User talk:Classicfilmbuff/Archive 3

GG Citation

You can try something like this:

<ref name=TCMBrownlow>{{Cite video|title=Garbo|year=2005|last=Brownlow|first=Kevin|authorlink=Kevin Brownlow|publisher=[[Turner Classic Movies]]|medium=Television production|minutes=15:27–15:42|quote=Appropriate quote from time shown backing up statement.}}</ref>

Which would show as:

Brownlow, Kevin (2005). Garbo: Portrait of a Legend (Television production). Turner Classic Movies. 15:27–15:42 minutes in. Appropriate quote from time shown backing up statement.

You will need to change the minutes= and quote= parameters to reflect something actually in the video, and the actual time span where it occurs.

Let me know if you have any questions. Fat&Happy (talk) 00:40, 4 December 2012 (UTC)

Follow-up

Nah, more like 30 seconds than 10 minutes, since you got your addendum in before I saw the original...

Wow, here I try hard to make it simple to copy/paste and you have to go complicate things. I formatted the original response so that what you needed to enter would be displayed as you were reading the message, so there would be no need to go into edit mode to make a copy. So the first indented set of code above is what is needed, without any of the "code" or "nowiki" nonsense, which is just used to make it display correctly here on the talk page.

I figured that since the TCM page on the TV show credited Brownlow for the screenplay as well as being the director, it was OK to attribute anything in the show to him (except identified second-hand quotes, of course), but putting an excerpt in-line seems all right too. Fat&Happy (talk) 20:28, 4 December 2012 (UTC)

Brownlow, Kevin (2005). Garbo (Television production). Turner Classic Movies. 15:27–15:42. minutes in.

Correct format: text blah blah

Final result in the article looks fine. Sometime when you're in there for other things, you might want to link the first reference to Brownlow in the new addition instead of the later but older one down below.

Thanks for the baklava. (I had to look it up to find out what it is; got confused with the Tennyson poem – looks good). Fat&Happy (talk) 00:31, 5 December 2012 (UTC)

text blah blah

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Refs on talk page

I'm pretty sure that any time you've seen me write a ref so the content actually displays on a talk page, I used only the {{Cite}} template without the <ref> / </ref> tags. Fully formatted refs won't display unless there's a {{Reflist}} template (or equivalent HTML markup) following it somewhere on the page. Of course, you could add a Reflist template, and personally I don't care, since as you've pointed out my talk page isn't exactly overcrowded these days, but in general the practice is frowned on in Wikipedia. Fat&Happy (talk) 20:27, 6 December 2012 (UTC)

Monday-morning quarterbacking and nit-picking

1. You might want to link Ty Burr and George Sidney, which adds some air of credibility to their opinions as well as helping non-classic-film-buffs to learn more if they're interested.
2. I've never been particularly good on these fine grammatical points, but since Sidney has been dead for ten years is it better to say he "added" rather than he "adds"?
3. I think I'd eliminate Ty Burr from the citation, either showing it as authorless or, my preference, adding the director, Steve Cole (according to TCM). This could be properly qualified by substituting "|author=Cole, Steve (director)" instead of "|last=Burr|first=Ty".
4. While checking something else in the middle of typing this, I see you've already corrected the second time-frame to be different than the first...

Fat&Happy (talk) 20:27, 6 December 2012 (UTC)

Dispute resolution

I see you already located one official description of acceptable sources. You might also want to look at WP:RS, a fairly detailed discussion of what is considered a reliable source. Specific questions and disputes as to whether a particular source is considered reliable for particular content can be brought to the reliable sources noticeboard at WP:RSN. The page at WP:DR discusses methods of resolving other disagreements, such as whether particular content gives WP:UNDUE weight to certain viewpoints or minor events. These methods may include seeking a third opinion (WP:3O) or a request for comments {WP:RFC). Fat&Happy (talk) 04:45, 18 December 2012 (UTC)

And a little more nitpicking, just to keep in practice.

If the outcome of discussions includes a decision that Garbo's relationship with Cécile de Rothschild was important enough to be mentioned in the bio, it would probably be considered a friendly gesture to spell her name correctly... Fat&Happy (talk) 04:45, 18 December 2012 (UTC)

LOL – probably the same way you did, by copying and pasting from another location. Being unfamiliar with her, I had Googled to confirm she was a member of the famous family and not just a homonym. In the process, I found enough references using the accented "e" to (a) convince me it was correct, and (b) provide an easy source for transporting it to this page.

I hope you have an enjoyable holiday break also.

Oh, and you can always take a look at WP:BLOCKME, and maybe the page it references at WikiBreak Enforcer Script. Fat&Happy (talk) 22:20, 18 December 2012 (UTC)

Mercedes de Acosta ref

blah</nowiki> tags. I left them out to avoid repeating the confusion we had in the #GG Citation section above.

Actually, the tags are there now because another editor attempted to correct your earlier try, but didn't specify all the template parameters correctly. (For that matter, parts of my version above are also questionable. Duke University Press shows the year as 2000 or 2001 in different places. The best I can guess is that Volume 15 was nominally the volume for 2000, but for some reason Issue 3 came out late, in early January 2001. Also, this journal uses a dual issue-numbering convention that I haven't seen before. Camera Obscura is published three times a year, so Volume 15, Issue 3 is the 45th issue of the publication overall. They seem to use both 3 and 45 as the issue number sometimes. I chose to keep it simple.)

When I started out here, there was one category, Category:Citation templates, which listed all the relevant templates. Since then, in what appears to be the ongoing effort to make Wikipedia the province of the properly initiated by continually adding layers of esoterica and complexity for editors, this has been broken out into a sub-hierarchy of several categories. For now, if you just remember the more common templates like {{Cite book}}, {{Cite news}}, and {{Cite web}}, you can go to any of them by entering template:cite web (e.g.) in the search box and check the category it's in at the bottom of the page. Currently, this would be Category:Citation Style 1 templates. Fat&Happy (talk) 18:18, 19 December 2012 (UTC)

Yeah, I left the year as 2000 based on the Project Muse listing. You might be right about it being the 45th online issue; if you scan through the archive listings at http://cameraobscura.dukejournals.org/content/by/year year by year, it's a bit helter-skelter on volume numbering until 1989, at which point it pretty much settles down to one volume of three issues per year. The appearance – not necessarily the historical reality – is that for the first dozen years they published irregularly and just considered three consecutive issues to be a volume, regardless of the year of publication.

Side question: looking at the intro to the journal's own article (Camera Obscura (journal)), is "feminist" an appropriate characterization? I just tend to consider the term more one of advocacy than academic study, but maybe that's a narrow viewpoint.

Oh, and I still think the author's name needs to appear in the citation, and that even if there is a cost associated with reading the full article, at least the doi number, if not the direct link to the Muse extract, may be helpful and cannot be harmful. Also, showing the publisher and/or the link to the Wikipedia article helps distinguish the journal from the general-circulation photography magazine of the same name. Fat&Happy (talk) 20:08, 19 December 2012 (UTC)

Oops. I knew there was something else in your last post, but forgot to check before submitting above. If you're editing an entire page, the normal preview mode before submitting works fine. If you're just editing a single section, you need to insert a {{Reflist}} template at the end of the section before clicking on "Preview", then remember to delete the template before doing a final save. Everybody forgets that last step at least once, resulting in an unsightly extra reference list in the middle of the article. (I created a "test" template called {{Reflistp}} that has code to suppress the reference listing when the article isn't being previewed in edit mode; you could use that instead, but it's still best to remove it when you're finished to avoid clutter in the article. It's just that the results of forgetting aren't as obvious.) Fat&Happy (talk) 20:20, 19 December 2012 (UTC)

Carelessness on my part. After I realized I had skipped something from your earlier post, I glanced quickly at it and sort of read it as "How do you preview a citation ... before you put it in the article?", neatly eliding the "you've drafted on a talk or sandbox p." part. And since I've never bothered to check cites on a page other than their intended destination, I just mentally skipped to that process. But yes, you could test it on a talk page or a separate sandbox page, then copy it to the article, and the reflist template could remain there without doing any harm.

Actually, the "feminist" question wasn't related to de Acosta specifically but rather to Camera Obscura's Wikipedia article, where the opening sentence reads: "Camera Obscura is a feminist journal published by Duke University Press." Fat&Happy (talk) 00:52, 20 December 2012 (UTC)

blah

Fixed Reflist test for sample. Sample above is formatted correctly, including handling of name as well as other issues discussed. Fat&Happy (talk) 18:14, 21 December 2012 (UTC)

Watchlist

Happy New Year, Classic. Not sure how to remotely diagnose the watchlist issues; mine has so many pages on it (>1,700 after significant recent culling) it hardly ever goes an hour without a new entry, but without knowing the pages you have included or any of the other timing and exclusion settings, it's anybody's guess.

Make sure that on the watchlist page itself, the options line reads:

"Hide minor edits | Hide bots | Hide anonymous users | Hide logged-in users | Hide my edits | Hide patrolled edits" –

if any of the "Hide"'s are replaced by "Show", those kinds of edits are suppressed. And for now, click "All" at the end of the line immediately above the hide options. If I'm on your watchlist, at least your posting to my talk page should show up, but I see that Garbo has not been changed since December 27, and de Acosta since the 23rd. Fat&Happy (talk) 05:06, 5 January 2013 (UTC)

Garbo

Hello, You and I had a discussion/argument a few months back on the section about Garbo's personal life and I just wanted to drop a line saying that the section, in it's current form, is strong, precise and balanced.Princetoniac (talk) 18:51, 26 February 2013 (UTC)

Greta Garbo 20130514

Hello Frze, Some nut case came along and vandalized (I think this is the right term for what s/he did) the entire p. and you seemed to undo all crazy stuff. Am I right that you returned everything back to normal? If so, out of curiosity, how did you do it? Or, what exactly happened. EVerything is fine now. Thanks in advance for explaining.--Classicfilmbuff (talk) 23:35, 15 May 2013 (UTC)

Look at this page http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Greta_Garbo&action=history and check what's wrong. Then choose the last version without vandalism. Then choose http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Greta_Garbo&diff=prev&oldid=554756492 , click Edit, ignore the warnings and click Save page. That's all. --Frze (talk) 04:42, 16 May 2013 (UTC)

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