Talk:Love/Hate (The-Dream album)/GA1

GA Review

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Reviewer: Wetrorave (talk · contribs) 16:34, 29 June 2021 (UTC)

From a quick look, here's my opinion:

Good Article review progress box Criteria: 1a. prose () 1b. MoS () 2a. ref layout () 2b. cites WP:RS () 2c. no WP:OR () 2d. no WP:CV () 3a. broadness () 3b. focus () 4. neutral () 5. stable () 6a. free or tagged images () 6b. pics relevant () Note: this represents where the article stands relative to the Good Article criteria. Criteria marked are unassessed

Infobox and lead

• Image nees |alt= text – NFCC seems fine
  • Okay
• A possibly better way to summarize The Dream's roles: "American singer, songwriter, and producer" > "American musician"
  • Okay
• "is the debut album by" – remove album wikilink
  • It should stay as a contextual link to an elementary topic of this article (MOS:CONTEXTLINK).
• "producer The-Dream. It was released" > "producer The-Dream, released"
  • I don't find this kind of construction the most sophisticated grammatically.
• "2007, during his" > "2007. With his"
• "pop music. [line break] The-Dream pursued" > "pop music, The-Dream pursued" (without the line break)
  • That would change the meaning of the sentence by directly connecting his emergence to his musical direction for the album. isento (talk) 20:11, 29 June 2021 (UTC)
• "Love/Hate, drawing" > "Love/Hate. The album drew"
  • The word works best as an adverb referring to The-Dream and his direction, rather than the album itself, which is more a product of the direction and inspirations than an acting agent. isento (talk) 20:11, 29 June 2021 (UTC)
• "native Atlanta. Recording" > "native Atlanta. [line break] Recording"
• "Recording alongside fellow songwriter-producers Tricky Stewart and Carlos McKinney, he employed" > "Recorded alongside fellow songwriter-producers Tricky Stewart and Carlos McKinney, the album employs"
  • Okay. isento (talk) 20:11, 29 June 2021 (UTC)
• For info on critical reception, add this before the first sentence of the third paragraph:
  • That doesn't seem necessary. And I think it's more effective to end the paragraph with views on its lasting significance, mirroring the structure of the body. isento (talk) 20:11, 29 June 2021 (UTC)
    • Sorry isento, I suggested that when I didn't know any better. I was going to write a summary of the reception but then I saw that it's already there (it's fine for it to be at the end of the lead). I must have forgotten to remove this suggestion, but I guess it was just a burning memory. Wetrorave (talk) 21:38, 29 June 2021 (UTC)
      • Nice lyric reference! I love sharing the things we know and love with those of my kind ... isento (talk) 03:46, 30 June 2021 (UTC)

Background

• "As The-Dream recalls, "I called [Island Def Jam executive] Karen Kwak and I told her I wanted to [...] shit. I figured" > "The-Dream stated he remembers calling Island Def Jam executive Karen Kwak and telling her he "wanted to [...] shit." The-Dream said: "I figured"
  • I've paraphrased much of it instead. "Stated" means to say something clearly and definitely, which phrases like "artist shit" and "figured" do not. isento (talk) 00:59, 1 July 2021 (UTC)

Writing and recording

• "and McKinney[4] – were [...] Angeles.[5]" > "and McKinney – were [...] Angeles.[4][5]"
  • WP:CITEFOOT says to place the citation after the adjacent punctuation and close to the material it is supporting. isento (talk) 02:07, 1 July 2021 (UTC)
• "approach[6] and wrote some of its songs responding" > "approach,[6] writing some of its songs as a response"
  • I've split the clauses into two sentences. isento (talk) 02:07, 1 July 2021 (UTC)
• "life, most notably "Nikki", which was inspired" > "life. An example is "Nikki", a track inspired"
  • Apparently, whoever added that sentence in the past misused the source. So I've replaced it with something more faithful to the source. isento (talk) 02:07, 1 July 2021 (UTC)
• "from past artists" > "from artists" – past is redundant, since there's no way someone can be influenced by a future artist
  • Well, there is also the present, and the sentence mentions "contemporary", so I believe the "past" distinction is still useful. isento (talk) 02:07, 1 July 2021 (UTC)
• "elements,[4] as the" > "elements.[4] The" for the sentence not be too large
  • I've replaced the period with a semicolon, so the connection remains. isento (talk) 02:07, 1 July 2021 (UTC)
• "resolutely luminescent" with" > "resolutely luminescent", with" for readers to have a pause on this sentence
  • Done. isento (talk) 02:07, 1 July 2021 (UTC)

Title and packaging

• Change to Title and album cover
• Make this section a level 3 header since it's three/four lines long
  • I would prefer to keep as is. As a subsection, it wouldn't belong under any of the other sections, topically. Perhaps I will expand it in the future, actually. isento (talk) 02:17, 1 July 2021 (UTC)
  • Actually, it can work also if merged into marketing and sales. isento (talk) 04:03, 1 July 2021 (UTC)

Marketing and sales

• "Around the time of "Bed"'s release," > "Near the release of "Bed","
  • Near is defined primarily as proximity, i.e. physical distance, so I think the current phrasing makes it clearer that we are defining a period of time. isento (talk) 02:21, 1 July 2021 (UTC)

Critical reception

• Ref 25 redirects to Vibe's news page; use this
  • Thanks. Done. isento (talk) 02:27, 1 July 2021 (UTC)
• "year" because of The-Dream's ability to write catchy songs." > "year",opining that The-Dream is a skilled songwriter."
  • Well, the critic specifies it's his "tune-sense", tune meaning melody or melodic song, so I've revised it to "The-Dream's instinct for composing melodies". isento (talk) 02:27, 1 July 2021 (UTC)
• "Some reviewers had reservations." – this is a very vague statement; what reservations did they have, and why?
  • It's merely a summary and no more or less vague than the album having received acclaim. The subsequent sentences elucidate those reservations. isento (talk) 02:27, 1 July 2021 (UTC)
• "remained impressed by the consistent quality" > "opined that the album has consistent quality"
  • I don't want to get too wordy here. I'll just remove "consistent", since that was the only problematic element in stating what she "remained impressed by" as fact. isento (talk) 02:27, 1 July 2021 (UTC)

Legacy and influence

• Endash with other dash might be confusing, so "the West–Jay-Z song" > "West's collaboration with Jay-Z"
  • That would complicate the remaining structure of the sentence and make a long one even longer. MOS:ENBETWEEN says the dash can be used this way for compound constructions indicating "and". isento (talk) 02:46, 1 July 2021 (UTC)
• "proved highly innovative" > "is considered highly innovative"
  • The Pitchfork source, cited at the end of the second sentence, verifies it this. And writing "considered ..." without attribution would be weasel-y. There's no reason to doubt the veracity of this statement, with other sources verifying it too ([1]). isento (talk) 02:46, 1 July 2021 (UTC)
  • Also, phrasing it in the past tense suits the narrative tone of the section, as events happening after the album. isento (talk) 03:57, 1 July 2021 (UTC)

Track listing

• Use Cite AV media notes here per WP:TRACKLISTING
  • Done. isento (talk) 02:50, 1 July 2021 (UTC)

Personnel

• Wikiling the first instance of mastering to mastering (audio) and engineer to audio engineer
  • Done. And I've expanded/completed the track credits. isento (talk) 03:37, 1 July 2021 (UTC)

Charts

• Seems fine

Certifications

• Change to Certification since it's only one
  • Done. isento (talk) 03:43, 1 July 2021 (UTC)

See also

• Fine

References

• Cite SOHH as |website= or |work= on ref 3
• Use Cite AV media notes rather than Cite web for ref 5, since it seems the intent is to cite the liner notes
• Ref 10 is |url-access=limited and not paid, since the NYT does give you some free articles
  • Done. isento (talk) 03:53, 1 July 2021 (UTC)

Further reading/External links

• Fine

Overall

•  On hold for now; I may not be able to respond in the following hours though. Wetrorave (talk) 16:34, 29 June 2021 (UTC)
  • Thanks. I'll get thru the rest later though. isento (talk) 20:12, 29 June 2021 (UTC)
    • You seem to have addressed all the issues. The ones you didn't seem fine, since there is a stated reason for not doing each one of them. I'm still not entirely happy with the article not having a combination of the artist's name with the release date separated only by a comma, like other articles do, but 'brilliant' prose is not a requirement of GA so it's not necessary.

In conclusion, this article is good to go: ✓ Pass. Wetrorave (talk) 12:52, 1 July 2021 (UTC)