Talk:Icelandic language/Archive 2

Archive 1

Archive 2

Archive 3

Archive 4

Underlying!!??

Would someone with a linguistic background please remove the underlying nonsense attributed here to Eiríkur Rögnvaldsson? Something either is or isn't. Tertium non datur, especially if the theory is not susceptible to either proof or falsificatiation. Cheers Io 20:33, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

Yes, I don't like that theory much either but unfortunately it has some following so it seems that we cannot throw it out. See above for the linguist tutor who maintained that /y/ and /i/ have an underlying distinction in modern Icelandic (last unindented paragraph of the Phonology section). Stefán Ingi 21:17, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

Following or not — it's still nonsense. As Haukur mentioned in the paragraph above, they are probably confusing synchronic with diachronic, which, as it happens, is a thought that had also occurred to me. Why not throw it out and let the followers stand up and be counted? I'd be glad to take the blame. Cheers Io 21:33, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

::PS: If a linguist can't differentiate between synchronic and diachronic, what kind of linguist is he? I'd say an educated fool. But I'm in a belligerent mood now. Let's see what happens. If nothing happens, I'll remove it and then we'll see. Cheers Io 21:41, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

Struck with apologies to anyone whom I might have offended. Cheers Io 16:52, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

Underlying revisited - Jungs, tear me apart, if you must

I added a conservative viewpoint to the underlying viewpoints of ER et al. Have your best go. :) Io 20:13, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

Grammar

This article could benefit from a grammar section, especially given that Icelandic still has a middle voice, something that disappeared from almost every other IE language long ago. •Jim62sch• 00:35, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

You are completely right. This article looks more like an Icelandic phonology than Icelandic language. Ciacchi 01:38, 29 July 2006 (UTC)

I agree, that an Icelandic grammar, complete with morphology, phonetics and syntax should be here. But two points:

People are too lazy, and that includes me (I once had a dream of beautifully coloured declension tables).

The second point is: Icelandic lost its middle voice along with the other Germanic languages. The present one is an innovation, and it is debatable, whether it should be called a voice or a separate class of verbs. Given the drastic changes in meaning that often occur, I favour the second option. An example: Klæða - klæðast meaning dress - dress [oneself] would be an example of a middle voice proper. But drepa - drepast, meaning kill - perish miserably would not. Cheers Io 19:02, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

Strange wikipedia article: Seiksiun alphabet

Could someone with the necessary background knowlegde take a look at this recently created Wikipedia article? Seiksiun alphabet

It is written in extremely bad English, someone even asked on the talk page whether it is a joke. Google search gives no results for either seiksun or seiksiun.

This alphabet doesn't exist and the article has now been deleted. Stefán Ingi 20:27, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

Grammar

How come there is no mention to Icelandic grammar here? Ciacchi 00:20, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

There is, but it is very rudimentary. How detailed would you have it? I cite Slovenian grammar as an extraordinarily thorough article for comparison. But would you have an article with all 60 or so paradigms for nouns and corresponding numbers for adjectives and verbs. It would at least be very laborious, and noone here with the knowledge seems to have the time, including me. I could cook up a detailed description on the lines of classical grammars, but I both have a job and sleeping needs. Cheers Io 20:02, 4 March 2007 (UTC)

I & Y; Í & Ý

As far as I'm concerned, Icelanders call the letter i an i, and the name of the letter y is y (as with all the other vowels: the name of the a is a, the name of the á is á and so on). So, if the pronunciation of i and y are exactly the same, how do they distinguish between them? For example, lyf means "medicine", and lif is the shortened form of the imperative of the verb lifa, "to live". How do they distinguish these words when spelling? Ciacchi 16:23, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

I think most Icelanders call y something like [YfsYlOnI] and ý something like [YfsYlOni]. I sometimes call y [y], though, especially in mathematical contexts (with coördinates and such). Haukur 17:23, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

Right, a Google search for ypsiloni in Icelandic returns many results. Ciacchi 01:44, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

Ypsiloni ([IpsIlOnI]) isn't even how it's pronounced. It's 'ufsilon y' or 'ufsilon i' depending on who you ask ;) -- Crushti 21:21, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

Hmm, usually it is [YfsIlOnI] ('ufsilon i') and [YfsIlOni] ('ufsilon í'), I think. Stefán Ingi 22:07, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

Oops, then someone would better check the article Icelandic alphabet and correct any mistakes I have made... By the way, could anybody check if the IPA is right in the table of that article? --Ciacchi 19:56, 1 August 2006 (UTC)