Talk:The Independent Florida Alligator

Improving the Article

• Discuss the leadership over the years, and expound upon the famous alumni (alot of them are still missing). Jccort (talk) 21:04, 5 June 2011 (UTC)

External links modified

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Corrections needed by someone who knows how...

1. The information in the box on the right side of the page is out-of-date. It changes three times each year - each semester. Actually, since it is unknown who is updating this section, I would suggest that all of the editor positions be eliminated from this box. 2. In the area where it talks about Patricia Carey becoming general manager... Please add: In 2019, Shaun O'Connor, who had worked at the paper beginning as a student in 2009, succeeded Carey as general manager. 3. This part is wrong... "That same year, the paper switched from twice-weekly printing to its current daily format." Correct information: In 1962 the paper switched from twice-weekly printing to five times a week. In fall of 2017 the paper went to three days a week and then in March of 2020 it began it's current weekly publication schedule. 4. Include verbiage when talking about the purchase of The High Springs Herald to include the reasoning that it was purchased to provide a source of additional intern experiences for journalism and advertising students. 5. To clarify: change - "In May 2016 The Alligator moved operations from its former location on University Avenue, where it had operated for over 30 years, to the Gainesville Sun's building." to be "In May 2016 The Alligator moved operations from its former location on University Avenue, where it had operated for over 30 years, to lease office space in the Gainesville Sun's building. We don't want it to be misconstrued (as it has been by some people) that we are now PART OF the Sun. 6. Under the Rivals and related publications section -- The last two paragraphs: The "readership program" is no longer happening. And The Really Independent Florida Crocodile is now defunct. I am unsure of the dates for these.

If someone more knowledgeable in Wikipedia could update this page to include these changes, it would be much appreciated. It is important to us to have correct information about our organization in this article. Please contact me if you have any questions or if I can provide any assistance with this. Thank you. E-358-lit (talk) 15:34, 16 May 2024 (UTC)

Hi there.

1. I agree removing the editor positions from this box until we find references we can cite to support it.
2. Do you have any source for Carey becoming general manager, or about O'Connor starting the position in 2019? I'm assuming it's been published in some kind of article somewhere.
3. Do you have a source that explains the switch from twice-weekly to daily format?
4. Do you have a source about The High Springs Herald being purchased? I'm sure it was announced in an article somewhere.
5. Do you have a source about the office move? Since you think the current wording is misleading, if we can't find a source it may make sense to remove it from the article as it isn't hugely relevant to have an unsourced mention of the office space.
6. Any source you can find here would be valuable.

Mokadoshi (talk) 16:08, 16 May 2024 (UTC)

1. I don't know why our digitized archives with the University of Florida Library would not suffice.

2. Probably, but no idea when.

3. It was 2x/wk then 5x/wk then 3x/wk then 1x/wk. No idea of any published explanation. It's just something we did.

4. I have no idea.

5. Gainesville Sun article 3-29-2016

6. https://ufdc.ufl.edu/collections/alligator/results?q= Chances are very good that the answers can be found here.

As far as we are concerned all of the information here is relevant and should be included. I don't see anyone challenging any of it. We are likely the only ones who know that these things happened and know of no other way to corroborate these happenings. E-358-lit (talk) 17:13, 16 May 2024 (UTC)

Well, that's the point, isn't it? If you can't verify these things with sources, especially with secondary sources, it's not something of notable interest, is it? Also, have a read through Wikipedia:Verifiability. --Hammersoft (talk) 21:48, 16 May 2024 (UTC)

As Hammersoft notes, this is the fundamental problem you're facing here, and it's hard to ignore once people are aware something is going on.

The very conceit of Wikipedia is that verifiability is what is important, not necessarily truth. We want secondary sources for things; we want to hear what other parties say about The Independent Florida Alligator, not what the Independent Florida Alligator says about itself. Now, there are times we accept primary sources, such as for uncontroversial, simple facts, but they still have to be verifiable, and used as little as possible. Information about the Independent Florida Alligator that only the Independent Florida Alligator knows about and no unconnected party can verify is information that has to be unbelievably compelling and crucial to include.

I know it's frustrating to not simply be able to update a page about yourself with things you *know* to be true. I'm in your shoes more than you know. But this is the basis for Wikipedia, so you have to be careful and patient. Thankfully, you're discussing these issues, where many people and organizations in your position choose to do things like edit war or make dubious legal threats. Housing extremely minor information that is out-of-date is far less concerning, in the context of Wikipedia standards, than housing extremely minor information that is unverifiable. CoffeeCrumbs (talk) 13:34, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

I think what the main difficulty here is that most other organizations' pages are able to use the local newspaper as a secondary source of verification. In this case, we ARE the local newspaper. I doesn't really leave us with any alternative source.

I've pretty much given up at this point. I've given you all of the info that I have. If it isn't enough, there is nothing more I can do. We will just have to let the inaccuracies lie.

This does make me less inclined to believe anything that I read on Wikipedia now though. E-358-lit (talk) 14:32, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

The fact that Wikipedia strictly requires reliable sources makes you less likely to believe what you read here? Okay. glman (talk) 14:47, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

This highlights a common Wikipedia problem - that someone with personal experience of the subject in question isn't considered a reliable source because they're "original research". As far as I know, everything E-358-lit has said is correct (he's certainly right on point 3, the Alligator was never a daily. In it's prime it was M-F, there never were Sat or Sun issues.) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:589:300:C7C0:A4FA:10D8:6A64:6E25 (talk) 21:00, 23 October 2024 (UTC)