Talk:Gene Roddenberry/GA1

GA Review

Article (edit | visual edit | history) · Article talk (edit | history) · Watch

Reviewer: SilkTork (talk · contribs) 08:40, 22 August 2015 (UTC)

I'll start reading over the next few days and then begin to make comments. I am normally a slow reviewer - if that is likely to be a problem, please let me know as soon as possible. I tend to directly do copy-editing and minor improvements as I'm reading the article rather than list them here; if there is a lot of copy-editing to be done I may suggest getting a copy-editor (on the basis that a fresh set of eyes is helpful). Anything more significant than minor improvements I will raise here. I see the reviewer's role as collaborative and collegiate, so I welcome discussion regarding interpretation of the criteria. SilkTork ^{✔Tea time}

Closed as not listed on request. SilkTork ^{✔Tea time} 13:47, 23 August 2015 (UTC)

Tick box

GA review – see WP:WIAGA for criteria

1. Is it reasonably well written?

   A. Prose is clear and concise, without copyvios, or spelling and grammar errors:

   B. MoS compliance for lead, layout, words to watch, fiction, and lists:

2. Is it factually accurate and verifiable?

   A. Has an appropriate reference section:

   B. Citation to reliable sources where necessary:

   C. No original research:

3. Is it broad in its coverage?

   A. Major aspects:

   B. Focused:

4. Is it neutral?

   Fair representation without bias:

5. Is it stable?

   No edit wars, etc:

6. Does it contain images to illustrate the topic?

   A. Images are tagged with their copyright status, and valid fair use rationales are provided for non-free content:

   B. Images are provided if possible and are relevant to the topic, and have suitable captions:

7. Overall:

   Pass or Fail:

Comments on GA criteria

Pass

• Images are appropriately copyright tagged. The lead image File:Gene roddenberry 1976.jpg is poor quality, with a distracting head. Is there a cropped version of this image, or perhaps, for the lead image, use a crop from File:Space shuttle enterprise star trek-cropcast.jpg, which is of slightly higher quality to start. SilkTork ^{✔Tea time} 08:55, 22 August 2015 (UTC)

I have uploaded a crop: File:Gene Roddenberry crop.jpg. SilkTork ^{✔Tea time} 09:23, 22 August 2015 (UTC)

• Article has an appropriate reference section. SilkTork ^{✔Tea time} 08:58, 22 August 2015 (UTC)
• Article is stable. SilkTork ^{✔Tea time} 09:08, 22 August 2015 (UTC)
• Prose is clear and readable and of a good standard. SilkTork ^{✔Tea time} 16:36, 22 August 2015 (UTC)
• Article appears to more than adequately meet requirements of broad coverage. I'm not picking up anything in background reading to suggest there's anything important missing. SilkTork ^{✔Tea time} 00:24, 23 August 2015 (UTC)
• Article is written in a neutral tone, and is fair and balanced. I have some quibbles about negative comments apparently coming from only one source, but that is a separate sourcing issue already raised. SilkTork ^{✔Tea time} 00:53, 23 August 2015 (UTC)
• Article appears to remain with sources and known facts - I've not detected any original research. SilkTork ^{✔Tea time} 00:57, 23 August 2015 (UTC)

Query

• The article is richly provided with images, though consideration could be given to how relevant they are, and how much they are needed. What encyclopedic value is there in having an image of Erle Stanley Gardner, for example. There are three images of planes -why is there one of a Lockheed, which is not mentioned in the main text? Some of the captions would benefit from attention - for example, the caption "Nichelle Nichols as Uhura in 1967" doesn't tell us why there is an image of her in an article on Gene Roddenberry. Two captions are possibly too long - the two of the Star Trek crew. See WP:Captions for guidance. SilkTork ^{✔Tea time} 09:07, 22 August 2015 (UTC)

• The article is richly cited, and most stuff I'm spot checking is fine, but I'm having trouble with the animated series section, in which Roddenberry told Nimoy that "he was the only member of the main cast not returning"; there is an end of paragraph cite to Joel Engel's book that I'm unable to access so I can't check if the details about the "deception" come from that book. My research indicates that Nimoy did insist that Takei and Nichols were involved, but I'm not turning up anything about Roddenberry misleading Nimoy about that. Because this is a negative comment on Roddenberry's character, I'd like to see that accusation of deception backed up by another source, one I could check, or the section rewritten to follow the standard commentary on the incident, such as this, in which there is no mention of a deception. SilkTork ^{✔Tea time} 00:06, 23 August 2015 (UTC)

There are more negative details about Roddenberry's life which are sourced to Engel - that he took drugs. This review of the book indicates that it is an unauthorised biography, and only Nimoy agreed to be interviewed. How reliable is this book? In the authoritative voice of Wikipedia we are saying that Roddenberry was a liar and that he took a series of illegal drugs. If there is only Engel saying this, then I think we should be making clear it comes from one source. SilkTork ^{✔Tea time} 00:21, 23 August 2015 (UTC)

Fail

• To meet GA criteria 1(b), which relates to specific manual of style guidelines, the article needs to comply with the advice in WP:LEAD. That is, in addition to being an introduction, the lead needs to be an adequate overview of the whole of the article. As a rough guide, each major section in the article should be represented with an appropriate summary in the lead. Also, the article should provide further details on all the things mentioned in the lead. And, the first few sentences should mention the most notable features of the article's subject - the essential facts that every reader should know. The lead contains information that he was a "populistic philosopher, and futurist", but this is not mentioned in the main body. Inforamtion about Star Trek is pushed to the end of the lead, while less essential information on his place of birth and early career is prioritised in the first paragraph. There is a section on religious views in the article which is not mentioned in the lead, etc. The lead needs to more accurately reflect and summarise the article. SilkTork ^{✔Tea time} 16:13, 22 August 2015 (UTC)

• I've not yet fully read and analysed the article, though I am finding it goes into unnecessary detail in places. It is unusual to mention the doctor who delivered the subject, even if he also delivered the subject's mother - such colouring is acceptable for a full biography, but not for a general encyclopedia where the aim is to be selective, and present only the essential information. This casual anecdotal approach continues through his military service. For example: . After graduating, he travelled to March Air Base and signed up for the Army Air Corps; due to the lack of training spaces his entrance was delayed. For the remainder of the summer, he attended Peace Officer training at the University of California, Los Angeles as an Army cadet. In the days following the attack on Pearl Harbor, Roddenberry received a telegram with orders to attend Kelly Air Force Base,[ enlisting on December 18, 1941. Following the completion of boot camp, he was sent to Corsicana, Texas for pilot training by civilian instructors. He completed sixty hours of flight time there, including thirty-two solo hours. In March 1942, he moved to Goodfellow Field (now Goodfellow Air Force Base) in San Angelo, Texas for basic flight training where he flew a Vultee BT-13 Valiant. Roddenberry graduated on August 5, and was commissioned as a second lieutenant. This is summarised at roddenberry.com as He volunteered for the U.S. Army Air Corps in the fall of 1941 and was ordered into training as a flying cadet when the United States entered World War II. The article is 61kB, the point at which it is recommended an article should be considered for splitting or reducing in size. I'm putting this here as a query as I've not yet finished reading - I suspect I may conclude that the article does need trimming in order to assist the general reader get to the essential facts. Encyclopedia articles are for essential facts; biographies are for additional details and colouring. SilkTork ^{✔Tea time} 16:33, 22 August 2015 (UTC)

On finishing the review I have moved this criteria into a fail. The article contains too much unnecessary and intricate detail. The article needs trimming to the essential facts. SilkTork ^{✔Tea time} 01:09, 23 August 2015 (UTC)

General comments

• A review was started and abandoned - that has been moved to /Abandoned review. SilkTork ^{✔Tea time} 08:41, 22 August 2015 (UTC)
• The infobox contains info that he was a police officer and pilot - this is debatable info for the infobox - while he did those jobs, he is not notable for them, and if it were not for Star Trek he would not have a Wikipedia article on his flying or police career. For the at a quick glance infobox, it might make more sense to just put down the main points; Occupation: TV scriptwriter and producer. SilkTork ^{✔Tea time} 16:13, 22 August 2015 (UTC)
• What information is contained on the IMDB page that can't be used in this article? SilkTork ^{✔Tea time} 18:18, 22 August 2015 (UTC)
• What information is contained on Memory Alpha that can't be used in this article? SilkTork ^{✔Tea time} 18:23, 22 August 2015 (UTC)
• Why are there no films at all listed in the Filmography section? See Wikipedia:Summary style. SilkTork ^{✔Tea time} 18:27, 22 August 2015 (UTC)
• Why are there no awards and nominations at all listed in the Awards and nominations section? See Wikipedia:Summary style. SilkTork ^{✔Tea time} 18:27, 22 August 2015 (UTC)
• There needs to be some clarity brought to the contested will section in relation to his first wife. From my reading of sources, it appears that his wife filed in 1987 and the case was heard in 1993. The wording of the section refers to a 1987 case - is that not the 1993 hearing that was filed in 1987? Or was there a 1987 hearing as well as the 1993 hearing and the 1996 appeal? SilkTork ^{✔Tea time} 00:40, 23 August 2015 (UTC)

Hold

This is a readable and interesting (if a little long-winded) article on Gene Roddenberry. It is well written and meets most of the GA criteria. There are some quibbles and queries mentioned above, and two fails - the lead needs a rewrite to meet part of Criteria 1b - MoS: WP:Lead; and trimming of non-essential details and colouring to meet Criteria 3b - Focused. Review on hold to these issues to be addressed/discussed. SilkTork ^{✔Tea time} 01:09, 23 August 2015 (UTC)

In that case, can you fail the nomination at this time. I'm going to have to take a look at whether to content split away some of the sections in order to save some of that detail somewhere. Miyagawa (talk) 11:16, 23 August 2015 (UTC)

OK. SilkTork ^{✔Tea time} 13:46, 23 August 2015 (UTC)