Talk:Haakon Toresfostre

Latest comment: 1 month ago by Asukite in topic Requested move 26 August 2024
edit

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified one external link on Haakon Magnusson of Norway. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

  • If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
  • If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 16:05, 27 October 2017 (UTC)Reply

Requested move 26 August 2024

edit
The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: moved. Opposing comments noted that the proposed title isn't the common name, however they were effectively rebutted as the move is not using the common name as an argument, but rather, disambiguation. Given that, a move appears to be the supported outcome, with no strong prejudice for the proposed title (meaning if a better disambiguation is found later, a new discussion may be pertinent). (closed by non-admin page mover) ASUKITE 16:39, 12 September 2024 (UTC)Reply


Haakon Magnusson of NorwayHaakon Toresfostre – "of Norway" is a poor disambiguator when all the other Haakon Magnussons are also kings of Norway. Håkon Toresfostre is a more common spelling in the literature, but the spelling with double a is more consistent with the WP article titles of other royal Haakons. Håkon Magnusson Toresfostre is also a common name, but the suggested title is more concise. Jähmefyysikko (talk) 18:55, 26 August 2024 (UTC) — Relisting. Reading Beans 07:48, 4 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

Oppose - The proposed name returns zero results in google ngrams [1] nor in any reliable sources [2]. The other Norwegian kings by this name are naturally disambiguated by their regnal numbers, and the currently existing hatnote (to which very few readers navigate [3]) should suffice. estar8806 (talk) 21:16, 27 August 2024 (UTC)Reply
Both Haakon V and Haakon VI are called "Haakon Magnusson" without the numerals often enough so that there is a reason to disambiguate. And with three articles to disambiguate, it is not enough to disambiguate two of them and leave the third with a non-disambiguated title, unless it is the primary meaning, which is not the case here. The relevant section in the guideline about disambiguation is WP:NOPRIMARY. The page on incomplete disambiguation (WP:INCDAB) is also relevant.
As for the Ngrams, they are not shown (or stored) for phrases with less than 40 occurrences. Thus zero Ngrams just means less than 40 sources in English, which is not surprising for such a niche topic.
Here are the Google Books results for "Håkon Toresfostre" and "Håkon Magnusson Toresfostre" ("Haakon" is more rare as a spelling.) Also note that the only secondary source in the article that mentions him is the bio titled "Håkon Magnusson Toresfostre". This indicates that the byname is common enough to be used for natural disambiguation. My preference for the short title over the longer Haakon Magnusson Toresfostre is weak, and I would also agree with the longer title if that is preferred for recognizability. Jähmefyysikko (talk) 23:47, 27 August 2024 (UTC) edited:04:23, 28 August 2024 (UTC)Reply
Here's how the current title performs in searches: GBooks search for "Haakon Magnusson of Norway" returns a few hits referring to Haakon VI, but apparently nothing about this king. Jähmefyysikko (talk) 21:54, 30 August 2024 (UTC)Reply
Oppose I think the nominator has not shown sufficient evidence that the suggested title is WP:COMMONNAME. I think at the very least they should try to refute the points made by the user above. Keivan.fTalk 21:38, 27 August 2024 (UTC)Reply
Sorry for being unclear in the above, but I am not arguing for COMMONNAME, which would most likely be Håkon Magnusson. But we need to disambiguate, and using Toresfostre in some form seems to be the most common disambiguation strategy. For example, see GBooks search for Håkon+1093. Jähmefyysikko (talk) 05:53, 28 August 2024 (UTC)Reply
  • Comment. One may also study the title in other encyclopedias. He is not mentioned in Britannica, but here's a survey of Scandinavian encyclopedias:
Jähmefyysikko (talk) 07:37, 28 August 2024 (UTC)Reply
The motivation for studying these encyclopedias is that they offer a similar depth as WP regarding historical Scandinavian figures and encounter similar disambiguation challenges. Jähmefyysikko (talk) 15:42, 4 September 2024 (UTC)Reply
Note: WikiProject Norway, WikiProject Biography, WikiProject Norse history and culture, WikiProject Middle Ages, and WikiProject Royalty and Nobility have been notified of this discussion. Reading Beans 07:47, 4 September 2024 (UTC)Reply
Relisting comment: Relisting to garner further input from notified WikiProjects. Best, Reading Beans 07:48, 4 September 2024 (UTC)Reply
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.