We are duty bound to take at face value all assertions made by an editor, but we are also entitled to push them on their assertions and make correct criticisms of behaviour without ad hominem criticism. I have just taken an assertion at face value because it was freely made.

I also choose not to wear admin goggles. This means I cannot block someone and be accused of misuse of powers. I choose never to be an admin Fiddle Faddle 15:56, 14 August 2020 (UTC)

Timtrent, Whatever comes for free, just take it. LOL. I think I will follow your path - just be the foot soldier, but an effective one. But, yes, it's indeed an honor to be interacting with you and learning from your experiences. - Hatchens (talk) 16:13, 14 August 2020 (UTC)

I'm sure I am unworthy of it being an honour, but I shall accept the compliment. This short essay presents my own reasons for not wishing to have a mop and bucket. Yours will be different Fiddle Faddle 16:17, 14 August 2020 (UTC)

Timtrent, Amazing read. I will come back with a subject/topic to write upon. Let me work out something with AfC. Mine (essay) will be - Hatchens The Terminator; the funniest read you will ever have. - Hatchens (talk) 16:36, 14 August 2020 (UTC)

I imagine you are watching Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Ravi Venkatesan. I have deployed the templates there. I am not sure the creating editor quite understands how to assess references Fiddle Faddle 18:59, 14 August 2020 (UTC)

Timtrent, yes, I can see that. I am going to keep a copy of this template along with others that you have shared with me earlier. Interesting it is because it lends a different perspective altogether. - Hatchens (talk) 02:44, 15 August 2020 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Kraglin (September 13)

Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed! Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reasons left by AngusWOOF were:  The comment the reviewer left was: Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit when they have been resolved.

• If you would like to continue working on the submission, go to Draft:Kraglin and click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window.
• If you now believe the draft cannot meet Wikipedia's standards or do not wish to progress it further, you may request deletion. Please go to Draft:Kraglin, click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window, add "{{Db-g7}}" at the top of the draft text and click the blue "publish changes" button to save this edit.
• If you do not make any further changes to your draft, in 6 months, it will be considered abandoned and may be deleted.
• If you need any assistance, you can ask for help at the Articles for creation help desk, on the reviewer's talk page or use Wikipedia's real-time chat help from experienced editors.

AngusWOOF (bark • sniff) 18:40, 13 September 2020 (UTC)

Hello, Hatchens! Having an article declined at Articles for Creation can be disappointing. If you are wondering why your article submission was declined, please post a question at the Articles for creation help desk. If you have any other questions about your editing experience, we'd love to help you at the Teahouse, a friendly space on Wikipedia where experienced editors lend a hand to help new editors like yourself! See you there! AngusWOOF (bark • sniff) 18:40, 13 September 2020 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for September 14

An automated process has detected that when you recently edited Marek Kohn, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page British.

(Opt-out instructions.) --DPL bot (talk) 07:09, 14 September 2020 (UTC)

DPL bot, oopsy. my mistake (once again). Rectified! - Hatchens (talk) 15:39, 14 September 2020 (UTC)

North Carolina?

Just wanted to let you know that I reverted a change (by Pplarge4) that you approved in Pending Changes. (He changed some numbers by a small amount; bored school-kid vandalism...) — UncleBubba ^{( T @ C )} 20:16, 15 September 2020 (UTC)

UncleBubba, perfectly fine bro. thanks for stepping in and helping out. - Hatchens (talk) 02:49, 16 September 2020 (UTC)

good work

I like the direction your editing is taking Fiddle Faddle 04:56, 5 October 2020 (UTC)

Timtrent, thanks a ton for motivating me and putting your trust in me... in the first place. I'm trying to create articles for historical buildings/demolished historical buildings, authors/filmmakers from the 1930-1960 era, state institutions/closed-down state institutions. I will slowly try my hands on other subjects. Thank you once again. - Hatchens (talk) 05:56, 5 October 2020 (UTC)

Keep it up. As you gain exposure to the weird ways of Wikipedia please consider joining the AFC review team. Don't rush to join because it really does need time served to gain enough expertise, but keep it in the back of your mind as a good task to perform. Fiddle Faddle 10:19, 5 October 2020 (UTC)

Timtrent, sure. AFC review team - I'll keep that on my list. And, I guess you are right... I still need to spend a good amount of time to develop a certain level of expertise. I will again get my work reviewed by you once I complete 25 wiki articles and for that, I need 6 to 9 months. Thank you once again. - Hatchens (talk) 15:00, 5 October 2020 (UTC)

I think you'll do just fine. Wikipedia can be a very difficult place, or it can be easy.

I learned years ago to step away from conflict. Things can be resolved in a wholly non urgent manner.

I create article now only when the fancy takes me, or if I find a challenge. I don't need them to be perfect, I just need them in a state where others will pick them up and run with them.

I managed a DYK form a couple, Edward Upcott and Keith White (yachtsman). I was pleasantly surprised by that, but each had something that stood out. Fiddle Faddle 16:10, 5 October 2020 (UTC)

Timtrent, lessoned learned. I joined Wikipedia during the lockdown to add some value to it. But, I guess... I was very much naive. In the last 7 months, I got seasoned. I'm always going to be thankful to you for giving a direction to my efforts. I checked both the pages which you have shared - your "fancy" works. hehehe.- Hatchens (talk) 16:54, 5 October 2020 (UTC)

Hatchens, try for a DYK or two. It's an exacting process. Pay any benefit you feel you have received from me forwards, here or in real life Fiddle Faddle 19:00, 5 October 2020 (UTC)

Timtrent, ok.. but to choose a DYK subject/entity or anything hook(able) with an article to make it a DYK article... is quite overwhelming but surely I'm gonna give a try to it. I'm reading Wikipedia:Did_you_know doc. Thank you for introducing to this. - Hatchens (talk) 05:51, 6 October 2020 (UTC)

George D. Sidman

Hi @Hatchens:. I have fixed that article up, adding several secondary references. Thanks for posting that message. I'd found a couple of sources in Google Books and knew it could be updated. I'd completely forgotten about it and would have missed it, otherwise. I think it important that the work was done. scope_creep^Talk 08:31, 18 October 2020 (UTC)

Scope creep, Thanks to you for working on this article. I strongly felt that the person should have got due respect at Wikipedia. But, I am not an expert on American Civil War-era entities... at the first place. So, I thought tagging you would be the only best possible option to revive it (if there was any chance). - Hatchens (talk) 12:34, 18 October 2020 (UTC)

I'm not American, I'm Scottish, so I don't know much about the American civil war but there was plenty of coverage on the guy and particularly since he was so young. Its better looking now. scope_creep^Talk 12:55, 18 October 2020 (UTC)

Scope creep, count me in! I will assist you... for this article and others. - Hatchens (talk) 13:11, 18 October 2020 (UTC)

I don't intend to do any more to this article, but I'm working on other articles that always need help on. scope_creep^Talk 14:38, 18 October 2020 (UTC)

Scope creep, I'm now following your user-page and will keep a tab on your list of work which needs quick attention. - Hatchens (talk) 16:23, 18 October 2020 (UTC)

AFC

I was surprised to see someone had accepted an article that more than qualified for deletion as a BLP violation. Please be more cautious and read WP:BLP, WP:NPOV and WP:RS. Notability was dubious at best but it was written so badly and in a tone that insinuated someone was a convicted serial killer that very clearly hasn't been convicted, nor are they on trial (and the article even said as much at the time you accepted it.) In addition, the article was nothing more than WP:SYNTH/WP:NOR. So again, I ask you be more diligent about checking sources and content before actually moving content to mainspace. Thanks, Praxidicae (talk) 15:34, 27 October 2020 (UTC)

Praxidicae, Thank you. I will be more diligent in dealing with such topics (any topic) in AfC. In the meanwhile, I will refrain from moving any "content" to mainspace, till I get my fundamentals sorted. - Hatchens (talk) 15:31, 28 October 2020 (UTC)

MyGate

Hi Hatchens, Could you please explain which part of the article sounds promotional? I will try to rewrite in a more neutral tone or remove them all. Thanks.Loveneeth (talk) 11:57, 22 October 2020 (UTC)

Loveneeth, sorry for the late reply. You need to expand the article with credible third-party citations WP:RS, strengthening its position as per WP:SIGCOV. These rules do overlap and they do complement each other. - Hatchens (talk) 03:33, 24 October 2020 (UTC)

Thanks for your feedback and suggestions Hatchens. I have expanded the article adding more citations as you advised. They are all third party, reliable sources with indepth sigcov.--Loveneeth (talk) 08:58, 28 October 2020 (UTC)

Loveneeth, If you think the draft is ready, then feel free to submit it for a review. There would be other editors to look into your submission. All the best. - Hatchens (talk) 16:02, 28 October 2020 (UTC)

Hi Hatchens, thanks for your response. I have submitted the draft for review as you stated and added more citations that are secondary, reliable and cover the company in detail. I would really appreciate it if you take out a few minutes of your time to review it. Thanks for all your help and suggestions.Loveneeth (talk) 07:22, 29 October 2020 (UTC)

Loveneeth, I reviewed your page... once. For an unbiased outcome, I wish other reviewers to participate. Please keep patience. - Hatchens (talk) 15:04, 29 October 2020 (UTC)

CPIR, Goa

Hi Hatchens, We in Goa -- the smallest state in India -- are trying real hard to document aspects of local life, including institutions here. There can sometimes seem to be some systemic bias against smaller, mainly-oral societies, which lack sufficient written and digitised citations to justify the prominence of local institutions, even if these have played a significant role in the area. The Centre for Post-Graduate Research and Instruction, has had its space in the life of a few thousand post-graduate students here, between the early 1960s and 1985. Like in most 'Third World' societies, it is very challenging to find online (and even print) sources about most issues here; this is because the place is largely an oral society and is being written about more seriously and digitised only in recent times. Seeking your help in allowing this page (very little information available otherwise about it in one place) see the light of day. fredericknoronha (talk) 16:59, 5 November 2020 (UTC)

PS: I feel it would not quite work to merge this page into the Goa University page, as these have been two very separate and distinct institutions, even though one takes off where the other left. The CPIR does have issues and specificity of its own, which could distract attention from the other, and vice versa.

Dear Fredericknoronha, Thank you for reaching out. I have gone through the CPIR Goa's draft and your reasoning. I really appreciate your zeal. But, here I put up my views; Since, CPIR Goa, as you have rightly mentioned, is the genesis of Goa University. (Fact verified)... I would recommend you to expand the "History" segment of the university and later create a redirected page for CPIR Goa leading it to Goa University. Currently, except for the University website, there are no credible third-party mentioning of CPIR Goa. That's why I would not advise an independent page for it. If you still not satisfied with my views, then I would be happy to recommend your case to a senior editor for having a look at it. He/she... might help. - Hatchens (talk) 03:44, 6 November 2020 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Special Barnstar
	Thank you for helping resolve a situation, teaching me something new and improving an article at the same time! Prolix 💬 14:11, 6 November 2020 (UTC)

Draft Pratik Gauri

Mind specifying how you find this so promotional that you declined it? I don't find it promotional at all. You stated sources do not show significant coverage? You mean articles like [1][2][3][4] which cover him directly and in detail and published by sources like Statesmen, Entrepreneur, International business times, and Dainik Bhaskar do not count as significant coverage? Please double check, there could probably be no sources better than those as they are all secondary reliable sources and talk about the subject in detail. Thank you.ShaiksKings (talk) 12:03, 9 November 2020 (UTC)

ShaiksKings, The links which you have highlighted... are "sponsored articles" written by "news desks" (i.e, not by "staff writers"). For better clarity, read WP:SPONSORED. No further checks required. Thank you. - Hatchens (talk) 16:28, 9 November 2020 (UTC)

I don't understand how you find the article so promotional that you even nominated it for Speedy deletion under G11. You really need to elaborate on how it reads like an advertisement and how the sources I have added to the article are sposored articles. Statesman, IBT, Dainik Bhaskar, and Entrepreneur are some of the well known news outlets and there are more sources available online about the subject. You're seriously claiming Entrepreneur article which was written by a staff, IBT, Dainik Bhaskar, Statesman to be sponsored articles. These articles were posted by their staffs and almost 90% of the articles are published in the same manner in India. I would request you to reconsider your decisions. Thanks.ShaiksKings (talk) 11:26, 11 November 2020 (UTC)

ShaiksKings, kindly read my earlier comment. And, proceed accordingly. - Hatchens (talk) 05:03, 17 November 2020 (UTC)

Request on 13:01:17, 19 November 2020 for assistance on AfC submission by Haronte

• Haronte (talk · contribs)
  • User:Haronte (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

I have finished writing an article on wikipedia, my first one actually and after submitting for review, i got a notification minutes later that the article had copyrighted text, now i dont understand which text specifically or which content is copyrighted i need help on which item on the article is copyrighted because ive checked the images and they are okay, please help Haronte (talk) 13:01, 19 November 2020 (UTC)

Hi Haronte, Sure... I will help you with this. First, remove all the copyrighted text from the draft (Draft:Alupe_University_College) and write the whole article in your own words. Once you are done with it, just ping me here. I will jump in. - Hatchens (talk) 13:21, 19 November 2020 (UTC)

Request on 14:39:00, 19 November 2020 for assistance on AfC submission by Haronte

• Haronte (talk · contribs)
  • User:Haronte (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

Submitted my article for a second review. Please help me understand the specific, for instance please cite the exact content that requires correction if there is one. It really helps because general feedbacks are hard to decipher Haronte (talk) 14:39, 19 November 2020 (UTC)

"Parichay" and future editing

Hi Hatchens, I would like to thank you for pointing out that my editing may be considered as vandalism, it is a serious accusation and as you clearly are a more experienced editor I concur that this may really have some merit, however I would like to tell you that, it was never my intention. I am here to build an Wikipedia not to vandilate. I request you to please elaborate further as to how they might be considered as acts of vandalism and what should I do to be able to edit the Wikipedia more responsibly in the future. Also is editing Wikipedia randomly is a bad thing.Ankit (Talk with me) 10:46, 20 November 2020 (UTC)

Ankit2299, being random is not bad at all. But, not following certain processes/approaches... then it's definitely bad... but again, we all are human. In the beginning, even I made mistakes and was guided by some of the best senior editors such as Timtrent. My first advice for you would be, go through these guidelines; WP:AFDEQ, and WP:VD. At the same time, do study one of my past mistakes/learnings. On Wikipedia, there is always a fine-line difference between knowing and not knowing. Some guidelines are extremely dicey and overlapping. So, in the end, nobody is right or wrong. All you have to keep in mind, a consensus has to be generated by all means. - Hatchens (talk) 03:35, 21 November 2020 (UTC)

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Concern

Why have you reviewed Draft:MyGate again? Had you not stated to me, that you were going to be leaving it to another reviewer to review it for an unbiased outcome? then why did you review the page again and keep declining for being promotional?

Were you not the one who had advised me to expand the page and add more sources when you first reviewed this page? I did as you stated (reworked on the entire page and added more references) even though there were already over seventeen references in the draft (previous version) which were more than enough for one to determine notability of this entity and the page was also meeting the NPOV.

When all was said and done, you refused to look at it agian stating would leave it for someone else to review. And I see, on 9 November, you again declined the page and I could not comprehend what do you want to convey by saying "A desperate attempt to push this entity as a relevant one". Did i force you to review my draft? Please also explain where it reads like an advertisement?Loveneeth (talk) 11:22, 16 November 2020 (UTC)

Dear Loveneeth, you may have executed some edits but it didn't enhance the page to the level of having any encyclopedic value. Your assertion and your edit history pointing it towards WP:SPA scenario. If you have issues with my judgment call, then I can recommend your Draft:MyGate to a more experienced editor (or admin). - Hatchens (talk) 05:01, 17 November 2020 (UTC)

I did not get a satisfactory answer to any of the questions I posed above which is fine. Its your choice whether you want to answer or not. While I appreciate your time and effort in reviewing this page i am not satisfied with your assessment and would request you to leave it for a more experienced editor. I have no idea what you look for in an article. I just took a closer look at the general notability guidelines and NPOV and this article lives up to Wikipedia standards. Anyways, thanks a lot for your review and have a nice day.Loveneeth (talk) 11:14, 17 November 2020 (UTC)

Dear Prolix, I need a bit of help with respect to this company's draft (Draft:MyGate). Since it's an Indian company and you have an expertise in it. Could you assist in validating? -Hatchens (talk) 12:39, 17 November 2020 (UTC)

Hi Hatchens, from what I've just read about the Mygate app it certainly meets WP:SIGCOV. The COI concerns notwithstanding, the article seems reasonably well written now and has enough citations in my opinion. However, I feel it needs a little bit of clean-up to ensure that no promotional language remains before draft re-submission. Always better to err on the side of caution when it comes to disclosed paid-editing. Prolix 💬 15:25, 17 November 2020 (UTC)

Prolix, Thanks, man! You're a savior. I would rather leave this draft to some more experienced editor(s) for the time being. If no concrete results come out, then only I will jump in and try to enhance the page and accept the draft. - Hatchens (talk) 15:41, 17 November 2020 (UTC)

Hatchens, I agree. Do let me know what happens, I'll be happy to help out with the copyediting. Prolix 💬 17:06, 17 November 2020 (UTC)

Thank you Prolix. When it comes to India-related pages... I got to depend on you. - Hatchens (talk) 02:54, 18 November 2020 (UTC)

Hatchens, glad to be of assistance :D Prolix 💬 07:27, 18 November 2020 (UTC)

Thanks Prolix for all your help and feedback. What do I do next? Will I need to submit the draft again? Prolix, I will really appreciate it if you help me edit out promotional material. Thanks again for your time and effort in reviwieing this draft.🙂Loveneeth (talk) 12:16, 18 November 2020 (UTC)

Loveneeth, before re-submitting try and flesh the article out as much as possible. The more content you add, the better. To alleviate any concerns of bias add a controversy/criticism section to the article, if the app is indeed notable there will no doubt be some sort of criticism. I'll try and copyedit when possible. Prolix 💬 13:18, 18 November 2020 (UTC)

Thanks a lot for your suggestions @Prolix:🙂. I have added more information on how it came into being and also added more sources to back it up. Was wondering if you could take out some time to have a look at it before I resubmit it for review. Please feel free to copyedit if you think it needs it. Thanks once again for your time and effort.Loveneeth (talk) 12:02, 19 November 2020 (UTC)

Hi Hatchens, I think I have expanded the article enough and added more citations from reliable sources. I am going to be submitting it for a third review. As Prolix also stated the article is reasonably well written and passes WP:SIGCOV, will you please review and approve it? Please feel free to copyedit if you think it needs it. Thanks.Loveneeth (talk) 16:02, 21 November 2020 (UTC)

Loveneeth, I'm still not satisfied with your approach. Your account is pure WP:SPA and you yourself have declared that you been paid by the company to draft its page. On top of that, I'm still not convinced with entity's encylopedic value. You are not enhancing the page because you have nothing more to add to it. Now, I have to refer your page to a much senior editor Timtrent. - Hatchens (talk) 07:16, 22 November 2020 (UTC)

I am not satisfied with your decline reasons either. The only reason I approached you this time was because you yourself had stated in your previous comment that you would try enhancing the page and would possibly re-review it and that's what I was requesting you to do. You keep insisting me to expand the page. Creating a lengthy article is not a criteria of notability. I could have added a lot more information to the page as there are tons of sources available but I don't want to make it look promotional and just making sure it meets npov. If you're having trouble identifying the sources, better leave it for a senior editor. I won't text you again. Good bye.Loveneeth (talk) 10:33, 22 November 2020 (UTC)

Dear Loveneeth, I'm not talking about drafting a lengthy article. A senior editor has already taken call on your draft. However, please do read my comments once again and get back to me if you need any help in future. - Hatchens (talk) 13:31, 22 November 2020 (UTC)

Hatchens, I'm not senior, you know. What would you like me to achieve here?

What I would do normally is to add {{connected contributor (paid)}} to the article's talk page if the editor has declared that they are paid, referring to that declaration.

I'm only here casually right now. Real life has intervened. I'm renovating an 18th century cottage I just bought Fiddle Faddle 10:13, 23 November 2020 (UTC)

Thanks Timtrent, sorry for the late reply. Your advice was eventually followed by approving reviewers.

Congratulations on the "new rig". Sending your healthy reiki from my end. - Hatchens (talk) 02:13, 27 November 2020 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Suhail Dabbach (November 30)

Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed! Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reason left by Dan arndt was:  The comment the reviewer left was: Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit when they have been resolved.

• If you would like to continue working on the submission, go to Draft:Suhail Dabbach and click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window.
• If you now believe the draft cannot meet Wikipedia's standards or do not wish to progress it further, you may request deletion. Please go to Draft:Suhail Dabbach, click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window, add "{{Db-g7}}" at the top of the draft text and click the blue "publish changes" button to save this edit.
• If you do not make any further changes to your draft, in 6 months, it will be considered abandoned and may be deleted.
• If you need any assistance, or have experienced any untoward behavior associated with this submission, you can ask for help at the Articles for creation help desk, on the reviewer's talk page or use Wikipedia's real-time chat help from experienced editors.

Dan arndt (talk) 06:03, 30 November 2020 (UTC)

Thanks Dan arndt, I accept and appreciate your call. Let this draft evolve with time. Cheers! - Hatchens (talk) 06:06, 30 November 2020 (UTC)

Hello, Hatchens! Having an article declined at Articles for Creation can be disappointing. If you are wondering why your article submission was declined, please post a question at the Articles for creation help desk. If you have any other questions about your editing experience, we'd love to help you at the Teahouse, a friendly space on Wikipedia where experienced editors lend a hand to help new editors like yourself! See you there! Dan arndt (talk) 06:03, 30 November 2020 (UTC)

Decline of the Article of M S Sankaran

Hi Saw that there was a decline at your end. Would love to know what can be done regarding that. Was not able to figure it out why it was declined ! Can you help out with this regard.? Vdraman259 (talk) 18:25, 30 November 2020 (UTC)

Vdraman259, thanks for reaching out. You need to develop the article by keeping WP:NPROF in mind. Currently, the subject's h-index is pretty low (as well as insignificant). But, if you can bring in more details and satisfy WP:SIGCOV with WP:RS, then definitely there is a chance for this article to get approved. - Hatchens (talk) 03:17, 1 December 2020 (UTC)

Exists: Native language proficiency level

Hi, I noticed you specified the babel level 5 for your English proficiency, and not level N (native). But in the lead, you write that you are a native of North Carolina. I was thinking that it is highly likely that you are not speaking English as your first (and native) language, especially since you have not marked any language with higher proficiency. I'd correct it, but I think it would be a step too far, since it would make your German proficiency look as if it was "lower" than your English proficiency. Maybe German is also a native language of your childhood home, how would I know? So I didn't change it, but I'd encourage you to raise the proficiency level to native for at least one language. Have a great day. --Ysangkok (talk) 18:09, 2 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi Ysangkok, as suggested/advised by you... I have updated my native language proficiency. Thank you for bringing this to my notice. - Hatchens (talk) 01:53, 6 December 2020 (UTC)

My page was deleted

Ots my channel no need of sources. YasharthSinhaOfficial896 (talk) 15:54, 7 December 2020 (UTC)

Please assume good faith

User:Hatchens First, you cast aspersions on my motives, now you are casting aspersions on seasoned AFC participants. The reviewers passed my drafts because these topics all pass the relevant notability guidelines. Some of these reviewers have been editing here longer than you, me, and your friend combined, so I trust their judgement. You may nominate all my articles for deletion if you want to, but it's pretty clear to me what the outcome of those AFD discussions will be. I see that you have made assumptions over another editor's motives before an—d been warned at administrator's noticeboard as well, yet here you are displaying the same behavior, if not worse.

Most of my article creations are short because I do not have the patience or the willingness to spend hours to research and write full length articles about companies of which I barely know anything. I just type down the main points that show the company's significance or notability, all backed by reliable, independent sources. I usually create stubs of notable companies hoping that they eventually become full-length articles, but not turn into corporate spam like this and this. Regardless, short articles or "poorly written" articles are not valid grounds for deletion.

Of late I've been sending all my articles through AFC, because I was once accused of COI editing by an editor who is now blocked for paid editing/sockpuppeteering (the irony!). Like they say "all is yellow to the jaundiced eye".

I hate corporate spam as much as the next guy. So from time to time I nominate egregiously non-notable company articles for deletion. I do remember seeing you at some of these AFDs. I don't understand what you mean when you say that I am covering my tracks. Do you have a problem with my sporadic editing habit or something?

I hope you don't take offence from this mesage. I am frustrated by the unsubstantiated accusations you continue to level against me. So if this message comes off as a tad bit brusque, I apologize in advance. I just hope to have a good faith, meaningful dialogue with you. Best, M4DU7 (talk) 16:18, 7 December 2020 (UTC)

Dear M4DU7, I respect your point of view. But, also do keep in mind... I always advocate for an AfD (not CSD) where the creator and others can participate... to derive a "general consensus". You are right, short articles are not the issue (or only issue). Also, I have noticed your past issue with Lapablo... that was quite an unfortunate one. Me and Prolix, both will monitor your past creations and current ones. And as he suggested... we hope that you will expand these articles by following these prescribed guidelines - WP:RS, WP:SIGCOV, WP:NCORP (and If I have missed any, then we will include that too) - do note, most of the guidelines are overlapping in nature. In case, if you need any help please feel free to reach out to any one of us. We will be more than happy to assist you. - Hatchens (talk) 16:40, 7 December 2020 (UTC)

M4DU7, also please share the details (User IDs) of the reviewers of each company page which you have created. So that we can involve them in this discussion. Their participation will bring in much more clarity and will provide us necessary way forward. - Hatchens (talk) 16:44, 7 December 2020 (UTC)

I'm skeptical about expanding the articles, to be honest. Promotional/paid editors tend to write long and in-depth articles. I can only imagine the barrage of ridiculous accusations I'd be facing if these were full length articles. I'll leave the task of expansion to someone else who might find these companies interesting enough to dig for more info.

If you mean AFC reviewers who approved these drafts, you can find them on my talk page. Most of them have been editing for 4 to 9 years and have a clean track record. I don't see the point in involving them in this non-issue, but you may ping them individually (in good faith) if you are so inclined. M4DU7 (talk) 23:59, 7 December 2020 (UTC)

Dear M4DU7, we all are here for a greater good. Since you came to my talk page for a "meaningful dialogue" with me, then it's my duty to provide the best of my abilities by supporting your work. I appreciate your contribution but I am not sure what you are trying to prove in the first place... if you have been skeptical from the beginning... you should have kept those pages in the draft and let it be edited by the others.. which you have not. Neither you have marked those pages as "stubs"... a basic gesture to invite others to further edit those pages.

Now coming to your misconception about, "Promotional/paid editors tend to write long and in-depth articles" is a completely one-sided view and I simply don't agree with it. A good creator always takes ownership of the article and expand it as per the rules and guidelines (whenever the time permits). Please don't indulge in half-hearted work. I would like to invite you to expand all the "company" pages which you have created in the past... in your free time.

Also, I agree your pages have been reviewed by more experienced reviewers in comparison to me and Prolix but mistakes happens because we all humans. In fact, I like the confidence you do have in your reviewers with 4 to 9 years of editing experience. I hope with time, me and Prolix can earn such high level of trust from your end.

I apologize for casting aspersions on seasoned AFC participants like you. That's why I am taking help from our co-editor Prolix whose integrity and expertise is second to none. And, I assure you... his observations & decisions are independent of mine and totally unbiased.

We again like to "reiterate the invitation" and ask you to expand those articles as suggested by our co-editor. - Hatchens (talk) 03:27, 8 December 2020 (UTC)

I do not subscribe to this view: "you should have kept those pages in the draft and let it be edited by the others". I don't know what you are trying to imply this time because most of these articles were literally drafts during the AFC stage. The whole point of AFC is to improve drafts and get them ready with the input of experienced editors. If the drafts weren't ready to be proper articles, they wouldn't have been approved by experienced editors in the first place. I doubt if other potentially interested editors would be able to find these articles if they were sitting as drafts forever.

I did not say that I have been skeptical of writing full length articles from the beginning. I am saying that I am skeptical about doing it NOW after constantly getting accused of paid editing for creating short stub articles. I can only imagine how much worse it would have been if these articles went into great detail the history and line of work of these companies. I could not find any guideline that asks article creators to mark their contributions as stubs.

Then I'm not a good creator. That is a tag I can live with. Wikipedia is open for anyone to edit. Nobody has WP:OWNERSHIP of anything. If you see my work as "half-hearted", that's another opinion you are free to have. I might come back to expand these articles in the future, but I can't guarantee when or if I am going to do it.

I appreciate you taking the time to talk to me. It is not a pleasant sight to see someone you have never interacted with question your motives without evidence. Please always assume good faith on fellow editors especially the ones who have been around for a while. I will see you soon. Best, M4DU7 (talk) 11:23, 8 December 2020 (UTC)

M4DU7, Sure mate. Will see your around. - Hatchens (talk) 13:44, 8 December 2020 (UTC)

New Page Patrol December Newsletter

Hello Hatchens,

Year in review

It has been a productive year for New Page Patrol as we've roughly cut the size of the New Page Patrol queue in half this year. We have been fortunate to have a lot of great work done by Rosguill who was the reviewer of the most pages and redirects this past year. Thanks and credit go to JTtheOG and Onel5969 who join Rosguill in repeating in the top 10 from last year. Thanks to John B123, Hughesdarren, and Mccapra who all got the NPR permission this year and joined the top 10. Also new to the top ten is DannyS712 bot III, programmed by DannyS712 which has helped to dramatically reduce the number of redirects that have needed human patrolling by patrolling certain types of redirects (e.g. for differences in accents) and by also patrolling editors who are on on the redirect whitelist.

Rank	Username	Num reviews	Log
1	DannyS712 bot III (talk)	67,552	Patrol Page Curation
2	Rosguill (talk)	63,821	Patrol Page Curation
3	John B123 (talk)	21,697	Patrol Page Curation
4	Onel5969 (talk)	19,879	Patrol Page Curation
5	JTtheOG (talk)	12,901	Patrol Page Curation
6	Mcampany (talk)	9,103	Patrol Page Curation
7	DragonflySixtyseven (talk)	6,401	Patrol Page Curation
8	Mccapra (talk)	4,918	Patrol Page Curation
9	Hughesdarren (talk)	4,520	Patrol Page Curation
10	Utopes (talk)	3,958	Patrol Page Curation

Reviewer of the Year

John B123 has been named reviewer of the year for 2020. John has held the permission for just over 6 months and in that time has helped cut into the queue by reviewing more than 18,000 articles. His talk page shows his efforts to communicate with users, upholding NPP's goal of nurturing new users and quality over quantity.

NPP Technical Achievement Award

As a special recognition and thank you DannyS712 has been awarded the first NPP Technical Achievement Award. His work programming the bot has helped us patrol redirects tremendously - more than 60,000 redirects this past year. This has been a large contribution to New Page Patrol and definitely is worthy of recognition.

Six Month Queue Data: Today – 2262 Low – 2232 High – 10271

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18:17, 10 December 2020 (UTC)

Nikolaos Tsitiridis

I really don't understand why the page Nikolaos Tsitiridis is up for a speedy deletion, i don't think that it's somehow promotional. If you are talking about the Comedy Club section i just put it there because there is no seperate page for Comedy Club Sofia, if this is the reason i will remove this part of the page. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Krizzz2020 (talk • contribs) 13:41, 17 December 2020 (UTC)

Articles for creation: James Blake (entrepreneur)

Hi Hatchens, Thank you for reviewing Draft:James_Blake_(entrepreneur). The subject of the article has been reported on by a number of reliable secondary sources, including The Ulster Star, The Irish Mirror, The Irish News, The News Letter etc. Could you tell me why they are not notable? — Preceding unsigned comment added by MisterTech (talk • contribs) 10:02, 17 December 2020 (UTC)

MisterTech, Kindly enhance the article with more credible news citations and then ping me. I will surely assist. - Hatchens (talk) 11:38, 17 December 2020 (UTC)

Thanks again. I've updated the article and added some more references MisterTech (talk) 14:08, 17 December 2020 (UTC)

justice

i had earlier renamed it but you changed its name back .So i want to have a formal and polite discussion. Hindus believe that place to be krishna janambhumi(birthplace like ram janmbhoomi) evan hindi wiki title page is कृष्ण जन्म भूमि. Even U.P government also calls it as( JANMBHOOMI https://mathura.nic.in/tourist-place/shri-krishna-janambhumi/) You would not be knowing hindu culture but hindus believe it so that is true.Also you deleated eidgah mosque page just because u want to hide truth and are biased.Whwn even congress historians are saying aurangzeb destryed the mosque.\ You are deleating it If you are a true deserving wiki admin donnt block me and wwrite the truth. https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/astrology/religious-places/unknown-facts-about-krishna-janmabhoomi/articleshow/68206163.cms

https://haribhakt.com/truth-and-facts-about-shri-krishna-janam-bhoomi-mandir/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Redmu3212 (talk • contribs) 07:55, 18 December 2020 (UTC)

Redmu3212, There is already a Krishna Janmabhoomi page which inturns getting redirected to Krishna Janamasthan Temple Complex. No new page is required. Kindly edit the existing page. - Hatchens (talk) 08:54, 18 December 2020 (UTC)

Pinging Umakant Bhalerao for second opinion. - Hatchens (talk) 08:52, 18 December 2020 (UTC)

Welker White

I see that this article has been deleted before (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Welker_White)

In my creation of this page today, I added well-known sources establishing notability, especially in her more recent works. However, the page is still a stub and requires expansion.

Splitpeasoup (talk) 05:40, 18 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi Splitpeasoup, I've checked with Espresso Addict's recent edits. And, have reviewed it too. Please feel free to expand and I will chip in and add relevant information to the page soon. - Hatchens (talk) 10:14, 18 December 2020 (UTC)

About discussion page (indira rasoi yojna)

Hii I added 7 other reliable sources. I request move this draft in mainspace and help me improve this article Thnks — Preceding unsigned comment added by Wiki97828 (talk • contribs) 10:58, 18 December 2020 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Suhail Dabbach has been accepted

Suhail Dabbach, which you submitted to Articles for creation, has been created.

Congratulations, and thank you for helping expand the scope of Wikipedia! We hope you will continue making quality contributions.

The article has been assessed as Start-Class, which is recorded on its talk page. Most new articles start out as Stub-Class or Start-Class and then attain higher grades as they develop over time. You may like to take a look at the grading scheme to see how you can improve the article.

Since you have made at least 10 edits over more than four days, you can now create articles yourself without posting a request. However, you may continue submitting work to Articles for creation if you prefer.

If you have any questions, you are welcome to ask at the help desk. Once you have made at least 10 edits and had an account for at least four days, you will have the option to create articles yourself without posting a request to Articles for creation.

If you would like to help us improve this process, please consider .

Thanks again, and happy editing!

Curbon7 (talk) 04:55, 28 December 2020 (UTC)

Thank you Curbon7... for the kind approval. I have seen your work as an AFC reviewer. It's an honor to be working by your side. - Hatchens (talk) 06:28, 28 December 2020 (UTC)