Talk:Thopha saccata/GA1
Latest comment: 10 years ago by Casliber in topic GA Review
GA Review edit
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Reviewer: Yzx (talk · contribs) 04:04, 28 November 2013 (UTC)
I'll take a look. Comments to follow. -- Yzx (talk) 04:04, 28 November 2013 (UTC)
- images ok
"Described by Johan Christian Fabricius in 1803, it was the first Australian cicada described" -- the two occurrences of "described" in this sentence is awkward
"thorax", "tymbal", "abdomen", and "eucalypt" should be linked in intro
"Some years they appear in great numbers, yet are absent in others" -- sentence structure is odd, suggest "they appear in great numbers in some years, yet are absent in others"
"tambour" should be linked
"John Obadiah Westwood designated it the type species of the genus" -- when?
"The male averages 4.75 cm (1.88 in) long and the female is 5.12 cm (2.02 in) long" -- sentence construction is odd; the male here uses "averages" and the female uses "is"
"The head is much broader than other cicadas" -- "than in other cicadas"
"and broader than the pronotum behind it" -- "and is broader"
what are the "vertex" and the "ocelli"?
"black pseudopupils from the posterior edge forwards" -- not sure what this means
- A spot (pseudopupil) that looks like a pupil - in this case it is at the posterior edge of the eye (rather than the centre) - added "of the eye" if that helps Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 07:05, 29 November 2013 (UTC)
"on either side of a median line" -- seems like a really complicated way of saying "paired cone-shaped spots"
"on either side more laterally" -- "lateral to these spots are a pair of markings" would be clearer
"Two sides of the thorax are distended when compared to other Australian cicadas" -- this sentence talks about shape, and seems misplaced amidst the parts about color
"conical protuberances with a..." -- the dash here should be after "cuticular nanostructures", as that's what this defines
"occasional females are darker in colour and markings" -- than males? Other females?
"black markings of the fore wing costa extending past the basal cell, and lacking the white pregenital band on the abdomen" -- "forewing" should be one word, "costa", "basal cell", and "pregenital band" should be linked or explained
- done all done apart pregenital band...
need to figure out best place to link for that one.All it means is that species has a prominent white band around the abdomen. Given it is immediately obvious to see, adding a descriptor like "pregenital" probably confuses more than it helps, so I have dropped it. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 01:31, 29 November 2013 (UTC)
- done all done apart pregenital band...
"The "song" of the Double Drummer" -- why is "song" in quotes? Also inconsistent capitalization of name
"The "song" of the Double Drummer is extremely loud—reportedly the loudest sound of any insect on earth[14]—and can reach an "almost unbearable"[10] volume in excess of 120 dB[15]" -- the refs here really interrupt the reading experience and I don't think it's necessary to break it up like this
"it is said to resemble high-pitched bagpipes" -- recommend "the song" instead of "it", since the previous sentence is so long that the pronoun loses track
- what are the "continuous" and "staccato" phases? How do these phases fit in with the abrupt starting and stopping/variable duration of the calls?
- Sometimes the cicadas just stop for a while, and start again - the constant and staccato are different calls within their call repertoire, as it were. Rewritten to clarify. Can't really extrapolate beyond the sources though. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 13:24, 29 November 2013 (UTC)
- I suppose I'm confused about when these song types are produced; if the songs are of variable duration, does that still mean that each song (no matter how long) contains a constant and a staccato component? Do these components alternate? Or is it that when the male calls, it's either a constant or a staccato song? -- Yzx (talk) 01:31, 2 December 2013 (UTC)
- Ok, I can only go what the sources say, which is that the male cicadas flip between constant and staccato segments, but with no set cycle time or anything. Given they stop and start quite often ( e.g. when anything goes near them they are smart enough to shut up to avoid getting eaten.) - I'd assume that either component might be present or absent in any given stretch of singing, however I can't say that as none of the sources discuss that. I presume it's generally both. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 04:52, 2 December 2013 (UTC)
- Sometimes the cicadas just stop for a while, and start again - the constant and staccato are different calls within their call repertoire, as it were. Rewritten to clarify. Can't really extrapolate beyond the sources though. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 13:24, 29 November 2013 (UTC)
- Right, the original wording is as follows (see [onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1440-6055.1972.tb01623.x/pdf here]) "The song is quite complex, consisting of two phases which alternate irregularly. There is a phase with continuous sound pulses and slight amplitude modulation at 4-6/sec., which may last for several minutes. Then there is a phase with increasingly frequent breaks giving a staccato effect, which lasts several seconds" To me this suggests the author is indicating the constant phase is always first, though I could easily believe he may not have meant it as such if there were contradictory statements elsewhere. Hence wording it as the "second" (me) gives it as much weight as original "then...." Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:01, 3 December 2013 (UTC)
- "alternate irregularly" says to me that there isn't a "first phase" and a "second phase", since which one follows the other is a relative thing. In the article, I would phrase it that the song is made up of two alternating phases, continuous and staccato, and leave out the implication of sequence. -- Yzx (talk) 16:22, 3 December 2013 (UTC)
- Right, the original wording is as follows (see [onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1440-6055.1972.tb01623.x/pdf here]) "The song is quite complex, consisting of two phases which alternate irregularly. There is a phase with continuous sound pulses and slight amplitude modulation at 4-6/sec., which may last for several minutes. Then there is a phase with increasingly frequent breaks giving a staccato effect, which lasts several seconds" To me this suggests the author is indicating the constant phase is always first, though I could easily believe he may not have meant it as such if there were contradictory statements elsewhere. Hence wording it as the "second" (me) gives it as much weight as original "then...." Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:01, 3 December 2013 (UTC)
"The pulse repetition frequency combines with the frequency" -- not sure what "combines with the frequency" means; which frequency?
"Double drummers also emit a distress call" -- is it still only males that do this?
the latter half of the article would be livened up by some more images, maybe of the forest or the wasp?
"in the branches or twigs usually of eucalypts" -- needs a comma after "twigs"
"On average about twelve eggs, among a total batch of a few hundred, are laid in each slit" -- recommend "On average about twelve eggs are laid in each slit, for a total of several hundred"
"The batch all hatch around" -- should be either "the batch hatches" or "the eggs all hatch"
"nymph" should be linked
"Nymphs of cicadas in general then spend from four to six years underground,[21] though the timing of the double drummer's life cycle is unknown." -- think the second half of this sentence should come first
"During construction of the final straight tunnel to the surface, sap is used to moisten hard soil" -- there's no subject that this sentence refers to, also how can sap be used in this manner? Does the insect carry it?
"exuviae" needs to be linked or explained
- "Within a forest, successive broods may emerge in different spots each year" -- not sure what this means; does a brood of a given year all come out in a particular spot?
- yes - seemed obvious to me from the wording so not sure how to reword to make it clearer Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:08, 29 November 2013 (UTC)
- If there's actually specific species- or population-wide brooding sites, that should be mentioned then, since I was under the impression that the nymphs emerged from all over the place within a forest. -- Yzx (talk) 01:31, 2 December 2013 (UTC)
- yes they emerge from one spot one year, and another spot the next time etc. Not sure if typical of all cicadas and hadn't read about itwith other species though wouldn't be surprised if holds true. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 10:39, 2 December 2013 (UTC)
- yes - seemed obvious to me from the wording so not sure how to reword to make it clearer Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:08, 29 November 2013 (UTC)
- Nothing in the cicada book on where nymphs emerge generally, but does note that a batch of eggs generally hatch together (so I guess you'd think they all drop down and burrow into the ground close to each other!) Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:01, 3 December 2013 (UTC)
- I can imagine that all the nymphs of a single brood would emerge in one spot, since presumably the female laid all her eggs close together. But would this apply to all the nymphs of a given year (i.e. multiple broods from multiple females, all located in the same area?) -- Yzx (talk) 16:22, 3 December 2013 (UTC)
- Yes I wondered that. Unless most of the whole batches of eggs that are laid are found and eaten, hence only occasional batches survive leading cohorts of nymphs that survive come from one or two batches (and hence emerge all close together in one or two spots(?)). No idea. Frustratingly, this is speculative as I can't find material on it Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 19:34, 3 December 2013 (UTC)
- Nothing in the cicada book on where nymphs emerge generally, but does note that a batch of eggs generally hatch together (so I guess you'd think they all drop down and burrow into the ground close to each other!) Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:01, 3 December 2013 (UTC)
"As cicadas extract their body and wings from the exuviae, they dry and harden" -- suggest "The cicada's body and wings dry and harden once free of the exuvia."
any chance of a distribution map?
"It is found in more elevated areas" -- "elevated" here is ambiguous; do you mean relatively elevated (like a hill) or absolute elevation?
"and hence the climate there is similar to that in southeast Queensland" -- the causality here's reversed; it should be "because the climate there is similar..."
"alight on large eucalypts,[10]," -- double comma
"their bodies found washed up on beaches" -- this phrase needs to be linked better with the first part of the sentence
"in the stomach of foxes" -- "in the stomachs"
"Flies, beetles and ants have been observed feeding on sap from holes drilled by cicadas, with ants sometimes even seeking to pull the cicada's rostrum out." -- this doesn't seem to fit in the predation section
"In popular culture" should be renamed, as keeping them as (short-term) pets isn't pop culture
some refs have first name spelled out, others only have initials
refs 19 and 29 -- unclear which source they refer to
-- Yzx (talk) 05:43, 28 November 2013 (UTC)
One more note, the author for Tettigonia saccata under Synonyms shouldn't be in parentheses, if it's the original published name. The same goes for Cicada saccata, if Germar is the original author. -- Yzx (talk) 06:16, 2 December 2013 (UTC)
- de parenthesized Fabricius (oriignal author), which predates Germar Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 10:36, 2 December 2013 (UTC)
Issues have been addressed to my satisfaction. I'm happy to promote the article. -- Yzx (talk) 22:44, 3 December 2013 (UTC)