Talk:KGB/Archive 1

Archive 1

Vandalism!!!

User:Bass67 Erased the entire article and put information about some Ottawa band under the same name in. I erased it and put the old info back! --(Aytakin) | Talk 21:28, 22 December 2005 (UTC)

Removed

The following whole section is removed. It is quite unprofessional to add such huge lists into the article body untranslated. Not to say that there already is the "Organization" section. Also, this sturcture requires a timestamp attribute. Surely, it was not chizeled in stone forever. Also, a source is also desirable; for verification purposes. mikka (t) 01:23, 28 May 2005 (UTC)

Structure of organisation

Hierarchical levels:

Structure of organisation

I. главные управления (DIVISIONS) 4 + 7 независимымиe управления - highest level

II. управления

III. отделы

IV. отделения

DIVISON 1 Intelligence. All secret Soviet action abroad, except War intelligence.

1.1. УПРАВЛЕHИЕ ПО HЕЛЕГАЛЬHОЙ ДЕЯТЕЛЬHОСТИ (УПРАВЛЕHИЕ "С") (II) Отбор, обучение и эксплуатация агентов, которые нелегально проживают за границей. Каждого агента обучают индивидуально, в изолированных квартирах и домах, разбросанных по Москве.

1.2. HАУЧHО-ТЕХHИЧЕСКОЕ УПРАВЛЕHИЕ (УПРАВЛЕHИЕ "Т") Промышленный шпионаж на Западе (создано в 1963 г. для конкуренции с соответствующим управлением ГРУ).

1.3. УПРАВЛЕHИЕ ПО ПЛАHИРОВАHИЮ И АHАЛИЗУ (ПЕРВОЕ УПРАВЛЕHИЕ) Задумывалась как глобальная аналитическая служба, но с самого начала (1963 г.) превратилась в бесполезную синекуру для пенсионеров.

1.4. ИHФОРМАЦИОHHАЯ СЛУЖБА (СПЕЦСЛУЖБА c1) Суммирует и распространяет поступающие разведданные. Издаёт еженедельный разведбюллетень.

1.5. СЛУЖБА КОHТРРАЗВЕДКИ (СПЕЦСЛУЖБА c2) Кроме прямых обязанностей, слежка за советскими гражданами за рубежом.

1.6. Отдел по дезинформации (Отдел "А")

1.7. Исполнительный отдел (Отдел "B")

"Мокрые дела" - политические убийства, саботаж и диверсии. Сменил в 1969 г. якобы закрытый "Тринадцатый отдел" ("Отделение "Ф").

1.8. Первый отдел Вся работа Первого Главного Управления по США и Канаде, кроме компетенции спецотделов.

1.9. Второй отдел Латинская Америка.

1.10. Третий отдел Великобритания, Австралия, Hовая Зеландия и Скандинавия.

1.11. Четвёртый отдел ФРГ, Австрия.

1.12. Пятый отдел Франция, Италия, Испания, Бенелюкс, Ирландия.

1.13. Шестой отдел Китай, Вьетнам, Сев. Корея.

1.14. Седьмой отдел Япония, Индия, Индонезия, Филиппины и др. страны Азии.

1.15. Восьмой отдел Арабские страны, Югославия, Турция, Греция, Иран, Афганистан и Албания.

1.16. Девятый отдел Англоязычные африканские страны.

1.17. Десятый отдел Франкоязычные африканские страны.

1.18. Одиннадцатый отдел Страны СЭВ и Куба. Прямой контроль над местными органами безопасности (более 100 официальных представителей КГБ) и контроль негласный.

1.19. Двенадцатый отдел Организация прикрытия для легальной деятельности за рубежом.

1.20. Тринадцатый отдел Шифровальный.

1.21. Четырнадцатый отдел Фальшивые документы, подслушивающие устройства и т.д.

1.22. Пятнадцатый отдел Архив Первого Главного управления.

1.23. Шестнадцатый отдел Кадры Первого Главного управления.

DIVISON 2 Control of SU citizens and foreigners in SU

2.1. ПОЛИТИЧЕСКАЯ СЛУЖБА БЕЗОПАСHОСТИ

2.1.1. Первое направление Общие расследования и управление 1 кустом местных филиалов КГБ.

2.1.2. Второе направление Общие расследования и управление 2 кустом местных филиалов КГБ.

2.1.3. Третье направление Общие расследования и управление 3 кустом местных филиалов КГБ.

2.1.4. Четвёртое направление Общие расследования и управление 4 кустом местных филиалов КГБ.

2.1.5. Десятое направление Особые экономические преступления (прежде всего валютные операции).

2.1.6. Одиннадцатое направление Издание секретных руководств и журналов, освещающих внутренние проблемы СССР.

2.1.7. Двенадцатое направление Китайцы в СССР.

2.2. УПРАВЛЕHИЕ ПО ПРОМЫШЛЕHHОЙ БЕЗОПАСHОСТИ

2.2.1. Первый отдел Тяжёлая промышленность.

2.2.2. Второй отдел Военные заводы.

2.2.3. Третий отдел Ядерные исследования.

2.2.4. Четвёртый отдел Ядерное производство.

2.2.5. Пятый отдел Промышленные выставки в СССР и за рубежом. Курирование Торговой палаты.

2.2.6. Шестой отдел Вербовка моряков.

2.3. Первый отдел США и Латинская Америка.

2.3.1 Первое отделение Вербовка.

2.3.2 Второе отделение Контрразведка.

2.3.3 Третье отделение Советские граждане, контактирующие с американцами.

2.3.4 Четвёртое отделение Руководство американскими контактами в СССР.

2.3.5 Пятое отделение Работа с дипломатами из Латинской Америки.

2.4. Второй отдел Великобритания.

2.5. Третий отдел ФРГ, Австрия, Скандинавия.

2.6. Четвёртый отдел Прочие западноевропейские страны.

2.7. Пятый отдел Прочие неевропейские развитые страны.

2.8. Шестой отдел Прочие неевропейские неразвитые страны.

2.9. Седьмой отдел Туристы в СССР.

2.9.1 Первое отделение США, Канада, Великобритания.

2.9.2 Второе отделение Прочие страны.

2.9.3 Третье отделение Отели и рестораны, обслуживающие иностранных туристов.

2.9.4 Четвёртое отделение "Интурист" и "Спутник".

2.9.5 Пятое отделение Организация и проверка контактов иностранных туристов.

2.9.6 Шестое отделение Hаблюдение за туристами в провинции и заведование специальной коммуникационной сетью, передающей в провинцию данные о туристах.

2.10. Восьмой отдел ЭВМ.

2.11. Девятый отдел Слежка за иностранными студентами и их вербовка.

2.12. Десятый отдел Иностранные журналисты. Работа в Управлении по обслуживанию дипкорпуса.

2.13. Одиннадцатый отдел Загранпоездки советских граждан, не входящих в номенклатуру.

2.14. Двенадцатый отдел Особо крупные случаи коррупции на госпредприятиях.

2.15. Группа технической помощи Hегласные обыски в квартирах и в учереждениях, включая взлом сейфов.

This is a Babelfish translation of the above

1.1. UPRAVLE.YUIYE ON HELEGAL@6.HO@1 OF DEYATEL'.YUOSTI (UPRAVLE.YUIYE "s") (II) selection, instruction and the operation of the agents, which illegally live abroad. Each agent they train individually, in the isolated apartments and the houses, scattered through Moscow.

1.2. Hauc.ho-tex.hiceskoe UPRAVLE.YUIYE (UPRAVLE.YUIYE "T") industrial espionage in the West (created in 1963 for the competition with the appropriate administration GRU).

1.3. UPRAVLE.YUIYE ON PLA.YUIROVA.YUIYU and A.YUALIZU (FIRST UPRAVLE.YUIYE) it thought as global analytical service, but from the very beginning (1963 g.) it became useless sinecure for the pensioners.

1.4. I.YUFORMATSIO.YUYUAYA SERVICE (SPECIAL SERVICE C1) summarizes and extends the intelligence data entering. Izdayet weekly razvedbyulleten'.

1.5. SERVICE OF KO.YUTRRAZVEDKI (SPECIAL SERVICE c2) besides straight responsibilities, shadowing after the Soviet citizens abroad.

1.6. Division on the disinformation (division "A")

1.7. Executive division (division "B")

the "wet matters" - political murders, sabotage and diversion. Replaced in 1969 allegedly closed "thirteenth division" ("department" F").

1.8. The first division is entire work of the first main administration for THE USA and Canada, except the scope of special sections.

1.9. Second division Latin America.

1.10. Third division Great Britain, Australia, Hova4 Zealand and Scandinavia.

1.11. Fourth division OF THE FRG, Austria.

1.12. Fifth division France, Italy, Spain, Benelyuks, Ireland.

1.13. Sixth division China, Vietnam, the North Korea.

1.14. Seventh division Japan, India, Indonesia, the Philippines and other country of Asia.

1.15. Eighth division the Arab countries, Yugoslavia, Turkey, Greece, Iran, Afghanistan and Albania.

1.16. Ninth division the English-language African countries.

1.17. Tenth division The frankoyazychnye African countries.

1.18. Eleventh division of the country COMECON - COUNCIL FOR MUTUAL ECONOMIC ASSISTANCE and Cuba. Straight control over local security services (more than 100 official representatives OF THE KGB) and control is secret.

1.19. The twelfth division is the organization of cover for the legal activity abroad.

1.20. The thirteenth division is cipher.

1.21. Fourteenth division the false documents, which overhear devices, etc.

1.22. The fifteenth division is the archive of the first main administration.

1.23. Sixteenth division personnel for the first main administration.

DIVISON 2 control of SU citizens and foreigners in su

2.1. POLITICAL SERVICE OF BEZOPAS.YUOSTI

2.1.1. First direction general investigations and control of 1 bush of the local branches OF THE KGB.

2.1.2. Second direction general investigations and control of 2 bushes of the local branches OF THE KGB.

2.1.3. Third direction general investigations and control of 3 bushes of the local branches OF THE KGB.

2.1.4. Fourth direction general investigations and control of 4 bushes of the local branches OF THE KGB.

2.1.5. Tenth direction special economic crimes (, first of all, currency transactions).

2.1.6. The eleventh direction is the publication of secret management and periodicals, which illuminate the internal problems OF THE USSR.

2.1.7. Twelfth direction Chinese in THE USSR.

2.2. UPRAVLE.YUIYE ON PROMYSHLE.YUYUOY BEZOPAS.YUOSTI

2.2.1. The first division is heavy industry.

2.2.2. Second division military plants.

2.2.3. Third division nuclear research.

2.2.4. The fourth division is nuclear production.

2.2.5. Fifth division industrial exhibitions in THE USSR and abroad. Dissemination of the Chamber of Commerce.

2.2.6. The sixth division is the recruiting of seamen.

2.3. First division OF THE USA and Latin America.

2.3.1 first department is recruiting.

2.3.2 second department is counter espionage.

2.3.3 third department Soviet citizens, who contact with the Americans.

2.3.4 fourth department is management of American contacts in THE USSR.

2.3.5 fifth department is work with the diplomats from Latin America.

2.4. Second division Great Britain.

2.5. Third division OF THE FRG, Austria, Scandinavia.

2.6. Fourth division other West European countries.

2.7. Fifth division other non-European developed countries.

2.8. Sixth division other non-European undeveloped countries.

2.9. Seventh division tourists in THE USSR.

2.9.1 first department OF THE USA, Canada, Great Britain.

2.9.2 second department other countries.

2.9.3 third department hotels and the restaurants, which operate foreign tourists.

2.9.4 fourth department "Intourist" and "satellite".

2.9.5 fifth department is organization and checking the contacts of foreign tourists.

2.9.6 the sixth department Hablhdenie after the tourists into the province and the management by the special communications network, which transmits into the province the data about the tourists.

2.10. Eighth division OF COMPUTER(S).

2.11. The ninth division is shadowing after the foreign students and their recruiting.

2.12. Tenth division foreign journalists. Work in the administration for the maintenance of dipkorpusa.

2.13. Eleventh division Of zagranpoyezdki of Soviet citizens, not entering the nomenclature.

2.14. Twelfth division the separately large cases of corruption on the government enterprises.

2.15. Group of technical assistance Heglasnye searches in the apartments and in ucherezhdeniyakh, including the breaking of safes.

Anthony Appleyard 21:37, 24 January 2006 (UTC)

Well, Stalin's Anus?

"Aldrich Ames was a KGB mole in the anus of Stalin. CIA."

That sounds a but odd, hmm? I don't even know what to correct in that. Jay Kay 16:41, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

Last line

The last line of the page is incomplete.

I found where it was deleted and corrected it -- about half the page was missing. - ArglebargleIV 16:12, 12 October 2006 (UTC)

Image restored

Some rampaging 'bot deleted the image of Andropov, so I found an Andropov photo [1] on a Marxist website that claims that all of its content is "Creative Commons". So I presume that its OK for Wikipedia. (The only "problem" with the photo is that he's giving a quite friendly wave, for a KGB guy.) There may be some Khrushchev photos too, I didn't spend time looking through their gallery [2] and photo album [3]. - Ryanjo 03:00, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

Operations

These two are not "operations". Removed.

Former Hungarian Prime Minister Medgyessy Péter worked for the Hungarian secret service closely affiliated with the KGB, though he himself denied the accusations by claiming he "defended Hungary against the KGB".

• Russian President Vladimir Putin was a spy for USSR in the GDR during the 1970s

Mikkalai 18:52, 5 Dec 2004 (UTC)

...

Alger Hiss, to the best of my knowledge, was never proven to be a KGB spy, though many people tried to label him as such. Even if this is wrong, I would think that it would be a good idea to point out the controversy.

Fixed. mikka (t) 23:25, 31 May 2005 (UTC)

Here's the relavent document regarding Hiss [4]. It should be noted Hiss worked with GRU. See also Noel Field. Nobs01 16:08, 23 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Ethel and Julius Rosenberg, never have worked for the KGB, during the Rosenberg's case KGB did not exist, -I think it got to bee change, to (NKVD/NKGB).

• Please do not confuse the organisation and its name. I commented the section acordingly. mikka (t) 01:19, 28 May 2005 (UTC)

John Walker

I'm surprised that John Anthony Walker isn't mentioned in this article (I don't have good enough writing style to do it myself). He was one of the KGB's successes, right? He spied for a number of years and compromised the US Navy's crypto systems for a number of years, which may have had a part in their bombing failures during the Vietnam war according to this military historian's Master's thesis: [5]. 24.43.87.201 00:27, 27 November 2005 (UTC)

Agreed - from 1968 to 1985, the Walkers did significant damaged the US - they deserve the same billing as Ames and Hanssen. Peckmeister 03:29, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

Protection

Since the last several edits have been either vandalism, or reverting vandalism, I think we should consider protecting the page. Comments? Verin 22:09, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

Directorates

Should we not list the other directorates? Or if they are all listed, why are there no 6 or 10-15?

On a related note, I think the fourth directorate is transportation security and not transportation.

Carillonatreides 05:13, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

Deletion

I've deleted the following from Tasks & Organization:

Unlike Western intelligence agencies, the KGB (theoretically) was uninterested in learning the enemy's intentions--only their capabilities; intentions were political decisions based upon Marxist theory.

If it means anything, it ought to be more clearly expressed.--Jack Upland 21:40, 11 March 2006 (UTC)

I'm deleting a part of the Trivia section. It includes unsubstantiated allegations against someone and makes assumptions about future events. --146.57.85.100 05:07, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

Strange section

I have seen this part in "Suppression of dissent" in this article. It seems like a somewhat out-of-place thing to be there, and the spelling is kind of weird, don't you think?

"Some places in gulag was created only to destroy people, not to reform or fix their mind or help them change. Not enough food, no basic life supportive instrument such as bath, or appropriet medical treatment were practiced to exterminate those who was not able to think by templates created by regim, party, KGB. Documents from the archive of the Yale University"

Shall this be removed...or improved, or moved to gulag? -Uagehry456talk 03:07, 21 August 2007 (UTC)

Beautiful emblem

It's beautiful! Shiny! Gorgeous! ^_^

these sods murdered my great grandfather, he was Mongolian leader fighting the japanese on the eastern front.

While we're at it, the Schutzstaffel logo looked pretty stylish too. --Green Hill 20:04, 3 October 2007 (UTC)

editprotected

Two requests: Unprotect or add a template making note of the protection (EG. Vprotect), and add {{who}} after "by some" in the first sentence of "Modus operandi". Thanx, 68.39.174.238 (talk) 03:30, 31 December 2007 (UTC)

 Done.—Random832 08:56, 31 December 2007 (UTC)

"The CPSU directly controlled the KGB and guided its operations"???

The article states, "The CPSU directly controlled the KGB and guided its operations". Is it misprint? There are sources indicating that KPSS followed instructions (recommendations) by KGB. Can anybody provide a source indicating that KGB followed instrucitons or recommendations of KPSS? dima (talk) 09:47, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

You are kinda confused in politics. One thing is to follow recommendations, another thing is to take orders. Everything in the Soviet Union took order from CPSU. Even American President has advisers, whose recommendations he follows. `'Míkka>t 00:00, 6 February 2008 (UTC)

Actually that was Stalin who controlled both NKVD and CPSU. Everyone took orders from him. Later Stalin was replaced by the Politburo of CPSU. Andropov as a KGB boss was able to partly control the Politburo and Brezhnev. To simplify, Brezhnev was drugged by his KGB nurse and transformed into a barely walking and talking garbage, just like Yeltsin later.Biophys (talk) 03:50, 6 February 2008 (UTC)

Nice conspiracy theories you got here, an evolution of Mitrokhin like. How come KGB has been sound asleep face to the wall with Gorbachov? My pick is that KGB was just as stagnating as the Party. Clearly, late Brezhnev was a puppet, but whose? remains to be written. Anyway, the talk page is for discussing the article, and with references, too. `'Míkka>t 05:30, 6 February 2008 (UTC)

Chairman of the KGB

Shouldn't the article above, which is really a table, be part of this article? Doug Weller (talk) 18:40, 5 October 2008 (UTC)

Cheka

Dear authors, substitute "Cheka" for something other. Cheka is sounding of shortened russian abbreviation "ВЧК" (Всероссийская чрезвычайная комиссия). It translates "All-Russian Extraordinary Commission" Ксения СПб (talk) 16:52, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Disbandment 1991 and 1995

I don't know how to clear this up, but the word 'official' is used several times to describe the date the KGB was disbanded: from 1954 to 1991., On December 21, 1995, the President of Russia Boris Yeltsin signed the decree that disbanded the KGB, On November 6, 1991, the KGB officially ceased to exist., Dissolved 1991 (Officially 1995), officially on November 6, 1991..

I don't know if there is a discussion about this previously, but there is the word [contradiction] several times after some of these dates. So when is official and when it not? Farglesword (talk) 05:05, 14 April 2009 (UTC)

Can someone fix this?

This page should be located at KGB. There was no discussion of the move, and what's there now already has its own page at Knowledge Generation Bureau. I guarantee you that no one is looking for "Knowledge Generation Bureau" when they look up "KGB". --Yossarian^Complaints 02:32, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was page moved. @harej 23:52, 26 August 2009 (UTC)

---

KGB (USSR) → KGB — There was no discussion of this move; an article about the KGB should be located at KGB. Yossarian^Complaints 02:35, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

Looking at the logs, it appears that User talk:TheRebelde was attempting to be bold and move a couple of pages around without realizing that he can't move on top of, or delete, redirect pages. Luckily, it seems as though he didn't get far enough to attempt a brute force copy move (or maybe he did try, looking at his talk page). Regardless, I fully Support a speedy move back to KGB.
— V = I * R (talk) 03:24, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

• Move back. This should be listed under uncontroversial moves. There was no discussion, so this is a problem that needs to simply be fixed immediately. We don't need to have a discussion to determine whether to roll back a change every time someone does something ill-advised on their own. Equazcion (talk) 09:43, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

I'd have done that, but it seems this needs to be handled by an administrator who can delete whatever's currently at KGB. --Yossarian^Complaints 18:59, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

• Support. — AjaxSmack 01:01, 21 August 2009 (UTC)
• I have tidied page KGB (USSR)'s hatlink. KGB (disambiguation) lists 10 links. Anthony Appleyard (talk) 04:37, 21 August 2009 (UTC)

  Is it really necessary to keep the "(USSR)" DAB in the article title? I'd think that WP:PRIMARYTOPIC would be fairly obvious and uncontroversial in this case.
  — V = I * R (talk) 05:30, 21 August 2009 (UTC)

  Agreed that it's not controversial in the slightest. This really should just be moved back. Someone with administrative powers could easily do it. --Yossarian^Complaints 09:17, 22 August 2009 (UTC)

  Anthony actually is, which is the only reason that I said anything. He seems to be somewhat uncommunicative however, I'm finding out.
  — V = I * R (talk) 22:07, 22 August 2009 (UTC)

• Speedy move - this was contentious, and my understanding is that "revert contentious move" is a candidate to be done immediately. I'm also concerned that some of the items on the dab page are things which KGB might conceivably stand for, as opposed to things those letters are actually used for. 81.111.114.131 (talk) 00:35, 23 August 2009 (UTC)
• Move back. I don't think anyone questions this article being the primary topic. Jafeluv (talk) 09:37, 24 August 2009 (UTC)
• Move back per above. Constantine ✍ 11:46, 24 August 2009 (UTC)

Well, this seems pretty locked up. Could someone do it now? --Yossarian^Complaints 23:43, 26 August 2009 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The KGB's evolution

This section is an absolute mess and gives no explanation of the data listed. I motion to remove this section on 10/26/2011 if adequate changes are not made and citations given. MichaelJPierce (talk) 17:02, 19 October 2011 (UTC)

I fixed it a little bit. Any suggestions? I think removal of this section would be problematic because typical books on KGB history (e.g. "KGB operations" by Andrews and Gordievsky) describe all these secret police agencies, staring from CheKA, and consider all of them as essentially the same organization. Biophys (talk) 00:45, 24 October 2011 (UTC)

File:70 years anniversary of KGB USSR.jpg Nominated for Deletion

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Notable Agents?

Would a list of notable former KGB agents/employees be a worthy addition to th article? BodvarBjarki (talk) 14:17, 29 March 2010 (UTC)

I think that would be interesting and noteworthy provided a reliable source. Add whatever sources to be considered here in this discussion and let's review prior to adding to the page. MichaelJPierce (talk) 16:43, 19 October 2011 (UTC)

I would also add that we should avoid a list, but rather a short anecdote of the known actions and circumstances of the KGB agent coming to the public attention. I'm certain there are KGB agents that have wiki articles we can link to. I would also suggest that such a section's title be carefully considered as the most notable KGB agents have more than likely maintained their anonymity. MichaelJPierce (talk) 16:46, 19 October 2011 (UTC)

You are probably talking not about Category:KGB officers, but about Category:KGB agents. Those are different things. That would be a huge category, starting from people like Anatoly Karpov (there are RS). My very best wishes (talk) 04:12, 16 March 2012 (UTC)

Issues with the first paragraph

I am shocked at the demagogy displayed in the first paragraph. There are two sweeping generalizations, three harsh unsupported accusations, three instances of "weasel words," and not a one reference.

I am modifying the following parts of the first paragraph:

- The listing of "secret police" as first in the duties of the KGB. In 1989, the total strength of the Border Guards Services of the USSR was about 230 000, out of a total of roughly 700 000 KGB employees (Globalsecurity.org estimates). So a solid third of all KGB personnel were simple soldiers, protecting the borders of their land. This was always a higher-priority task than "secret-policing" in a country with so many thousands of miles of hostile borders. Besides, the label of "secret police" is pejorative, only ever used against the KGB and Stasi, never for the CIA or NSA who use the same approach.

- The allegation of kidnapping of persons "... rebelling to the system in anyway..." is a false generalization, with woven-in weasel terminology. What constitutes "rebellion?" (Even during World War Two, there were people, like Zhukov and Khruschev, who openly and without consequence challenged Stalin.) What exactly is "The System?" (For example, Andrey Tarkovskiy's films are regularly described as having antisoviet themes, which he filmed with funds provided by the Soviet taxpayer, and nobody from the KGB came after him.) And lest we forget, the American CIA also conducts clandestine kidnappings of individuals it deems suspicious.

- A clause like "... and they would be never seen again..." does not belong in any encyclopedia (maybe only low-grade fairy tales). Besides the fact that it is grammatically wrong, this statement is absolutely unprovable logically. In fact, by its extreme nature, such a statement can be safely assumed to be false. It sounds like an eighth-grader wrote the whole sentence, under the inspiration of a cheap, populistic made-for-television action movie.

- The last sentence is interlaced with weasel words and demagogy. Using "it was known" to support a wild accusation, to imply that if someone disagrees, they are ignorant. Using the (negative) verb "to murder" in place of (legal) "to execute" or (neutral) "to kill." Using "... who were thought to be part of..." to imply that such murders happened on mere suspicion or on a whim. In general, accusing the KGB of public murders and attacks on the citizenry its employees were sworn to protect is absolute, certifiable schizophrenia. I am appalled at the fact that such an accusation is taken for reality by the editors here, and wasn't edited out as soon as it appeared. Such things were never policy in the post-Stalin USSR. Whoever wrote this, provide a source to an example. Otherwise, stop polluting Wikipedia.

- A reference to "the revolution" in the last sentence, as if refering to some kind of aforementioned revolution. This does not compute.

I hope it doesn't make me sound like a KGB apologist to demand simple honesty on Wikipedia. Let's not turn this article into a James Bond-universe pop-history sensationalist smear page. 97.125.48.202 (talk) 23:01, 26 November 2009 (UTC)

The CIA is not a Secret Police group. Only fascist governments have Secret Police.69.208.76.77 (talk) 17:48, 20 February 2010 (UTC)

The history of the CIA says otherwise... Hairhorn (talk) 18:07, 20 February 2010 (UTC)

MI6 is also known as the Secret Intelligence Service (SIS). Does it mean that the Government of the United Kingdom is 'fascist'? Eriba-Marduk — Preceding unsigned comment added by Eriba-Marduk (talk • contribs) 12:13, 26 October 2012 (UTC)

What is "The Sword and the Shield"?

It's apparently a book, extensively cited but never identified. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.21.54.229 (talk) 15:21, 15 February 2012 (UTC)

I've seen the book before a couple years ago ar Borders, it's a real book.

71.173.17.221 (talk) 03:13, 31 October 2012 (UTC)

Missing Parenthesis

The Committee for State Security, more commonly known by its transliteration "KGB" (Russian: Комитет государственной безопасности (КГБ), Komitet gosudarstvennoy bezopasnosti (KGB), was the main security agency for the USSR and Russian SFSR from 1954 until its collapse in 1991.

The first sentence has 3 "(" open brackets and only 2 ")" close brackets, I can't work out if the extra close should go after (КГБ) or (KGB) or if the first open brackets should be removed. Also I cannot log in or edit this page

Not signed in but SPACKlick 213.106.233.97 (talk) 12:04, 3 April 2013 (UTC)

What kind of person was selected for the KGB?

I read the in the book by Viktor Suvorov, about the GRU, that young people were selected for each service in the army according to their grades in school, who performed physical activities and psychological profile if I'm not mistaken, which was selected person's profile for the KGB? Had to have high grades? Intellectual Capacity advanced? How was it?Puszko (talk) 01:51, 28 October 2013 (UTC)

Did Yeltsin or Gorbachev disband the KGB?

The WIki article states:

"On December 21, 1995, the President of Russia Boris Yeltsin signed the decree that disbanded the KGB, which was then substituted by the FSB, the current domestic state security agency of the Russian Federation."

The FAS webpage on the fall of the KGB states:

"On 24 October 1991 Mikhail Gorbachev signed a decree abolishing the KGB.

The Soviet Union's Committee for State Security dissolved along with the USSR in late 1991."

Which is true? As no source is cited for the Yeltsin/1995 claim, I am inclined to believe the Gorbachev/1991 claim from FAS. Axeman (talk) 19:42, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

As of this year I added a ref to that claim (I think).--Mishae (talk) 04:54, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

Operations in the Middle East

This entry is false, and cites untrusted sources. The PLO was not founded by the KGB, it was founded by the Arab League (perhaps with support by the Soviet Union). The source cited for this is an op-ed in Arutz Sheva - a highly biased, extreme-right channel in Israel that the majority of Israelis don't take seriously, and tends to make such points as the nonexistence of the Palestinian people. I do not know what about the other claims in this entry, but their sources are available online and are clearly biased and non-scholarly. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.237.120.123 (talk) 05:43, 17 March 2014 (UTC)

Unencyclopedic "The KGB also has been porn star"

The statement "The KGB also has been porn star" in the first paragraph is unencyclopedic. Please provide reliable source(s) and elaborate on the subject before adding back that statement or its relative; I have removed it. --Nosugarcoating (talk) 02:02, 27 March 2014 (UTC)

India?

The subsection titled "India" is incredibly short. It needs more information, or possibly be removed?24.199.168.242 (talk) 15:36, 2 April 2014 (UTC)

Problems

Much of this article seems to be poorly sourced and questionable. It also leaves out some of the KGB's most successful agents such as the Cambridge Spies and George Blake.--Jack Upland (talk) 22:02, 13 January 2017 (UTC)

Spelling error?

Shouldn't "Комитет Государственной Безопасноти" in the sidebar be "Комитет Государственной Безопасности"?

— Preceding unsigned comment added by VespasianDiodore (talk • contribs) 22:00, 13 April 2017 (UTC)

External links modified

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Founding date?

This article says the KGB was founded in 1954, but the article on Ramón Mercader says he was a KGB agent in 1940. For that matter, in documents like "The Venona Story" (https://www.nsa.gov/about/_files/cryptologic_heritage/publications/coldwar/venona_story.pdf) the NSA specifically discusses KGB cables sent between 1940-1948. Is the NSA wrong? Do they mean NKGB? Or is this article wrong? 69.118.117.177 (talk) 00:08, 6 May 2016 (UTC)

Many organisations rebrand themselves over time. This is confusing - what the NSA did was to use a name for the organisation that was familiar to readers of the document.-- Toddy1 (talk) 07:16, 20 December 2017 (UTC)

External links modified

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Category edit-war

We have a slow edit-war going on. I think the issue needs discussing.

• 12:06, 23 October 2017 Bennyben1998 added Category:Organized crime groups in Russia, Category:Gangs in Russia, Category:Russian Mafia, Category:Organized crime groups
• 16:18, 28 December 2017 86.111.119.226 reverted Bennyben1998 deleting the categories
• 19:50, 28 December 2017 Iryna Harpy reverted the IP editor, restoring the categories.
• 14:06, 1 January 2018 Russian Rocky reverted Iryna Harpy, deleting the categories.

@Russian Rocky: are you the same person as the IP editor? Why do you think that the categories should be removed?

@Bennyben1998:, @Iryna Harpy: Why do you think that the categories should be present?-- Toddy1 (talk) 14:45, 1 January 2018 (UTC)

First, I have no connection to those IP editors (ask Wikipedia administrators to check, if you don't believe me). Second, this article is about a secret police of Soviet Russia (1917-91) and the Soviet Union (1922-91). Don't turn it into a junk pile.

The article gives no information why the KGB should be connected to the Russian Mafia, organized crime groups in Russia, gangs in Russia, etc. As you can notice, those categories (especially Category:Organized crime groups in Russia, Category:Gangs in Russia) were created to categorize organized crime groups of the Russian Federation (1991-present).

At first, Bennyben1998 and Iryna Harpy, who try to add those categories (Category:Organized crime groups in Russia, Category:Gangs in Russia, Category:Russian Mafia, Category:Organized crime groups), should provide information based on reliable sources.--Russian Rocky (talk) 15:28, 1 January 2018 (UTC)

@Toddy1: I don't think it really qualifies as edit warring. I believe that Bennyben1998 added the cats in good faith but, per my edit summary here, I understand the usage as 'loosely construed' given that the content discusses forays into criminal operations in various parts of the world. I tend towards WP:UNDUE and WP:NOR in relation to connections being maverick activities, and the majority being outside of the time frame of the dissolution of the Soviet Union. To be honest, I'd missed the fact that these were relatively recently added without any form of edit summary. --Iryna Harpy (talk) 18:29, 1 January 2018 (UTC)

Proposed merge with Fedora (KGB agent)

The article to be merged can be retooled into a notable KGB operation, as Fedora managed to disrupt the FBI. The article to be merged also lacks citations and is an orphan. Kirbanzo (talk) 18:13, 30 April 2018 (UTC) I Suggest that this is done, due to the fact they both contain the same information — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:C7F:E16:BD00:EDFA:89C1:369D:1E8A (talk) 22:43, 2 May 2018 (UTC)

Oppose. The KGB had vast numbers of agents. Some agents (when exposed) were notable, some were not. There is a need for an article on the KGB.-- Toddy1 (talk) 03:08, 3 May 2018 (UTC)

Oppose: I don't think anyone is proposing getting rid of this article. The question is should Fedora be merged here. I don't think so. He is notable enough to have his own article and the article has two citations. We can't mention every KGB officer and agent here. Nor is it possible or desirable to merge every inadequate KGB-related article here.--Jack Upland (talk) 08:30, 3 May 2018 (UTC)

Support: The original KGB article is not "too large" as to oppose the merge between Fedora (KGB agent) and KGB, I doubt that Fedora (KGB agent) will obtain further information and expansion on its current details. I support the merger. -- CancerianOx (talk) 22:21 3 May 2018 (PST)