Talk:Kale/Archive 1

Archive 1

Nutritional value added

Hello friends,

I to include at least some information on the nutritional value of kale, although it would be great if someone with a greater nutritional knowledge than I have would expand this information. There seems to be plenty of stuff on the Web. Thanx... --Gunnermanz 07:40, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

Curly kale

Merged content of Curly kale into this article. The article remains messy and so I will try to re-write. Dave 09:14, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Re-written Dave 10:09, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Sorry couldn't find any better place to put this information. I like to make comment, in Dutch kale is called Boerenkool, like I submitted, but I looked a little further when I saw the other englisch name for Kale was Borecole, witch is very simmilar for the Dutch word Boerenkool, and this site http://www.answers.com/topic/borecole says that the etymology of the word borecole is the Dutch word Boerenkool, so this could be good information, especially Boerenkool being one of the few tradionally Dutch disches. On the Englisch wikipedia there is more information about the North German use of Boerenkool but I can say for sure that if you ask a person in the Netherland what is the most Dutch dish nine out of ten people say Boerenkool. So hope someone has any intressed in this so important subject.

Considering the fact that the Netherlands have been a part of the Holy Roman Empire until ca. 1650 (and that you can still hear that Dutch is a North German dialect) of course the traditional dishes would be similar.2003:7A:8E3D:1704:C433:EC7A:5A83:593A (talk) 23:21, 15 January 2016 (UTC)

Images

MPF,

With all due respect to Quadell (and Grimmway Farms), and certainly not implying that I could do better, Image:Lacinato Kale and Collard Greens.jpg is both unattractive and unclear. Using it for collard greens is sort of marginal, but it gives almost no idea of the appearance of kale at all. Until an alternative is available, wouldn't it be better to keep Image:Flowering-kale.jpg at the top?

Humbly, Pekinensis 21:45, 14 Mar 2005 (UTC)

No offense taken. I admit, it isn't very good. But then again, it's nice to have decorative kale in the decorative kale section. I hope to take a better photo of kale in the next week or so, and I'll replace the old one. – Quadell ^{(talk) (sleuth)} 22:52, Mar 14, 2005 (UTC)

Collard greens

I thought people interested kale might be interested in the question of what to name the article currently known as Collard greens.

There are really two questions. One is a complicated one about what is collard greens, what is kale, and what is spring greens, and whether they should have separate articles or be merged.

The second is, assuming there is a separate article, whether it should be called Collard, Collards, or Collard greens.

Your thoughts are welcome.

Pekinensis 19:35, 17 Mar 2005 (UTC)

For rabbits?

Kale is prescribed by Vets following spaying or neutering of rabbits. Kale is high in vitamins, calcium, and anti-oxidants. Giving your pet rabbits kale on a regular basis will help to keep them healthy. Most rabbits should love this treat.

Ignoring the fact that this sounds like an advertisement, I remember reaing just yesterday on rabbit.org that kale should only be given to rabbits sparingly as it, along with spinach, is "high in either oxalates or goitrogens and may be toxic in accumulated quantities over a period of time." I don't know about other people, but I wouldn't give something to my rabbits on a regular basis when it's supposed to be toxic over a period of time. More information on this would be appreciated, either explaining why rabbit.org's statement isn't true, or changing the article so people don't overdose their bunnies. 71.217.100.65 20:48, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

It isn't sourced, so don't just discuss it, remove it. It can always be put back once someone comes up with some proof of the unsourced claim. wikipediatrix 22:14, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

To be honest the oxalic acid angle seems to be harder to source.WolfKeeper 22:30, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

I used to raise rabbits, and my suppliers warned me against feeding kale to my rabbits because it would give the rabbits blood in their urine, and could prove fatal in some cases. If there is a substantial amount of oxalic acid in kale I would avoid eating much of it myself, since I do producce kidney stones. Does anyone know if such is the case?Arnepe (talk) 11:32, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

Misinformation?

"Kale is the result of man's artificial selection for enlargement of leaves in the wild mustard plant." - Can someone explain what this means please? This does not agree with the "Origins" section and given it is off by itself, I think someone must have just randomly added it. 74.12.72.77 12:11, 25 August 2007 (UTC)

It's a brassica which if you read the page it is a class of plants that are referred to as mustards. So it's probably true- most foods we eat are artificially selected for extra size or other properties, that's an inevitable consequence of growing crops- you always try to grow from the best stock, and that gives a large selective pressure on its genome.WolfKeeper 18:37, 25 August 2007 (UTC)

Can we get rid of the weaseley words, please?TheMadChild (talk) 04:39, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

Referring to genus Brassica as "mustards" is misleading. From the wikipage, lead paragraph: "a genus of plants in the mustard family (Brassicaceae). The members of the genus may be collectively known either as cabbages, or as mustards." Most people know brassicas as vegetables related to cabbage. Mustards, on the other hand, are "several plant species in the genera Brassica and Sinapis" (from mustard plant, which the text under discussion links to; emphasis added).
I've made the hypothetical nature of the statement clear with "may", removed the redundancy of "human-aided artificial selection", and linked to artificial selection:

Kale may be the result of artificial selection for enlargement of leaves in some plant of the cabbage family, either wild or already being cultivated.

--Thnidu (talk) 22:39, 14 June 2008 (UTC)

This section is so unscientific as to border with misinformation.

For starters: "Kale is considered by nutritionists including Dr Joel Furhman to be the most nutritious vegetable in the world...." This sounds like someone earning commission from your friendly, self-promoting nutritionist.

Anyway, the expression "... boosts DNA repair" is totally meaningless, considering the number of known DNA repair mechanisms and their complexity. Could it be that the poor, humble vegetable "boosts" ... what? Photoreactivation? methyl guanine methyl transferase? Or, perhaps, protolyase or, maybe, DNA ligase activity? Does it "boost" base excision repair? Homologous recombination? Or, maybe, all of them get a "boost" hey? Even when no repair is needed ... it still gives it a "boost". I bet later on I'm going to find the ubiquitous, retch-inspiring "it boosts your immune system".

As for the "... block the growth of cancer cells", I'm not going to heap any more sarcasm on it but, can't we do any better than citing BBC news? Please use some serious scientific literature. Contra-gian (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 00:36, 3 September 2011 (UTC).

The article is still full of cheerleading, circumstantial info, but I don't know enough to separate the real nutritional facts from the inconsequential. 69.22.242.15 (talk) 17:21, 18 January 2015 (UTC)

Lutes?

In the "Cultivars" section, suddenly the article starts talking about "Kale Lutes" as if that's something the reader should already be familiar with. No explanation is given. Is this some form of childish vandalism?

At http://www.bunchalinks.com/lookup/index.cgi/Kale there is an article about kale that credits Wikipedia and appears to contain everything here and more. Was this an earlier version of this article? In any case, it doesn't provide any information about what "kale lutes" is supposed to be. rowley (talk) 03:03, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

Pronunciation

Could someone add a description on how to pronounce kale, by using the Phonetic Alphabet, please? 82.173.52.101 (talk) 10:40, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

Nevermind, this is solved. I will just put in {{wiktionary|kale}}. 82.173.52.101 (talk) 10:57, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

Halland, Sweden

For the second time, Holland is not a part of Sweden. Halland, however, is. If anyone sees some topographically challenged vandal changing this back again, please revert it. 85.145.118.99 (talk) 21:53, 7 May 2010 (UTC)

Also, whoever added the recipe for Halland's Langkål doesn't know how to make it. It isn't a simple boiled kale dish. It is twice cooked -- first you boil it in stock and then you fry it with cream. In our family we also add lemon juice or vinegar and nutmeg to the fried cabbage, but that might count as original research (wink). I assumed the recipe from ICA would count as a good reference, though it doesn't mention that the kale is best frozen between the boiling and the frying stage. Many other on-line recipes omit the boiling part -- because they assume that you are starting with frozen kale you purchased at the supermarket. If old dead tree references are preferred, I can provide one. Lacreighton (talk) 08:47, 10 September 2014 (UTC)

How to Harvest

It would be good to describe how to harvest kale as some greens should be cut off as a whole plant and others you should just harvest the a few leaves at a time. Based on an article on http://www.e how.com/how_4550641_harvest-kale.html (sorry had to break the link because ehow is blacklisted on wikipedia, don't you like competition???)kale should be havested leaf by leaf but as I have no personal experience it would be better for someone that knows for sure to add a section on this. --RobinGB (talk) 12:57, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

Need disambiguation for sukuma wiki

If I search for sukuma wiki, I go to kale. Yet in Kenya, sukuma wiki can be collards or kale, and in Uganda, it means only collards. Can someone add a disambiguation page for it? DBlomgren (talk) 17:49, 6 September 2012 (UTC)

Growing

Please add information relevant to growing this plant.-96.237.4.73 (talk) 17:46, 22 November 2012 (UTC)

Merging Chomolia (also apparently spelled Chou moellier/Chou moellier/Chou mollier)?

Chomolia discusses a kale-like vegetable grown in Zimbabwe. An editor left a comment on the talk page there that it was Brasica oleracea acephala, with a common name chou moellier. Phonetically, the common name link between chomolia and chou moellier seems plausible. Chomolia appears to mostly be a Zimbabwean spelling, but I've found several sources from other countries (especially South Africa/New Zealand) use one of several varients of the two word spelling. What's not clear is what this plant is. Some sources describe it as kale and attribute it explicitly to the Acephala group. Other sources call it "marrow-stemmed kale", which may be Medullosa group, although I'm not clear enough on B. oleracea taxonomy to know whether a Medullosa group is usually recognized. It may be appropriate to merge Chomolia into this article (kale), or Acephala Group. If Medullosa group is widely recognized, that may be an article at that title might be an appropriate place to discuss Chomolia. Or perhaps a title at another common name, although there are numerous competing possibilities: various spelling of French-derived Chou moellier, or English-derived Marrow Stem kale, Marrow-stemmed kale, etc.Plantdrew (talk) 22:55, 1 February 2013 (UTC)

These two plants seem different in every way, except perhaps the name. They are literally a world apart. It would be a huge assumption to merge them, unless there is a reliable source that the plants are indeed the same species. Mamyles (talk) 15:09, 22 May 2015 (UTC)

Wrong interwiki with Turkish WP

This article has been wrongly inter-wikied to "Kara lahana" in Turkish WP; this is not correct. Please change that interwiki to one between "Kara lahana" and "Collard greens (Berza)". --E4024 (talk) 16:38, 4 March 2013 (UTC)

Names

Not only is kale a food it is also a name. I know 3 kales that go to my school. I think this name is unique. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 162.213.21.212 (talk) 01:52, 11 March 2015 (UTC)

Let's just redirect anyone with this question to this page.

BTW, if you know three, it's certainly anything but unique. ;-) -84.190.84.207 (talk) 14:10, 24 October 2016 (UTC)

Kale for cows

When I was a child in Ireland (Co. Armagh) kale was grown for cows to eat as winter fodder. It was a tall plant and at eight years old I would walk along without obstruction between the rows of kale with the green leaves above me, so that I was completely hidden from view. This seems much bigger than the vegetable being sold for humans in supermarkets to-day which I have found quite bitter. Can anyone add something to the article about kale for cows? Mike Spathaky (talk) 06:59, 9 November 2015 (UTC)

The German entry mentions a variety called "Langkohl", growing head-high with very large, brownish/violet leaves, the bigger leaves were/are used as fodder. I think this is the same kale you know.2003:7A:8E3D:1704:C433:EC7A:5A83:593A (talk) 23:36, 15 January 2016 (UTC)

If Kale tastes bitter, is it possible that it was picked too early, before the first frosts? I have learned that it must not be picked before it was exposed to below zero (Centigrade) temperatures. --84.190.84.207 (talk) 14:17, 24 October 2016 (UTC)

I have clear recollections of kale grown in Lincolnshire for cattle feed. During the season, as one of many teenagers in the country, I worked on Saturdays bushbeating on shoots for pheasants, hare, etc. There was almost always at least one large field of kale to beat through; it was (I estimate) up to 8 ft tall with stems around 2 inches thick. I don't recall it being any colour except a shade of green. If there had been rain during the preceding night, or even a heavy dew, it was not pleasant. Often, with the lack of attention to health&safety that was common at the time, there would occasionally be the pitter-patter of shot falling on to the leaves above the beaters' heads. I wouldn't even think of eating it because it seemed more like leather. I can't find any sources to support a mention of that variety to the article.Twistlethrop (talk) 20:09, 9 October 2018 (UTC)

Assessment comment

The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:Kale/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.

Good article but lacks refs and more on its uses -- Warfreak 23:45, 22 June 2007 (UTC) Kale is the most abnosome of vegetables :D — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gish bot (talk • contribs) 19:39, 18 August 2013 (UTC)

Last edited at 19:40, 18 August 2013 (UTC). Substituted at 20:49, 29 April 2016 (UTC)

Article needs clarification: Sulforaphane are not bad

My first impression from the Kale & Sulforaphane article was, that sulforaphane are bad. The respective german wikipedia article clarified that sulforaphane are or are assumed to be rather good than bad. Both english wikipedia articles need to clarify that, as well. Consequences if the english articles are not fixed: People could believe that sulforaphane are highly poisonous and consequently kale must be cooked and is harming if eaten uncooked. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.152.174.108 (talk) 17:26, 22 October 2016 (UTC)

Research on sulforaphane applicable to human health and diseases remains at a preliminary level not yet sufficient to indicate if it has any effect. Sources have to comply with WP:MEDRS. I added a review to the section under Phytochemicals, but admit it is not very fulfilling. All we can say is that "preliminary research is ongoing" but there are no firm answers yet. --Zefr (talk) 22:24, 22 October 2016 (UTC)

Cooking Kale

I'm entertained but not what the talk page is for. EoRdE6(Come Talk to Me!) 20:29, 13 November 2017 (UTC)
When cooking kale always put a little coconut oil into it, that way it is easier to slide out of the pan and into the bin.124.169.77.59 (talk) 10:59, 3 June 2017 (UTC)