Talk:Human nutrition/Archive 1

Humans Are Biological Frugivores

(Copyright violation removed. Ucucha 13:40, 15 March 2010 (UTC)) http://www.publicaciones.cucsh.udg.mx/pperiod/esthom/esthompdf/esthom19/21-31.pdf

(Copyright violation removed. Ucucha 13:40, 15 March 2010 (UTC)) http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN&cpsidt=1667679

Pearl999 (talk) 16:34, 14 March 2010 (UTC)

See discussion at Talk:Human#Humans_Are_Biological_Frugivores. - SummerPhD (talk) 03:08, 16 March 2010 (UTC)

Now archived at Talk:Human/Archive_31#Humans_Are_Biological_Frugivores. - SummerPhD (talk) 13:13, 25 June 2010 (UTC)

Proposed merge

We don't need two articles on the same topic.Marcus Qwertyus 23:45, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Too long to merge IMO. Human nutrition is also a bit different. Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 23:55, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

If this article is too long for your tastes a split can be arraigned. Marcus Qwertyus 00:05, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

As I stated previously health diets discusses full diets while human nutrition discusses individual dietary components. Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 18:05, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

Merge of Healthy diet

I do not think a merge is the best idea. The healthy diet page should discuss healthy diets in general ( like the DASH diet, Mediterranean diet ) rather than diet elements such as zinc.Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 21:05, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

Human diet (non-existent) should talk about diets and healthy diet should merge/move to it and human nutrition should talk about nutrient requirements.username 1 (talk) 21:37, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

Closed as no merge. Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 14:54, 19 February 2010 (UTC)

Agreed. Vincent2128 (talk) 12:26, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

Obtaining nutrition

I've removed the (unsourced) "Obtaining nutrition" section because it almost solely consisted of factual errors, namely:

• The switch from foraging to agriculture causes population growth, not vice versa
• The declining frequency of foraging in recent millennia isn't a response to environmental change
• There was no "worldwide switch" to agriculture 10,000 years ago; the process started 10,000 years ago and is ongoing
• Agriculture is more "efficient" than foraging in the sense that it (usually) supports higher population densities and the energy it produces is closer to a given environment's net primary productivity, but until recent centuries was inefficient with regard to individual labour costs, and since then has been inefficient in the long-term because of unsustainability. It's therefore misleading to call agriculture "efficient" and foraging "inefficient" without further explanation.

Most of those errors were introduced recently, but the section as it stood before then was also pretty dire. I would have made a stab at rewriting it more accurately, but I'm not sure a history of subsistence techniques is really relevant to this article (and in any case, it would be nice to have it at subsistence techniques first).   jroe ^tk_cb  19:14, 17 May 2011 (UTC)

Actually, forget that last part, I just noticed there's a good write up of it buried at the end of the article.   jroe ^tk_cb  19:19, 17 May 2011 (UTC)

French paradox

I removed this claim:

• More active lifestyles involving plenty of daily exercise, especially walking; the French are much less dependent on cars than Americans.

It's unreferenced, and I doubt it is true. Looking at [1] for example, EU-wide stats from 1997 were within 7% of the U.S. for auto mode share. Nothing about exercise is mentioned in French paradox. -- Beland (talk) 18:30, 10 July 2013 (UTC)

Vegans redirect under the "Protein" section

I just wanted to say that the link "vegans" in the protein section redirects you to a list of vegans. I believe that it would be more useful if the link would direct you to the "Veganism" page. I have no idea how to change this so, someone please take a look at this. Dennimen (talk) 19:34, 6 November 2011 (UTC)

This has since been fixed. -- Beland (talk) 18:34, 10 July 2013 (UTC)

Page Edit

I plan on providing an extensive edit, mostly comprised of adding content rather than deleting content. This contribution will be part of a class assignment. This contribution will provide the social aspect of understanding malnutrition amongst human populations, especially children, across the globe from both a cause and effect perspective. This will entail providing not only operational definitions of malnutrition and under-nutrition, but also providing the context that produces poor nutrition, including environmental factors and social determinants. My article will also discuss nutrition programs in the United States and programming aimed at rectifying disparities in access to nutritious meals and other social determinants that cause inequalities. This contribution aims to rigorously analyze all the different perspectives of malnutrition and inaccessibility of foods by including sections pertaining to: nutrition education, obesity, poverty and food insecurity, minority populations, rural populations, special needs populations, and the lifetime benefits of these provisions. Within these subjects, I will discuss current and developing programming and policy and the need for social support. I hope my contribution will improve the article by providing a different context for information about human nutrition and malnutrition. Gaining better understanding of the social factors that contribute to malnutrition in humans and the effectiveness and availability of programs that address these needs can serve to develop a broader perspective of nutrition specific to humans. Please provide any feedback you would like or ask any questions about my more specific approach to editing and restructuring the article. I am interested in helping this article reach better class status, as well as help differentiate it from the Nutrition article. Lbockhorn (talk) 03:15, 8 October 2013 (UTC)

questions about revisions

I do not understand why you removed the information on minorities. I plan on expanding that section profoundly, but have only inserted a bit of information at this time due to other time commitments. However, do you see something inappropriate about that information? Also, child wasting is a technical term that signifies the degradation of bodily tissues due to severe malnourishment that is an indicator similar to stunting. May I please revert those edits? I will link the term you believe people do not recognize the term. Lbockhorn (talk) 07:09, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

Please follow the guidelines for WP:LEAD and WP:MOS. In my opinion, you are extracting (or plagiarizing) a lot of information from the UNICEF report, much of which is more about sociopolitical factors than it is about the Article's topic: human nutrition. Let's stay on topic. --Zefr (talk) 02:38, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

Peer Reviewer

One possible thing to consider revising is the way the article separates “industrialized countries” and all the other regions. I also don’t think that the section on the U.S. should be above the section on industrialized countries, and various regions (and the section on the U.S. could use some expansion). In the last section, “Recommended Policy,” more viewpoints should be added. This section talks about a policy recommended by the World Health Organization, but no other potential policies. Additionally, I think there are some areas where you could still add in-text references. For example, you might consider adding an in-text reference to the statement “In 2008, 35% of adults above the age of 20 years old were overweight (BMI 25 kg/m), a prevalence that has doubled worldwide between 1980 and 2008.” It would be good to know where this statistic is coming from. Lastly, work on fixing formatting (missing periods, etc.) in the “Intro” section. Great job so far, and very comprehensive work! Kimmyfromtexas (talk) 05:21, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

Peer review of LBockhorn

The first thing that jumped out at me in your contribution was the random phrase "that provide many challenges to individuals and societies" in what you added to the introduction. Fix this ASAP! Read your contribution out loud- some phrases you used do not really make sense. "Nourished women are less likely to experience risks to birth" sounds awkward and needs to be revised to "Well-nourished women are less likely to experience risks during childbirth". Be sure to link organizations and concepts such as the WHO to other wikipedia articles. Avoid using an acronym without first spelling out what the acronym stands for! The casual reader may not know what the WHO is, and you leave him or her no easy means to find out. Consider conceptualizing what "developing well" and "good development" mean. Is it height and weight goals? Is it normal bone fusion? Your section on "Child and maternal nutrition" needs to be split up into smaller paragraphs. Right now you have a lot of text with no spatial divisions, and this can be overwhelming for readers. Overall, you have added important new dimensions to this article, and have sourced your claims with scholarly articles. I did notice that you rely on your 1st and 2nd sources, so consider finding more sources to further back up the information. Great job, and good luck on further additions to this article!

Samanthaplove (talk) 05:52, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

Deciding new structure

The organizational structure of malnutrition needs some more work I believe. Does the following structure provide a better combination of the previous article and the new social information that needs to be incorporated?

Individual nutrition challenges

4.2.3.1 Illnesses caused by improper nutrient consumption

4.2.3.3 Mental agility

4.2.3.4 Mental disorders

4.2.3.5 Cancer

4.2.3.6 Metabolic syndrome and obesity

4.2.3.7 Hyponatremia

Global nutrition challenges

2.1 Malnutrition and causes of death and disability

2.2 Child malnutrition

2.3 Adult overweight and obesity

2.4 Vitamin and mineral malnutrition

2.4.1 Iron deficiency and anaemia

2.4.2 Vitamin A deficiency

2.4.3 Iodine deficiency

2.5 Infant and young child feeding

2.6 Undernourishment

Are there any comments on this structure? Lbockhorn (talk) 15:17, 25 November 2013 (UTC)

Studies needed

"In general, people can survive for two to eight weeks without food, depending on stored body fat and muscle mass."

Imagine a guy who has 200 pounds overweight. He can certainly survive longer than 8 weeks without any food! There is probably only an upper limit depending on the body fat storage. Are there any studies that made such an experiment with an overweighted person? I'd be especially interested if there are any lack of vitamins and/or of what kind of disease such a fasting person would die (but the latter can only be assumed by watching the vitamin status and monitoring the blood and scale it some time to find out a possible death). --178.197.236.241 (talk) 23:00, 20 May 2014 (UTC)

Essential Nutrients

By Wikipedia's own article on essential nutrients, carbohydrates (which would include fiber) are not essential to humans. This article includes carbohydrates and fiber as sections under "nutrition". Given the essential nutrients article, this article seems to conflict. Either essential nutrients needs updating or this article needs updating. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.178.222.50 (talk) 04:44, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

I don't see the conflict. "An essential nutrient is a nutrient required for normal human body function that either cannot be synthesized by the body at all..." Carbs can by synthesized but food containing carbs can still be nutritious. --NeilN ^{talk to me} 04:57, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

Just adding my two cents: Either you feed on carbos or on meat. That's for humans, many animals feed on cellulose or chlorophyll. Actually humans could probably also feed on chlorophyll, but not cellulose. However, even meat eater also eat a lot of fats beside the proteines. That said, saying carbos aren't "essential" is a bit too much, you must say "either carbos, proteines or fats are essential". I personally even think that either fat or carbos are essential, because I never heard that our body can build glycogen out of proteines... --178.197.236.241 (talk) 23:12, 20 May 2014 (UTC)

As choline was added to the vitamins by the National Academy of Sciences in 1998 I deleted it from the list of "essential nutrients not considered vitamins".Lewis Goudy (talk) 22:33, 22 March 2014 (UTC)

Nutrition is a science / Overlap with Nutrition page

Nutrition is a science and it's own field it seems to me (having a higher degree in it). "Healthy diet" is something like "good music" -- it's all relative and not terribly technical. Because nutrition is such a new field, "healthy diet" involves some debate, and the answers are not all in. "Healthy" may depend on a number of variables for any one person, and be qualified for populations.

There seem to be sections of the "Nutrition" page that could be moved to "Human Nutrition" and sections here such as carbohydrate and protein metabolism that are basically nutritional biology not specific to humans. For example, the section of proteins states "Proteins are the basis of many animal body structures". Couldn't that be referenced in the general "nutrition" article? Ayeletshacar (talk) 09:22, 15 December 2014 (UTC)

User Ayeletshacar has proposed the following as the WP:LEAD. In my opinion, this information does not add significantly to the article which already contains the main elements Ayeletshacar proposes in other locations. According to WP:LEAD, the introduction provides a succinct summary of the what the article contains and does not require specific content that may be controversial as Ayeletshacar claims is a "new" science with weak published reports. Furthermore, the discussion of non-essential "antioxidants" is not human nutrition, as these phytochemical compounds have not been proven to have any effects in the human body. The proposed new lead is also poorly written with several syntax errors so should be edited in the user's sandbox first or here on the Talk page. Please follow WP:MOS for article writing style and WP:MEDMOS when supporting statements about nutrients. Meanwhile, I am reverting the new section again under WP:BRD and warn Ayeletshacar to not engage in edit war, WP:3RR. --Zefr (talk) 17:16, 15 December 2014 (UTC)

Proposed by Ayeletshacar as the new lead on 15 Dec 2014:

Human nutrition is a relatively new science that studies the effects of food components on metabolism, health, performance and disease resistance of humans. It encompasses nutrition at the metabolic level to investigate essential nutrients necessary to support life, as well as non-essential substances in foods that prevent cell damage leading to disease, such as flavonoids, phytoestrogens, phenolic compounds, tannins, etc. Human Nutrition also examines human behavior at social and environmental levels that influence what people eat. The study of eating behavior and food choices in human populations has developed into the fields of nutritional epidemiology and public health nutrition, where statistics and trend analyses are used to evaluate, understand and ultimately improve nutrition, health and resistance to disease. The Women's Infant and Children (WIC) program is an example of a successful population based nutritional intervention because it was able to show quantitative improvement in children's nutritional health when given supplemental healthy foods using the nutritional indicator of hemoglobin levels. .

References

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Malnutrition

Seems like most of the sections on Malnutrition should be moved to the Malnutrition page.Skingski (talk) 20:32, 19 July 2017 (UTC)(talk)

Link trouble

I'm having trouble with a couple reference links. 71 and such that apparently do not refer. Cannot seem to fix them myself. Any help? Lbockhorn (talk) 06:37, 28 November 2013 (UTC).

I cant help you, sorry.--Bolzanobozen (talk) 15:21, 27 August 2017 (UTC)

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Extra paragraphs about rationing and MyPlate

Hi. Two paragraphs were after the history section and seemed quite out of place. Saving here in case anyone needs them. -SusanLesch (talk) 22:20, 18 June 2020 (UTC)

From 1940 rationing in the United Kingdom – during and after World War II – took place according to nutritional principles drawn up by Elsie Widdowson and others. In 1941 the National Research Council established the first Recommended Dietary Allowances (RDAs). Oxford University closed down its nutrition department after World War II because the subject seemed to have been completed between 1912 and 1944. In 1992, The U.S. Department of Agriculture introduced the Food Guide Pyramid. This replaced the Four Food Groups (1956-1992) and was superseded by the concept of MyPlate (2011–present).

In 2002 a Natural Justice study showed a relation between nutrition and violent behavior.

References

Astounding deficit

I found exactly zero mentions of the term "basal metabolic rate" in the article's text. I'm left astounded by this enormous blind spot. Nutrition is roughly the study of the substances (food and drink) which provide energy and body structural and dynamic constituents. It should be blindingly obvious that even if energy requirements as a clear nutritional need are ignored, the body's need to drive metabolism and furnish both general free energy as well as warming (if and when necessary) must be mentioned!!!174.130.70.61 (talk) 09:29, 28 June 2020 (UTC)

Feel free to edit the article and add a WP:SCIRS review as your source. Zefr (talk) 13:39, 28 June 2020 (UTC)

Missing a ´See also´

Hi. These articles (the links to) should be in a ´See also´:

• Micronutrient
  
• Micronutrient deficiency
  
• Vitamin
  
• Vitamin deficiency
  
• Mineral (nutrient)
  
• Mineral deficiency
  

And those, perhaps as sub-topic:

• Spirulina (dietary supplement), natural (nature) product of algas, including B12
  

(*Silica (gel) (from Diatom) is mentioned here Vitamin_B12#Pseudovitamin-B12). But not each Silica product has really any Diatom in it. (Somewhere I posted an external german source, with translation, of this saying.)

• Healing clay (redirects to (Medicinal clay)
  

I see the many sub-categories. But they are just too much and/or unoverviewable, sorry, for only just to look through at all and/or easyly, my experience.
--Visionhelp (talk) 12:40, 9 April 2021 (UTC)

Protein into the list of nutrients not with ?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_nutrition#Sports_nutrition (quote) "The protein requirement for each individual differs".
A simpleton question, please:
Does ´protein´ not belong into the list of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_nutrition#Nutrients ?
(Source: german article ´Protein in der Nahrung´ https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protein#Protein_in_der_Nahrung) (quote german: "Zum Aufbau, zum Erhalt und zur Erneuerung der Körperzellen brauchen Menschen eine Nahrung, die Protein enthält.") (english: "To build, preserving and renewing the body cells, humans need a food that contains protein ".
Note: to (be) more exact, instead of ´humans´ ´human bodys´.
--Visionhelp (talk) 08:50, 1 October 2021 (UTC)

Human_nutrition#Minerals

To ´Minerals´ Human_nutrition#Minerals.
In opposite to "inorganic minerals":
"Some dietitians recommend that these be supplied from foods in which they occur naturally".
So, please, at least, name it clear(ly): o r g a n i c minerals. Thanks.
--Visionhelp (talk) 05:32, 22 October 2021 (UTC)

Connections and relations of vitamins and minerals (nutrient) and trace elements

As in soil the stuffs the connections and relations are very well listed to find in the internet. Very overviewable, despite the lots of stuffs and relations.
The minerals and trace-elements and vitamins the human body needs are still some more stuffs, and the relations therefrom more complex, alone by those lots of stuff.
I wonder, if this work did already begin or is not even in the beginning really.
(Thanks the interesst.)
--Visionhelp (talk) 03:25, 5 April 2021 (UTC)

Vitamins and minerals have exchange effects and dependencies

Ignoring just now (´first´, once; please) the other nutrients, I am asking (to me) the dependencies of vitamins (one from each other) and minerals (one from each other) as well as vitamins and minerals (one from each other):
does not appear as topic, to be a topic at all.
Sorry, just once saying, please.
An example:
Iron is necessary, essential, existential, for the household handling the oxygen in the body, when I may understand it correctly this way.
For receiving as much as possible iron vitamin C does support this very.
Conclusing: for good providing of oxygen iron, for supporting the extract of iron, out of food (and what else), vitamin C.
A further figuring out of what I want (perhaps dis-placed):
There are parts in the body (organs, and what else), which receive the providing of oxygen, only or in the mean, over oxygen transported over, with, the blood.
The formation of blood is depending on the mineral iron.
For better, for a good, extracting of iron out of the food vitamin C is necessary. (Leads to a kind of: The more vitamin C, the more the mineral iron given with food to the body is able to reach the body where it is needed.)
Conclusion: for best providing (of oxygen) these parts of the body, which do receive oxygen transported with/over the blood, the mineral iron is required, for the formation of blood, and the most iron receiving out of the food (and/or getting to the body, where it is needed) is vitamin C required. And, of course, good much clean fresh air, and the movement not to forget.
Sources (partial):

• (german) https://www.active-a.de/eine-kurze-geschichte-des-blutes/ (to english) A brief history of blood
  
• https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypoxia_(medical)
  or the german article https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypoxie_%28Medizin%29 (translating to english) de-m-wikipedia-org.translate.goog Hypoxie_(Medizin)
  
• www.tu-braunschweig.de ´Atmung, Stoffwechsel und Blutkreislauf´ (english) ´Breathing, metabolism and blood circulation´; (sadnessly as german pdf-file I cannot translate to english, sorry.)
  
  

Note: my criticism is, it is not mentioned clearly and out-pointing expressly, that the organs and further areas of the human body, which are only provided with oxygen this way over the transportation over the blood circulation, do already suffer themselves under the deficiency of oxygen providing. This is different as it is being presented now: only the processes from these organs and areas do suffer and do not work poperly, from oxygen deficiency.

(See also)

• https://www.who.int/nutrition/publications/en/ida_assessment_prevention_control.pdf Quote: "Iron deficiency is the most common and widespread nutritional disorder in the world."
  
• Iron_deficiency
  

(Those, such, dependencies I want to know, is what I mean.)
--Visionhelp (talk) 08:58, 1 October 2021 (UTC)

heme and non-heme iron, iron rich food lists

• "Food has two types of iron — heme and non-heme iron" from https://www.redcrossblood.org/donate-blood/blood-donation-process/before-during-after/iron-blood-donation/iron-rich-foods.html
  
• "Iron is a nutrient needed for many functions of the body, such as making haemoglobin in red blood cells, which transports oxygen from the lungs throughout the body. While it can store iron, your body can't make it. The only way to get iron is from food." from https://www.healthdirect.gov.au/foods-high-in-iron
  

(I do not know, whether iron with vitamin C as supplements are mentioned, for test and/or short term.)
--Visionhelp (talk) 16:26, 4 November 2021 (UTC)

Sources and quotes

Quotes from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hemoglobin#Diseases_related_to_hemoglobin

• "The ability of each hemoglobin molecule to carry oxygen is normally modified by altered blood pH ...",
  
• "Anemia has many different causes, although iron deficiency and its resultant iron deficiency anemia are the most common causes in the Western world.".
  

Three links to WHO as sources:

• Anaemia - World Health Organization https://www.who.int/westernpacific/health-topics/anaemia
  
• WHO guidance helps detect iron deficiency and protect ... https://www.who.int/news/item/20-04-2020-who-guidance-helps-detect-iron-deficiency-and-protect-brain-development
  
• Prevention of iron deficiency anaemia in adolescents https://apps.who.int/iris/handle/10665/205656
  

Quotes "Iron-deficiency anemia is anemia caused by a lack of iron.", "Iron supplements and vitamin C may be recommended.".
from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron-deficiency_anemia

A good step-into article about the mineral iron
(german https://www.t-online.de/gesundheit/ernaehrung/id_90963460/eisen-eisenwerte-eisenhaltige-lebensmittel-eisentabletten.html),
englisch (translation with http://itools.com/tool/google-translate-web-page-translator) https://www-t--online-de.translate.goog/gesundheit/ernaehrung/id_90963460/eisen-eisenwerte-eisenhaltige-lebensmittel-eisentabletten.html?_x_tr_sl=de&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en
A source of good presentation the exchange-effects between iron and other nutrients
(german https://aktiv-für-gesundheit.de/mineralien/mineralstoffe/),
english https://0-aktiv--fr--gesundheit--cbc-de.translate.goog/mineralien/mineralstoffe/?_x_tr_enc=0&_x_tr_sl=de&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en
— Preceding unsigned comment added by Visionhelp (talk • contribs) 11:09, 2 December 2021 (UTC) Visionhelp (talk) 09:53, 23 November 2021 (UTC)

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment

This article is or was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Taylor.riley.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 23:59, 16 January 2022 (UTC)