Talk:Kitana/Archive 1

Archive 1

First Unasked Playable Appearance?

What is that supposed to mean? (see UMK3 pic caption)

Even if you meant to say "unmasked", I don't recall her being without a mask in UMK3.

Pics of Kitana and her weapons from the movies

Shouldn't there be images of Kitana from the MK movies? --User:Angie Y.

Kitana's Age

IIRC, wasn't Kitana described as "over 10,000 years old" in MK3? Then she should have no specific age.Virogtheconq 04:10, 26 January 2006 (UTC)

Mortal Kombat Deception Unchained

Can someone make mention of the fact that she will appear in the PSP port of Mortal Kombat Deception? Check IGN.com for more info.

• Done.

external link

the external link provided doesn't have real content - if you go to the sub-pages (ie on the left), it goes to a page identical to the home one.

• Link removed. Virogtheconq 16:48, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

Conquest role

I added accurate information for all three of Kitana's MKC episodes, including actresses, appearance, and plots. AtenRa 13:53, 27 August 2006 (UTC)

Kitana's fatality

Am I permitted to add a "Kiss of Doom"-fatality video to her fatality from youtube? Morris Munroe 15:47, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

Who has created the "Kiss of Doom"-fatality where the opponent blows up until he explodes? Morris Munroe 15:58, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:KKKK.jpg

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Fair use rationale for Image:Kitana unc01.png

Image:Kitana unc01.png is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

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If there is other other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.BetacommandBot 10:52, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:MK083.jpg

Resolved

 – Fair Use rationale written. EVula // talk // ☯ // 04:32, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

Image:MK083.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

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Storyline

I've removed the "Storyline" section, which had been marked as overlong. The story related to Kitana belongs, if anywhere, on the articles of the relevant works featuring her. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Tony Sidaway (talk • contribs) 17:55, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

- That's retarded. Story is a key thing in Mortal Kombat and if you're going to remove the storyline section for Kitana, you might as well remove it for all other MK characters as well. I never understood why the section was marked as overlong anyway. That was her storyline. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.187.255.154 (talk) 19:22, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

Am I wrong when I say that the storyline will be covered in the relevant articles? --Tony Sidaway 20:44, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

- What relevant articles? And how do you define "revelant?" It makes sense for each characters' individual page to have a section that tells their individual storyline. I can see this in action not even just in Mortal Kombat, but characters for Street Fighter, DOA, Tekken, etc. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.187.255.154 (talk) 21:37, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

By "relevant" I mean articles about games or films in which Kitana features as a character having a storyline. We have an article on Mortal Kombat, which explains the overall role of Kitana in the stories. Descriptions of plot elements involving Kitana also feature in the articles Mortal Kombat (film), Mortal Kombat: Annihilation, Mortal Kombat: Deadly Alliance, and Mortal Kombat II. --Tony Sidaway 21:52, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

- Those articles barely touch on Kitana's individual story and the movies' storyline is completely different from the games' story. Hence why each character should have their own individual storyline section to fully explain that character's role and importance/relevance to the storyline. The sections on Mortal Kombat, Mortal Kombat II, and Mortal Kombat: Deadly Alliance make no mention of Kitana being raised by Shao Kahn herself. They don't explain how she served him until she learned the truth about her past. They don't explain how she dealt with Mileena, Jade, Sindel, Reptile, etc. This is crucial information about Kitana herself that should be placed in her own article. And the same should apply to any other character in the series. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.187.255.154 (talk) 22:21, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

I've opened an RFC on this question. I'll be interested to see what other people think. On the points you make, since this is a fictional person perhaps it is the case that the details that aren't important enough to be considered relevant to those articles do not belong in an encyclopedia, simply because they have no external relevance. --Tony Sidaway 22:33, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

- If that's the case, then why does any fictional character have their own page? The summeries on the other articles only give a very broad and general gist of the story. Some don't even delve into the many other individual characters. So if someone wanted to find out the storyline and/or role of Kitana...or any other character...in paticular, where would they go then? And if that sort of thing isn't considered important enough to keep, then shouldn't every fictional characters' article be removed? Why should Luke Skywalker get his own page when surely all relevant information about him can be found in the Star Wars, Empire Strikes Back, or Return of the Jedi articles? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.187.255.154 (talk • contribs) 00:10, 13 February 2008

That's a very good question. I'll answer it by saying that I don't think it's necessarily appropriate to give a blow-by-blow account of every scene in which a character is involved. In the case of Luke Skywalker, for instance, his parentage, orphaning at birth, uneventful childhood, and subsequent events can be recapped fairly briefly--I'd estimate that 500 words or less would be sufficient. The bulk of the article would be taken up with his appearances in different films, the official merchandising that has been used to promote the Lucas films (action figures, posters, playsuits, etc) live appearances of actors in the role, spin-off novels he appears in and (of course) his significance in wider popular culture (satirical representations, tributes, etc).

Now getting back to Kitana, we have a quite good "Background" section, which I think does a good job of establishing Kitana's role in-universe. Then we have a "Storyline" section which is a detailed, blow-by-blow account of Kitana's life. This runs to nearly 1300 words. It could easily be trimmed down, for instance:

First appearing in Mortal Kombat II as Shao Kahn's personal assassin and daughter, Kitana has actually discovered quite early on that she is really the daughter of the usurped king Jerrod, but keeps her own counsel and cooperates with Shao Kahn, biding her time. Her twin, Mileena, is actually an evil clone originally created to replace her but instead used to spy on her. In Mortal Kombat II, Mileena discovers that Kitana is not loyal to Shao Kahn, they fight and Kitana kills Mileena. Some of Kitana's backstory is also told in Mortal Kombat: Shaolin Monks.

Sentenced to death for treason and Mileena's murder, Kitana escapes and joins the warriors of Earth. Sindel, her dead mother, has been resurrected, and with her loyal friend Jade, Kitana removes the taint of evil from Sindel's soul. Sindel leaves Shao Kahn, leading to his defeat at the hands of Liu Kang.

That's a compressed version of the first 500 words. There should be more in the above relating to games in the Mortal Kombat series, of course, but I hope you get the idea. It isn't necessary to include every little thing about the story. The basics can be given in one-third of the space used in the current "Storyline" section. --Tony Sidaway 12:18, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

Her fans

Anyone have good pictures of the various design for Kitana's war fans? Angie Y. (talk) 22:29, 9 May 2008 (UTC)

Could someone update the pic?

MK9 look?[1] --Asperchu (talk) 23:26, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

Fullmoon's render isn't the official one, it might be a recoloring of one released by them but it's not the official Kitana pic. Sincerely Subzerosmokerain (talk) 17:33, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

The current one's apparently containing a watermark of some kind. Guess it's pretty awkward. --Asperchu (talk) 18:12, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

No it doesn't, it has the link to the main site "worldscollide.com". It is an official render and can stay there. Sincerely Subzerosmokerain (talk) 23:06, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

Is it possible to crop it out? Or is this picture even really necessary anymore? --Asperchu (talk) 23:09, 25 November 2010 (UTC)

It's necessary because the image that's up right now, though official, isn't holding its own weight per free-use rationale. If that image is deleted, we'll need a backup, outdated, but a backup nonetheless. A similar thing occurred on the Eddy Gordo article. Just keep it where it is for now, maybe a bit smaller. Sincerely Subzerosmokerain (talk) 23:13, 25 November 2010 (UTC)

The article is rewritten and expanded now

Is it enough for this to be nominated for a good article? --194.145.185.229 (talk) 13:12, 10 August 2011 (UTC)

Late reply, but this article is very detailed, well written and has a very big number of sources supporting the content here, considering it's an article for a video game character. If there's one Mortal Kombat character article that deserves to be a Good Article, it's this. If you have an account, you can nominate it as a Good Article or maybe I can do so for you, even though I personally haven't worked on this article much. Kokoro20 (talk) 15:49, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

I don't know about GA (and its criteria), but I'm sure deserves something more than "Start-Class" and "C-Class" it has. --194.145.185.229 (talk) 12:53, 23 December 2011 (UTC)

Then how about requesting a peer review to get multiple opinions? Assessment can be requested in Wikipedia:WikiProject Video games/Assessment/Requests. The GA criteria is in here.Tintor2 (talk) 15:53, 23 December 2011 (UTC)

Wait, can guest IPs even request peer reviews? I wouldn't think they can. Kokoro20 (talk) 15:54, 27 December 2011 (UTC)

I think it might need to be checked for grammar first, at this point I wrote or I rewrote practically everything there but English is not my first language, so someone needs to read it through and correct it if needed. (Mileena too.) --194.145.185.229 (talk) 15:48, 30 December 2011 (UTC)

I suppose the "In video games" could be trimmed a bit considering how the first Mortal Kombat games only had story in the characters bio and the endings that contradicted the events from following games. For example, the section could start with her role in Mortal Kombat II, with the above information given to a separate section about the character's main traits.Tintor2 (talk) 16:27, 31 December 2011 (UTC)

I've went over the article and done fixes, but haven't gotten around to checking the last few sections yet. By the way, this article does not need to be re-written again, just some fixes here and there. Just keep it how it is and have a peer review done on it. Kokoro20 (talk) 16:34, 1 January 2012 (UTC)

Well, I just requested a peer review, if that's okay. Kokoro20 (talk) 15:02, 5 January 2012 (UTC)

Btw, I once again worked a lot on Mileena, which is in now my opinion actually better article than Kitana's. It has now many more sources (108) and I tried my best with good reading flow (grammar might be still imperfect), so check out the latest edit if you want, and possibly consider to nominate or whatever. --194.145.185.229 (talk) 17:39, 25 January 2012 (UTC)

Hey, it's been a while. Anyway, I've added more sources after it was suggested in that peer review. It was also suggested to trim the "In video games" section of the article, but I'm not sure how I would go about doing. So, I guess I should nominate both this and the Mileena article as Good Articles soon. Kokoro20 (talk) 16:53, 4 March 2012 (UTC)

As I said several times, Mileena's article would make use of "Sexy Mileena" as an additional illustration. --194.145.185.229 (talk) 16:35, 13 March 2012 (UTC)

The A-class thread

Because apparently it's needed to be started, so be it. --Niemti (talk) 10:09, 7 September 2012 (UTC)

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Kitana (Mortal Kombat)/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Cabe6403 (talk · contribs) 08:57, 25 October 2012 (UTC)

I'm starting this review and will hopefully get it done within 24-48 hours.

Mid review comment - Currently I think this article is too long and waffles a lot. I've pointed out some of the issues I noticed during my first read through so they can be worked on in the meantime. Cabe6403 ^{(Talk•Sign)} 09:25, 25 October 2012 (UTC)

Rate	Attribute	Review Comment
1. Well-written:
	1a. the prose is clear, concise, and understandable to an appropriately broad audience; spelling and grammar are correct.	Tobias' original inspiration while creating Kitsune was the character of Princess Mariko from Jordan Mechner's 1984 video game Karateka (Mechner commented: "Ha thanks, that's awesome! Kitsune/Kitana vs Mariko... not sure who I'd bet on!"[18] - This section doesn't read well. I'm sure it can be rewritten to remove the parentheses. In the reception section the first ~800 words are just paraphrasing sources saying she's a babe basically. It waffles on and on about the same point that could be made in a sentance or two with some examples and sources. This can be cut down. who got hired for the role after she contacted - doesn't read well.
	1b. it complies with the Manual of Style guidelines for lead sections, layout, words to watch, fiction, and list incorporation.
2. Verifiable with no original research:
	2a. it contains a list of all references (sources of information), presented in accordance with the layout style guideline.	Source 19 is just a link to a twitter account. Twitter is blocked where I am currently but I will confirm it is a verified account when I get home. Additionally the URL suggests it does not link to relevant tweets. The sentences before all quote (what I'm assuming where tweets) but aren't sourced. For Kitana's first 3D (and the first unmasked) appearance in Gold, her face was modelled after Talisa Soto, who was Kitana's actress in the films, and clad in a slightly-modified leotard from UMK3. - Source this. These post-release additions brought the numbers of Kitana's and Jade's costumes in MK2011 to four for each of them, equaling them with Mileena in having the highest number of alternate looks in any game in the series. - Cite Kitana is one of the only five characters to perform a kata in the game's attract mode of Deadly Alliance. - cite
	2b. reliable sources are cited inline. All content that could reasonably be challenged, except for plot summaries and that which summarizes cited content elsewhere in the article, must be cited no later than the end of the paragraph (or line if the content is not in prose).	"becoming one of the most popular and recognisable characters of the franchise" - Intro paragraph. Uncited? often regarded as one of the most attractive women of video games in general. - As above.
	2c. it contains no original research.	Her UMK3/MKT Animality transformation animal is a small rabbit, in a reference to the film Monty Python and the Holy Grail. - citation for this or is it a derived conclusion? removing the claim and linking to the rabbit from the film is the same as original research
3. Broad in its coverage:
	3a. it addresses the main aspects of the topic.	Yes, although it covers too much of some aspects. See below.
	3b. it stays focused on the topic without going into unnecessary detail (see summary style).	This is an issue at the moment. Especially in the reception section and the last section of design. There's no need for a game by game description of changes in the clothes the character wears. This is unnecessary detail. Additionally that section is not cited much, I assume these descriptions have been made by either playing the games or looking at videos/pictures. Original research?
	4. Neutral: it represents viewpoints fairly and without editorial bias, giving due weight to each.
	5. Stable: it does not change significantly from day to day because of an ongoing edit war or content dispute.	Appears to be stable.
6. Illustrated, if possible, by media such as images, video, or audio:
	6a. media are tagged with their copyright statuses, and valid non-free use rationales are provided for non-free content.
	6b. media are relevant to the topic, and have suitable captions.	Images look good, relevant and have suitable captions.
	7. Overall assessment.

Nothing in the lead is cited because it's a summary of the article (the refs are in the articles, and in this case in Reception section). Related GAs Reptile (Mortal Kombat) and Mileena have such detailed descriptions (these are only MK characters that are GAs) and so do many/most other GAs for vg chars. I'll look into all the other stuff. --Niemti (talk) 19:08, 25 October 2012 (UTC)

Ah yes, the first was me just dropping thoughts in to see if they are cited later. I simply forgot to remove them. Also, regarding those other articles, beware WP:OTHERSTUFF. Additionally, I'd say the do not go into as extensive detail as this article. Thats just my opinion after the first read through though so it may develop as I do some more work. Cheers. Cabe6403 ^{(Talk•Sign)} 19:58, 25 October 2012 (UTC)

I think I fixed everything already. --Niemti (talk) 20:28, 25 October 2012 (UTC)

I still find the reception and design sections too long and effusive. There is no need for that level of detail, it breaks the flow of the article and is of little encyclopedic value. I would like to see this addressed and cut down before I pass this article. The length of the Reptile (Mortal Kombat) article is a much better target length but at less than half, I don't expect you to cut it down completely. Cabe6403 ^{(Talk•Sign)} 07:41, 26 October 2012 (UTC)

I've done a small amount of copy editing to cut down the lengthy sections. The reception section is so unweidly I can't even follow it to chop stuff out. It should be completely rewritten in around half the length, remember, you don't need to quote and paraphrase every single reference. It is better to give on example with a couple of references to reviewers with similar opinion. Cabe6403 ^{(Talk•Sign)} 08:05, 26 October 2012 (UTC)

Hi, I disagree on that not being cultural impact, I think it's very much about the character' impact on popular culture and it's also about other things too. I also restored some of design stuff (not the detailed unreferenced descriptions of every appearance, though) and the DLC info too but now it is in promotion. Regarding downsizing reception, I removed some non-notable websites and I'll take a look later. --Niemti (talk) 18:02, 26 October 2012 (UTC)

OK, and so I did. Note: reception / impact is actually the most important part of any such article, much more than plot-related stuff which should be a minor part of the article (it's this "real world perspective" thing). It's completely other way round as in Mortal Kombat Wikia, where it's all plot and various actual trivia (like a list of all "singnature moves" with detailed descriprtions, or a long list of quotes), while reception is in "trivia" sections, if at all. --Niemti (talk) 18:36, 26 October 2012 (UTC)

Also Reptile is actually a minor character. He's not big in games (an odd henchman with some unimportant stories except being possessed by Onaga, but that's then Onaga thing), his impact is limited, and he's not actually discussed all that much in comparison (also this article is atrributing only publications and not authors - Kitana's article had no authors too until recently, when it was pointed out to me they should be atrributed by name, and so I did). Also I just noticed Reptile's article discusses the same thing (a few seconds of his appearance in the "MK Rebirth" short film) twice and his reception is an unsorted (not even chronologically) single block of text of tl;dr kind because of poor prose (which should be expanded, if possible, and rewritten in some way or another to make it more interesting and easy to read, including, yes, adding more quotes and other explainations/elaboration). --Niemti (talk) 18:47, 26 October 2012 (UTC)

It's my opinion that, in following WP policy and GA criteria the reception section of this article is not up to par. It's simply too long and unweildy making it actually very difficult to read. It's very much "Someone said X[ref], and someone said X[ref], and someone else said X[ref], someone said Y[ref] but they also said X[ref], as did someone[ref]." It should be cut down to "Some people said X[ref][ref][ref]." If you want to cite multiple people saying the same thing. As is, there is a great deal of redundant information. I'm going to put this on hold until that section has been rewritten. Continue the good work. Cabe6403 ^{(Talk•Sign)} 16:58, 30 October 2012 (UTC)

I have not seen any sign of work on this article other than reverting other users edits. I will be waiting the 7 days and then closing this GAN as unsuccesful if nothing is done to address the points I have raised. Cabe6403 ^{(Talk•Sign)} 09:02, 5 November 2012 (UTC)

"Some people said" is absolutely not enough - not only the specific outlets but the authors of the articles need to be identified (by their names). That's how it is, in all of such articles. And no, just stating their names in the references is also not enough - the names must be in the article body. It was not my idea, that's how the other reviewers want it. Good Articles are like that, Featured Articles are like that also. --Niemti (talk) 22:41, 28 December 2012 (UTC)

Removed content

Can be used at Wikia or whatever. (I recall some IP editor(s) spend a lot of time and edits wording it out.)

In Deception, Kitana only appears in the endings for Sindel and Ermac, resembling an unmasked and blue-clad Mileena (it was also the first time ever when Kitana has appeared with a ponytail). This is explained by the two early design concepts for Mileena's design in Deception, created by Steve Beran and included as unlockable pictures in the game's bonus gallery called "The Krypt". According to the picture's gallery caption text, the first costume shown there was actually originally supposed to be Kitana's, but was later developed into Mileena's primary. (This attire appears to be already belonging to Mileena in the picture, as indictated by its colors that are associated with her, and has evolved further before its final version.) Her UMK3/MKT Animality transformation animal is a small rabbit. In this game [MKII], she was clad in a swimsuit-based blue leotard, along with matching thigh-high boots, long gloves and a headband. Becky Gable took over the role from Zamiar in UMK3, for which the motion capture footage for all of female ninja characters had her wearing a more neutrally-colored dark red outfit. Gable's Kitana wore a leotard with added details, including a laced chest opening, arm rings, earrings, and a more liberal use of black, while the headband was dropped and her hair was tied in a tight bun. For Kitana's first 3D (and the first unmasked) appearance in Gold, she was clad in a slightly-modified leotard from UMK3. In Deadly Alliance, Unchained and Armageddon, Kitana wore two outfits: a blue-and-black leotard with a matching mask and a more regal costume featuring a lavender leotard with a very deep V-neck exposing her cleavage even more and stiletto heels on her boots, both of which are worn with a brown belt, a matching neckband, dangling earrings, and hair ties for her braided hairstyle. In MKvsDCU, Kitana wears a blue-and-black leotard and her long hair is held by a ribbon. In MK2011, she wears a cerulean-colored bustier with silver trimmings, laced together in a way reminiscent of UMK3, a matching thong with a long flowing loincloth at the front, and a coronet in place of the MKII's headband. Other accessories are cerulean thigh-high boots, matching arm gauntlets, and silver earrings. Her alternate outfit consists of a blue-and-silver halter top and matching bikini briefs with a loincloth at the back and knee-high boots. Since Deadly Alliance, Kitana's hair is much longer and is also usually tied into a braid, which became her most often used hairstyle next to a bun; her loose hair did not reappear until MK2011

Also removed:

and Unreality's David Madison listed her among ten "most badass video game women of all time." Featuring Kitana in the 2009 list of top 25 "hottest" female video game protagonists, the staff of Manolith stated their preference of her over "the rather butch" Sonya, adding that she "may have been cloned and copied in the game, but none of her doppelgangers held the same sway." while Techi.com called her "arguably the most popular character in the series."

--Niemti (talk) 17:52, 26 October 2012 (UTC)

References

Move?

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: moved per request. Favonian (talk) 18:48, 16 January 2013 (UTC)

---

Kitana (Mortal Kombat) → Kitana –

• The other two articles have different titles and none of them have simply "Kitana" within. Brandmeister^talk 11:18, 6 January 2013 (UTC)
• Or Kitana (disambiguation) to Kitana? Is the fictional character from the Mortal Kombat media franchise (Kitana (Mortal Kombat)) the dominant meaning? Anthony Appleyard (talk) 12:51, 6 January 2013 (UTC)
  • I would argue that yes per Google test. When people type Kitana, they rather don't usually mean Kitana Baker or Cherie Roberts. Brandmeister^talk 14:01, 6 January 2013 (UTC)

Just remember to change the link in all articles. --Niemti (talk) 01:00, 7 January 2013 (UTC)

• Support; neither of the other two are known as just "Kitana". Powers ^T 01:23, 7 January 2013 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Sonya comparison

"[Kitana] was also compared to other Mortal Kombat characters, especially to Sonya Blade; Austin American-Statesman described Kitana and Mileena as "far nastier than that martial-artless aerobics instructor from the first game."

I just love the irony of this statement, because in the first game, Sonya's hometown was, you guessed it, Austin. sixtynine ^{• spill it •} 16:24, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

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External links modified

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External links modified

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• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20120929141958/http://www.ugo.com/games/mortal-kombat-characters?page=5 to http://www.ugo.com/games/mortal-kombat-characters?page=5
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• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20130228110539/http://tech.malaysia.msn.com/photoviewer.aspx?cp-documentid=250764311 to http://tech.malaysia.msn.com/photoviewer.aspx?cp-documentid=250764311
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Reception

Reception section is a mess. Far too much stuff about her sex appeal, etc. along with unreliable sources. --Jtalledo (talk) 11:51, 8 June 2017 (UTC)