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Latest comment: 1 year ago6 comments3 people in discussion
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The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.
Comment: The sources are in Portuguese, so I should ask the reviewer to assume my good faith—that’s a good article in the Portuguese Wikipedia. Any help is welcome, as this is my first nomination here. Best regards,
@RodRabelo7: the nominator's first nomination. An interesting article. The hooks work, but I have proposed hooks for punchiness, interest and possible April Fools' Day below. As a note: we probably need a ruling on the fair use images File:Twelves (2).jpg and File:Twelves (3).jpg - if they are not FU they can be removed and will not hold up the nomination. The main image is allowed under fair use since it is an image of the deceased subject. Earwig does not work because the sources are in foreign language and the article is in English. I google translated and spot checked four of the citation/references and did not find copyright violations. I made a few corrections to the article. Changed the lead to reflect the article and references and changed a fact that was misinterpreted. I also de-orphaned the article and added a see also with the List of individual apes. The article is new enough (3/26/23) and long enough (6601 characters). The QPQ is not needed. The article is neutral and is cited - the hooks are interesting and cited in the article. I did some copyediting and the article could use a bit more so I will continue to look and hope that @Cielquiparle: will look it over before a promotion.
Please see if you can approve these hooks and then I can tick this green.
(For April Fool's Day we're allowed to be slightly misleading, I am learning...) Cielquiparle (talk) 18:36, 27 March 2023 (UTC)Reply
Bruxton and Cielquiparle, all hooks seem to be fine in my opinion, so I don’t oppose any of them, allowing you to decide what fits better, specially if it’s posted on April Fools’ Day. In regards to the fair use images, I didn’t figure out exactly what you (Bruxton) were trying to say. Do we need a better rationale to keep them as fair use, or will they have to be removed from the article? Thanks for all your improvements to the article. Best regards, RodRabelo7 (talk) 18:50, 27 March 2023 (UTC)Reply
@Cielquiparle: I like it! Free to promote if you like it too. Regarding fair use, we would need an expert, the main image is 100% allowed and I will go through the rationales there to clean up. Bruxton (talk) 19:04, 27 March 2023 (UTC)Reply
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Hello! I will be reviewing this article. As this is my first time reviewing an article, I may make some mistakes; you are welcome to correct me. Reviews will be put under the GABox soon.
GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not)
Infobox looks good, image has a valid non-free use rationale.
For the lead, I would suggest merging some sentences together as it feels awkward to read. For example:
Latino received criticism for posting the image, and the Brazilian Institute of Environment and Renewable Natural Resources (Ibama) released a statement which said that the singer would be held responsible for the post.
Is there a source that says Twelves is a robust capuchin monkey specifically? It isn't mentioned anywhere else; the body says Twelves is a capuchin monkey.
I would recommend expanding the IBAMA acronym again in the first paragraph because the only part that explains the acronym is in the lead, and per MOS:LEAD, significant information should not appear in the lead if it is not covered in the remainder of the article.
... the singer's fascination with the number 12, also because Twelves was born on "12/12/12". Change the comma to "and" and don't italicize Twelves. Also would suggest adding the first ref at the end of the sentence because the source used doesn't mention "12/12/12".
He asked me, "what do you want as a present?"... It should be clarified that "he" in this quote is the businessman who worked with him. You can do it like: [Businessman who worked with Latino] asked me, "what do you want as a present?"...
... However, he thought the monkey was a cheap thing, not knowing that one of these costs about 120,000 to 150,000 Brazilian reais.
This translation seems too literal. I don't know Portugese, so you can correct me, but I think "However, he thought the price of a monkey was low, not knowing that one could cost around 120,000 to 150,000 Brazilian reals." could work.
Also, I think it's actually reals, per the Wikipedia article.
The real article does mention reals, but it only uses reais when referring to the plural. I think it's more natural. Skyshiftertalk 23:52, 8 August 2023 (UTC)Reply
I would move the blockquote to be right after the third paragraph because it is weird to bring up the quote after the information about the monkey's name and the microchip.
Y Did a different move, but should be better Skyshiftertalk 23:52, 8 August 2023 (UTC)Reply
Is the person who gifted Twelves a businessman who worked with Latino, like in reference 3, or is he Latino's former manager, as said in reference 7?
I didn't find that mention in source 7, but it should be the businessman. Skyshiftertalk 23:52, 8 August 2023 (UTC)Reply
The couple had all the necessary Ibama documentation,... I would change it to something like "The couple had all the documents required by IBAMA".
I think an explanation as to why they needed documents by IBAMA and a pet microchip here would help.
Y Added what IBAMA is. I think the pet microchip was optional. Skyshiftertalk 23:52, 8 August 2023 (UTC)Reply
The following month for his second birthday, there was a "super party" and it was televised and featured celebrity guests, including other monkeys. I would separate the sentence and rephrase a bit, something like: "For Twelves's birthday the following month, a "super party" was hosted. The event was broadcast live on television and featured celebrity guests, including other monkeys." I used 's after Twelves because of WP:'S.
Assuming that the original caption was in Portuguese because I can't access the source, I would recommend either put the original caption before the translated one, like this: The caption read: "Original caption" ("Translated caption"). or clarify that the caption is translated, like The translated caption read: "Translated caption"
What exactly did his followers criticized him for? It would help to clarify to the readers.
Added that they called Latino "irresponsible". Skyshiftertalk 12:17, 12 August 2023 (UTC)Reply
Like the former point, maybe a quote from Luisa Mell criticizing the post would help to show what aspect she had criticized. An example I can think of is the final paragraph's first sentence in When We Are in Need#Critical response.
The lead mentioned that IBAMA said the singer would be held responsible for the post, but it's not mentioned in the body. I would recommend adding the information.
It's mentioned on the 2nd paragraph. Skyshiftertalk 12:17, 12 August 2023 (UTC)Reply
For the first sentence of the third paragraph, I would use "suddenly disappeared" instead.
the monkey was found in a residence near the Jacarepaguá Airport lake, the next day. Assuming that the lake is not named or is owned by Jacarepaguá Airport but rather a lake near the airport, it should be clarified.
"very sad, inconsolable and not talking to anyone" I would change "not talking to anyone to "does not want to talk to anyone", it makes more sense.
It makes sense with "Latino was [...] not talking to anyone", no? Skyshiftertalk 12:51, 12 August 2023 (UTC)Reply
@Skyshifter Yes, but sad and inconsolable are adjectives, and not talking to anyone is past continuous, so grouping them together is strange. The option I presented is another way to phrase the sentence. Spinixster(chat!) 09:36, 13 August 2023 (UTC)Reply
Oh, someone just reminded me of this. Unfortunately, you might have to paraphrase the quotes because they are translated. If you find a source that translates the quotes into English, you can use that instead.
For example, instead of Latino's agent stated that the singer was "very sad, inconsolable and not talking to anyone". you'll have to do Latino's agent stated that he was inconsolable and did not want to talk to anyone.Spinixster(chat!) 10:26, 13 August 2023 (UTC)Reply
@Spinixster: Do you have the policy that says this must be done? This doesn't make sense to me. Skyshiftertalk 18:26, 13 August 2023 (UTC)Reply
@Skyshifter I have decided that since the quotes aren't really a big problem and can be sorted out later, I'll be passing the article. I'll be sure to let you know once there's a concrete answer to my concern. Spinixster(chat!) 15:09, 14 August 2023 (UTC)Reply
Same as the second point of the Controversy and disappearance for the caption in this section.
Like the last section, I would remove the blockquote as it doesn't really serve any purpose here.
Reduced quote. I think it's relevant to show how they "treat him like a son" and how that even "postponed their plans of becoming parents".
His monthly costs, around one thousand Brazilian reais, generated controversy. Monthly costs for what? Generated controversy for what? This part should be clarified. Something like "The monthly costs to take care of Twelves, which is around one thousand Brazilian reals, generated controversy as (reason)."
Latino also hired a private nanny for the animal, which was described as a "restless and noisy" creature and an "enlightened animal" for his dangerous behavior. I don't think the second part fits the sentence well, one part mentioning that Latino hired a private nanny for him, the other describing his personality. I would pair the second part with the next sentence since it seems quite short. Example: "Described as a "restless and noisy" creature and an "enlightened animal" for his dangerous behavior, he often went out for walks."
Perhaps a better sentence combination would help. I would mention the treatment first (from Twelves was treated similarly to a human baby to the end of the first paragraph and the second paragraph minus the sentence mentioned before), then personality, then the last sentence of the third paragraph. Then, in a new paragraph, the monkey's publicity and popularity (the first sentence of the first paragraph and the rest of the third paragraph).
I noticed that this article seems to be a translation of the article in Portuguese. I understand that translating articles is hard; I've gone through it myself, but I would suggest checking the article to see if there are any other translation mistakes or unclear sentences. Sometimes, translating the prose literally won't give the best result. If you need help, I recommend reading Wikipedia:WikiProject Guild of Copy Editors/How to.
Thanks! This article was actually translated by fellow Brazilian RodRabelo7, though I'm the one who created and raised it to GA status on pt.wiki. I'm not very good with English though, so if needed, I will send it to GOCE. Skyshiftertalk 12:51, 12 August 2023 (UTC)Reply
This is probably not needed for GA, but I would recommend translating the titles of the references.
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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