Talk:Simba

Mohatu, Ahadi,

Well, if Kopa is in there [based on the books], but isn't Simba also Mohatu's great grandson? Simba would also be Ahadi's and Uru (The Lion King)'s grandson. --71.168.231.215 20:16, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

Languages

I'm going to assume that bit about Bantu and Swahili isn't redundant, Swahili's a Bantu language? Anyway, I noticed that his appearances in Timon and Pumbaa aren't specifically listed here, in terms of who voiced him. It sounded like Cam Clarke, though.

---

Oh, and wouldn't it make more sense to refer to the short-maned Simba as 'adolescent' rather than 'teenage' since he's probably not yet a year old?

Kopa

It's a disputed subject amongst fans, but I've edited this article *slightly* to include minor references to Kopa. These include listing him as offspring in the introduction and naming him as he cub presented at the fist film. I'm not going to argue about retconns and fan theories and such, but it's clear that presentations at the end of The Lion and the opening of Simba's pride are different occasions, and if I remember correctly the director's have stated once of twice that the cub be presented in the finale of the first film is in fact Kopa. This might be artistic liberty but who am I to analyze that. Perhaps if there was some small explanation of Kopa's place in the TLK continuity things might be less confusing.

At any rate, Kopa is an important part of the continuity and should, I believe, be mentioned in this article. After all Simba fathered him. I Just Kissed Al Pacino august 14 2007

Kopa never existed in the movie universe which became official by the first film's makers in 2003, on the DVD's commentary track. I didn't remove your mention of Kopa but I added to it explaining that fact of Kopa not existing in the movies, in more detail and also some more information on what the book universe is like. (TheVampireOutlaw (talk) 05:51, 25 October 2010

The director's commentary track from the DVD was most likely the same one that was on the Laserdisc edition of the movie, released about 1995, well before the storyline for Simba's Pride had been finalized. The name "Fluffy" used in that track was probably a nickname given to him by the animators during development of the original film that was not meant to be taken as an official name for the cub. It it appears likely that the developers of Simba's Pride either didn't know about or simply ignored The Lion King: Six New Adventures, from which Kopa originates. --mwalimu59 (talk) 06:19, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

But the commentary track was made/released after those books and Kopa were approved into the book universe by the general Disney in 1994 - and thus the cub in the end of the first film is not "him" nor Kopa because the cub's creators didn't call it "him" nor Kopa when they should've if it was supposed to be that. Kopa wasn't created in the Disney company and as evident, he wasn't approved into the movie universe by even the first film's makers. So whether the sequel film's makers didn't know or ignored the books doesn't make a difference because evidently Kopa never existed in the first film. And as "Fluffy" is a unisex nickname and the creators didn't give it a gender, it of course blends the girl Kiara into "Fluffy" as Kiara is the only other official cub in the movie universe while her film makes no references to any siblings. --TheVampireOutlaw (talk) 22:12, 11 November 2010

Actually it's Kiara never exsisted in movie's universe because of huge plot holes in SP which violate original movie's plot. And I don't care what Disney say since I can prove the impossibility of SP in TLK universe and there're many fans in fandom who don't accept SP as sequel. The only good point is ignoring anything except TLK itself. Neither TLK SNA nor SP nor TLK 1/2 nor any Japanese games should not be treated as canon since they are made by different peoples and contradict to each other.217.173.18.179 (talk) 20:16, 18 January 2011 (UTC)

?

"Simba also appears at the Walt Disney Parks and Resorts as a meetable character." Really? I have never found anything that confirms this. The only time I have seen him is as a robot up on a float. (Mchelada (talk) 02:45, 5 December 2007 (UTC))

Yeah, I've never seen Simba walking around. He isn't there —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.108.149.138 (talk) 02:55, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

-There is another place that Simba can be seen. In Walt Disney World's attraction living with the land. Well, it used to be there! I don't know for sure if it is still there. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.23.74.71 (talk) 18:58, 18 March 2011 (UTC)

Other uses

I think Simba should be a disambiguation page, and this article should be moved to Simba (The Lion King) or similar. Failing that, there should be at least a mention of other uses of the word in this article - I got to this page looking for the rebels who captured Stanleyville in 1964 during the Congo Crisis. Opera hat (talk) 16:36, 21 December 2007 (UTC)

Er, OK - there is a Simba (disambiguation) page. I've added a link to it in the article. Opera hat (talk) 16:41, 21 December 2007 (UTC)

Swahili

Is Simba related to the Sanskrit सिंह (siṃhá) lion? Mallerd (talk) 18:39, 31 October 2009 (UTC)

Proto-Bantu *cimba. Cognate with Nyamwezi nshimba, Umbundu simbe, Venda tsimba, Zulu nsimba. Mallerd (talk) 18:50, 31 October 2009 (UTC)

Not without a source saying otherwise it isn't. -- AnmaFinotera (talk · contribs) 18:52, 31 October 2009 (UTC)

Righteous. Mallerd (talk) 18:37, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Children and relatives

I've removed any information which is not from TLK itself. Excuse me but it's completelly incorrect to mix Kopa and Kiara. 1) There're many fans who never considered SP as sequel because of huge plot holes like Zira's lionesses from nowhere. 2) The disappearance of Kopa in SP is a big deal and must be explained. I guess that I ask too much from a movie which can't explain even it's own plot but since Kopa is not mentioned we must admit that he never existed in SP universe. Countless fans' "explanations" make no sense. 3) I don't want to discuss SP and why it never existed in TLK universe since this's encyclopedia not forum but it's really good to write that Simba has at least one cub unnamed in TLK and describe Kopa and Kiara with other SP's characters separately in related sections. If this's not the only position which can be accepted by everybody I don't know what is.217.173.18.179 (talk) 20:57, 18 January 2011 (UTC)

You're entitled to your view on which movies in the TLK series should or should not be considered canon, but the prevailing view, and as far as we know the official one from Disney, is that SP and TLK1.5 are canon to the universe, and that TLKSNA was retconned or never acknowledged as canon by the creators of the sequels. Like it or not, Wikipedia is about presenting what can be found from independent reliable sources, not about catering to the views of fans who may or may not agree with how Disney chose to continue the series. I was an active TLK fan for a while myself and I can easily see where arguments for and against the viewpoints you present would come from, but if it hasn't gone beyond the level of discussions on fansites, it doesn't belong here. --mwalimu59 (talk) 21:34, 19 January 2011 (UTC)

And why my (and many other fans) point of view is worse than other? The problem is TLK SNA is as official as SP. Disney may say anything they want but FFS there're lot of people who just don't understand what happened to Kopa and Disney gives no explanations. If you insist that we can discard TLK SNA because it was never treated as canon by SP's creators then I ask you who're they SP creator? They don't have any relations to TLK. Why we shouldn't dicard their work either?? I doubt if they ever watched TLK. Scar never had any support from lionesses so outlanders never existed in TLK-universe. SP has no plot - stop discussion. Actually the only thing we must admit that Disney don't care about consistency in their universes. They can change anything in any time. Like any other media-corporation. Look at comixes like Batman or Captain America they have dozen contradictory universes.

About fans and fact. It's fact that many fans hate SP because of countless plot-holes. I've all rights to post this information to article about SP. But I doubt if it wouls stay there at lest 24 hours because of stupid SP-fans. If SP-fans believe in Kiara it's their rights. But any attemt to insist that Simba has Kiara is nothing more than SP-fans' attempts to dictate their point of view. Write anything you want in SP and TLK SNA sections but I remove any information which is not from TLK itself. It's totally correct to write that Simba has Kiara in SP section. But it's incorrect to mention Kiara, Kopa, Tanabi or what-is-his-name in main section which shouldn't contain anything questionable.

PS aren't you Joe McCauley? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.173.18.179 (talk) 14:23, 27 January 2011 (UTC)

I'm not going to agree or disagree with your arguments as to why SP should not be considered canon (or whether TLKSNA should). In fact I think you make some very valid points. But it doesn't matter. On Wikipedia we have to present the information available based on reliable sources. If you can find official information from Disney or anything from published media to back up your point of view, we can include it here. As far as I know, you're trying to represent a viewpoint that is fancruft, little known outside of fansites and discussion boards, which by and large are not considered reliable sources.

There is an article over on Wikifur that goes into some detail on the identity of the cub (I wrote the initial draft of the article, though it's since been updated by other contributors, and I see you (or at least your IP) are among them). Over there we have a lot more latitude to delve into such matters. You're welcome to make further updates, but we do ask that you step back from your personal opinions and keep the article NPOV and representative of all viewpoints.

And yes, I am Joe McCauley (the same one who used to be active in TLK fandom). --mwalimu59 (talk) 16:21, 28 January 2011 (UTC)

I'm Beltar. The Russian fan from FA who had translated some of your fan-fiction to Russian. I'll not spend any time to discussion about SP but I mark anything from SP as "in Simba's Pride" and add Kopa with mark "in TLK SNA". If somebody belives in Simba's Pride possibility it's their own problem but Kopa must be mentioned too. About the whole topic "who's the cub" The only correct answer is Fluffy. Any fan's theory like "Zira killed Kopa" is nothing more than fan's theory. The death of one from Simba's children is VERY BIG deal. It must be mentioned so Kopa never existed in SP universe. Another problem is the question itself. If Disney can redraw any canon character we must admit that they don't care about any integrity of TLK universe and no sequel or book can be treated as canon. Why spend hours for attemts to prove that TLK SNA fit in SP universe? It's like discussion about connection between first "Batman" comix and Nolan's "The Dark Knight" film. I can't get why SP-fans don't understand that. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.173.18.179 (talk) 21:18, 29 January 2011 (UTC)

sources

this article has 5 movies and books and tv as topics, yet only 4 sources. Please add additional inline citations to support additional topics. --RichardMills65 (talk) 05:33, 14 March 2012 (UTC)

It's on my cleanup list, but if anyone gets to it first be my guest :) ~ Kimelea (talk) 13:32, 14 March 2012 (UTC)

How many TLK fans consider TLKSNA books as canon?

I have notice that many TLK fans have read these books and they think that cub at the end of first film is Kopa. The problem is that Kopa only exists in the books not in the movies. When SP was released, many fans were not happy that Kopa was not in this film and they created these theories like "Kopa was killed by Zira or by an Outlander lioness" and "Kopa running away". These books weren't made by Disney. -- Nectaria 14:48, 26 June 2012 (UTC)

Fans will never agree on this. Some insist that the books aren't canon while some would argue that even though the books weren't made by Disney it got their permission which means the story is kind of canon, to some extent. The theories about Kopa killed by Zira stemmed from the fact that the movie didn't explain why Simba exiled her and how she pushed Kovu toward Simba in the beginning of the movie and told him that if he wanted revenge he could do it to Kovu. The movie never explained why Simba would want a revenge, and thus the "Kopa killed by Zira" theory was born. While it is plausible, I personally don't think Kopa was canon at all. I don't think he should be included, but if he must then maybe we can put something like Kopa (son) (only in TLKSNA)Krystaleen 16:35, 26 June 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for your comment, Krystaleen. Yes, I have seen some fans who don't consider the books as canon. I have seen many fan-made videos on Youtube about Kopa's story. The same fans who believe the "Kopa was killed by Zira" theories also believe that Kopa fell in love with Vitani. Most TLK family tree videos on Youtube have the TLKSNA characters. I remember that TLK fans created a family tree page on Wikipedia and later other users deleted it. -- Nectaria 20:10, 26 June 2012 (UTC)

First, a reminder that Wikipedia talk pages are not a forum, so it's only appropriate to discuss this here insofar as it relates to what belongs in any of the related articles here on Wikipedia. Having said that, the prevailing view among TLK fans (though as you note there are dissenters) seems to be to only treat TLKSNA as canon insofar as it does not conflict with more definitively canon sources. For instance, we can accept that Scar's real name is Taka, and his and Mufasa's father's name is Ahadi (if memory serves, both of these originated from TLKSNA), but the cub's identity (Kopa) is disregarded in favor of SP (Kiara). mwalimu59 (talk) 21:51, 26 June 2012 (UTC)

Yes, I know that talk pages on Wikipedia aren't forums but it's unknown if Scar had a real name in the TLK movie universe and Ahadi's name was never mentioned in the TLK movies either. Thanks, Joe! -- Nectaria 22:53, 26 June 2012 (UTC)

so what do you think about my suggestion? If you agree then everybody from SP should have (Simba's Pride) too to make it clear it's not from the first movie. Actually now that I think about it, we should put it there even if we're not going to include characters from TLKSNA because I'm pretty sure there are people out there who have never seen SP or even know it existed because it was never shown in theaters so they maybe have no idea Kiara even existed.--Krystaleen 11:45, 27 June 2012 (UTC)

Your suggestion is fine but I'm afraid that some other users will not agree and they will remove it. -- Nectaria 13:34, 27 June 2012 (UTC)

Which is why we're discussing this. If the conclusion is to include it then users can't remove it because we would point out that it's been discussed and decided.--Krystaleen 13:39, 27 June 2012 (UTC)

OK! Thanks, Krystaleen. -- Nectaria 13:48, 27 June 2012 (UTC)

So you mean you agree with me?--Krystaleen 13:57, 27 June 2012 (UTC)

Yes! -- Nectaria 14:05, 27 June 2012 (UTC)

Neither TLK SNA neither SP are not canon. I don't want to discuss countless plot holes in SP since it's really not a forum but we must write all official information. TLK SNA and Kopa are official. If SP contradicts with TLK and TLK SNA this is a problem for SP and it's fans. Kopa added. Period! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.173.18.179 (talk) 15:52, 30 January 2014 (UTC)

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Name origin

How is there nothing in this article that explains where the name "Simba" came from? Tad Lincoln (talk) 05:59, 19 March 2023 (UTC)