- The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was: promoted by Cwmhiraeth (talk) 07:08, 21 December 2019 (UTC)
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Susan Billy
... that Pomo basket weaver Susan Billy, granddaughter of Susan Santiago Billy, has been the featured weaver and/or curator at the American Museum of Natural History, Brooklyn Museum, the National Museum of the American Indian, De Young Museum, Oakland Museum of California, and the National Museum of Natural History in Washington D.C.?
- Reviewed: 2019 Antalya Open (pool)
Created by Myotus (talk). Nominated by Paul2520 (talk) at 06:13, 14 November 2019 (UTC).
New enough, and (barely) long enough. QPQ done. But the sentence in the article supporting the hook, "Billy has been the featured weaver and/or guest curator presenting Pomo basket weaving techniques at New York's Museum of Natural History, Brooklyn Museum, the Smithsonian National Museum of the American Indian, De Young Museum, Mendocino County Museum, and the National Museum of Natural History in Washington D.C.", is uncomfortably close to a direct copy of the corresponding sentence from source https://web.archive.org/web/19991013042848/http://www.mcn.org/A/mendoart/ae/199903/susan.html, "Susan has been the featured weaver or guest curator at New York's Museum of Natural History, Brooklyn Museum, National Museum of the American Indian/The Smithsonian Institution in Washington D.C., The De Young Museum in San Francisco, the Mendocino County Museum in Willits, and last year in an exhibition at the National Museum of Natural History in Washington D.C. where she presented Pomo basket weaving techniques": the only differences are moving one clause to the end, using a different form of her name, and changing "or" to the more awkward "and/or". Even the ordering of the museums is the same. All material on Wikipedia must be written in your own words, not merely copied and lightly tweaked to disguise the copying. Additionally, at roughly 333 characters, the hook is way over the 200 character limit. Please suggest alternative hooks that are within rules and not merely a laundry list of showings. —David Eppstein (talk) 02:15, 17 November 2019 (UTC)
- Thanks for the review, David Eppstein. I had missed how close that wording was to the ref, but fixed it (let me know what you think).
- How are either of these hooks?
ALT1 ... that Pomo basket weaver Susan Billy's grandmother Susan Santiago Billy was also a basket weaver?ALT2 ... that Pomo basket weaver Susan Billy co-authored a book about baskets others in her family created?- = paul2520 (talk) 02:46, 17 November 2019 (UTC)
- The paraphrasing is better. The new hooks are within rules for length, but not quite there. Beyond the minor spelling correction ("baseket") the sentence in the article supporting the hook needs a footnote, and that is not currently true: although the article says her grandmother was a weaver, the only footnoted sentence about her grandmother is the one about her death. And the article doesn't actually say what the book was about, it only gives its title (which hints at its topic but is not the same as saying what the topic is directly). I prefer ALT1 but I have the suspicion that both hooks could be made punchier. —David Eppstein (talk) 04:18, 17 November 2019 (UTC)
- David Eppstein Fixed the spelling. How about this alternate?
- ALT3 ... that Pomo basket weaver Susan Billy comes from a family of basket weavers that includes Susan Santiago Billy and Elsie Allen?
- = paul2520 (talk) 16:44, 17 November 2019 (UTC)
Good to go with ALT3 (and with WP:AGF on the two offline sources). —David Eppstein (talk) 19:59, 17 November 2019 (UTC)
- The paraphrasing is better. The new hooks are within rules for length, but not quite there. Beyond the minor spelling correction ("baseket") the sentence in the article supporting the hook needs a footnote, and that is not currently true: although the article says her grandmother was a weaver, the only footnoted sentence about her grandmother is the one about her death. And the article doesn't actually say what the book was about, it only gives its title (which hints at its topic but is not the same as saying what the topic is directly). I prefer ALT1 but I have the suspicion that both hooks could be made punchier. —David Eppstein (talk) 04:18, 17 November 2019 (UTC)
