Talk:Giovinezza

Translation

I don't know Italian. Could somebody who does give a translation? 192.88.124.205 15:55, 16 October 2005 (UTC)

Mussolini's decree

One book (M. Girardi "Puccini - His International Art", ISBN 0-226-29757-8 )says;

[Giovinezza] by Mussolini's decree of 21 April 1925 was to precede every theatrical performance in Italy.

Can anybody provide further info on the decree? Was it really compulsory for ALL performance, or they played it only when the Duce was present?--2goh 06:50, 10 December 2005 (UTC)

I would readd this but no page number. Savidan 03:11, 13 July 2007 (UTC)

Copyvio?

Is this a breach of copyright? It's quite likely that the author was still alive in 1936, so if we go by the 70 year rule for copyright it's not PD.--Brownlee 12:06, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

English Translation.

Why has this been edited out? Is it a bad translation? If so, could a proper one be supplied? White Guard 02:41, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

A year and a bit late, but they've been added now. - Gennarous (talk) 21:39, 7 April 2008 (UTC)

Failed "good article" nomination

This article failed good article nomination. This is how the article, as of June 21, 2007, compares against the six good article criteria:

1. Well written?: Not bad here, but needs some improvement. Give a brief parenthetical definition of Arditi in the lead section. Also, all italian words should be italicized (eg. Arditi) unless it has widespread in English or has been anglicized (eg. fascist). "Giovinezza" should always be in quotes and never italicized. Also, I noticed a few tiny copyediting issues. For example, this is a run on sentence and/or might have incorrect punctuation:

"Giovinezza" was composed by lawyer and composer Giuseppe Blanc—who wrote other Fascist songs, including The Eagles of Rome, the Imperial Hymn—in 1909 as "Commiato" (Italian for "farewell").

I believe it should read, ""Giovinezza" was composed by lawyer and composer Giuseppe Blanc (who wrote other Fascist songs, including "The Eagles of Rome, the Imperial Hymn") in 1909, calling it "Commiato" (Italian for "farewell")." I recommend reading the article out loud to catch sentences like this one. This is also a run-on sentence:

It came to be considered the official anthem of the fascist regime after the March on Rome, where it was sung, and after which Mussolini commissioned Salvator Gotta to write the new lyrics, which were completed in 1924.

This sentence doesn't use parallelism

based on the original score of Giuseppe Blanc and words by...

It should read, instead, "which was based on the original score by Giuseppe Blanc with words by...

This sentence: "at sports, films, and other public events" should read "at films as well as sporting and other public events." A brief explanation (probably in parenthesis) should follow the term "blackshirts." "the allies" should be capitalized. Major run-on sentence here (an entire paragraph!):

After the capitulation of Italy in 1944, the allies suppressed the hymn in Italy, during which time Italy had no national anthem,[11] until Il Canto degli Italiani was provisionally chosen as the anthem when Italy became a Republic on October 12, 1946, only to be officially legislated on November 17, 2005.

There were also some grouping issues in the History section. Appearances/broadcasts of the song should be mentioned together, and public reactions (or lack thereof) should be grouped together. Also, there is no clear reason as to why the subheading "Performances and non-performances" exists. Many performances are mentioned in History as well. Either merge the two sections, or make the distinction between them clearer.

Another monster of a run-on sentence:

In contrast, Arturo Toscanini (who had previously run as a Fascist parliamentary candidate in 1919 and whom Mussolini had called "the greatest conductor in the world") notably refused to conduct Giovinezza on multiple occasions; at a May 1931 concert at La Scala, was subsequently roughed up by a group of blackshirts, and thereafter left Italy until after World War II.

Also, the second part after the semi-colon is not a complete sentence, and it should be.

I imagine "Edizione Integrale" means something like essential edition, or greatest hits, but this should be clarified (as should all Italian used in the article, especially when it contributes to meaning).

The lyrics must be removed from the article, as they will not go into copyright until 2019. Please see: WP:COPY. It is confusing, but the rule in the US, wo we'll go on that.

One sentence sections are evil. Merge it elsewhere or fill it out.

This fact:

Note °: The reference to Alighieri is an allusion to Dante Alighieri marking Italy's borders on the Quarnaro River, thus including the province of Istria, a territory granted to Italy after World War I.[27]

Keep it and merge into the body text.

2. Factually accurate?:

3. Broad in coverage?: Not bad, although it would be nice to know what role the song has in modern Italy, or at least post World War II.

4. Neutral point of view?: Good here.

5. Article stability? Young article with few edits (might give it some time), but yes, stable. No edit wars to speak of.

6. Images?: I presume that it is good since it is in Wikicommons.

When these issues are addressed, the article can be resubmitted for consideration. If you feel that this review is in error, feel free to take it to a GA review. Thank you for your work so far. — Esprit15d (talk ¤ contribs) 19:09, 21 June 2007 (UTC)

I'll address the grammatical and stylistic issues relatively quickly and renominate this. I am cautious about giving too much "context" for Italian terms unless it is directly relevant to the song in question. As for modern Italy, I was unable to find sources for this; I would "ask an Italian" but that might constitute original research. If you can direct me to some sources, I would be glad to incorporate that into the article. Also, I haven't seen Arditi Italicized anywhere; I'm not Italicizing "Marcia Reale" either because its a proper noun. "Edizione Integrale" is the name of the album. I could render my own translation but that'd be Original Research. Savidan 20:13, 21 June 2007 (UTC)

I believe these comments have now been addressed. Savidan 01:08, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

Successful good article nomination

I am glad to say that this article which was nominated for good article status has succeeded. This is how the article, as of July 12, 2007, compares against the six good article criteria:

1. Well written?: yes

2. Factually accurate?: yes, it is remarkable that it cites so many books, not only web pages like majority of other articles

3. Broad in coverage?: yes

4. Neutral point of view?: yes

5. Article stability? yes

6. Images?: yes

If you feel that this review is in error, feel free to take it to a GA review. Thank you to all of the editors who worked hard to bring it to this status. — Ruslik 12:27, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

---

GA Reassessment

This discussion is transcluded from Talk:Giovinezza/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the reassessment.

As part of Wikipedia:WikiProject Good articles' Project quality task force ("GA Sweeps"), all old good articles are being re-reviewed to ensure that they meet current good article criteria (as detailed at WP:WIAGA.) I have determined that this article needs some work to meet current criteria, outlined below:

• All paragraphs need by definition at least three sentences; there are sections (such as the second "paragraph" of the lead) where this is not so.
• Sources need to be fully formatted, ideally using {{cite web}}, et al. There are missing fields in the references, and some are unformatted entirely (raw direct URLs).
• Some content in the lead does not appear in the article body, and I don't think the lead adequately summarizes the article currently (expanding the second paragraph could probably fix this).
• Terms a general audience would be unfamiliar with (blackshirts, who some of the people you discuss are) you be briefly introduced, i.e., "paramilitary blackshirts" or the like. You don't want to force people to link away from the page to understand it.
• What makes [1] a reliable source?

I am putting the article on hold for one week pending the address of these concerns. Please appraise me of progress here or on my talk. Thanks, Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs^(talk) 21:39, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

Thank you for taking the time to review the article, but I will not be able to comply with this reassessment. I have limited time to spend on Wikipedia, and none of the above are a high priority to me. Feel free to delist the article; I will not be offended. Savidan 22:08, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

As no progress has been made by any party, I am delisting. Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs^(talk) 18:58, 25 January 2010 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Dubious statement

Giovinezza is not banned in Italy. Maybe people have been arrested in the post-war period for - and more recently just charged with - singing it, but in most cases they were acquitted: [2]. In 2011 someone proposed singing it in Sanremo Music Festival alongside with Bella ciao. Gianni Morandi stated: «Giovinezza has been performed many times on tv, and nothing clamorous has ever happened» [3]. Actually, the crime of apology of Fascism does not consist in just singing fascist songs, uttering opinions or proclaiming slogans; it consists in pursuing anti-democratic goals by the exhaltation of violence. The Italian Constitution (par. 21) protects freedom of speech and only forbids to re-establish the Fascist Party (final par. XII): that's why the Italian judges most times acquit people charged with apology of Fascism only for singing a song. --Erinaceus (talk) 07:42, 12 May 2015 (UTC)

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1943 Lyrics

I added the lyrics of 1943 and they got removed because of "reedeming facism". What is wrong abouth the lyrics i added? They are historical i dont honor them, i even put a source, this has nothing to do with propaganda i dont like facism, facism is bad but why does wikipedia censor the 1943 lyrics? THEY ARE NO FICTION! BLACKFOXER (talk) 21:48, 24 August 2022 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:

• It-gio.ogg

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 15:03, 23 March 2023 (UTC)