David M. Bunis

David M. Bunis

If you own the copyright to the material then I'm afraid we can't just take your word for it. These issues have legal implications, after all. You will have to follow the instructions here to prove that you own the copyright to the material and that you are licensing it. If you are writing about yourself (or your son is writing about you), then you would be well advised to read our guideline on conflict of interest. Hut 8.5 18:38, 15 August 2013 (UTC)

You really do need to follow the instructions at the link above to get the page restored. Blanking the Amazon page doesn't really help. Hut 8.5 19:09, 15 August 2013 (UTC)

Adding a notice to the article's talk page wouldn't actually prevent the page from being deleted even if it hadn't been deleted already. I can see that of the two paragraphs in the article, the second and longer one was taken from your personal website. If you can follow the instructions for that page then it would be possible to restore the second paragraph. For the first paragraph there isn't much I can do unless you put the Amazon description back or follow the instructions with respect to some other copy of the text on the internet somewhere. I appreciate this may be frustrating but copyright is taken rather seriously here and I'm sure you wouldn't be happy if someone else reused your work without your permission. Hut 8.5 20:03, 15 August 2013 (UTC)

OK, I've restored the article with that material. The Amazon text is still visible in a number of places, including [1]. Hut 8.5 09:07, 16 August 2013 (UTC)

A notice in which you claim copyright over the text is no good to us at all. Wikipedia is available under the CC-BY-SA 3.0 licence, and any content we use has to be available under this licence. You don't actually need the HTML to work, you only need the text in it. I suggest you add (as text) "This text is available under the Creative Commons Attribution-Sharealike 3.0 Unported License (CC-BY-SA) and the GNU Free Documentation License (GFDL) (unversioned, with no invariant sections, front-cover texts, or back-cover texts)." Hut 8.5 14:47, 16 August 2013 (UTC)

OK, the article is now restored. I haven't deleted any user page with this material on it, can you clarify what user page you are referring to? Hut 8.5 15:07, 16 August 2013 (UTC)

Ah, that was your son rather than me. I've put it back per your request. Hut 8.5 15:31, 16 August 2013 (UTC)

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Welcome!

Hello, David M. Bunis, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Unfortunately, one or more of the pages you created, such as Rabbi Menachem Mendel Monsohn, may not conform to some of Wikipedia's guidelines, and may not be retained.

There's a page about creating articles you may want to read called Your first article. If you are stuck, and looking for help, please come to the Teahouse, where experienced Wikipedians can answer any queries you have! Or, you can just type {{help me}} on this page, followed by your question, and someone will show up shortly to answer your questions. Here are a few other good links for newcomers:

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I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you have any questions, check out Wikipedia:Questions or ask me on my talk page. Again, welcome! 220 of ^Borg 02:33, 13 April 2015 (UTC)

Menachem Mendel Monsohn

G'day, HJ, Thanks for your comment - but I'm puzzled. Can you tell me what on the "Rabbi Menachem Mendel Monsohn" page does not conform to Wikipedia guidelines? That way I could try to remedy the problem. My experience is that Wikipedia is not a very user-friendly medium: vague criticisms which make it difficult to put things up. Any specific suggestions would help. Thanks David Bunis David M. Bunis (talk) 06:41, 13 April 2015 (UTC)

I added the sub hdg above. 220 of ^Borg 08:36, 19 April 2015 (UTC)

Shalom! HJ? Do you mean HJ Mitchell? I though this message was meant for me (coming after my template message above), plus I received a similar query (but misplaced on my user page not my talk page) from IP 132.64.195.128 (talk · contribs) somewhere in Jerusalem.
• Anyway, originally the Menachem Mendel Monsohn page was un-sourced. I could have nominated it for deletion on that basis, but first I usually drop the 'first article' welcome template on the editor's talk page so they are directed to the resources they need to write an article acceptable to Wikipedia. It now has four sources, but only four 'citations' in the text. A few more to show from which source the information in the text came from would be an improvement. 220 of ^Borg 08:36, 19 April 2015 (UTC)

Hello again, Thanks for getting back to me on this - and for not nominating it for deletion! (It turns out that one of my kids did the cross-referencing, etc., that I thought YOU had done. In any case, a pleasant surprise.

In answer to your discussion: Wherever possible, the numbered references refer to printed sources verifying the information stated in the body of the text. For example:

"He was a great-grandson of Abraham-Leib Monsohn, one of the founders of the Ashkenazi Old Yishuv of Jerusalem in the early nineteenth century, and a son of Abraham-Leib Monsohn II, a founder of the A.L. Monsohn Lithography in Jerusalem."1

means that you can find verification of what's stated above in quotations in reference no. 1.

Some of the information relies on family members who supplied the details orally. I haven't found references to those details in any printed sources, but I'm sure they're correct. Does Wikipedia accept references like "Personal communication, person's name, date"? If so I can add this. If not, is there any other way to keep these details? Finally, when you say there are only "four 'citations' in the text" I'm not sure I understand you. Do you mean what we commonly call quotations, with quotation marks around them? If so, I thought to shorten things by just restating what I found, briefly. (The sources can be quite verbose...) If not, could you help me understand what you mean?

Finally: thanks for deleting that "User:Monsohn..." page which resulted from an erroneous switch from a sandbox piece to the actual piece. I just couldn't figure out a way to get rid of it. Best wishes, David David M. Bunis (talk) 08:56, 19 April 2015 (UTC)

Remember, I am 220 of Borg not "HJ" which usually means HJ Mitchell.

• "Personal communication, person's name, date" are not acceptable as a source. I mean, people could say anything (they still try, without sources!) Something 'published' in a reliable source is the basic requirement. Book, newspaper, television, video, journal, on-line, government and other 'reliable' websites. Twitter, Youtube, Myspace, Facebook or other social media sites are Self published sources and generally not acceptable as sources.
• No not quotations, I mean 'sources'. Each source can apply to more than one place in the text, that's what I mean by a citation, the little ^[2][3] etc symbols that link to the sources in the References section. See wp:Referencing for beginners which should explain it better than I can.
• Your last there I think refers to User:Monsohn Family of Jerusalem and the A.L. Monsohn Lithography which has been moved to your sandbox by an admin. not by me, I am not an admin. (Click on the red link above for more info), If you no longer want that page put template {{Db-u1}} on it and it will be deleted.

Sorry for late reply, I started it then 'nodded' off, it's late here (UTC +10!) 220 of ^Borg 19:22, 19 April 2015 (UTC)

• Reply below copied from my talkpage, where it was moved from my userpage by an admin 220 of ^Borg 22:35, 19 April 2015 (UTC)

Hello 220 of Borg - I hope I have the correct place now. (Somehow it the comments always seemed to open in the other place, so it's hard for me to keep it all straight.)

Non necessary part of misplaced message 'hatted'
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.
Your comments: "Personal communication, person's name, date" are not acceptable as a source. I mean, people could say anything (they still try, without sources!) Something 'published' in a reliable source is the basic requirement. Book, newspaper, television, video, journal, on-line, government and other 'reliable' websites. Twitter, Youtube, Myspace, Facebook or other social media sites are Self published sources and generally not acceptable as sources. No not quotations, I mean 'sources'. Each source can apply to more than one place in the text, that's what I mean by a citation, the little [2][3] etc symbols that link to the sources in the References section. See wp:Referencing for beginners which should explain it better than I can. Your last there I think refers to User:Monsohn Family of Jerusalem and the A.L. Monsohn Lithography which has been moved to your sandbox by an admin. not by me, I am not an admin. (Click on the red link above for more info), If you no longer want that page put template {{Db-u1}} on it and it will be deleted. Sorry for late reply, I started it then 'nodded' off, it's late here (UTC +10!) 220 of Borg 19:22, 19 April 2015 (UTC)

The outright rejection of "personal communications" is very problematic. I don't know if you guys are researchers or what, and if so, if in the humanities (like me) or maybe the natural sciences, computer science, whatever. In the humanities, we are sometimes faced with a situation where we interview reliable "informants," who are the only ones who actually have certain knowledge about various people, events, etc. Rather than allowing this information to get lost, WE put it in writing, and then our work can be cited by others. In the case of some of the information about M.M. Monsohn and others mentioned in the article, his family members are the only ones who knew this information. They have no reason to make it up (since they have nothing to gain by it; some of it isn't even complimentary).

Because I have to work full time, I'm trying to add the documentation from written sources - and there is more - little by little, in the evenings (talking about nodding off... here it's 11 pm... a bit late for an "old timer" like me). But I really don't think we should give up on all of the personal details known only to family members because a lot of the nitty-gritty is there, and if we don't put it into writing, it will disappear. As I say, this is common practice in the humanities, referred to as "personal communications." It's like serious television or radio or newspaper reporting - only a reporter who could publish the communications never took an interest in these people while they were alive, so at the moment there's no written record. I simply want to supply the written record. I hope in the end this will be acceptable.

Take care,

David

David M. Bunis (talk) 19:55, 19 April 2015 (UTC)

• Above reply copied from my talkpage, where it was moved from my userpage by an admin 220 of ^Borg 22:35, 19 April 2015 (UTC)

Seeing as we have been discussing here, it's better not to carry the discussion on elsewhere, splitting discussions over two pages just makes it confusing! (plus you put the message on my wp:USERPAGE not my 'talk' page). As you can see, I have copied the message back here for clarity and centralisation of discussion. Nb. clicking on "^Borg" takes you to my talk-page.

• Re "... if you guys are researchers ..." no we are not. Under WP rules we are not allowed to be. If you are דוד מונזון בוניס, somewhat different rules may apply, but citing your own research or publications may then be seen as self promotion! However, it can be done, see WP:SELFCITE.
• 'personal communication' interviews with people would I think comprise wp:Original research and wp:Primary source. These are some of the guidelines WP operates under. If a person is notable enough, then the encyclopaedic information about them should be source-able. Note that I am not an expert in these areas. I have only written a few new WP pages, eg Karin Helmstaedt. If you 'published' these interviews in a wp:reliable source, ie. a journal or website then they might be usable.

Remember, this in not the humanities, This is SPARTA! (Sorry, couldn't help myself ) Rather, this is Wikipedia! This will probably be confusing, unless you've seen the movie! 220 of ^Borg 22:35, 19 April 2015 (UTC)

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License tagging for File:Yoel Yosef Shimon Monson and Family Jerusalem 1905.jpg

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Wow -that (or rather the link you directed me to) is incomprehensible to a computer-moron like me. The story is this: the photo is a family photo from 1905 (i.e., over 100 years old, thus non-copyrighted), commissioned and owned by members of the family since 1905. The last copy in the family was in the possession of my late Uncle, Shimon Barmacz, who gave it to me several years ago, before his death, and said it could be used and copied by anyone - the proof of which is that he made many copies and distributed them to whomever asked for one. So - it would be greatly appreciated if YOU could decide which tag should be given to this. It is my wish, as the owner of the photo, that anyone who wants to copy it can. Much thanks for your help with this. David David M. Bunis (talk) 16:23, 26 April 2015 (UTC)

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Hi (I hope you can see this). Thanks for pointing this error out. I'll delete the link format symbols around "charity." Best wishes, David Bunis David M. Bunis (talk) 14:23, 15 May 2018 (UTC)

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