Talk:River Phoenix/Archive 1

Archive 1

Archive 2

Melissa Etheridge

Does anyone know which song she apparently wrote about River? I'm fairly sure it was Natalie Merchant instead (with, sensibly enough, River), and will be editing that. If people know that Etheridge did indeed write a song about him, feel free to add her back in, but I've turned up nothing on Google. -- Dandelions 23:06, 19 November 2005 (UTC)

Musical References

The song "Anyone Can Play Guitar" on Radiohead's album Pablo Honey is about River Phoenix. Deleted Thom York wrote it concerning reading Morrison's lyrics as poetry. [1]

The band Snow Patrol wrote the song "Run" about River. If it can be referenced somewhere add it back in. I've found nothing to confirm that the song had anything to do with Phoenix. --Elthearosa 23:05, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

Upon hearing of Phoenix's death, the guitarist Throb from British band Primal Scream branded him a "lightweight". Where is the reference to this? (My opinion is the guy who said that is an asshole who takes a bunch of drugs and is poking fun at the fact that River couldn't hold his drugs)

Needs To Be Re-edited or Re-written

Someone re-edited this article to include unverifiable rumors of R. Phoenix parenting a child in 1988. The whole document has been cut and pasted together without continuance.

Much of this article is un-cited. I AM NOT SURE I BELIEVE THIS

I dont believe this is true that he died of a speedball. And I dont believe he injected. I have read that he snorted the heroin, and had meth in his system. I dont think he injected.

Everyone lives in a glasshouse and everyone makes mistakes, his was fatal.

..eh yes. Anyway, this article as it is now suggests the overdose came out of nowhere. I really don't know whether this is true. The article should make explicit what his drug habits were before the overdose: many?, none?, some?, unknown?, maybe documented controversy? Pukkie 21:54, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

..His family never made a public announcement to drug addiction. There is the letter his mother wrote to the LA Times stating he was not a regular user and there seems to be a statement from then girlfriend that he had been clean for 3 months before he died. Anthony Kiedis did make a statement in his book Scar Tissue that River Phoenix had been drinking heavily and using since they had been introduced.

(The autopsy also revealed traces of cough syrup, crystal meth and cannabis in his blood.) Where in his autopsy does it specify what drugs he died of, can anyone verify that the autopsy report specified chemical ingestion? [2] and [3] show only acute multiple drug ingestion. As for ephedrine it is found in cough syrup, crystal meth, and some vitamin supplements.

Grammar

This article was rife with poor grammar, vague pronouns, poor word choice, and incoherent narrative. After spending about an hour and a half correcting this, someone is "undoing" my edits. I would appreciate it if you would stop. It violates the spirit of Wikipedia. If you want to actually IMPROVE on my version: Fine with me. But please stop reverting to an earlier version that is clearly INFERIOR. Even if you wrote it. Best wishes for a happy Wiki experience. KarynN1 21:44, 22 August 2007 (UTC)Professor K

I agree that the revert was done in bad faith. In the future, please add your comments to the bottom of the talk page. María (críticame) 23:49, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

Plagiarism?

I don't know which came first, but the first paragraph of the article here and the paragraph on River Phoenix from this page are eerily similar. Toxicologia (talk) 07:17, 19 January 2009 (UTC)

"Us" came first - it looks like one of those sites that copies Wikipedia (notice how all the text resembles the style of Wikipedia opening paragraphs). All Hallow's Wraith (talk) 09:25, 19 January 2009 (UTC)

Viper Room

If someone wants to investigate and find a source feel free... he did not overdose outside the viper room. it was inside and he was carried out by the bouncers. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.28.43.12 (talk) 02:07, 13 February 2009 (UTC)

Regarding Phoenix's statements about his life stories

Remember that one should take with a grain of salt statements Phoenix said about himself - He admitted that he often lied and changed his stories many times to the press. WhisperToMe (talk) 18:27, 19 October 2009 (UTC)

Family Guy Episode

The Family Guy episode mentioned in the cultural references section is "Three Kings" (Season 7, Episode 15)150.203.110.103 (talk) 14:01, 2 November 2009 (UTC)

heath ledger (link)

at the start (died of a drug overdose) links to heath ledger article! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 91.189.67.59 (talk) 01:38, 3 January 2010 (UTC)

Reverted this link; tenuous at best. LPS (talk) 08:02, 3 January 2010 (UTC)

references in popular culture

Why was this section removed from the artical? it was interesting. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.132.248.191 (talk) 18:42, 17 April 2010 (UTC)

Article about River or his family?

- Is it me, or does the article go into way to much detail about his siblings/family ect? I won't remove this stuff but hopefully others will chime in. Also, this article is a train wreck as far as unsourced material goes, but nothing new in that I guess. Anyways, --Tom (talk) 00:27, 16 May 2010 (UTC)

Contradiction

The article says "Phoenix died at the age of 23 from an accidental drug overdose of heroin and cocaine (speedball)" But then this is contradicted a sentence later saying "was offered Persian Brown (a powerful form of methamphetamine mixed with opiates, which is then snorted)". The truth needs to be found out and then the article edited accordingly

I agree completely, both are speedballs, but which is it? meth & "some opiate" or cocaine and heroin? 67.5.156.119 (talk) 04:07, 7 December 2007 (UTC)

Though I applaud River's and his family's vegan-related activism, it has to be pointed out that early in his career River was a principal in a Red Lobster commercial. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.213.238.4 (talk) 00:18, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

There is another contradiction under "Death". It says:

“his autopsy report revealed no traces of methamphetamine in his system, but rather cocaine, morphine and diazepam (Heroin metabolizes to Morphine and shows up as such in the blood).”

The reference posted is a FranksReelReviews article located at: http://www.franksreelreviews.com/shorttakes/phoenix.htm. If you read the article, it states:

"River Phoenix's autopsy showed lethal levels of cocaine and morphine (heroin shows up as morphine, as the body metabolizes it), Valium, marijuana and ephedrine. Ephedrine is the main ingredient found in crystal meth."

I am removing the comment "no traces of methamphetamine in his system, but rather" and including "ephedrine" to the list of substances in his blood.

GekkoForLife (talk) 18:51, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

Sexual abuse controversy

I think it's crucial to add the information about River's sexual abuse while in Children of God. He made it clear he lost virginity at the age of 4 with other "kids" (I'll cite that interview in Details mag when I write about it), but reportedly his publicist made him say it wasn't serious. Yet again when asked about COG a few years later he said: They are awful. They ruin people's lives. And then the article of other girl that was molested in COG that was spread in 2007. — Cannot (talk) 20:26, 9 January 2011 (UTC)

poorly written article.

Anyone that's editing this article should be ashamed of their poor grammar skills. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.35.32.21 (talk) 18:11, 8 April 2011 (UTC)

I agree this article needs some work, but keep in mind that Wikipedia articles about popular stars have most likely been edited by hundreds of editors. The article could probably benefit from a rewrite by one writer, and I've been planning to to add some information about certain aspects of his career, but I've been busy with other articles recently, so I'll need to wait until I have more time. --- Crakkerjakk (talk) 18:29, 8 April 2011 (UTC)

Talent as an actor

This article would benefit from saying more towards the end about his legacy as an actor, seeing how he was nominated for an Academy Award. Just something to consider in making this article better. Bravo! Alfa! Papa! 20:30, 28 June 2011 (UTC)

How do we get RP's page to featured status?

I want to see River Phoenix become the featured Wikipedia article. What do we need to do to get this article there? I've found that the hardest task is finding credible secondary sources. In my opinion none of the commercially available RP biographies meet basic standards for quality research or writing, so I don't find them reliable. Internet searches pull up little more than fan sites, YouTube clips, and a handful of archived interviews and movie reviews. How do we find credible sources for this article without resorting to original research? And how can we shape this article so that it is factual, informative, and historically relevant? Pinko1977 (talk) 05:34, 30 November 2011 (UTC)

Death edit

Changing:

"According to Haynes the band was in the middle of their song, "Michael Stipe", which includes the line "but we didn't have a part, not a piece of our heart, not Michael, River Phoenix or Flea or me", while Phoenix was outside the venue having seizures on the sidewalk."

to read:

"According to Haynes the band was in the middle of their song, "Michael Stipe" while Phoenix was outside the venue having seizures on the sidewalk."

As the cited reference has no lyrics and the lyrics do not contain said line. --Omar418 (talk) 03:55, 28 September 2012 (UTC)

Choice of Photos

Is there some reason that this article features the most mediocre, even unattractive, of all the magnificent photos available from which to choose? River's life is a celebration of his vibrancy, his photogenic qualities, his screen-presence and appeal. 218.102.150.183 (talk) 04:18, 17 April 2015 (UTC)

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Sexuality Claims

What evidence is there that he was gay/bisexual?

Brian J. Robb's book "River Phoenix: A Short Life". Also I believe Gus Van Sant made a comment about Phoenix's sexuality during an interview.

• Robb's book: [4] but it's only "snippet" view.
• Friend, Tad (March 1994), "River, with love and anger", Esquire, vol. 121, no. 3, pp. 108–10

-- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 19:33, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

" NOTE Brian J. Robb never met River all above is Bull ..please excuse the language — Preceding unsigned comment added by Skyphoenix6 (talk • contribs) 04:25, 30 August 2015 (UTC)

NPOV

"was one of the most promising movie actors of his generation." seems very biased. Not knowing anything about him i'm not sure haw to fix it. I'm adding it to NPOV tho.

He was listed in John Willis' Screen World as a "Promising New Actor of 1986" (one of twelve). I think that would qualify the statement in the article, though it should probably be actually mentioned.

Yes True:

John Willis' Screen World 1986 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Skyphoenix6 (talk • contribs) 04:32, 30 August 2015 (UTC)

References

Rumour

An unconfirmed rumor claims that actress Christina Applegate "stood there and watched."

If it's an unconfirmed rumour why is it in the article? 207.6.31.119 19:26, 19 November 2005 (UTC)

Married With Children star Christina Applegate was at the club that night and witnessed the seizures, which she later reenacted at an anti-drug dance piece.

True Ms Applegate was there — Preceding unsigned comment added by Skyphoenix6 (talk • contribs) 04:34, 30 August 2015 (UTC)

Paternal Parentage Unconfirmed Rumor & Other Uncomfirmed Rumors

The rumors on the internet are that the father of the Phoenix clan might not be River's father genetically. The cults which the parents were in were very much into orgies, and also, pedophilia.

There are rumors on the internet that River was raped as a child by adults in the COG, and it contributed to his mental imbalances, which also led to his drug addictions.

That's "paternity" unconfirmed. One's paternity is who one's father was. Paternal Parentage is grammatically correct but redundant. Kasreyn 00:33, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

Obviously no one will ever know the real answer, but I defenitely would not be surprised if he has a different father. He looks NOTHING like his siblings. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Littleknee33 (talk • contribs) 07:23, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

• Note ONE BIG Falsehood this whole section, — Preceding unsigned comment added by Skyphoenix6 (talk • contribs) 04:37, 30 August 2015 (UTC)

Bisexuality

It's well documented that Phoenix had sex with another man on the set of "My Private Idaho". The article should mention this since he was a vocal supporter of gay rights. (92.3.135.150 (talk) 10:02, 8 June 2010 (UTC))

Then cite it in the article. --Mjrmtg (talk) 10:43, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

No, that is not well documented. The only sources are the National Enquirer and blogs on which anyone can say anything. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.101.236.250 (talk) 03:10, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

• NOTE One big FALSEHOOD all of this is a Lie — Preceding unsigned comment added by Skyphoenix6 (talk • contribs) 04:38, 30 August 2015 (UTC)

Dark Blood (2012)

The film Dark Blood (1993/2012) is mentioned just once in the section titled 'death'.

Surely this should have it's own section being that Phoenix died while making it, along with and the legal issues surrounding the (failed) law suits of his estate (ongoing until 1999) to the tune of 6 million dollars in damages because he signed insurance documents denying the use of recreational drugs. The fact the film reels were legally held for the duration of the court action and subsequently abandoned, set for being destroyed before being bought by the director George Sluizer for the movie's completion with a crowd funding campaign and release to the festival circuit in 2012?

I also read an article which stated that following Phoenix's death, and the law suits by both the production company for Dark Blood and by Warner Bros for Phoenix not appearing in 'Interview With the Vampire' due to.. well, death, that there was a tightening in insurance contracts for actors in the industry to ensure minimal risk of a similar case happening again. Worth more than half a sentence, no?

• NOTE Mostly good info here.... Insurance companies disparaged River's name by using the media to make him out to be a Junkie, so that they could win the lawsuit. Read how the contract had a provision about this, so the Insurance companies could get an edge in the Trial. The insurance companies lost badly... finally some justice for the family!! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Skyphoenix6 (talk • contribs) 04:48, 30 August 2015 (UTC)

Place of birth

So,... is he born in Metolius, Oregon as stated in the article itself or Madras, Oregon as written in the infobox? Currently he is linked on both articles about the cities. TherasTaneel (talk) 21:00, 8 January 2015 (UTC)

Hmm, I've removed mention of Metolius in this article and Phoenix in the one about the city, should anyone find a better ref than People, go right ahead and change it back. TherasTaneel (talk) 21:25, 8 January 2015 (UTC)

NOTE* Truth was River was born in a cabin Between Vida and Blue River Oregon (off of State Road 126) River took 3 days to come out and when he did he had a cone head! Ask his mom! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Skyphoenix6 (talk • contribs) 04:54, 30 August 2015 (UTC)

Assessment comment

The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:River Phoenix/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.

This article is poorly written. Some sentences are confusing as are some word choices ('extracurricular' for instance).

Last edited at 02:57, 16 April 2007 (UTC). Substituted at 04:30, 30 April 2016 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by JJMC89 bot (talk • contribs) 04:30, 30 April 2016 (UTC)

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Final 24

I find it unbelievable that some of you in here deem it apporpriate to delete stuff you don't want to see in here and dismiss it as nonsense! I went to great lengths to put in stuff about his death from a recent "Final 24" episode on Discovery Channel and you just deleted ALL OF IT and accuse ME of vandalism!I wonder who the vandalist is in here! Most of the info in here is not cited as it is hard to determine the exact source. The same goes for my source: I could not cite "Final 24" as it has yet to appear on the imdb ( I submitted the title and it's still being checked) Yes, River did use drugs for years, even before My Own Private Idaho, just like his friend Matt Ebert said on the documentary! His abuse deteriorated during MOPI where he would swallow all sorts of pills, as Ebert said. And yes, it is true that River got snubbed by Flea right before their performance in the Viper Room and that's what drove him to the bathroom to ingest a speedball. That's what the investigating LIEUTENANT said on the docu! And yes, he had an eightfold cocaine overdose, as the coroner said on the docu, too! And yes, Judy Davis was hard to work with and River was deeply hurt by her behavior, as the director George Sluizer said on the docu! So either all these people are lying or you are just refusing to accept my input. So now I wonder why you deemed it appropriate to delete my info and leave all the uncited stuff in there. Is it because one of you in here prefers to control all the input? I stand by what I wrote in there. Is the info I submitted so hard to believe or outrageous that it doesn't fit the whole picture? I suggest you watch the documentary yourself! Sliponshoe 17:13, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

I read your comments and was also curious why people would take out your contributions to the article if they were sourced to a documentary. Then I went on YouTube and watched "Final 24" on River Phoenix and found it very suspect. It makes many claims in ominous voiceover with no sources and has interviews with people who may or may not have been close to River. I think reverting those statements were the correct thing to do. FilmFemme 21:02, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

Well, I agree partly with you. But you have to remember that the actual coroner and the investigating police detective were making those statements. To me, they are very credible sources. And I'd find it hard to believe that they were fraudsters or liars. Besides, what outrageous claims did they make anyway? That River was snubbed by Flea or that River died of an eightfold cocaine overdose? To me, the sources were very credible and none of the interviewees, incl. the guy who had worked with River on "Idaho" appeared to be making false or outrageous claims or tried to dump on River. And I was definitely not trying to spam this article. I'd never ever smear River. He's one of my idols and I have far too much respect for his memory and legacy. Sliponshoe (talk) 03:38, 28 March 2008 (UTC)

Final 24 is the only source to claim Phoenix was 'snubbed' by Flea. All other's; articals, books, claim he was due to play at some point in the night. Final 24 directly places Phoenix's desicion to use drugs that night on Flea telling him he could not play. There is no actual evidence of this. Therefore, to place the 'blame' for Phoenix's death on the weight of Flea's comments is extremely unfair. Final 24 also hints to Phoenix recieving the drugs that killed him from John Frusciante, (despite this never being proven) they do not mention John Frusciantes name anywhere in the doc but have a frusciante look-a-like as the dealer and then having 'John Frusciante' appear as a character in the credits. It is all drama. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.147.64.184 (talk) 11:42, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

• NOTE Final 24 was a for TV enquirer show mostly false and or bad info, producers never met River all above is Bull ..please excuse the language — Preceding unsigned comment added by Skyphoenix6 (talk • contribs) 04:27, 30 August 2015 (UTC)

If you want the truth read River's autopsy. There was no drug residue in his nose nor needle marks on hos body. The drugs that killed River were put into a liquid speedball. John Frusciante handed it to him after Flea told him that there was no room on stage to jam. John told River it would make him feel fabulous. River drank it and got sick instantly. John bailed as River yelled out to Johnny Depp that he was dying. He was then told to go outside where he collapsed having convulsions. Nobody called 911 until it was too late. The Phoenix family are well aware that John handed River the drink but decided not to press charges. If you want the truth you just finished reading it. 204.99.118.13 (talk) 18:08, 5 January 2019 (UTC)

Jewishness and bisexuality

There should be more mention of Phoenix's bisexuality, as he admitted having sex with men. Also should he be called Jewish, as he was only of Jewish descent and was not raised in the religion. (GarfieldMitcham (talk) 18:07, 1 February 2017 (UTC))

River never said he had sex with men what a lie! 204.99.118.15 (talk) 18:40, 5 January 2019 (UTC)

Land In Costa Rica?

Following the source, it appears that Phoenix's land interests were in a very urban section of Tampa, Florida, not rainforest in Costa Rica as the article suggests. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.12.213.83 (talk) 22:53, 28 December 2010 (UTC)

River did INDEED purchase acres upon acres of land in Costa Rica so they would not be destroyed and made into Hotels or McDonalds. The rainforest is the earths lungs! 204.99.118.13 (talk) 18:50, 5 January 2019 (UTC)

Death and age

Died of Speedball, as did John Belushi, outside The Viper Room; see RiverPhoenix.org for details. Alf ^melmac 09:15, 8 September 2005 (UTC)

According to "Classic Cases in Medical Ethics" by Gregory Pence, Phoenix died by "mixing barbiturates, alcohol, and benzodiazapines," not by mixing cocaine and heroin.

Born Aug 23 1970: age 0

Therefore this birthdays on each August 23rd are;

'71=1, '72=2, '73=3, '74=4, '75=5, '76=6, '77=7, '78=8, '79=9, '80=10,

'81=11, '82=12, '83=13, '84=14, '85=15, '86=16, '87=17, '88=18, '89=19, '90=20,

'91=21, '92=22, '93=23

he died in October of '93 which makes 23 at the time of his death. --Alf ^melmac 13:09, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

Many fail to mention that his dear friend, regarded only as Stephani from Philadelphia, was the person to make the original 911 call and that he died in her's, among others arms. She refuses interviews and to this day, January 6, 1999, still cannot comment on the events that transpired that night. I feel she does not want any celebrity from this and just wants to contunie her life. Her only mention is on the E! True Hollywood Story about River as the initial 911 caller and being employed at the Viper Room from January 1992 to Nov. 1993 stating she could not be there another minute due to the enormity of what her dear friend River whent through. One quote from Stephani was found however,"I do not want River to be forgotten or to be remembered for what happened on Halloween 1993, my wish is for him to be remembered for his talent and generosity to those he was close too." This quote is taken from a People Magazine article that emereged after River's death. - Richard Johnson, New York Post, Page Six

False: Stefani fact, River did not know her, False claim!

False: The Autopsy shows there was NO alcohol in his system. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.62.246.10 (talk) 20:10, 22 March 2019 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 13 January 2020

The reference named "river-phoenix.org" is cited in the Children of God section as the source for the family joining the Children of God in 1973. The timeline on the cited page, however, does not mention that event. Would someone please add the {{Failed verification}} tag there, please? The reference is still needed to support other content. Thanks. 67.188.1.213 (talk) 04:34, 13 January 2020 (UTC)

 Done Replaced original cite with tag and moved full citation to second use of reference. Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 20:20, 18 January 2020 (UTC)

Jodean

From Joaquin Phoenix:

He also has a half-sister named Jodean (born 1964) from his father's previous relationship.

It should also apply to River, shouldn't it? --Error (talk) 16:06, 2 May 2020 (UTC)