Talk:Mike McCartney (footballer)

Requested move 6 May 2023

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: not moved. (closed by non-admin page mover) CLYDE ^{TALK TO ME}/_{STUFF DONE} (please mention me on reply) 17:20, 21 May 2023 (UTC)

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Mike McCartney (footballer) → Mike McCartney – The page "Mike McCartney" itself redirects to the page of Mike McGear, whose real name is Mike McCartney but who does not go by that name professionally. Given that the footballer did go by this name professionally, I do believe that his article should be called "Mike McCartney," while Mike McGear's page can remain in the state it is in, considering that the Mike McCartney page itself is just a redirect to that article and not a disambiguation page. Hatnotes can help out with the rest. JeffSpaceman (talk) 11:46, 6 May 2023 (UTC) — Relisting. CLYDE ^{TALK TO ME}/_{STUFF DONE} (please mention me on reply) 20:56, 14 May 2023 (UTC)

• Note: This discussion has been included in WikiProject Football's list of association football-related page moves. GiantSnowman 15:30, 7 May 2023 (UTC)
• Support per nom; footballer should be main page, and we can dab to the artist McGear. GiantSnowman 15:32, 7 May 2023 (UTC)
• Support per nom. A hatnote is fine. -- Necrothesp (talk) 13:24, 9 May 2023 (UTC)
• STRONGEST POSSIBLE OPPOSE. You all can't be serious. Mike, the brother of (former) Beatle Paul McCartney, is not the primary topic for Mike McCartney??? Google begs to differ. The first page of results for "Mike McCartney" is dominated by Paul's brother, and then an American football player, a Democratic politician, etc. And the page views are 318:91 favoring the brother of the famous Beatle over the obscure footballer. This is a classic case of a proper WP:PRIMARYREDIRECT. --В²C ☎ 04:53, 13 May 2023 (UTC)

  The person who this page redirects to does not go by "Mike McCartney" professionally. The footballer does, and he is the only other person noted in the hatnote on Mike McGear's page. The fact is that McGear does not primarily go under his birth name professionally, while the footballer does. Because of this, I don't feel that this should be a primary redirect -- it seems like it should be an obvious primary topic for the footballer, since he uses that name professionally while McGear does not. JeffSpaceman (talk) 16:44, 14 May 2023 (UTC)

  What he goes by professionally is immaterial to COMMONNAME determination. What he is commonly referred to in reliable sources is what is relevant here. He is far better known for being Paul's brother than for his profession. Seriously. --В²C ☎ 06:10, 19 May 2023 (UTC)

• Additional information.
  • Mike McCartney's website: mikemccartney.co
  • Twitter handle: MikeMcCartney
  • His book: Mike McCartney's Early Liverpool
  • NY Times uses Mike McCartney: Mike McCartney

In short, it appears he used McGear as a stage name decades ago to avoid the connection with his famous brother, but not so much any more. People searching for "Mike McCartney" are FAR more likely looking for Paul's brother than for some totally obscure footballer. Click HERE for pageview comparisons. It's not even a contest. There is strong argument to move Mike McGear to Mike McCartney, but the argument to otherwise leave Mike McCartney as WP:PRIMARYREDIRECT to Mike McGear is unassailable. It would be a huge mistake to move this as proposed. --В²C ☎ 06:26, 19 May 2023 (UTC)

I suppose you make a good point. Perhaps, if you are correct about Mike McGear not being as commonly used by McCartney as a stage name anymore, that page should be titled Mike McCartney instead, with a hatnote disambiguating the obscure footballer, while this page remains in the state it is in. That might be a better option, given the information you have offered. JeffSpaceman (talk) 20:20, 19 May 2023 (UTC)

Yes, but this is not the place to make that proposal. --В²C ☎ 02:49, 20 May 2023 (UTC)

RM Proposed: Talk:Mike_McGear#Requested_move_20_May_2023 --В²C ☎ 03:05, 20 May 2023 (UTC)

Thank you for doing that. One more question: am I allowed to close this move discussion as "not moved," or does someone else need to do that? JeffSpaceman (talk) 10:42, 20 May 2023 (UTC)

Somebody not involved has to do that, but since you the nom have changed your mind, whoever comes here to close it should just close it as not moved. В²C ☎ 22:07, 20 May 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.