Talk:Thérèse Rein/Archive 1

wikipedia is an encyclopaedia not a directory or search engine of newslinks mentioning the subject. If you wish to use the links as references for information you have actually put into the article, that is fine, but it is not appropriate for you to leave links on the article for people to use as research for the article. Cheers, WikiTownsvillian 09:41, 26 May 2007 (UTC)

At this point, the article is... sparse. And while the article may be expanded in future, these articles are each a lot more informative than what we have on this site. I don't see the harm of leaving some links for further reading. Not everyone wants to wade through a ton of identical google news articles.--Quietprice 09:53, 26 May 2007 (UTC)

Hi Quietprice, welcome to wikipedia, in reply to your comment I suggest you try diverting your efforts to actually writing an article, as you say the info on this article is sparse, but that's an argument that this article should be redirected again until someone is willing to write a proper article and not just a one sentence attack on the subject. I suggest moving the newslinks to this talk page, so that it is there as a resource for those who may wish to expand the article but it is not trying to turn the page into a construction site. Thanks, WikiTownsvillian 10:03, 26 May 2007 (UTC)

If you'd looked at the articles, you'd have found they weren't all with regard to IR related issues. They also looked at how she rose to become the person she is today, especially the Age article (which would not, as you suggested, been easily found via Google News).

I wouldn't characterise what I wrote as an attack on the subject. I included the current controversy because that's what she's mainly known for. It established her notability, and there's a disturbing trend in Wikipedia of sweeping women articles under the carpet (outside the entertainment industry). So with regards to writing the article... probably not. If I stayed here for long periods, I'd go mad. That said, the links are useful to readers (if not to writers), and should remain. I don't see a good reason to remove them.--Quietprice 10:22, 26 May 2007 (UTC)

Hi Quietprice, I agree that the subject person is notable for an article, but that article actually has to be written by someone. I will check out the newsitems tomorrow and if you are correct in that they provide good background information generally about the subject I would be happy to contribute that info to the article and reference it to the newsitem. I am interested in the trend you identify of articles being written about males and would be interested in seeing some stats on that. I will try to write a decent stub myself in the coming days and that should resolve all our worries. Cheers WikiTownsvillian 18:22, 26 May 2007 (UTC)

News articles

links to news articles regarding the May 2007 IR related issues:

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20867,21786418-601,00.html

http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/therese-rein-defends-life-support/2007/05/26/1179601711711.html

http://www.news.com.au/business/story/0,23636,21796581-462,00.html

http://www.theage.com.au/news/in-depth/the-thing-about-therese/2007/04/23/1177180562164.html

Use of accents in name

Does Rein actually have accents in Therese? is this her official version? I've never seen it ever in the media. Suggest removing unless reliable source can be found. Michellecrisp 04:20, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

I actually came here to make exactly that point. Kevin pronounces it "te-raise", but that doesn't necessarily imply French diacritics are required in the spelling. The article is titled "Therese Rein", and that's how the media spell it. She's Australian born, and there's no information to suggest her parents chose French spelling. I'm going to be Bold and make the changes. -- JackofOz 22:07, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Stop the Presses. On closer inspection, I find this, which tells us " ... from a young age she was particular. She’s long insisted on spelling her name Thérèse, which renders the pronunciation as "tuh-rayz". Her Burgmann file shows that someone has hand-penned in the acute (é) and the grave (è) above typed spellings of her name.”.

So, what’s actually needed is a move from “Therese Rein” to “Thérèse Rein”. I’ll do it. -- JackofOz 22:14, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

The "spelling note" in the article is ugly and to my mind unnecessary, can't we just put the reference next to her name. Cheers, WikiTownsvillian 09:08, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

By all means. Be my guest. -- JackofOz 09:14, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Reference 1 is nice to have to be sure of orthography, just one problem - those accents don't in fact 'render the pronunciation as "tuh-rayz"'. Actually, those accents make it tay-REZ /te'rɛz/. Nevertheless, I have heard Kevin pronounce it the way Jack and the reference say, /tə'reɪz/. I think we can assume that Kevin says it the way she prefers. Therefore I'm going to trim that quote (so that people don't think that's the normal way to pronounce Thérèse) leaving enough info to show that she does like the accents. I'll make the pronunciation at the top match Kevin's pronunciation. Nick 00:15, 24 November 2007 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Nick81 (talk • contribs)

It's odd to read of inserting accents in her name, because I did just that in August ... I must point out however that the name of her company was THERESE REIN & ASSOCIATES PTY. LTD. Reference? ASIC. Comments before I change that? Bellthorpe (talk) 05:54, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

The names of companies do not necessarily reflect the spelling of their owners' names. It's one thing for her to prefer Thérèse in relation to herself, but she can hardly insist on her clients spelling her company's name that way, particularly if it was registered as Therese (no accents). I'm reminded of Toyota, which was founded by a Mr Toyoda. He named it after himself, but for some reason slightly altered the spelling. -- JackofOz 13:33, 4 December 2007 (UTC)

Notability

Is Therese really notable in her own right? Per the standard for inclusion of people? I'm not particularly sure on this point. --TheSeer (TalkˑContribs) 11:47, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

Is Laura Bush? Is Cherie Blair? Is Laureen Harper? Rein is actually more notable in her own right. •Jim62sch• 18:48, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

So being married to a prime minister automatically guarantees notability? — Chris.B | talk 20:07, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

I agree that it shouldn't but clearly it does. The media make spouses household names. There's nothing we can do to stop that. But, as Jim rightly points out, Rein is more notable than some political spouses because of her prominence as a businesswoman and that potential conflict of interest (which she is trying to avoid). Nick 21:16, 25 November 2007 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Nick81 (talk • contribs)

It's not for Wikipedia for "stop" people becoming notable, or to decide who should or should not be notable, but to record those who, for whatever reason, are notable. We're like a dictionary in this respect. If a very large number of people were noted using the word "zongle" to mean something, and its use continued unabated, lexicographers would be derelict if they chose not to record the word on the basis that in their opinion it shouldn't exist. It may not have been true in an earlier age, but in this day and age, being married to a prime minister automatically guarantees notability. It's reflected notability, if you like, but still notability. I note that of the PMs' wives over the past 35 years, the only ones we don't have articles on are Tamara Fraser and Sonia McMahon, which are curious omissions. Nobody would argue these women are not notable, particularly the latter but certainly the former as well. Huge amounts have been written about both of them. Maybe we have an aversion to Russian-sounding names. -- JackofOz (talk) 21:39, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

Has Rudd really had 25 wives before her?

There's a problem with that infobox. Of course it's meant to mean "Spouse of the 26th Prime Minister", not (26th Spouse) of the Prime Minister. But "Spouse of the Prime Minister of Australia" is not a stand-alone title, so 26th(Spouse of the Prime Minister) doesn't make sense. I'm changing it to exclude this artificial category. Nick 15:04, 3 December 2007 (UTC)

"Incumbant" to the "Office" of the Spouse of the Prime Minister

As we have agreed that the Spouse of the Prime Minister is not an 'office', the terminology is misleading. It reads as if this 'office' is some sort of position officially recognised by the Australian Constitution or by Parliament etc. Rein, I think we can agree, has a 'role' and is in a 'position' but does not hold an 'office'. I'm changing some of the terminology to reflect the true nature of this position. ScottMacGregor1985 (talk) 02:38, 16 August 2008 (UTC)

OK I just went to do that and found that the information is formated in an infobox specifically for 'officeholders'. I don't know if there is a more appropriate alternative so someone might want to look for one, my wikipedic skills aren't that advanced. ScottMacGregor1985 (talk) 02:44, 16 August 2008 (UTC)