Talk:With Roots Above and Branches Below

Release date

Why does everyone keep saying the album is coming out in April? Don't get me wrong, I would love that! But all I've heard is that it's coming out in the Spring?

-They're video updates say April I'm pretty sure.I don't know though.(Tham22 (talk) 16:40, 5 March 2009 (UTC))

-Actually, none of them say April. This album will be released in early May. Trust me. Advance copies sent to reviewers next month.

Yeah, they posted the date after I posted above. (Tham22 (talk) 12:54, 17 March 2009 (UTC))

Professional reviews - specifically AP.net

The review for With Roots Above and Branches Below from AbsolutePunk.net has recently been removed a few times. According to WikiProject Albums, "Professional reviews may include only reviews written by professional music journalists or DJs, or found within any online or print publication having a (paid or volunteer) editorial and writing staff (which excludes personal blogs). The standard for inclusion always is that the review meet Wikipedia's guideline for reliable sources and that the source be independent of the artist, record company, etc." How does AP.net not fit those qualifications? Fezmar9 (talk) 18:29, 5 May 2009 (UTC)

heavy music charts?

deputed at "#1 on the heavy music charts" according to the article.. Which music chart is this? I've never heard of any "heavy" music charts at all, link and citation please? 72.72.199.25 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 02:09, 19 May 2009 (UTC).

According to Billboard it did chart on the "Top Hard Rock" albums chart (there seems to be an error every time the page loads right now, so I will look that up what position it peaked at another time), but to my knowledge there is no "Heavy Music" chart. I am going to remove all charting claims but Billboard 200 and Top Independent Albums for the time being as those can be found on The Devil Wears Prada article. A full chart peak section will probably be made sometime soon. Thank you for pointing this out! Fezmar9 (talk) 03:12, 19 May 2009 (UTC)

Trivia section

Without some reliable sources for visitors to verify the information provided, the section is considered original research which is not allowed on wikipedia. If there was anything in that list that you feel should be included in the article, provide a source and add it to the page in a format other than a bulleted list. The argument of "but other pages have trivia sections..." does not hold much weight on wikipedia. It was suggested that because Infinity on High and Plagues (album) have a list of song information, perhaps it is okay for this article to have one too. These are not representations of good articles according to the album project quality scale. Examples of featured class articles include Year Zero (album), Vol. 3: (The Subliminal Verses) and Christ Illusion. I know that there may seem to be an endless list of wiki-policy and regulations, so if you have any questions please feel free to ask! Fezmar9 (talk) 17:42, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

I know all of this from going to their live shows, talking with guys in the band, and reading the liner notes of the album. So how do I cite all of that as a source? Jstar37 (talk) 20:37, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

Well, you cannot cite a conversation as a source, so you cannot add anything based what was said. Only what has been published. Liner notes do count as a reliable published source, however, I have the booklet for With Roots Above and Branches Below right next to me and I do not see anything other than lyrics and credits. Fezmar9 (talk) 20:49, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

In Mike's thanks, he thanks XWAPAX (which alludes to the song "Wapakalypse), Wiggly ("Big Wiggly Style), Ben and Brayden, ("Ben has a Kid"), and Wildman, ("Danger: Wildman"). Dan thanks "all of our crew for being hilarious and great dudes, including [...] Chris aka Wiggly, Stephen Poole aka Wildman [...] Ben Wilcox and his adorable kid Brayden." James also thanks Wiggly and Ben. While it never specifically says that they based their song titles of their crew members, it is not very difficult to make the obvious connection.

Before playing "Assistant to the Regional Manager" at live shows, Mike dedicates the song to Dwight Schrute. Even before I saw their tour this year, I knew that this song title was a reference to The Office. Finally, "Dez Moines" is an obvious reference to Des Moines. Jstar37 (talk) 21:57, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

The liner notes are a stretch as they don't directly state what you want to add. I would be willing to consider adding that if some other editors weighed in. Some editors are also more picky about not including self-published sources as it is one of the criteria in the notability guidlines. The info about "Assistant to the Regional Manager" and "Dez Moines" can obviously not be sourced and verified, and therefore should not be added. Please at least skim through some of the policies I have linked in this discussion. Fezmar9 (talk) 22:36, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

If I found a Youtube Video of the song being played live, would that count as a source? You can clearly hear Mike say "Dwight K. Schrute" at the beginning. Jstar37 (talk) 23:42, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

Debates have been going on for a while on whether or not YouTube can be considered a reliable source. For a while there was even a specific citation template just for YouTube, but it has since been removed. I don't know where wikipedia currently stands on the issue. Either way, that is still just one little claim that hardly adds any substance to the article. Fezmar9 (talk) 23:45, 25 May 2009 (UTC)