CriticallyThinking

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December 2021

Hello, I'm Wallyfromdilbert. I noticed that you recently removed content from Tom & Jerry (2021 film) without adequately explaining why. In the future, it would be helpful to others if you described your changes to Wikipedia with an accurate edit summary. If this was a mistake, don't worry; the removed content has been restored. If you would like to experiment, please use your sandbox. If you think I made a mistake, or if you have any questions, you can leave me a message on my talk page. Thanks. – wallyfromdilbert (talk) 04:21, 8 December 2021 (UTC)

Please do not add original research or novel syntheses of published material to articles as you apparently did to Sonic the Hedgehog (film). Please cite a reliable source for all of your contributions. Thank you. – wallyfromdilbert (talk) 05:01, 8 December 2021 (UTC)

Please stop your disruptive editing.

• If you are engaged in an article content dispute with another editor, discuss the matter with the editor at their talk page, or the article's talk page, and seek consensus with them. Alternatively you can read Wikipedia's dispute resolution page, and ask for independent help at one of the relevant noticeboards.
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If you continue to disrupt Wikipedia, as you did at Sonic the Hedgehog (film), you may be blocked from editing. Stop inserting original research and your personal interpretations. You need to use the article's talk page if your proposed changes have been reverted. – wallyfromdilbert (talk) 06:45, 9 December 2021 (UTC)

Hi CriticallyThinking! I noticed that you recently marked an edit as minor at Scoob! that may not have been. "Minor edit" has a very specific definition on Wikipedia – it refers only to superficial edits that could never be the subject of a dispute, such as typo corrections or reverting obvious vandalism. Any edit that changes the meaning of an article is not a minor edit, even if it only concerns a single word. Please see Help:Minor edit for more information. This is not a minor edit and is also not even supported by the cited source. – wallyfromdilbert (talk) 05:41, 23 December 2021 (UTC)

February 2022

Your recent editing history at Space Jam: A New Legacy shows that you are currently engaged in an edit war; that means that you are repeatedly changing content back to how you think it should be, when you have seen that other editors disagree. To resolve the content dispute, please do not revert or change the edits of others when you are reverted. Instead of reverting, please use the talk page to work toward making a version that represents consensus among editors. The best practice at this stage is to discuss, not edit-war. See the bold, revert, discuss cycle for how this is done. If discussions reach an impasse, you can then post a request for help at a relevant noticeboard or seek dispute resolution. In some cases, you may wish to request temporary page protection.

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Sonic the Hedgehog film

@CriticallyThinking: According to the source in the article lead, the statement "criticized its screenplay" already covers the "lack of ambition" criticism. It's the same thing. Articles are supposed to have a neutral tone. Contributor19 (talk) 23:21, 3 April 2022 (UTC)

References

Please remember to fill out your references when you add them. Bare URLs are frowned upon. You'll find that under "Cite" there is a subheading that provides templates that even autofill when pressing the magnifying glass once the URL is input.--CreecregofLife (talk) 15:48, 8 April 2022 (UTC)

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January 2024

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February 2024

Hello, I'm Escape Orbit. I noticed that you added or changed content in an article, Tom & Jerry (2021 film), but you didn't provide a reliable source. It's been removed and archived in the page history for now, but if you'd like to include a citation and re-add it, please do so. You can have a look at referencing for beginners. If you think I made a mistake, you can leave me a message on my talk page. Thank you. Escape Orbit ^(Talk) 11:52, 29 February 2024 (UTC)

April 2024

Please do not add or change content, as you did at Tom and Jerry: The Movie, without citing a reliable source. Please review the guidelines at Wikipedia:Citing sources and take this opportunity to add references to the article. Thank you. Waxworker (talk) 05:43, 9 April 2024 (UTC)

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Tom & Jerry

Stop trying to edit the article without references or credible sources I know you love it but Wikipedia is supposed to be objective VeryFirst (talk) 14:47, 2 May 2024 (UTC)

The article says that the film became a success on Netflix with audiences who re-appraised the film. You've reverted it without reading it. CriticallyThinking (talk) 15:48, 2 May 2024 (UTC)

At least try to compromise, you can keep the produciton stuff you added but stop trying to make like the film is now better received, beign in the top 10 in Netflix doesn't mean that much in the grand scheme of things VeryFirst (talk) 15:38, 4 May 2024 (UTC)

May 2024

You have been blocked from editing for a period of 1 week for edit warring. Once the block has expired, you are welcome to make useful contributions.

During a dispute, you should first try to discuss controversial changes and seek consensus. If that proves unsuccessful, you are encouraged to seek dispute resolution, and in some cases it may be appropriate to request page protection.

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Hi CriticallyThinking! I noticed that you have reverted to restore your preferred version of The Looney Tunes Show several times. The impulse to undo an edit you disagree with is understandable, but I wanted to make sure you're aware that the edit warring policy disallows repeated reversions even if they are justifiable.

All editors are expected to discuss content disputes on article talk pages to try to reach consensus. If you are unable to agree at Talk:The Looney Tunes Show, please use one of the dispute resolution options to seek input from others. Using this approach instead of reverting can help you avoid getting drawn into an edit war. Thank you. Classicwiki (talk) If you reply here, please ping me. 02:36, 12 May 2024 (UTC)

Warning: Edit warring on The Looney Tunes Show

Please stop attacking other editors, as you did on The Looney Tunes Show. If you continue, you may be blocked from editing. Comment on content, not on other contributors or people.

Please do not add commentary, your own point of view, or your own personal analysis to Wikipedia articles, as you did to The Looney Tunes Show. Doing so violates Wikipedia's neutral point of view policy and breaches the formal tone expected in an encyclopedia.

If you continue to exacerbate this, I will be filing a report to Wikipedia administrators.

Ciscocat (talk) 00:45, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

It's not my point of view. Like I said, if you can't be bothered to read sources, the joke and issue is on you. Critics hated the series for how it felt like a generic sitcom that never stayed true to the Looney Tunes and what made them unique. It's been this way, when it released. CriticallyThinking (talk) 02:29, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

Given your edit history, it's clear you have an axe to grind against the series (for full transparency, I haven't seen any of its episodes) and it's disingenuous to act like you're just bringing more sources in. Harryhenry1 (talk) 02:36, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

When the show first released, it was ewually as hated as Teen Titans Go! was. The first reviews of the show that were published were also courtesy of ToonZone, who all hated it for its lack of ambition and departures from the source material. Its reviews were mixed. CriticallyThinking (talk) 02:40, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

How can it be as equally hated as Teen Titans Go!, yet also just get mixed reviews? Harryhenry1 (talk) 02:42, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

This is your only warning; if you make personal attacks on others again, as you did at The Looney Tunes Show, you may be blocked from editing without further notice. Comment on content, not on other contributors or people. Ciscocat (talk) 12:01, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

There is currently a discussion at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you. Ciscocat (talk) 22:08, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

There is another form of warning on Wikipedia regarding the combination of sources to come to a conclusion that is not explicitly stated, which you have done a few times before. And for what it’s worth, I have no dog in the fight of whether the show is good or not. I have no problem with including negative reviews. But please do not project your own biases as accusations towards myself. Ciscocat (talk) 04:42, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

The reviews, as cited by the sources, criticized the show for lacking in the source material's spirit and creativity with sitcom-izing the characters. It is not a personal bias. Your edit-warring is the reason why you got banned from editing other pages, like the T&J one. Give it up. CriticallyThinking (talk) 13:12, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

Ciscocat hasn't been banned from editing those other pages, and it's clear from your edit history that a personal bias against the show is a major factor in your edits. Harryhenry1 (talk) 13:36, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

It was a stupid edit war, but for the record, I was abiding by the sources. Under visual effects and animation, I was attempting to embed quotes from citations, which is a pretty safe bet, that you felt the need to pull out and hastily paper over for some reason. You seemed very hung up over the specific choice of wording as some form of misinformation, which is much bigger than what it actually was. Tell me, why was it such a problem to embed quotes directly from the source? I genuinely want to know. Ciscocat (talk) 13:36, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

I highly advise you to read the sources again, because yes, the "2D+" direction T&J took innovated and was a first-ever attempt at duplicating 2D animation by a CGI workflow who can do it in less than half the time than a 2D workflow. Also quoted by Tim Story himself. Much like how you ignore the reasons why critics hated TLTS, as proven with your petty edit warring and throwing a fit when it doesn't go your way. CriticallyThinking (talk) 13:47, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

“First-ever attempt at duplicating 2D animation by a CGI workflow” is a very broad phrase and in that case, no it wasn’t the first-ever. Maybe that specific method, but that’s beside the point. This is an example of you taking a lot of liberties with sources and treating quotes that aren’t necessarily statistical as such. Also, again, I took actual quotes from the interview and kept the paraphrasing minimal/neutral on that occasion. I fail to see how that wasn’t reading the sources. Ciscocat (talk) 14:10, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

It was the first attempt at completely duplicating 2D animation with CGI software, and it introduced many aoftware tools to help get the part. The production behind the film, even the animators, said that the demands were high and unlike anything a VFX team was used to. Because CGI is infamous for its realism and creative limitations, in spite of how less time-consuming it is. The sources said it. CriticallyThinking (talk) 14:12, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

Make sure you’re quoting or attributing this to certain interviewees, then. This is beside the point, though. Evidently from the edit logs, I’m certainly not the first person to make edits you disagree with, and unlike most recently when the article was locked to all users, you have an actual one week block from editing the page earlier this year, as seen on this very page. Ciscocat (talk) 14:18, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

You were called out by an admin for "not helping" at all. You certainly weren't helping and caused the page to be blocked for vandalism (all from you), and still aren't today. Tim Story himself described "2D+ animation", introduced with T&J, as a CGI animation workflow who can replicate 2D animation for less time than a traditional animation workflow would take via drawing every cel. The Looney Tunes Show, also cited by the sources, was infamously criticized for its "generic" writing and direction that never embraces the uniqueness of the Looney Tunes. Like I said, the sources say everything. Putting in your personal bias and ego doesn't re-write history. CriticallyThinking (talk) 14:23, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

What personal bias do you think he has? He admits that he doesn't care about the show at all.

I've also read the sources you gave, and nowhere do they use the terms innovative when describing the animation in the T&J movie, and it seems to be an assumption you've made. Harryhenry1 (talk) 14:48, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

The sources described it's "hyperkinetic" and is completely different than VFX animators did prior. Tim Story coined it as "2D+" animation, where it bypasses the creative limitations of CGI but took advantage of its quick time to animate and introduced multiple software techniques to get the part and entirely replicate 2D animation with it. Even a generated tool for the outlines was introduced here, alongside a sketchviz phase where 2D artists guided the 3D animators with expressions over a rough edit. Read the sources, once again. CriticallyThinking (talk) 14:54, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

You can't just extrapolate terms like "innovative" from the sources like that, it's veering into original research - it seems to come from your own personal bias towards the film. Harryhenry1 (talk) 15:10, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

Yet the production team, animators, and director Tim Story himself say otherwise. The animation and production demands were high and differed than any other CGI project, and it completely invented "2D+ animation" which is 2D animation replicated by a CG workflow. It's not a personal bias. It's just a fact. "Coyote vs. ACME" is the only other film to have followed this route, and chances are, we might not ever see it again as projects might even soon revert back to traditional 2D animation. CriticallyThinking (talk) 15:17, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

Where in the sources did they use the term "innovative"? Again, you can't just use terms like that which aren't reflected in the sources used. Harryhenry1 (talk) 15:22, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

The sources called it "hyperkinetic", which means completely innovative and different than the usual. The animation director said it was different than anything he and any VFX animator are used to. Interviews with the animators called the process "daunting" to replicate 2D animation under CG's creative limitations and introduced many software tools to get the part. Director Tim Story also confirmed that 2D sketchviz artists were added to the workflow to even guide the animators during many rough edits to draw-over poses and expressions of the characters. A sketchviz phase was never done to add to an animation team. "2D+" animation was innovated here, and was described by Story as 2D animation but if it was duplicated by a VFX team. Read the sources. CriticallyThinking (talk) 15:25, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

"Hyperkinetic" means something that's energetic, which is a good way to describe animation for cartoony characters. But that's not the same thing as calling it innovative.

The animators calling the process daunting is how many would describe their time on any film productions, which isn't to take away from what they did. Every new project has its own challenges, including for this film, and that's commendable. But again, you're reading too much into how they word things. Harryhenry1 (talk) 15:30, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

a "hyperkinetic clash of styles" means beyond the usual. Your bias does not re-write history nor change the fact that it completely bypassed CG's creative limitations and replicated 2D animation with first-ever software and a direction that no VFX animator prior did nor were used to. It innovated and brought it to the next level. https://www.framestore.com/work/tom-jerry CriticallyThinking (talk) 15:36, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

Again, it's clearly describing the energetic nature of the animation. And where's this idea that they were the first to ever do this? It would've likely been the first for the team involved personally, but the first production ever to do so? Harryhenry1 (talk) 15:40, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

The animation director, who comes from a CGI workflow, said that the demands for the production and animation were high and differed from anything a VFX workflow did prior. Hence the "2D+ animation" in the film, in which even countless software tools that the CGI team considered pivotal to duplicate the look and feel of classic 2D was first created here. https://www.animationmagazine.net/features/frenemies-in-the-big-city-tom-and-jerry-director-tim-story-team-discuss-the-new-hybrid-pic/ CriticallyThinking (talk) 15:54, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

That's nice to hear, but again it's not the same as calling the production truly innovative, or the first of its kind. As Ciscocat, this was not the first CG film to try and duplicate the look of 2D, and also not the first to develop new tools for such a process. You're extrapolating a lot from a little here, and seem unable to admit your own bias for this film. Harryhenry1 (talk) 17:04, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

You clearly didn't read the post, again. It invented newly developed software considered pivotal by a CGI workflow to replicate 2D animation. It has never been done before and was only done again in Coyote vs. ACME. Stop being stuck on your ego and accept that re-writing history doesn't change anything and doesn't change your history of vandalism to be biased. CriticallyThinking (talk) 17:12, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

You’re not making any sense lol. You’re taking adjectives that are meant to be positive descriptors and taking them as fact. If you’re unable to parse the difference, then that places a lot of doubt on our ability to take your editing decisions in good faith. Ciscocat (talk) 17:21, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

I'm not saying it's awful if it didn't innovate. But the production behind the film, cited with sources, claimed that the demands were high and unlike anything else a CG workflow did. It created new software techniques and pushed the limit to break the rules and traditions of CGI entirely. It innovated and bypassed the realism and creative limitations of CG to create an exact replica of classic 2D while taking less time to animate than traditional cel animation. No project did it prior, and nothing else might be done like it again aside from Coyote vs. ACME. Stop throwing a fit because a movie you didn't like managed to be unique. CriticallyThinking (talk) 17:26, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

You’re repeating yourself, and also clearly showing a bias towards the movie and indicating it has interfered with properly editing the article. This doesn’t really make a case in your favour. For what I hope is the last time, nobody is editing the article to skew it away from neutrality. We’re trying to make sure it’s properly sourced and reliable, and that you seem to be hung up on the way it’s worded tells me that’s your modus operandi and the very thing you seem to think we are trying to do. Ciscocat (talk) 17:39, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

Name a single CGI project before T&J with software for hand-drawn animation techniques to create an exact replica of 2D animation, even with help from a 2D sketchviz team guiding the animators to help break the rules of CG completely. Your bias towards the movie is literally the reason you got blocked from editing pages and that it was protected from vandalism. An admin called you out for it. It's just a fact. Move on and stop throwing a fit because the film actually pushed boundaries in a production when demands were confirmed to be incredibly high and different than anything a CGI team did prior. CriticallyThinking (talk) 17:42, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

You're still putting words in Ciscocat's mouth, accusing him of bias while being biased yourself. Why else are you trying to push such a positive view of the film? Harryhenry1 (talk) 17:47, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

There has never been a single CGI project that attempted to create an exact replica of 2D animation, as confirmed by the production team who literally come from a CG background. It's innovative and especially considered daunting for a CGI workflow, since 2D has far more creative freedom. Like I said, I'm not biased. Don't take my word for it. Throwing a fit won't re-write history. Innovation is when something new is invented and introduced. "2D+ animation", coined by the creative team, is something unheard of and completely different to what CG animators are used to. And no, it isn't merely cel-shading either. CriticallyThinking (talk) 17:53, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

“2D plus” was an unofficial term that the director came up with. What I glean from the article(s) is that it’s 3D animated models directed to look like 2D through rendering and animatics and some minor new software was developed to achieve that effect. And as previously stated there are plenty of high-profile examples of a similar process so this isn’t majorly different. Ciscocat (talk) 18:06, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

Exactly. As the cited sources claim, the director called this direction as if 2D animation was replicated by a CGI workflow. CGI takes less time to animate than 2D, but also has less creative freedom, and the team created many software tools to help them break the traditions of CGI, from the stiffness to lifeless realism, and completely clone 2D animation with it. The look and feel in every shot. It'd be better to give up before admins once again will call you and Cameron out for vandalizing out of pure personal bias and throw a fit. CriticallyThinking (talk) 18:11, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

Do you actually think the admins are gonna take your side on this? God almighty. Ciscocat (talk) 18:15, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

You’re treating this as a pissing contest over the film, which is not why I’m here. I’m here to punch up the article. Also, “draw-overs” are not new to 3D animation at all; see this interview with Brad Bird where he talks about drawing over 3D-animated scenes on a whiteboard for guidance. And of course plenty of CG animation has varying degrees of homage to 2D (Paperman, Feast, SpiderVerse, Peanuts Movie, Mitchells vs the Machines). But again that’s beside the point. You get really heated when we try to rein in the bias of the article and imply it’s anything less than what you think it is. When a crew is talking up their own project there’s a difference between opinion and fact. Ciscocat (talk) 18:02, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

speak for yourself. The admins protected the page out of your vandalism from pure bias alone rather than actually reading sources. You constantly argue and throw a fit just for the sake of being a contrarian rather than because you fail to accept the fact that something new and innovative happened behind production. It's just a fact. Move along CriticallyThinking (talk) 18:22, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

Defending a sitcom that critics even hated upon release for its lack of creativity and faithfulness to the Looney Tunes doesn't help. At least with T&J, I know the reception was negative and am not making it look like it was positively received from bias. You have an obsession over me for little reason, even when I cite sources and info from research. Seek therapy. CriticallyThinking (talk) 18:26, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

Can you please cool it with the personal attacks? MiasmaEternal☎ 23:14, 8 August 2024 (UTC)