184.58.156.91

December 2017

Hello, I'm Thelost byte. I wanted to let you know that one or more of your recent contributions to Celtic brooch have been undone because they did not appear constructive. If you would like to experiment, please use the sandbox. If you think a mistake was made, or if you have any questions, you can leave me a message on my talk page. Well you blanked mass sections of a page without indicating why and added non neutral opinionated edits to the article. I'd recommend you to go through Wikipedia editing procedures first before making edits to any other further articles. Thelost byte (talk) 13:34, 22 December 2017 (UTC)

If this is a shared IP address, and you did not make the edits, consider creating an account for yourself or logging in with an existing account so you can avoid further irrelevant notices.

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Hello, I am indeed the one that deleted your addition to the page. I will paste what I wrote to the other editors of wikipedia and I urge you to remove this bit yourself. I also want to make clear that I do believe I gave a reason for exactly why I deleted your article. If those reasons did not post I apologize. I'm pretty sure they did post. Below is what I wrote to the team.

+++++++++++++ START OF PASTED CONTENT ++++++++++++++++++ I was reading a page titled 'Celtic Brooch' which is an excellent page in my opinion. There are many citings from professional sources in the scientific field.

This is the page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celtic_brooch

As I came to the bottom of the page I came across this heading, "North African connections with Amazigh/Berber people" I have several problems with this part of the page and tried to remove it and I believe I did leave reasons why I deleted them. I was looking on Wikipedia today and got a notice that the author (I believe it was the author) had reinserted the bit I deleted and said I had no reason for deleting it.

I would appreciate if someone would please fix this and here are my reasons why. I would do it myself but I don't know how to stop him from just adding it back again and I don't want to break any rules of the pages.

1.) The heading, "North African connections with Amazigh/Berber people" makes no sense on a page about Celtic brooches.

2.) The ONLY citings on this otherwise excellent page are to where the author got his photographs.

     There are NO citings on his claims whatsoever about any cultural connection between 'Amazighn/Berber people' and Celtic people of any region.

3.) The ONLY thing the author ties his part of the article with this page are two sentences with ZERO citing of any type! I will paste the quote below:

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  "The implications and connections between Gaelic people and Amazigh are large and require more study, as a scottish DNA research project suggests that a small percentage of Scots have DNA ties to North Africa. This would imply that Gaelic people either were influenced by Amazighi cultures and their Jewelry, or the other way around, implying that Gaelic seamen reached the North African shores, perhaps to trade.

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The final thing the author says is, "This requires more study."

My contention is that as far as I know; there has never been any study on this matter. If there has been the author certainly does not supply the reader with one single citation. I love wikipedia but this is exactly the reason so many people don't trust it.

Again, the main article is excellent with citations to peer reviewed scientific articles. What this person added, I'm sorry is nothing but 100% unsubstantiated garbage as far as he/she has shown. If I knew how to remove it and stop him from misinforming people I would do it. Normally I would ignore something like this but as a metalsmith that has studied jewellry as well as recreated some historical pieces, even the untrained eye can look at the examples provided in the pictures that were posted and see there are no similarities.

I don't know why this person insists on posting this, I'm just hoping for posterity someone can remove it permanently or at a minimum force the author to post legitimate citations that support these strange assertions. +++++++++++++++END OF PASTED CONTENT++++++++++++++++++++

I hope this clears up why I deleted the content you added. I hope you go back to the page and either add credible citations that back up your claims or remove your contribution. I would like to see Wikipedia remain a credible source for factual material and not opinion pages.

Thanks.

(I mean c'mon man do you know what requires a citation?! When you say things in a paper like, "as a Scottish DNA project suggests" you need to give the citation for the specific DNA project. Also, You need to not insert your OPINION that because there is shared DNA (if true) that somehow this means that there is a link between their contact and influences on jewellry designs. You need to SHOW how that happened, what dates that happened,etc. What you present does not imply anything except that these two cultures had children (assuming there is a DNA project that proves your assertion.) To be honest what dates in history?! It is just as likely that Vikings raided these areas and took slaves back with them and had sex that resulted in children as they were known to do after conquering a people. Thinking of it from that perspective...how would that support your claims? If I wanted to write an article on that it would be MUCH easier to find those citations to support my claim than yours. Vikings, from my understanding, didn't sail the seas looking for trade partners. Think about it. Also, do you even understand the functionality of those Celtic Brooches? I can tell you this, they weren't just for decoration or status which also seems at odds with the pictures of what you posted.

I don't know, what you wrote rubbed me the wrong way. It feels like you are just trying to inject little opinion pieces instead of contributing factual work for the good of the readers. Please don't do that.

I hope this clears up why I did what I did. Again, I implore you to remove what you wrote unless you can come up with citations that support your claims.

Take care. ++++++++++++++++++++++++

Also, please read this page and it should explain why your section will be deleted again.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Verifiability#Responsibility_for_providing_citations

It is YOUR responsibility to provide citations for your assertions. Your assertions are unverifiable and if you still think that is untrue then please provide the appropriate citations. Your opinions should not be in the article; saying things like, "The implications and connections between Gaelic people and Amazigh are large and require more study, as a scottish DNA research project suggests that a small percentage of Scots have DNA ties to North Africa. This would imply that Gaelic people either were influenced by Amazighi cultures and their Jewelry, or the other way around, implying that Gaelic seamen reached the North African shores, perhaps to trade." Have multiple issues. 1.) What DNA study? You need to cite this particular DNA study. 2.) A DNA study in itself, unless specifically targeting these two groups as part of a larger study, is not enough to prove any connection between the two groups and their jewellry or customs. 3.) Unless you can provide a professional study (and cite it) that can actually show a correlation between the two cultures and how they traded or exchanged jewelry techniques then you are violating Wikipedia's policy on verification. 4.) If you still dispute this but you can't find supporting documents you can cite then you are attempting to add new, unproven and unpublished information on Wikipedia which is ALSO against their policy.

I am asking you one more time to please remove your section. It bothers me a great deal that you are ruining an excellent fact based article with conjecture instead of facts.

Thanks

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