Talk:Latin American integration

Content brought over from Talk:United States of South America

The last statement ("Mexico will never be part of this union since ratified in the year 2005 the Security and Prosperity Partnership of North America defining this way its perpetual alliance with Canada and the United States of America") smacks of POV and is not true; I see nowhere in the agreement signed by the nations of North America that would preclude Mexico joining a future Latin American Union, and even if it did, a future government could simply sever the ties.

Mexico is a sovereign nation, and if it wanted to sever all ties with the US and Canada and instead join the European Union (and the EU chose to admit them despite being an ocean away from any other member state), it is their right. Therefore, I deleted the statement.--Bjeversole 10:53, 22 January 2006 (UTC)

I think the anon edits were just vandalism. the United States of South America no longer exist (and they didn't exist for long), so saying Mexico will never be part of it doesn't say much. Mariano(t/c) 08:39, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

Disputed

There was never such thing as United States of South America. There was o union of Latin American States proposed by Simón Bolívar under the name of Colombia (read article Great Colombia & Organization of American States), so this idea wasn't limited to South America only, but to the entire continent in times when the Unites States had not yet taken the West from Mexico.--tequendamia 22:39, 1 March 2006 (UTC)

Counter disputed

United States of South America do existis as a proposed state and political term. Simón Bolivars United South America was meant to include all the countries liberated by Simón Bolivar and his friend San Martin. Great Colombia was only the remains of this idea. Dentren 19:16, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

While Simon Bolivar did preach a Latin American union, I'm not sure about the accuracy of this article. It should have references that assure that the United States of South America were a concrete plan and not an interpretation of his ideas. My point is: I think the way the article is right now is original research. --Hetfield1987 (Wesborland | James Hetfield) 15:06, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

There are a lot of references to Bolivar's (and others) and that phrase, as well as a modern understanding of it: [1][2][3][4][5].

Perhaps the error is to connect the term to Simon Bolivar alone, but it's a concept used today, based in the ideas of some of the Libertadores. --Mariano(t/c) 20:38, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

I incorporated the above mentioned citations into the article. Despite what's claimed above, none of the citations state that the term was used by the Liberator. Frankly, I think this article should be deleted, and its component parts incorporated into the appropriate articles (the Congress of Panama, Gran Colombia, Union of South American Nations, etc.). But I suspect that it would be recreated soon after.TriniMuñoz (talk) 08:29, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

On further reflection, I note that once the article is developed using the articles cited by Mariano or some anonymous editor, it becomes a discussion about "Latin American integration." The term "United States of South America" is clearly just a metaphor for the desired outcome of this process. I challenge anyone to find evidence that Bolívar or San Martín or any other independence leader used it. (I just finished reviewing a collection of Bolívar's letters on the subject—despite this dangerously crossing over to original research—and could not find anything that came remotely close. As is typical of this era, Bolívar wasn't too concerned with an "official" name and used many interchangeably.) Since there is no article on Latin American integration, but many articles on the various trade blocs and international political associations, such an article would be a nice place to unify all of them and have a description of the evolution of trans-nationalism in Latin America from its independence to now. This would also take into account the objections about deleting the article mentioned below in the section "speedy removed." I really like the idea of bringing in Hugo Chávez's invocation of "Bolívar's dream" as he carries out and explains his domestic and regional policies.TriniMuñoz (talk) 17:38, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

speedy removed

This seems to be an editing question. Find references, because it doesn't depend on what the eds. think but on what published sources say. DGG 03:30, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

I agree. Besides, the term has gained some popularity with Chavez. --Mariano(t/c) 13:46, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

Reasons for merge

As I mention above in the section "Counter disputed," once I worked on the article about the creation of a Latin American union, it became an article about Latin American integration, and it became apparent that the name "United States of South America" is really not that important. The more appropriate article title, "Latin American integration," already existed as a redirect to Pan-Americanism, a related, though distinct, phenomenon. I performed the merge and had the title "United States of South America" redirect here.TriniMuñoz (talk) 13:12, 27 April 2009 (UTC)