Talk:Morocco/Archive 6

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Archive 7

Demographics Section

The column in the demographics section that reports the population in each decade says that it's reporting the population in thousands, not millions. Y'all might wanna fix that. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.118.191.64 (talk) 22:22, 22 January 2018 (UTC)

External links modified (February 2018)

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• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20100206173055/http://www.moroccoboard.com/news/34-news-release/874-morocco-to-launch-high-speed-train-that-will-carry-8-million-passengers-per-year to http://www.moroccoboard.com/news/34-news-release/874-morocco-to-launch-high-speed-train-that-will-carry-8-million-passengers-per-year

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the area of Morocco

the text only specifies one area of Morocco ignoring the 710,850 km2. i think this area should be added as well. best regards your fellow Wikipedian Zak bnou (talk) 18:46, 20 April 2018 (UTC)

External links modified

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Excuse me! Motto the morocco not (لله الوطن الملك) but is: (الله" الوطن الملك")ÎMÀD-MØRØČČÕ (talk) 16:52, 2 May 2018 (UTC) ÎMÀD-MØRØČČÕ (talk) 16:52, 2 May 2018 (UTC)

WWII

It's quite incredible that the history section makes no mention of the U.S.-led invasion of Morocco in November 1942. A glaring omission. Sca (talk) 19:55, 6 June 2018 (UTC)

Offical Languages

There are only 2 Offical Languages Arabic and Berber, not French and Spanish Moroccansoldier (talk) 01:51, 30 July 2018 (UTC)

Culture

I think this passage should be removed from the Culture section : "Women are at times sexually harassed when walking the streets, a woman walking the streets of Casablanca while filmed by The Moroccan Times was harassed about 300 times." — Preceding unsigned comment added by History21st (talk • contribs) 19:37, 24 August 2018 (UTC)

Mauritania/Western Sahara

@AZSH: The international community does not recognize Morocco's sovereignty over Western Sahara, as it does not recognize Israel's sovereignty over Jerusalem and the Golan Heights. Morocco does not even control the border with Mauritania. There is no place for chauvinism here. See here Morocco has a land border with Algeria only and maritime borders with two states.--Sakiv (talk) 23:40, 9 December 2018 (UTC)

the territory is administrated by Morocco and the border with Mauritania is a 4km UN buffer zone.There are no foreign customs between Morocco and Mauritania. When "western sahara" gets its independence we can edit the article. it's not a good idea to do it now. --AZSH (talk) 23:56, 9 December 2018 (UTC)

Well, this is a recognition that 99 percent of the border is beyond Morocco's control. There are about 40 countries that recognize the sovereignty of the Sahrawi Republic over Western Sahara, while no country recognizes Moroccan sovereignty. Therefore, the region is considered a disputed territory and it is not right to add Mauritania as a neighbor to Morocco.--Sakiv (talk) 00:05, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

When Moroccans cross to Mauritania they only show their documents to the Mauritanian customs officers. In this encyclopedia we should tell people what the reality on the ground is, this is not the United Nations' official website. The reality tells us that it is not bordered by something called western sahara. I will continue tomorrow--AZSH (talk) 00:26, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

@AZSH: This never gives you the right to consider Mauritania as a neighbor of Morocco. Why do not we consider each country occupying land as its own and then all the problems will be solved according to your opinion. What is the importance of negotiations, then, if it is the force that determines everything? Here is Wikipedia and not the site of the Moroccan Ministry of Tourism. As defined by international conventions (not the United Nations), Morocco occupies Western Sahara.--Sakiv (talk) 02:51, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

someone reading Morocco's wikipedia article would like to know the truth. saying it is bordered by a country other than Mauritania is inaccurate. let's wait for other people to give their opinion. --AZSH (talk) 17:02, 11 December 2018 (UTC)

use de facto/de jure if you really want to make the edit. because erasing Mauritania and replacing it with your western sahara, that does not exist in reality, is not going to work.--AZSH (talk) 19:53, 27 December 2018 (UTC)

• Comment : There is no such thing as Moroccan rule over Western Sahara, see here.---Wikaviani ^{(talk) (contribs)} 02:24, 19 December 2018 (UTC)

there's only the flag and the currency. + how did you know there was a discussion over this subject here? I'm pretty sure you are Sakiv. don't play this game with me --AZSH (talk) 20:08, 27 December 2018 (UTC)

I'd like to point out that there is little chance of us settling this dispute on Wikipedia, until the dispute in the real world is settled. That is going to take a long time. In the meantime, we have historically covered the situation quite well, describing the situation as it is rather than as participants here would like it to be. So we should not be claiming Maroc has a border with Mauritania without acknowledging that this is disputed by much of the world. The currency/border/customs that are de facto in place, It is not our role to define things, but to describe them. -Roxy, the dog. wooF 20:27, 27 December 2018 (UTC)

that is why I proposed to use de facto/de jure for the borders. --AZSH (talk) 21:12, 27 December 2018 (UTC)

@AZSH: I would suggest you to desist from baseless accusations, i'm not Sakiv or any other user, i'm Wikaviani, if you don't trust me, please go for a SPI (sock puppet investigation). Keep in mind that baseless accusations are considered to be personal attacks on Wikipedia. To answer your question about how i came here to join this thread, it's because this article is on my watchlist.---Wikaviani ^{(talk) (contribs)} 21:24, 27 December 2018 (UTC)

@AZSH: Stop your personal attacks and discuss rationally without fanaticism or personalization. Your country has no borders with Mauritania. Morocco alone claims to have borders with it, while 192 countries do not recognize this and above it the United Nations. In the Geography of Morocco article you can't see Mauritania included as a neighbouring country.--Sakiv (talk) 21:44, 27 December 2018 (UTC)

PLEASE NOTE. I will remove any further posts which are not pertaining to improvement of the article. These personal attacks by anybody must stop. I do not doubt that if asked, Admins here will make you stop. -Roxy, the dog. wooF 22:03, 27 December 2018 (UTC)

@Roxy the dog: What is wrong with my reply to the user?--Sakiv (talk) 22:20, 27 December 2018 (UTC)

One proposal could be to remove the whole sentence about Morocco's neighbours in the lead to the Geography article instead. This was present before an IP added this sentence back in October [1].--Sakiv (talk) 22:26, 27 December 2018 (UTC)

Your proposal could work. Agreed.---Wikaviani ^{(talk) (contribs)} 00:30, 28 December 2018 (UTC)

no problem for me. or else de facto bordered by Mauritania will also work --AZSH (talk) 18:00, 28 December 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 21 January 2019

Remove the French from the top, since it's not an official language. Only Tamazight or Arabic. 3bdelilah (talk) 13:49, 21 January 2019 (UTC)

Not done as the request is far too vague to understand. -Roxy, the dog. wooF 16:42, 21 January 2019 (UTC)

@Roxy: Rightly so, thank you. But I'd also like to add that the section "foreign languages" is pretty vague...You have schools teaching German (just for instance) there, too...In that sense I think only the "traditional" ones with the historical linkages - Fench and to a much lesser extent Spanish - should be accounted for. 85.242.114.30 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 17:53, 25 February 2019 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 9 May 2019

Change X Dustonefrost (talk) 18:04, 9 May 2019 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. NiciVampireHeart 19:27, 9 May 2019 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 6 June 2019

in the exports graphic: change m&arines to mandarines..it was probably mistakenly altered in a replaceall operation Mohamed Megahed 21:58, 6 June 2019 (UTC)

 Not done. Can't edit an image. El_C 22:02, 6 June 2019 (UTC)

Transliteration of Arabic and Tifinagh alphabets

There are no Capital letters in boths alphabets, so I think capital letters should not been used in transliterations. I removed them. --Lucyin (talk) 23:02, 17 August 2019 (UTC)

... as it was already before in "al-maġhrib" --Lucyin (talk) 23:06, 17 August 2019 (UTC)

Coastlines

Article says Morocco, France, and Spain are only countries with both Mediterranean and Atlantic coastlines.

Portugal? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Drlaz (talk • contribs) 05:36, 23 August 2019 (UTC)

As the Mediterranean begins at the Strait of Gibraltar/Cape Trafalgar (See Mediterranean Sea#Extent), Portugal would only have an Atlantic coastline. Declangi (talk) 07:19, 23 August 2019 (UTC)

This discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.
Correct. But, by that definition, Gibraltar has both Mediterranean and Atlantic coastlines. Ghmyrtle (talk) 07:40, 23 August 2019 (UTC) Perhaps you should look at a map. -Roxy, the dog. wooF 07:54, 23 August 2019 (UTC) Oops - my error. Ghmyrtle (talk) 08:36, 23 August 2019 (UTC)

Does Morocco observe daylight saving?

The time zone given in the infobox is Central European Time rather than West Africa Time (both UTC-01:00). So:

1. does Morocco observe CEST daylight saving?
2. does Morocco have a civil time defined in law? What is it? (It may have been inherited from French/Spanish colonial law and just transposed at independence).
3. is there a citation that says CET and not WAT?
4. Spain is seriously considering changing its anomalous time zone to Western European Time/UTC±0. Has the Moroccan government discussed (publically) the same idea?

Thank you. --Red King (talk) 14:51, 20 November 2019 (UTC)

Hey, if you are reading this I just want to let you know that you are a wonderful person and you should never let anyone get you down <3 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.1.250.100 (talk) 16:24, 6 December 2019 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 22 January 2020

Change "Morocco has also some of prestigious postgraduate schools, including: l'Institut National des Postes et Télécommunication (INPT), École Nationale Supérieure d'Électricité et de Mecanique (ENSEM), EMI, ISCAE, INSEA, National School of Mineral Industry, École Hassania des Travaux Publics, Les Écoles nationales de commerce et de gestion, École supérieure de technologie de Casablanca." to "Morocco has also some of prestigious postgraduate schools, including: l'Institut National des Postes et Télécommunication (INPT), École Nationale Supérieure d'Électricité et de Mecanique (ENSEM), EMI, ISCAE, INSEA, National School of Mineral Industry, École Hassania des Travaux Publics, Les Écoles nationales de commerce et de gestion, Ecole national des sciences appliquée de Tanger, École supérieure de technologie de Casablanca. 41.87.141.77 (talk) 14:10, 22 January 2020 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 23:46, 24 January 2020 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for speedy deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for speedy deletion:

• Mount Ghorghiz in Tetouan.jpg

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Addition to Morocco's demographics

There is a small number of Asians (Chinese, Vietnamese, Filipinos and Indians) in Morocco, a legacy of colonialism by France (and also Spain, with British influences). The navigational route from Asia along the Pacific and Indian oceans, then enters the Atlantic in South Africa and finally, before the ships enter Europe (Spain), they stop in Moroccan seaports and largest cities. And considered a part of Asia (and Europe) are Turks from Turkey, they spread out across the Mediterranean coast of North Africa in Ottoman times. 2605:E000:100D:C571:7D82:A683:E434:DB3D (talk) 02:01, 10 May 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 10 July 2020

the following sentence is not reliable enough, on the contrary it seems completely wrong from the data procured by Moroccan Census and the CIA data: https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/resources/the-world-factbook/geos/mo.html and also from the proportion of region/population density. So delete this sentence: In 2008, Frédéric Deroche estimated that there were 12 million Berber speakers, making up about 40% of the population.[145] 2.34.4.75 (talk) 00:34, 10 July 2020 (UTC)

 Not done The number of Berber speakers is an estimate -- and the sentence recognizes that the number may not be exact. Additionally, it says in the CIA data that the number of Berber speakers is disputed, not giving an exact amount of speakers. I see nothing wrong with leaving an estimate in place. P,TO 19104 (talk) (contribs) 16:19, 10 July 2020 (UTC)

History: 19th century is completely missing

The 19th century is complelety missing from the "History" section. Perhaps it could be added by translating from the French-language version of this article. Acwilson9 (talk) 05:52, 19 July 2020 (UTC)

Invoked Citation error

I am unable to clear the citation error invoked through the use of the {{excerpt}} template for § Architecture. I thought maybe adding the references= parameter would remove the references from this section, and thus remove the citation error, but Preview mode doesn't appear changed at all.
I'm assuming we'd like keep the Moroccan architecture excerpt to populate this section. Christopher, Sheridan, OR (talk) 23:12, 8 September 2020 (UTC)

Fixed. That named ref was defined in the body of Moroccan architecture and called in the lede, so if we only transclude the lede here, it will invoke this error. While another solution may exist, I thought the most straightforward way was to just move the definition up to the lede of the architecture article and include an explanation in the edit summary. Rotideypoc41352 (talk · contribs) 01:21, 9 September 2020 (UTC)

I see what you did there. Thanks very much, I wasn't sure how to handle this. Christopher, Sheridan, OR (talk) 01:46, 9 September 2020 (UTC)

CENTER 3D

Machines Agricole Hamid 155 (talk) 13:05, 9 September 2020 (UTC)

Pourquoi? -Roxy the inedible dog . wooF 15:12, 9 September 2020 (UTC)

Use of the term "Berber

The use of the term "Berber" to reference the indigenous people of Morocco is considered offensive today. Its etymology is not completely clear. Most trace it to the Greek "barbaros" and Latin "barbarus," both originally meaning "foreign, strange" and eventually "barbarian" as it related to northern invaders (Celts, Goths, Gauls, etc.) and later North Africans. The use of Barbary as a geographic region stems from this. While North Africans adopted "Berber" as the term for the indigenous people to separate them from the Arabs who migrated there, it is now considered to have a demeaning connotation as it is thought to have been imposed by foreign invaders (you cannot be a foreigner in your own land). Indigenous people of Morocco prefer the term "Amazigh" (singular) or "Imazighen" (plural). All references in this article should be changed to refer to them as such, with "(formerly, Berber)" following, instead of the other way around. — Preceding unsigned comment added by EllenH63 (talk • contribs) 17:23, 26 September 2020 (UTC)

Clarification of water supply and sanitation concessions

The section on Water Supply and Sanitation needs clarification of the other two cities supplied by private concessionaires. "Water supply and sanitation Main article: Water supply and sanitation in Morocco Water supply and sanitation in Morocco is provided by a wide array of utilities. They range from private companies in the largest city, Casablanca, the capital, Rabat, and two other cities,[clarification needed]" The two cities are Tangier and Tetouan. The main article referenced in this section contains the corrections and citations. — Preceding unsigned comment added by EllenH63 (talk • contribs) 18:44, 26 September 2020 (UTC)

minerals, mineral resourcing

de:Marokko#Bodenschätze (sub-section of section economy) mentions iron ore, lead, copper, zinc, silver, gold, manganese, Nickel, Cobalt and phosphor. --Präziser (talk) 20:28, 15 November 2020 (UTC)

Demande de modification semi-protégée le 10 décembre 2020

{{edit demi-protected|Morocco to Casablanca in by 2 Mars City Verdin Palace an New York Time of the Journal Wekend Time|answered=no-yes}} 21:18, 10 December 2020 UTC [refresh] 105.155.103.165 (talk) 21:18, 10 December 2020 (UTC)

..en anglais svp? -Roxy the inedible dog . wooF 22:15, 10 December 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 11 December 2020

Morocco does not occupy the so-called western Sahara. It is part of the Kingdom of Morocco. Yesterday, the US President, Donald J. Trump, recognized the sovereignty of Morocco over Sahara. Please, Change the Map an turn it into Green as whole. I am atttaching a link below that shows the recognition of US over Moroccan Sahara

https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/proclamation-recognizing-sovereignty-kingdom-morocco-western-sahara/ Abdelaaliel (talk) 21:37, 11 December 2020 (UTC)

 Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{edit protected}} template. (CC) Tbhotch^™ 22:05, 11 December 2020 (UTC)

Recognition

Morocco wasn't the first to recognize the United States independence neither formally nor informally. The Dutch was first informally "Sint Eustatius was the most important place for dealing or smuggling with Americans. On 16 November 1776, at the beginning of the American Revolutionary War, the American navy ship USS Andrew Doria, with the American Declaration of Independence on board, arrived in St. Eustatius. Its captain fired a salute to the Dutch flag on Fort Oranje and Johannes de Graaff decided to answer the salute with eleven gunshots. And so the United States of America were for the first time recognized as a nation by this salute of eleven guns." Bluedreambrook (talk) 09:07, 19 October 2020 (UTC)

The source is here https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johannes_de_Graaff Bluedreambrook (talk) 09:08, 19 October 2020 (UTC)

There's a huge difference between a salute and a formal recognition. BlueLight05 (talk) 01:45, 17 December 2020 (UTC)

Black people

No mention or statistics given on the possible number of black people in Morocco Nlivataye (talk) 16:09, 30 September 2020 (UTC)

There's no official statistics of how many black people live in morocco. BlueLight05 (talk) 01:46, 17 December 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 17 December 2020

Hi wiki, you have to delete western sahara from the Moroccan map, coz the news map is only morocco from Tanger city at Mauritain contry..thank u جواد الأطلس (talk) 01:22, 17 December 2020 (UTC)

I agree it should at least include the area Morocco controls or administers. BlueLight05 (talk) 01:42, 17 December 2020 (UTC)

 Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{edit semi-protected}} template.
SSSB (talk) 10:38, 18 December 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 17 December 2020 (2)

Updating the GINI index to 40.3 Source: https://read.oecd-ilibrary.org/development/africa-s-development-dynamics-2018_9789264302501-en#page18 BlueLight05 (talk) 01:40, 17 December 2020 (UTC)

 Done
SSSB (talk) 11:58, 18 December 2020 (UTC)

Orthographic Projection

Hi, I changed the orthographic projection displayed on this page (as well as the correct description to go along with it. Sources why I made this change: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Sahara https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Sahara_conflict https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Provinces. I think that the projection should be updated with a clearer (more direct) view of Morocco, so if anyone can do that with this projection, that would be a big help. Thanks -EdDakhla — Preceding undated comment added 17:38, 25 December 2020 (UTC)

CIA changes map of Morocco

Hi, I just wanted to point out that the Central Intelligence Agency, one of the most highly used and reliable sources for articles in Wikipedia, has in fact changed the country map of Morocco (on 17 Dec. 2020). Given that the CIA is a highly reliable source, I formally request the revision of all (reliable) sources used to cite for the current map (and orthographic projection) of Morocco used in this article. If there are not any sources (or a majority) that contradict the new change made by the CIA, then I believe it is appropriate to present the map/projection of Morocco including the Sahara (mainly all dark green for the orthographic projection and the Koppen Climate Type map to be updated showing the Sahara). If not, I request that map should at least show the zones of W. Sahara that Morocco (not occupy) but controls (west of the Moroccan Berm Wall/coastal regions) in dark green because Polisario have zero control or influence in those parts of the territory. Thanks -EdDakhla (talk) — Preceding undated comment added 10:11, December 27, 2020

The majority of sources contradict the World Factbook source, which has no special status as a reliable source. CMD (talk) 00:53, 28 December 2020 (UTC)

I agree with CMD. While the Factbook is a reputable source, it is also a source intimately linked to U.S. foreign policy and changes in its content do not necessarily merit overarching changes in wikipedia's content without a consensus across sources. Cristiano Tomás (talk) 08:04, 28 December 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 6 January 2021

Hello, please change "tageldit n lmaɣrib" to "tageldit n lmeɣrib" in the romanized version of 'the kingdom of morocco' in tamazight as it is closer to the pronunciation and also more coherent with the tamazight spelling ("ⵍⵎⵖⵔⵉⴱ"(L-M-GH-R-I-B) the 'e' equivalent in tamazight is generally not used because it is implied, which is not the case of the "a", "lmaɣrib" would've been written "ⵍⵎⴰⵖⵔⵉⴱ"). I also noticed it was written correctly in its first occurence, so this would make the introduction also more coherent. Thanks in advance. Ufloe (talk) 22:29, 6 January 2021 (UTC)

 Done (CC) Tbhotch^™ 22:55, 6 January 2021 (UTC)

small edit suggestions

Current:

It regained its independence and reunified in 1956, and has been relatively stable and prosperous (by regional standards) since then: Today, it has the fifth largest economy in all of Africa.

Suggested:

It regained its independence and reunified in 1956, and has been relatively stable and prosperous by regional standards since then. Today, it has the fifth largest economy in all of Africa.

Current:

Portuguese efforts to control the Atlantic sea trade in the 15th century did not greatly affect the interior of Morocco even though they managed to control some possessions on the Moroccan coast but not venturing further afield inland.

Suggested:

Portugal made efforts to control the Atlantic sea trade in the 15th century and managed to control some possessions on the Moroccan coast, but did not venture further inland or greatly affect the interior of Morocco.

Electronwill (talk) 07:25, 6 February 2021 (UTC)

Request of fixing the Motto in tamazight language

ⴰⴽⵓⵛ - ⴰⵎⵓⵔ - ⴰⴳⵍⵍⵉⴷ is not correct. Actually ⴰⴽⵓⵛ = a god , but in the Motto says Allah not ilah , it has different meanings. so we should use ⴰⵍⵍⴰⵀ. for ⴰⵎⵓⵔ idk where u get this from but it doesnt have the meaning of "Alwatan" at all so we sould use ⵜⴰⵎⴰⵣⵉⵔⵜ , more appropriate. then ⴰⴳⵍⵍⵉⴷ will stay the same cuz its correct .

So basicly it should be ⴰⵍⵍⴰⵀ - ⵜⴰⵎⴰⵣⵉⵔⵜ - ⴰⴳⵍⵍⵉⴷ -- Ayour2002 (talk) 13:05, 24 February 2021 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:

• Administrative Regions of Morocco.jpg

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 19:47, 8 April 2021 (UTC)

Morocco controlled/uncontrolled territory

For the orthographic map, it may be appropriate to consider showing the regions in Western Sahara that Morocco controls, like how India, China, Pakistan and other countries that have claims on regions they do not control (Morocco currently administers/controls about 80% of the territory). For almost all of the other countries that have disputed regions, lighter green represents the area that they merely claim, but not control (again, not the case for Morocco and Western Sahara because it controls ~80%). This projection shows the territory that Morocco controls in dark green, and the claimed but uncontrolled areas (SADR/buffer zone) in light green. The current map caption is also partially misleading compared to the current projection because it states it's "mostly occupied by Morocco as its Southern Provinces". These Southern Provinces are not shown in the current projection, but are in the proposed projection . Change to projection will also warrant to making some changes to the map caption, stating "dark green: territories controlled by Morocco, lighter green: claimed but uncontrolled territories", and still showing the disputed status of Western Sahara of course, or just the regular template. -EdDakhla 19:51, 31 December 2020 (UTC)

1) Western Sahara is a non-self-governing territory that is claimed and partly occupied by Morocco.[2] 2) Showing any part of WS as an extension of Morocco would violate NPOV and be grossly misleading. See WS map and Morocco's map (according to the UN). 3) As a matter of fact, by showing the light green (as it is now), we're already giving preferential treatment to Morocco. Have a look at Israel where the Golan Heights is not shown in the infobox. M.Bitton (talk) 20:19, 31 December 2020 (UTC)

Morocco is recognized as administrative power in Western Sahara (according to the UN): «The Secretary-General shared the view of his Personal Envoy that further meetings of the parties would not succeed, and could indeed be counterproductive, unless the Government of Morocco, as administrative power of the Territory, was prepared to offer or support some devolution of authority» [3]. I think the new map would reflect de facto administred territory in which Moroccan currency and customs apply. --Flaspec (talk) 20:38, 31 December 2020 (UTC)

I agree with @Flaspec. Morocco does not "party occupy" Western Sahara, it administers most* of it. As for the Golan Heights, Israel illegally attempted to take that region from Syria, while Morocco has deep historical influence (and relatively valid claims) to Western Sahara for centuries (if you go to 'W.S.' today, the "SADR" flag is nowhere to be found, and neither is the Polisario). I'm referring to territories in which Morocco controls, west of the Moroccan Western Sahara Wall. Need I remind you that the this map of Western Sahara you presented shows the (Berm Wall) I'm talking about. Additionally, although the UN does not recognize full sovereignty of Morocco or the self proclaimed "SADR" over Western Sahara, it does recognize Morocco's administrative sovereignty. As a former resident of "Western Sahara" myself of over 17 years, I'll enlighten you that the passport, driver's license, license plates, currency, flags and all other official or government documents/ID's are of Morocco's. EdDakhla 20:46, 31 December 2020 (UTC)

Of course you agree with the editor that you canvassed.[4]

The 2002 U.N. opinion also makes clear that Morocco does not have the status of being Western Sahara’s de facto administering power, as such a status does not exist under international law.[5]

Jacob Mundy is a scholar who has written a book about the subject. M.Bitton (talk) 20:51, 31 December 2020 (UTC)

I did not canvass or have an influence over the opinion of this editor, but simply request to explore the opportunity to show a less misleading projection map. Of course you'll cite Jacob Mundy, an author or "scholar", who you agree with and writes a book entirely from one POV. In addition to that, the Washington Post is not the UN and not a reliable source like the UN is, and that article was not viewable to people who are not subscribed members (like myself and many others). So far, a consensus has technically been made and you are the only minority objecting to this change. EdDakhla 21:06, 31 December 2020 (UTC)

You absolutely have canvassed Flaspec and I have supplied the diff to prove it. Jacob Mundy is a scholar whose job is to analyze primary sources, something we do not do. I suggest you read WP:CONSENSUS and WP:RS before jumping to conclusions. M.Bitton (talk) 21:17, 31 December 2020 (UTC)

I absolutely did not canvass Flaspec (I'll do you the favor of pinging him this time), as you can see here him and I have disagreements, please do not for one moment think you can try slander me to help your point of view and only bring up certain things that helps you. Jacob Mundy is a POV writer at its fine form and "Jacob Mundy is a scholar whose job is to analyze primary sources, something we do not do", no need to make assumptions of what we (or I) may or may not do, as for a fact you do not know what I do. EdDakhla 21:29, 31 December 2020 (UTC)

Slander? I am more than happy to take this to WP:ANI. M.Bitton (talk) 21:34, 31 December 2020 (UTC)

@M.Bitton, go ahead, take this to WP:ANI, bringing in unnecessary admin intervention maybe because you're getting upset. The claim that I "canvassed" @Flaspec is baseless because that did not happen and I've supplied the evidence to support that. Nobody has initiated a personal attack on you but if you wish, feel free to report me merely for using the discussion page. EdDakhla 21:43, 31 December 2020 (UTC)

If you don't want the admins to intervene, don't throw around baseless accusations of slander. As for Flaspec, there isn't a shred of doubt that you have canvassed them. If you think this is a baseless accusation, do the proper thing and report it to ANI. M.Bitton (talk) 21:50, 31 December 2020 (UTC)

@M.Bitton, done. Feel free to make your argument on that page. EdDakhla 22:21, 31 December 2020 (UTC)

Whether Morocco does or does not control Western Sahara is not up for you to decide. This is still up for discussion and awaiting consensus. EdDakhla 00:09, 1 January 2021 (UTC)

If we include all of Western Sahara in Morocco's area, its rank is #39. If we include none of it, its rank is #57. If we include only the 80% of it that this discussion is saying Morocco controls, then what is Morocco's rank?? Georgia guy (talk) 00:12, 1 January 2021 (UTC)

@Georgia guy good question. Mathematically speaking the de-facto size of Morocco is 659,350 km^2, therefore ranking it rank #40, after Myanmar which is 676,578 km^2. EdDakhla 00:33, 1 January 2021 (UTC)

Per NPOV, territory in W.S. that is controlled by Morocco must be shown (see Sahrawi Arab Democratic Republic article), where Polisario territory is acknowledged in dark green (should be the same for Morocco per NPOV). Also it is not showing it as an "extension" of Morocco (POV statement) like @M.Bitton said. EdDakhla 07:06, 5 January 2021 (UTC)

No part of Western Sahara (a non-self-governing territory) should be shown as part of Morocco as doing so would violate NPOV. M.Bitton (talk) 14:52, 5 January 2021 (UTC)

No, that would violate YOUR POV. See the SADR article where controlled territory is acknowledged in dark green. Per NPOV, the same should be shown for Morocco. Don't revert just because one thing doesn't align with your POV, you can't have your cake and eat it too. EdDakhla 16:24, 5 January 2021 (UTC)

Morocco controlled / uncontrolled territory. Virtual territory: www.sante.gov.ma/Contactez-Nous/Pages/ Sorry. Block. Who who ??? Block. Morocco? Belg? Russia hacker's ??? can not be true!195.244.180.59 (talk) 12:31, 9 April 2021 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 11 May 2021

Please change the Ethnic make up of morocco from 99.1% arab-berber to the more specific 40% berber,59% arabised-berber,0.2% Jewish,0,7% other,thank you! Goharocko (talk) 06:53, 11 May 2021 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 10:56, 11 May 2021 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 25 May 2021

My request is to remove the word of western Sahara because it's morocain and the United States claims that the Sahara is a part of Morocco. Marouanka (talk) 01:11, 25 May 2021 (UTC)

Marouane Marouanka (talk) 01:11, 25 May 2021 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. CMD (talk) 01:42, 25 May 2021 (UTC)

History of Morocco

Please can u change the year that Morocco ass founded the true year was Morocco founded is 789 Brown0102 (talk) 01:13, 11 June 2021 (UTC)

Please provide a WP:Reliable source to support changes you wish to be made. CMD (talk) 02:49, 11 June 2021 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 19 July 2021

Please change official languages from Arabic and Berber to Arabic, French, and Tamazight.

Berber is not a language. It is a derogatory term used to describe the Amazigh people. French is also an official language. I don't have sources but my husband is Moroccan and I've traveled their extensively. Amontebk (talk) 23:35, 19 July 2021 (UTC)

 Not done The article for Tamazight is at Berber languages. If it is a derogatory term, it doesn't seem to be one. List of countries and territories where French is an official language doesn't mention Morocco beyond 39 million inhabitants speaking it. That doesn't make it an official language. (CC) Tbhotch^™ 00:45, 20 July 2021 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:

• Cantarat Salla 02.jpg

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 08:26, 20 July 2021 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 29 July 2021

I request to add to the establishment section in the infobox:
[[Mauretania|Moorish Kingdom]]: 225 BC
See the relevant article for more clarification. Same was done to antiquity kingdoms in neighbouring countries' articles. Abdou Spark (talk) 22:33, 29 July 2021 (UTC)

Not done, please provide a reliable source that notes the current state was established by those kingdoms. CMD (talk) 00:34, 30 July 2021 (UTC)

@CMD: "The earliest known independent Moroccan state was the Berber kingdom of Mauretania, which lasted from the third century BCE until it became a Roman province in 44 BCE". source: Spencer C. Tucker, Modern Conflict in the Greater Middle East: A Country-by-Country Guide, Page 217.-Abdou Spark (talk) 22:59, 30 July 2021 (UTC)

Established by those kingdoms, not just existed in that same area. The field is for a "key event in history of country/territory's status or formation", not general history. CMD (talk) 02:35, 31 July 2021 (UTC)

@CMD: I understood, but I see in Algeria article they put in the infobox the prehistoric Kingdom of Numidia, which was right at the time of Kingdom of Mauretania. They both started as sovereign states and then became Roman provinces. I think we should add Mauretania here or remove Numidia from there. What you think?-Abdou Spark (talk) 19:19, 31 July 2021 (UTC)

The Algeria article should probably be fixed, but in general other articles having errors is not a good reason to introduce an error to this article. CMD (talk) 02:39, 1 August 2021 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 31 July 2021

I request to remove the french name "Royaume du Maroc" from the infobox as French is not an official language in Morocco. Abdou Spark (talk) 19:24, 31 July 2021 (UTC)

Done. There was a hidden note about its de facto importance, but noting a previous similar request in the archives that wasn't disagreed with and noting it remains in the lead, I agree with the suggestion. CMD (talk) 02:45, 1 August 2021 (UTC)

Sir Harry Aubrey de Vere Maclean

This British officer was actually commander of the Sultan’s armies for many years. A well - known man of the time, known as ‘Kaid’(leader) MacLean. Surely worth a mention. 96.90.200.185 (talk) 21:55, 3 September 2021 (UTC)

Eh, maybe in the Moroccan Army article. Can't say he seems to relevant to the overall scope of this article. Cristiano Tomás (talk) 22:06, 3 September 2021 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 28 December 2021

Morocco_map full 196.206.192.110 (talk) 20:27, 28 December 2021 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. CMD (talk) 20:49, 28 December 2021 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 29 December 2021

I make this change claim after having read the serious breach on this page (Kingdom of Morocco) in english.

First, by clicking on the small globe icon (coordinate) at the top right of the page, a small window opens with the map of Morocco, appearing the mention "French protectorate of Morocco". This protectorate is no longer current since 1956. No equivalent mention in a neighbouring country.

Secondly, in the rebric "Establishment" in the abstract rectangle on the right of the page, the different Moroccan empires/states do not appear, except the Idrisid dynasty, missing then the Almoravid empires, Almohads, Saadians, etc. These major shortcomings are not found in the French, Arab and other pages of the Kingdom of Morocco.

So I make this claim so that these shortcomings/errors can be corrected, on the basis of the French wikipedia page of the Kingdom of Morocco for example, Wikipedia does not yet allow me to do it myself.

Thanks. AmineR7 (talk) 22:18, 29 December 2021 (UTC)

@AmineR7 The map comes from meta:WikiMiniAtlas which, IIUC, pulls {{coord}} entries from wiki pages and builds its own label database. So the "French Protectorate" is coming from French Protectorate in Morocco which uses the same coordinates as Morocco. In a similar case, the dev had suggested removing 'type:country' from the coord template. You can try doing the same at French Protectorate in Morocco; do note that it will only be reflected when WikiMiniAtlas database is refreshed. Template talk:Coord might get you more informed responses. In any case, nothing can be done at here, i.e at Morocco, to solve this.

For the infobox additions, it'd be helpful if you give the exact text. Hemanthah (talk) 10:24, 31 December 2021 (UTC)

The infobox is not meant to show the timeline of an area's history, but the key date of achieving independence. For countries like Morocco that concept is not so clear-cut, but detailed timeline information is better presented in the History section. CMD (talk) 16:28, 31 December 2021 (UTC)

@Hemanthah Thank you for your answer Hemanthah. For the infobox, here is the exact text to insert, as it is found on the other French, Arabic and other wiki pages of the Kingdom of Morocco. Some of them are already there.

Thank you again for your work. --AmineR7 (talk) 17:03, 31 December 2021 (UTC)

@AmineR7, You've copied from fr-wiki but unfortunately the dates don't match the en-wiki page contents. For eg, the text in the article doesn't have anything about "Unification of Mauretania" or mention 300 BC; Tingitania page says 42 AD; Idrissid page says 788-974. Foundation section currently has no sources to verify 789 as the year. So I'm sorry to say,  Not done:. Hemanthah (talk) 04:01, 1 January 2022 (UTC)

@Hemanthah, Yes I have just noticed the differences in data between the fr-wiki and en-wiki pages. Below is a correction with the data of the en-wiki pages. Thanks again.

Mauretania: 3rd century BC – 44 AD Mauretania Tingitana: 42 - 7th century Idrissid Dynasty: 788 - 974 Almoravid Empire: 1040 - 1147 Almohad Empire: 1121 - 1269 Marinid Empire: 1244 – 1465 Wattassid Dynasty: 1472 - 1554 Saadian Dynasty: 1510 - 1659 Alaouite Dynasty: from 1631 Establishment of the protectorate: March 30, 1912 Independence: April 7, 1956 AmineR7 (talk) 12:57, 1 January 2022 (UTC)

@AmineR7 I'm not familiar with the relevant history to evaluate. I've set the request to unanswered so somebody more knowledgeable might take a look. --Hemanthah (talk) 13:15, 1 January 2022 (UTC)

Per my above comment, the infobox is intended to note the establishment of sovereignty, not to be a complete timeline. CMD (talk) 16:09, 1 January 2022 (UTC)

@Chipmunkdavis Good Evening. Notifying the different periods of state formation is an integral part of the establishment of sovereignty and should naturally appear in the infobox. The en-wiki pages of several neighbouring countries have respectfully more complete infobox. Even the french, arabic, spanish, and others wiki pages of Morocco have a complete infobox. The en-wiki infobox shows major shortcomings on this point, unlike other wiki pages of Morocco.AmineR7 (talk) 17:45, 1 January 2022 (UTC)

The more items you have in a list, the less salience and importance any individual entry has. A switch in dynasty is not by itself a switch in state formation. CMD (talk) 17:49, 1 January 2022 (UTC)

References

Bad hyperlink

Hi, 'Tan-tan' hyperlink should be replaced with 'Tan-Tan'. Thank you. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.76.160.44 (talk) 18:32, 13 January 2022 (UTC)

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 28 August 2018 and 22 December 2018. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Braelynnwilson.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 04:28, 17 January 2022 (UTC)

Paragraph on literature

The picture of "Leo Africanus" lacks any reference in text. There are two possible targets for the link, first the person mentioned and second the novel written by Amin Maalouf (I found out it is the person himself^^). Anyway, there should be at least a short potion of text. Ciao --Pentaclebreaker (talk) 15:46, 2 March 2022 (UTC)

Je moedr

Is je moedr 109.38.135.81 (talk) 20:11, 3 January 2022 (UTC)

Remarks in the English Wikipedia should be in English. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 17tgn17dbn (talk • contribs) 10:50, 24 March 2022 (UTC)

Section on history

While I cannot edit this page myself, I would appreciate it if someone who can would correct the spelling of Lyautey's military rank (in the section on history 1912-1956) from "Marshall" to "Marshal." ("Marshall" is the correct spelling of an unrelated word, and is also a common male given name, but is an error in this context.) 2601:190:403:9F50:0:0:0:7891 (talk) 15:18, 9 May 2022 (UTC)

done. - Roxy the grumpy dog. wooF 15:33, 9 May 2022 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 24 May 2022

Instead of "Berber", we could use "Amazigh". 105.159.35.11 (talk) 12:37, 24 May 2022 (UTC)

Why? -Roxy the grumpy dog. wooF 13:29, 24 May 2022 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 28 June 2022

Hello i want to edit something about the population because the population did grow and its above 38 million atm this is my source : https://www.populationof.net/morocco/ MoroccoGoals7 (talk) 19:57, 28 June 2022 (UTC)

I'm afraid not. That website specifically says that they make no claims of accuracy here, so it is not suitable as a source. - Roxy the bad tempered dog 20:10, 28 June 2022 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 9 September 2022

Change "Morocco was faced aggression from Spain and the Ottoman Empire allies pressing westward."

to "Morocco was faced with aggression from Spain and the Ottoman Empire allies pressing westward." Dillboy99 (talk) 15:51, 9 September 2022 (UTC)

 Done M.Bitton (talk) 16:04, 9 September 2022 (UTC)

shia islam in the country bar

the side bar claims shia muslims are 0.45% which is almost 170 000 people, this is obviously wrong for a country with no local shia community, there is also no real source for this claim and it contradicts with the more reliable source 41.143.212.27 (talk) 23:16, 21 September 2022 (UTC)

Source misrepresentation

Regarding this nonsensical question: the source itself doesn't support the statement that was added and Tiaret is obviously not in Morocco, so what source am I supposed to have to change the grossly misleading statement (that was added by the editor asking the question and that I corrected)? M.Bitton (talk) 13:51, 6 November 2022 (UTC)

The relevant text as I left it:

"Historically, the territory has been associated with what Muslim geographers referred to as al-Maghrib al-Aqṣā [ar] (المغرب الأقصى, 'the Farthest West [of the Islamic world]' designating roughly the area from Tiaret to the Atlantic)"

From the historian Emily Gottreich's Jewish Morocco: "The name of Morocco in Arabic, al-maghrib al-aqsa, translates into English as the farthest western point of the Islamic world," and there are several reliable sources supporting the association of al-Maghrib al-Aqṣā with Morocco.

Your assumption is that the current political borders of Morocco—and concepts of borders and nation-states more broadly—are exactly what they were when al-Maghrib al-Aqṣā was the term preferred by Muslim historians and geographers. Your edit made the statement anachronistic. إيان (talk) 14:14, 6 November 2022 (UTC)

1) Don't edit my comment again. 2) I won't let you change the subject: you misrepresented the source and asked a nonsensical question. These are the facts that you need to address. M.Bitton (talk) 14:17, 6 November 2022 (UTC)

Covid and Human rights?

There is a paragraph in the Human Rights section regarding Moroccan migrants temporarily stranded in Spain during the COVID-19 lockdown. From the current text and without any explanation, it is practically impossible to determine how it relates to human rights (was Spain trying to protect the human rights of those migrants? was Spain violating the human rights of the migrants? something else? ). If there are third-party sources that connect these news to human rights it should be noted, and appropriately attributed if it was an opinion and not a result from a legal proceeding (e.g, "In the opinion of The New York Times editors this was a violation of human rights because lockdowns constitute an arbitrary arrest"). If there is no connection to human rights that can is verifiable from external sources then it should be considered for removal. If it is relevant for reasons other than human rights then it should be moved to a new section - Ecrz (talk) 04:11, 21 November 2022 (UTC)

99.6% Islam???

There was some progress in the ethnicity where for long they insisted with 99% Arabs too but in reality mixture of predominantly Berber/Amazigh and Arab. The same needs to happen with Islam 197.250.225.208 (talk) 15:54, 28 November 2022 (UTC)

The U.S. government estimates the total population at 36.4 million (midyear 2021). More than 99 percent of the population is Sunni Muslim, and less than 0.1 percent of the population is Shia Muslim. Groups together constituting less than 1 percent of the population include Christians, Jews, and Baha’is. If you have sources that give a different percentage please provide them. nableezy - 16:38, 28 November 2022 (UTC)

Ethnic statistics

Hi, I don't think ethnic statistics should be included as it's not in the census statistics & there is no standard methodology for such. NorthAfricanArmsDealer (talk) 03:23, 30 November 2022 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 6 December 2022

Add link to this article in Indonesian language: https://id.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maroko 98.35.90.190 (talk) 16:38, 6 December 2022 (UTC)

We dont normally do that, so no. - Roxy the dog 18:10, 6 December 2022 (UTC)

Ibn Battuta, the great traveller is not mentioned

Why Ibn Battuta is not mentioned ??? 37.131.71.66 (talk) 06:45, 11 December 2022 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 15 December 2022 (2)

Revert to edit Revision as of 00:03, 10 December 2022 The wiki page has been vandalised by removing a well sourced information Achraf656 (talk) 10:52, 15 December 2022 (UTC)

Not done, as there is no consensus with for this change. Please discuss the reliability of afrobarometer with Lolamelody123456 who made the change. --Mvqr (talk) 14:26, 15 December 2022 (UTC)

Establishment of Morocco

While the modern state of Morocco started with the Idrissid dynasty in 788 AD. The records go back to antiquity, when Morocco was called Mauretania whose king was Bagas (225 BC). In Algeria wikipedia page, it states its formation back to antiquity, even though part of what is algeria today was under kingdom of Mauretania (Maures). Either Algeria formation date needs to change to exclude antiquity or added Moroccan formation back to the Maures in Antiquity (225 BC). — Preceding unsigned comment added by Warrior4just (talk • contribs) 00:12, 28 May 2022 (UTC)

I think that Morocco as the Country/Nation we have today was established in the 17th century by the Alaouite dynasty, as you can read in the wikipedia article, section "Early modern period". It is also hard to talk about "Nationalism" before XIX century.

If we talk about the State, we should look even later with the end of the protectorates...

Probably, the Algeria Wikipedia page may also be wrong in that aspect if it is written like you said. Zarzanator (talk) 17:20, 2 August 2022 (UTC)

With all respect, wikipedia project is highly important, and no room for supposition, only sources should prevail. Morocco officially recognise being a state since 788, and this mentioned. Everyone can think what he wants, however wikipedia is not a space for pouring personal thoughts, and many evidence show that Moroccan nationalim and identity as well as statehood are back to one millenar if not before.

In the establishement, it is important also to mention the great historical steps, and before 788, there was the formation of Mauritania in the 4th century BC. It is highly important to mention this, to show also the berber amazigh component in our History

Best regards HfedBo (talk) 00:31, 16 December 2022 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 15 December 2022

Revert to edit Revision as of 00:03, 10 December 2022 Wiki got vandalised by removing a well sourced information Achraf656 (talk) 10:47, 15 December 2022 (UTC)

Not done, as there is no consensus with for this change. Please discuss the reliability of afrobarometer with Lolamelody123456 who made the change. --Mvqr (talk) 14:26, 15 December 2022 (UTC)

It’s well reliable source study of 79 pages detailing the ethnic diversity of Morocco, Lolamelody123456 is deleting anything related to Arabs in Morroco pages, I don’t think discussing with someone targeting ethnic group is going anywhere. Achraf656 (talk) 07:22, 16 December 2022 (UTC)

FORMATION OF MOROCCO

Hi everyone

Two major edits brought by myself:

First edit: the independence of Morocco is the 18th of November 1955 according to the official Moroccan authorities (https://maroc.ma/en/content/national-holidays-religious-holidays). It is a matter of respect and coherence to mention the date reported and commemorated by Moroccans as their independence day, and not any other date.

The second edit is a mention of Kingdom of Mauritania as the first political entity in the History of Morocco. I believe it is necessary and important to mention that specific element as it is a mention of the amazigh berber past of Morocco.

Best regards HfedBo (talk) 00:23, 16 December 2022 (UTC)

Your edits contradict what the RS say about both subjects: 1) the date of the independence of Morocco is universally known as the 2nd of March 1956 (a fact that has nothing to do with respect). The declaration of independence that you are referring to is a different subject: for instance, although the Algerian declared their independence in 1958, it didn't happen until 1962. 2) There were many tribes and so-called "kingdoms" in North Africa, but we know next to nothing about them. What we know and can prove is that the first known Berber State (Numidia) was established in 202 BC, while the first territorial state in what is now Morocco was established in 788 AD. Reliable sources for these can easily be found (or supplied if needs be). M.Bitton (talk) 14:26, 16 December 2022 (UTC)

Dear M. Bitton

First, please note that Morocco celebrates its independence day the 18th of November, and none of the dates you show are celebrated in Morocco, not even mentioned. You know perfectly that Algeria is not celebrating the 1958 date but 1962.

This is your own discretionary choice to impose two dates where Morocco was already independent in 18th of November 1955 and the first government after independence sworn in the 7th of December 1955. I can't see the point with Algeria where in 1958 the war was at its peak and no one could have said once they will get independence.

So please, Wikipedia is not online to invent parallel realities to the ones in the country. Morocco's official Independence Day is the 18th of November, a holiday in Morocco celebrated as being the Independence Day. This last 18th of November it was the 67th Independence Day celebrated. I think further insistence means hurting the feelings of millions of Moroccans. Please make the date appear as it is in reality in Morocco since independence in 18th November 1955.

As for universality, please just put Independence Day in Morocco on Google, you will see that it is 18th of November.

I think that by insisting stubbornly of the other dates, you make Morocco the only country in Wikipedia that has not its independent date in its country fact sheet.

If in some random very old French books it is mentioned the 2nd of March, this does absolutely means universality, furthermore, by being celebrated on the ground since 67 years, and by being the recognized independence day by Google, and all official documents in Morocco, it is really very hard to understand why insisting that much.

Concerning Mauretania, please here a document of the UNESCO, where Volubilis is mentioned to be the capital Mauretania and founded in the 3rd century. Enough to add as a first step, Mauretania as being the first ever natural Berber Amazigh entity in Morocco in the 3rd century BC

https://whc.unesco.org/en/list/836

If needed I can bring enough document to show that Mauretania was a real entity since at least the 3rd century BC, mainly based in north Morocco.

Best regards HfedBo (talk) 15:19, 16 December 2022 (UTC)

Celebrating "the declaration of independence" doesn't change the date of independence (2 March 1956). This fact is supported by all RS that are about the subject and not just in French, as you claim. The Volubilis that you linked to was built by Juba I (hence its Roman character). Obviously, all the tribes and so-called "kingdom" were "real entities", but like I said, the first known Berber State was established in 2002 BC. If you have a reliable source that contradicts this, you are more than welcome to present it. M.Bitton (talk) 15:53, 16 December 2022 (UTC)

‘Name of Morocoo’ ?

Title of section has the name of the country misspelled. 2604:3D08:477D:AA00:C419:1FA1:E6E3:EF76 (talk) 02:36, 7 December 2022 (UTC)

Thanks for spotting that, corrected now. Moons of Io (talk) 02:41, 7 December 2022 (UTC)

Semi protected edit request

In the intro, please add a sentence that it is considered the westernmost country in the Maghreb. http://wildlife-explorer.com/morocco 2600:100C:A21C:E44E:2CF0:7EE2:2CCD:CA5C (talk) 02:25, 27 February 2023 (UTC)

Not done: When creating edit requests you are required to present what you want a reviewing editor to do specifically. That is to say, you should phrase your request to sound something like "Please change X to Y" or "Please remove/add Y" with X and Y being quoted prose. If adding content, you must also specify where specifically in the article you wish to insert it. —Sirdog (talk) 05:37, 27 February 2023 (UTC)

Formation of Morocco 2.0

dear M. bitton

I see you seem to have a personal problem with Morocco. And that is why I would now like to present my sources for all Moroccan Empires.

Mauretania Tingitana

1. ,,Mauretania Tingitana (Latin for "Tangerine Mauretania") was a Roman province, coinciding roughly with the northern part of present-day Morocco."

2. ,,The Tingitana included the western part, especially the area of ​​today's Morocco including Ceuta and Melilla."

Source: 1. Wikipedia Self, 2. University of Granada.

I have to admit that this is the only kingdom with so few sources, but that should be enough to describe Mauretania Tingitana as a Moroccan kingdom.

Idrisid dynasty

1.,,He united the Berber tribes of the area by claiming descent from Muhammad, leading to the emergence of the first independent Islamic dynasty in Morocco."

2. ,,Idrīsid dynasty, also called al-Idrīsiyūn, Arab Muslim dynasty that ruled in Morocco from 789 until 921."

Source: 1. Oxford, 2. Britannica Encyclopedia.

I refrain from showing further sources because everyone agrees.

Almoraviden dynasty

1.,,The Almohads also accepted the Almoravid precedent of a Moroccan empire reaching from the Sahara to Spain."

2. ,,The Almoravid Berbers rose in the middle of the eleventh century to become rulers of Morocco. They were nomadic people from southern Morocco and Mauritania who relied on stock raising and the ..."

3.,, The Moroccans desire to revive Islam revived the group and their empire became known as the Almoravid Dynasty (al-Mur ̄abit.un)."

Source: 1. University of Cambridge (Book: Islamic society and civilisation) 2. Oxford (Book: History of Islam Page) 3. University of Stanford (Book: Morocco and the War on Terror.)

The sources should be enough. There are of course many other reputable sources but I would have to buy the books for that. If there are still doubts, I can also call other sources.

Almohad caliphate

1. ,,The moroccan caliphate almohad attacked several positions of...."

2.,,the Moroccan caliphate was founded by ibn tumart"

3. ,,A Berber state had arisen in Tinmel in the Atlas Mountains of Morocco about 1120, inspired by Ibn Tūmart and his demands for puritanical moral reform and a strict concept of the unity of God (tawḥīd)."

I can also cite other sources here. but that should be enough.

Source: 1.Oxford (Book: Muslim Spain) 2. University of Cambridge (Book: History of islam) 3. Britannica.

Marinid Sultanate

1. ,,The Nasirid Arab princes, who had seized power there, pursued a precarious policy of balancing the Christians in the north against the Marinid sultans in Morocco. At times they paid tribute to the Christians; at other times they urged ."

2. ,,Marīnid dynasty, also called Banū Marīn, Amazigh (Berber) dynasty that replaced Almohad rule in Morocco and, temporarily, in other parts of northern Africa during the 13th–15th century."

3. ,,the Marinid Sultanate from Morocco...."

Source: 1. Oxford (Book History of the Crusades) 2. Britannica 3. University of Cambridge (Book: History of Africa)

I will not explain all the others because M.Bitta damot agreed.

it is strange that M.bitta with many Moroccan rich and historical people edits or formulates it in such a way that it cannot be traced back to Morocco.

Furthermore, I find it strange that M.Bitta absolutely needs sources for Morocco, but for Algeria he is very generous and edits some rich that is not Algerian at all. He doesn't ask for sources.

I almost have the impression. As if "M.Bitta" had a personal problem with Morocco. And he's trying to destroy the Moroccan identity. Unfortunately he succeeds, he treats historical people from Morocco and caliphates in such a way that one cannot call it "Moroccan".

What is wrong that many historians and universities such as Oxford Harvard Stanford and Cambridge are of this opinion.

I therefore offer you not to change it, Mr. M.bitta. I have shown you the sources and can I also show others Bahironga (talk) 21:50, 11 May 2023 (UTC)

I don't see any explanation for the content that you removed from the article. For the rest, I suggest you read the above discussion. Once done, you should also check out WP:AGF and WP:NPA. In the meantime, I have reported you to the admins for persistent disruption across multiple articles. M.Bitton (talk) 22:13, 11 May 2023 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 15 May 2023

Change the Flag of Morroco featured in this page for the one in the "Flag of Morroco page" ThisRando'Dude (talk) 01:20, 15 May 2023 (UTC)

 Not done for now: There's a discussion at Talk:Flag of Morocco#The Design of the Pentagram. Callmemirela 🍁 02:54, 15 May 2023 (UTC)

Morrocan Flag

The shown flag on the page is incorrect, Morrocan flag doesn't has a stroke for it's star. 145.255.121.228 (talk) 18:35, 14 May 2023 (UTC)

@145.255.121.228: Please see the previous discussion at Talk:Flag of Morocco#The Design of the Pentagram; we have flag photos and graphics from Moroccan embassies and consulates, showing the black outline (fimbriation) making the interlaced design of the pentagram visible. Also compare the relative size of star vs. flag, for instance at Moroccan website Article27.ma. – .Raven  ^.talk 03:57, 15 May 2023 (UTC)

Reversed order?

The two Arabic words of the kingdom’s name are reversed in order, unlike the other two-word Arabic names in this section. Is there a reason for this apparent mistake? Cieljaune (talk) 01:15, 18 December 2022 (UTC)

Well, the Arabic words should run consistently from the right. Depending on what you think is 'reversed', it may be the other ones that had the problem. — LlywelynII 23:50, 16 May 2023 (UTC)

Biledulgerid

is currently an article on a "country" of either 180 sq. mi. or many thousand based on early 19th century encyclopedia articles that had no idea what they were talking about. (a) If anyone here knows more about what it was actually trying to describe at the time, it shows up in European maps and gazetteers for centuries and whatever it's trying to talk about may have been an aspect of Moroccan history or at least the way historical European sources talked about it. (b) The "independent" "Mosselemis" seems to be trying to talk about a tribe or tribal group near Cape Bojador. They also show up in period sources as "Monselmines", "Moslemyn", and "Mosaylamyn". Were those all mangling of the Masmuda? or a different group that's now gone? or another still around? If anyone knows, we should at least fill out some stuff on Wikidata so it's possible to figure out what those sources were trying to talk about. — LlywelynII 23:57, 16 May 2023 (UTC) N.B None of the maps is accurate — Preceding unsigned comment added by Aichaadoui (talk • contribs) 19:15, 6 July 2023 (UTC)

Mention of Mauritania as a bordering state

An editor removed the mention of Mauritania bordering Western Sahara on the reasoning that it is irrelevant. Western Sahara is treated as a territory, nevertheless disputed, of Morocco on the map. So should Mauritania be mentioned, or only bordering states and regions of undisputed territories? Hamamat32 (talk) 22:06, 12 July 2023 (UTC)

Western Sahara is mentioned as being south of Morocco. This is a fact and the wikilink to Western Sahara is there for anyone who wants to learn more about it and the other countries that border to it. M.Bitton (talk) 23:00, 12 July 2023 (UTC)

Morocco's borders stop at the 12th parallel, over 30 kilometres (19 mi) north of the northernmost point of Mauritania. ―Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 02:36, 13 July 2023 (UTC)

The Sharifian empire

I noticed that the Sharifian Empire, which was the name of the nation from the sixteenth century until before the French protectorate in Morocco, is not mentioned anywhere, The Sharifian Empire even has a separate article in Wikipedia in the following languages: French, Spanish, Arabic, Dutch, and Romanian. And I'm wondering if the article were translated into English using the same sources, would it be published? 102.38.8.5 (talk) 18:56, 16 July 2023 (UTC)

July 2023

@Smartshri99: you didn't answer the question. Where did you get the 400BC from and why are you introducing a sock's wish? M.Bitton (talk) 10:46, 31 July 2023 (UTC)

https://books.google.de/books?redir_esc=y&id=F-8uAQAAIAAJ&focus=searchwithinvolume&q=Kingdom shri44 (talk) 15:12, 31 July 2023 (UTC)

If you have no intention of answering the question, then please do me a favour and don't waste my time with cryptic nonsense. M.Bitton (talk) 15:15, 31 July 2023 (UTC)

Countries with coastline in both the Atlantic and the Mediterranean

Shouldn't the UK be included as well, given that Gibraltar and parts of Cyprus are UK territories? 31.124.181.40 (talk) 09:39, 10 September 2023 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 17 September 2023

the land thats marked as western Sahara is Moroccan and there’s Moroccan people and families living there and they hold Moroccan nationality with Moroccan ID 41.141.128.134 (talk) 22:50, 17 September 2023 (UTC)

 Not done: this and the Western Sahara article say otherwise. M.Bitton (talk) 23:26, 17 September 2023 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 18 September 2023

Morocco founded in 789 AD 196.113.9.93 (talk) 12:15, 18 September 2023 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. M.Bitton (talk) 12:24, 18 September 2023 (UTC)

"ⵜⴰⴳⵍⴷⵉⵜ ⵏ ⵍⵎⵖⵔⵉⴱ" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect ⵜⴰⴳⵍⴷⵉⵜ ⵏ ⵍⵎⵖⵔⵉⴱ has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 September 23 § ⵜⴰⴳⵍⴷⵉⵜ ⵏ ⵍⵎⵖⵔⵉⴱ until a consensus is reached. greyzxq ^talk 22:22, 23 September 2023 (UTC)

"ⵜⴰⴳⵍⴷⵉⵜ" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect ⵜⴰⴳⵍⴷⵉⵜ has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 September 24 § ⵜⴰⴳⵍⴷⵉⵜ until a consensus is reached. –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 19:43, 24 September 2023 (UTC)

the creation date of the country is wrong. The country was created in this date 789 AD. The date quoted in wiki is the Independence Day. Not création date. Thanks Nuritcka (talk) 10:48, 27 September 2023 (UTC)