Template:Did you know nominations/The Winker's Song (Misprint)
- The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was: promoted by Gatoclass (talk) 06:45, 31 March 2017 (UTC)
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The Winker's Song (Misprint) edit
- ... that I'm a Wanker? Source:Lethal Force: "our anthem of choice was Ivor Biggun's 1978 classic "I'm a Wanker"
- Reviewed: Executive Order 13767
- Comment: For April Fools Day
Created by The C of E (talk). Self-nominated at 09:24, 3 February 2017 (UTC).
The article is new enough and long enough, but the hook does not present any verifiable facts, so cannot be used. Also, what makes 45worlds.com a reliable source, and The Metro is often considered a tabloid newspaper and not a brilliant source to use. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 16:26, 3 February 2017 (UTC)
- @Ritchie333: It's an April Fools Day hook and I'm not using the Metro as the source for the hook. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 17:24, 3 February 2017 (UTC)
- Hmmm. @EEng:, do you know what we normally do about these sorts of things? While the Metro is not used for the hook, the article still needs to be in a reasonable shape generally with regard to sources. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 17:32, 3 February 2017 (UTC)
- The misprint thing is confusing. Looks like the original title (when the song was written, and maybe as it was recorded) was "The Wanker's Song", but when actually released it was "The Winker's Song", and then later it was included on an album called The Winker's Album (Misprint). And even to put that together I had to connect some dots. I don't see anywhere that the song itself ever carried a title including (misprint).
- I'm not sure that a single source apparently mistakenly referring to the song by its first line, or refrain, as if that's the title, establishes that line as some kind of alternate title as given in bold in the lead. I think we'd need a source saying "popularly known as" or something like that.
- The Metro, aside from being a marginal source, doesn't support the statement "reached number 22 in the UK Singles Charts despite not being aired on the radio owing to obscenities around masturbation within it"; AFAICS the source just says that one particular slang term is used in the song, and nothing why it's wasn't aired.
- Personally I think better hooks would be:
- ALT1 ... that the "The Wanker's Song" has been compared to songs by George Formby?
- ALT2 ... that some nightclubs play the "The Wanker's Song" to clear the dance floor?
- EEng 18:17, 3 February 2017 (UTC)
- The article does cite British Hit Singles for the chart position (in another place), and while I don't have a copy anymore (where's it gone), I do recall seeing "Ivor Biggun" in it and am happy to AGF it is correct. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 18:22, 3 February 2017 (UTC)
- I have added further sources with regard to it alternatively being known as "I'm a Wanker". If you look at the official chart sources, it includes the full title as the official title. As for the hook @Ritchie333:, I'm not too sure about the proposed hooks so my suggestion is:
- ALT3 ... that the BBC banned broadcasting I'm a Wanker? The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 21:21, 3 February 2017 (UTC)
- The problem is that the source for that is the 1990 British Hit Singles, which doesn't seem right. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 21:40, 3 February 2017 (UTC)
- @Ritchie333: Sorry? That source isn't being used to reference the BBC claim. It's being used to reference Ibiza nightclubs using it for closedown, which would make sense as thats not about the release, its about the legacy it left. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 22:03, 3 February 2017 (UTC)
- @The C of E: Sorry, I was referring to ALT2, which is my preferred hook : "that some nightclubs play the "The Wanker's Song" to clear the dance floor?" While it's possible it's in the 1990 British Hit Singles, I'm sceptical as it doesn't really fit the narrative of those series of books. Also, the page number is missing. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 12:57, 6 February 2017 (UTC)
- @Ritchie333: I had got that from its use citing the same fact in the Doc Cox article, so I don't know what the page number is. However, I will say that I am supporting ALT4 from EEng as my preferred choice as we have had something similar with Computer says no from last year. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 13:23, 6 February 2017 (UTC)
- Right - I see what's happening think the source is citing the chart positions of this song and "Bras on 45" which fits the format of the book, but not the claim earlier in the sentence of emptying dance floors. All you get in British Hit Singles is a short introduction, the main bit of chart entries, and some stats at the back. I am certain this claim is not in the source. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 13:28, 6 February 2017 (UTC)
- @Ritchie333: I have changed the source to the only one I could find that appeared reliable (aside of all the blog posts confirming it), though I must stress I am putting a lot of faith into the claim on it that it has been "peer reviewed and edited by our editorial staff". IF you're not satisfied I suppose I will have to remove it, which would be a shame. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 13:46, 6 February 2017 (UTC)
- Right - I see what's happening think the source is citing the chart positions of this song and "Bras on 45" which fits the format of the book, but not the claim earlier in the sentence of emptying dance floors. All you get in British Hit Singles is a short introduction, the main bit of chart entries, and some stats at the back. I am certain this claim is not in the source. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 13:28, 6 February 2017 (UTC)
- @Ritchie333: I had got that from its use citing the same fact in the Doc Cox article, so I don't know what the page number is. However, I will say that I am supporting ALT4 from EEng as my preferred choice as we have had something similar with Computer says no from last year. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 13:23, 6 February 2017 (UTC)
- @The C of E: Sorry, I was referring to ALT2, which is my preferred hook : "that some nightclubs play the "The Wanker's Song" to clear the dance floor?" While it's possible it's in the 1990 British Hit Singles, I'm sceptical as it doesn't really fit the narrative of those series of books. Also, the page number is missing. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 12:57, 6 February 2017 (UTC)
- @Ritchie333: Sorry? That source isn't being used to reference the BBC claim. It's being used to reference Ibiza nightclubs using it for closedown, which would make sense as thats not about the release, its about the legacy it left. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 22:03, 3 February 2017 (UTC)
- I have added further sources with regard to it alternatively being known as "I'm a Wanker". If you look at the official chart sources, it includes the full title as the official title. As for the hook @Ritchie333:, I'm not too sure about the proposed hooks so my suggestion is:
- The article does cite British Hit Singles for the chart position (in another place), and while I don't have a copy anymore (where's it gone), I do recall seeing "Ivor Biggun" in it and am happy to AGF it is correct. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 18:22, 3 February 2017 (UTC)
- Hmmm. @EEng:, do you know what we normally do about these sorts of things? While the Metro is not used for the hook, the article still needs to be in a reasonable shape generally with regard to sources. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 17:32, 3 February 2017 (UTC)
I gotta say all of those alt hooks pale in comparison to the first one, especially as far as April Fools' go. If we can have "Did you know ... ?" (2012 April Fools') we can have "DYK .... that I'm a Wanker?". Headbomb {talk / contribs / physics / books} 23:22, 3 February 2017 (UTC)
- @Headbomb: Thank you. You're more than welcome to give it an official review for AFD if you think it does fulfill the requirements. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 23:39, 3 February 2017 (UTC)
- Well, if you want to go back to something like ALT0 I'd suggest dropping that –
- ALT4 ... "I'm a Wanker"?
- i.e. you're asking the reader whether he/she "knows" the song, rather than the asking whether he/she is familiar with the nominator's personal habits. Ritchie333, I'm not sure whether I answered you original query.
- Oh, and I still don't see anything giving the title of the song (not album) as "... (Misprint)". EEng 00:07, 4 February 2017 (UTC)
- @EEng: I like ALT4 there, thank you for suggesting it. As for including "(Misprint)" in the title, the official chart company use it. I think it's often left out in other references for brevity. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 09:11, 4 February 2017 (UTC)
Okay, since I cannot find anyone objecting, ALT4 it is! Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 16:25, 6 February 2017 (UTC)
I don't like any of the above hooks. Suggested alt:
- ALT5: ... that at the BBC in the 1970s, "winking" was verboten? Gatoclass (talk) 08:38, 29 March 2017 (UTC)
- No, I don't like that. I'm happy to keep ALT4. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 09:05, 29 March 2017 (UTC)
- Then we're even, 'cuz I don't care for ALT4. The important thing is that the new alt gets verified so that the updater has a choice. Gatoclass (talk) 09:09, 29 March 2017 (UTC)
ALT5 verified and cited inline. IMO it's better to avoid using obscenities if we're able, and the hint is suggestive enough. Yoninah (talk) 20:02, 29 March 2017 (UTC)
- I still affirm that the original review stands which was done in accordance with policy and the proposed above is a personal preference trying to be put onto this nomination. Besides, ALT5 is too awkwardly worded (Why would we use a German word on the front page of the English Wikipedia anyway?) and is not that hooky for April fools Day. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 23:10, 29 March 2017 (UTC)
- Then we're even, 'cuz I don't care for ALT4. The important thing is that the new alt gets verified so that the updater has a choice. Gatoclass (talk) 09:09, 29 March 2017 (UTC)