Talk:Headquarters Northern Ireland

External links modified

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Northern Ireland December 1989

The source used for the Northern Ireland units in 1989 has some inaccuracies e.g. 1 RRF as part on 3rd Infantry Brigade when in fact it was part of 5 Airborne Brigade based in Canterbury. I have a document from the MOD which gives the tour dates for major units from the start of Op BANNER until it's end and I will use this to update the entry when I get the chance. Army Brigade boundaries followed the RUC Divisional boundaries but at some point either in the late 80's or early 90's the RUC underwent a reorganisation and the Army followed suit and the boundaries changed e.g. Fermanagh moved from 3 Inf Bde to 8 Inf Bde. I will conduct more research and amend where needed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Demobbed (talk • contribs) 01:51, 26 November 2020 (UTC)

If you are making changes you need to comply with WP:CITE and WP:RS: that means reliable published sources. Thanks. Dormskirk (talk) 09:14, 26 November 2020 (UTC)

Noclador

Two command layers, World War II

EnigmaMcmxc do I understand correctly from what you've written that HQ BTNI sat over Northern Ireland District during most of WW II? So there were two command layers over the fighting divisions and brigades? Buckshot06 (talk) 08:27, 11 March 2022 (UTC)

To provide a few relevant sections from Blake (he jumps around a lot, so these are in the order within his work and the pages cited in the article):

• "Therefore they decided to establish in Northern Ireland special land and air commands, which would be responsible for the local control of active operations in the event of invasion. ... These commands came to be known as Headquarters British Troops in Northern Ireland ... ."
• "The spearhead of the British forces was to the be the 53rd Division ... . But a new Field force command was to be set up in Northern Ireland to direct military operations ... ."
• (this next passage goes onto p.160) "Lt-General H. J. Huddleston, the new Commander-in-Chief, BTI ... assumed control of all troops assigned to an operational role in the vent of invasion. the existing Northern Ireland District Command was to continue to be responsible for local defence measures and to exercise under certain conditions operational control of the 61st Division. But the responsibility for active operations in Eire, should they develop was to rest wholly with Headquarters B.T.I. Officers of the two military commands therefore co-operated, and during the next few months operations instructions were issued explaining various steps to be taken in the event of invasion. This contingency largely determined the locations of the troops in Northern Ireland."

I do not have access to his work beyond page 163, but he just identifies where each division and brigade was and what their role would be. He does not further identify what command would control what formation, beyond the above quoted sections. Based off his wording, it would seem that if an invasion of the republic or NI occurred, BTNI would include at least one division and four brigades (one marine, one from the 61st and two indy), whereas NI Command would retain the remaining two brigades from the 61st Div to defend Belfast and take over internal security duties (within NI only) behind the BTNI force.EnigmaMcmxc (talk) 15:18, 11 March 2022 (UTC)

OK, so BTNI appears to be, so to speak actually "British Troops Ireland," responsible for both North and Southern Ireland if an invasion were necessary. If BTNI had been required to move forward into Southern Ireland, NID appears to have been tagged as the residual NI garrison force. My guess also is that NID might have been supervising recruitment & conscription. All guesstimates!! Buckshot06 (talk) 04:56, 12 March 2022 (UTC)