Talk:Murder of Lakshmanananda Saraswati

Article purpose

What is the purpose of this article? Please explain. Is it to report facts. If so, wikipedia is not a newspaper. The originator needs to re-write this article giving an introduction to this person. Refer to his conviction and criminal background as well. Just some thoughts. We don't want to just have a POV pushing and building a case against Christians. Recordfreenow (talk) 05:42, 25 October 2008 (UTC)

The purpose of this article is to describe the killing of Swami Lakshmanananda that happened in the state of Orissa. It is not building any case unless the writing is on the wall. Shyamsunder (talk) 10:38, 27 October 2008 (UTC)

Involvement of Christians

Your addition "The involvement of the Christians in his murder resulted in considerable violence in Orissa", is not having any support in the reference provided.

What is the editor trying to prove? Also, you need to use specific names and not broad categorizations. Example: VHP rather than Hindus in case of radical behaviour. Recordfreenow (talk) 04:54, 27 October 2008 (UTC)

I see there are many pov issues in the article. I think we should re-write it in a better way. I feel pov almost everywhere, intentionally ignored numerous facts although there are sources. Perhaps, I’m wrong in a total substantiation of it. But it is well again if a third person scrutinizes it and comment. I therefore, reverted author’s removal of pov tag. --Googlean ^Results 10:56, 27 October 2008 (UTC)

Please list such pov issues here.-Bharatveer (talk) 11:06, 27 October 2008 (UTC)

One such pov, which I too noticed was listed by Recordfreenow and tagged. Instead of discussing & resolving it, the author himself started removing the tag. Apart from that, I strongly feel pov’s especially in the aftermath and investigation sections where we could have done in a better way (As I was bit busy right now, could not do it myself). I guess the author ignored Orissa Crime Branch’s official confirmation on this planned murder and arrests and such other issues, which I already added in the main Religious violence in Orissa and Swami articles. I later have noticed that some users removed those sourced info from that article. Pl have a look at those article's history too. --Googlean ^Results 11:24, 27 October 2008 (UTC)

POV violations

1. No background on Swami ji. Isnt his past jail conviction relevant?
2. How do we establish any hatred between Christians and Swami? Does report by PTI establish this as encyclopedic truth?
3. Why are we not giving a detailed description of Maoist claims with murder since it is so critical to the article?

Recordfreenow (talk) 17:32, 1 November 2008 (UTC)

Let us agree that the murder was an act of anti-Christian violence by Hindus. Fortunately, the Swami has not been accused of rape yet. Before long, he might be so accused here.

Swami Lakshmanananda

I suggest that article be merged to this article. That person is nowhere notability. Only the killing of him is notable. --SkyWalker (talk) 18:18, 3 November 2008 (UTC)

• Strong Support - Swami Lakshmanananda does not appear notable, only the killing was notable. Therefore, per WP:BIO1E he doesn't need a separate article and that (Swami Laksh) has to be merged to this (Murder) article. --Googlean ^Results 04:41, 4 November 2008 (UTC)
• Support I havent heard about Swami Lakshmanananda until the killing. I think both the articles should be merged , but I am Ok with either of the namesSwami Lakshmanananda or Murder of Swami Lakshmanananda. -- Tinu Cherian - 04:48, 4 November 2008 (UTC)
• Comment - Since we already have a section covered with the Murder of Swami at Religious_violence_in_Orissa#Swami_Lakshmanananda_Murder article, I feel now that do we really need these two articles? --Googlean ^Results 05:15, 4 November 2008 (UTC)

Well this article can serve has other purpose such has investigation and so on but the information on Religious violence in Orissa must be trimmed down. This article should serve has a carrier.--SkyWalker (talk) 06:27, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

• Oppose - Lakshmananda was notable prior to the murder for being a major religious leader in Orissa. Googlean and Tinu Cherian's logic rests on "not hearing of the man", which we must take as a justification for his lack of notability. Thankfully, Wikipedia doesnt operate on who certain users haven't heard of, and with sources indicating the Swami's popularity and the controversy surrounding him prior to his murder, there is no correct option other than to keep the two disparate articles.Pectore^talk 02:33, 13 November 2008 (UTC)

May be you can enligthen us with a few Reliable sources dated before the murder regarding the Swami Lakshmanananda ?? -- Tinu Cherian - 03:07, 13 November 2008 (UTC)

Here's a wide swathe of sources with a substantial number prior to the murder [1].Pectore^talk 04:17, 13 November 2008 (UTC)

I just had a look at those ref’s, & I could not find any independent reliable source (Per WP:N, If a topic has received significant coverage in reliable secondary sources that are independent of the subject, it is presumed to satisfy the inclusion criteria for a stand-alone article.), dated before the murder occurred. Pectore, could pls show anything such? --Googlean ^Results 06:25, 13 November 2008 (UTC)

Pectore do not remove the tag from that article until the discussion is over. --SkyWalker (talk) 14:31, 16 November 2008 (UTC)

Swami's biography deserves separate section -- How can "killing of swami" became notable without making "swami" notable in the process? The fact that killing was notable alone makes swami notable. Many notables become notable due to a single event(e.g. Rosa Parks). Moreover, Swami was notable prior to his murder and there was ample media coverage mostly due to half a dozen attacks on him. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Unbiasedpov (talk • contribs) 03:20, 29 November 2008 (UTC) — Unbiasedpov (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.

Pectore, Please do not remove the tag from that article until the discussion is over. This is second time I think you are trying to do this and you are being intentionally disruptive. While the consensus ( 3 - 1 ) is already to merge, how can you remove the the merge tag unilaterally ? If you continue with your disruptive edits, you may be reported at the ANI.You have been warned! -- Tinu Cherian - 04:57, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Three responses. Yourself and banned troll Googlean (a banned sockpuppeteering troll) do not equal 3. 1 + 0 != 3. Next, I removed the tag nearly a month after no one had posted on the page. After I give you a place to find enough sources to staff the article, you have the audacity to not only claim that you cannot find any (a sign of incompetence on your part rather than any scarcity of sources) but also to term my edits disruptive when it is you who has been hobnobbing with trolls and sockpuppets.Pectore^talk 05:19, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• Oppose - Svami Lakshmanananda Sarasvati was actively involved in tribal welfare activities in the Kandhamal district of Orissa. His work spans 4 decades. A separate article must be maintained on the saint's life. We all can work together and collect more info about him and update this article. The article on murder can exist as a section of this main article or as a separate article. But, a biographical article is needed for the Svami.--Deshabhakta (talk) 18:58, 29 August 2009 (UTC)

• Oppose - I will be removing the merge tag soon.--Deshabhakta (talk) 14:41, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

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"violence against Hindus"

@Unbiasedpov and Pectore: Please provide sources describing this murder as religious violence/violence targetting a Hindu because of his religion, or expect to be reverted again. That template is for religious violence directed at Hindus; not for violence in which the victims are, incidentally, Hindus (otherwise most violence in India would qualify, statistically speaking). Please also note that per WP:BURDEN, you are required to demonstrate the verifiability of the information you are adding, otherwise you are indulging in original research. Vanamonde (Talk) 19:01, 8 March 2020 (UTC)

In the absence of any reply for over two months, I am removing the template once again. I would expect that sources supporting its inclusion be provided before any reinstatement. Vanamonde (Talk) 17:44, 20 May 2020 (UTC)

This page was created for creating communal hatred

This page was created with unverified news for creating communal hatred. Please delete this page. Lokeshkumar007 (talk) 11:24, 23 August 2022 (UTC)