Talk:Gay–straight alliance

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GSA and terrorism?!

Excised Section The GSA is also currrently under investgation for funding several terroist groups. The Department of Homeland Security is watching them for possible terroist activities. It is well known that they use young impressionable kids as new recurits. They have also shown several ties to NAMBLA.

This is a strong statement, and requires equally strong proof--Tznkai 17:59, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Actually, its an inane. There is no such thing as "The GSA" and very few if any GSAs have the funding to support terrorists (maybe if they had a GSA on The O.C.). Do the terrorist recruit young kids or do the kids in the GSAs themselves recruit kids, and is that to terrorism or being gay? Accusing kids of having "connections" to NAMBLA is more than a "strong statement" its stupid. Hyacinth 04:50, 9 Jun 2005 (UTC)

I was at a gsa networking conference and I swear to god (well, not really, I'm an atheist) that on the local news that night one of the protesters said we were in there working on secret weapons and brainwashing rays to turn everyone gay and kill people. WTF?!

I was in the GSA in Holliston Ma. When I was there the group had a hard time getting the school to let them do things like diversity acceptance week and in getting space to keep the supplies (records, flag(s), magazines, etc.). As for the unconfirmed investigation there is a Puppeteers Guild http://www.sfbapg.org/archives/000450.html that I can prove is being investigated. Lets not forget the investigation of indymedia.org http://www.indymedia.org/en/2005/08/118575.shtml

Mostly Straight?

From the article

"In actuality most GSAs find that straight allies compose the majority of their membership."

Is this based on any actual evidence or is it anecdotal? --CVaneg 20:39, 10 Jun 2005 (UTC)

I believe it is anecdotal but that numerous references could be found. Hyacinth 23:43, 14 Jun 2005 (UTC)

In the GSA I started and ran, as well as in the other GSAs I know of in my old school system and others I have worked with, straight students have always outnumbered gay students. Matthillnc 18:10 20 Jul 2005 (EST)

Ditto, I've been in 2, and they were pretty mixed, and everyone didn't really say what they were, but most either claimed or were assumed to be straight.

Gotta say my experience in 2 university GSAs was different. Both were mostly gay men. Dave 23:35, 13 November 2005 (UTC)

Really varies from group to group. Ashibaka (tock) 00:38, 15 November 2005 (UTC)

So then it shouldn't be included as it is. I'll change it to reflect this diversity. Dave 04:10, 15 November 2005 (UTC)

WS/FCS Portrayed Unfairly

The way the article words it, Winston-Salem/Forsyth County Schools somehow maliciously doesn't support the GSA. In fact, it just treats the GSA as any other student-initiatied or special interest club. For it to be treated differently, the school administration would have to start it, I believe. I just think that could be worded a little bit better.

I was the one who wrote the small section on WS/FCS. I was completely honest in the way the GSAs are treated and noted that it was treated as a non-school sponsored club versus a school sponsored club. The school system wouldn't have to start it in order for it to be school sponsored; a student could sponsor it, but the school system has refused to recognize the GSAs. Matt 01:00, 2 September 2007 (UTC)

Robert Parlin

"The first public school gay-straight alliance was started at Newton South High School (Newton Centre, Massachusetts) by teacher Robert Parlin."

can this be verified? I've also read that the first GSA was in Concord, MA and was started by Kevin Jennings

GSA at Putney High UK was not forced to close

The Gay-Straight Alliance at Putney High School was not forced to close down at the school itself, but it was forced to remove its website and any links to other queer youth groups, and to restrict its access to students over the age of sixteen - cn lester

I picked this piece up on the page today and put it into the article. AirBa 12:54, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

En dash

I am quite sure an en dash should be used in this title and not a hyphen-minus, WP:DASH. No one will think I am being too disruptive if I move the page, right? -- Basar (talk · contribs) 23:54, 1 September 2007 (UTC)

Anti-Gay alliance

Does one exist(legally)?76.110.250.129 (talk) 01:09, 30 November 2008 (UTC)

Canadian GSAs

More information should be added now that a wealth of information is available with the launch today (May 17, 2010) of Egale Canada's online directory of Canadian GSAs: MyGSA.ca. --204.237.44.231 (talk) 02:37, 18 May 2010 (UTC)

United Kingdom

There are absolutely no sources for this section. Here's one http://www.guardian.co.uk/education/2012/mar/02/gay-straight-alliance-homophobia-school if anyone is interested. If not, delete the section because it is useless without sources. --DavisJune (talk) 02:45, 5 March 2012 (UTC)

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Please delete China Mainland column. It has no proof to be true and was mistakenly edited by unconfirmed users.

Done — nihlus kryik  (talk) 14:33, 24 August 2017 (UTC)

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Requested move 21 May 2018

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: Move request withdrawn. Justthefacts9 (talk) 18:56, 22 May 2018 (UTC)

---

Gay–straight alliance → Gay–Straight Alliance – The name, as properly and always used, has all of its words capitalized. Justthefacts9 (talk) 08:15, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

This is a contested technical request (permalink). Sam Sailor 10:37, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

Survey

Feel free to state your position on the renaming proposal by beginning a new line in this section with * '''Support''' or * '''Oppose''', then sign your comment with ~~~~. Since polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account Wikipedia's policy on article titles.

• Support as move requester. --Justthefacts9 (talk) 10:43, 21 May 2018 (UTC)
• Oppose. Not a proper name. Sam Sailor 10:39, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

In what manner is it not a proper name? --Justthefacts9 (talk) 10:43, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

WP:NCCAPS. Sam Sailor 11:02, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

@Sam Sailor: In that case, consider the move request withdrawn. --Justthefacts9 (talk) 11:10, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

---

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Justthefacts9: It's a shame that this move request was withdrawn. Just like you said, it should be renamed "Gay–Straight Alliance" per WP:COMMONNAME. The WP:NCCAPS guideline was not applicable here.

Note that in this ngrams plot comparing Gay–Straight Alliance with Gay–straight alliance, the sentence case version is zero or imperceptible; in any case, there isn't sufficient data for ngrams to even plot it. When talking about it generically, such as, "Specific benefits of attending a high school with a gay-straight alliance..." then sentence case is appropriate; they are talking about an "alliance" between groups, that may or may not have such a club. When talking about the organization, or one of the clubs affiliated with it, then Title case is appropriate, as in this sentence: "Critical pedagogy, combined with partnerships with adults at school, enabled the Gay–Straight Alliance (GSA) advisor to create the foundation for reflective, activist-oriented learning at one Midwestern high school." This is about an affiliated club. The article appears to be about the organization, therefore, title case is correct here.

Please consider reintroducing your Requested move. Thanks, Mathglot (talk) 10:16, 10 January 2019 (UTC)

History

I've updated the history section, which lacked the story of the GSA founding in 1988 in Concord, Massachusetts. Now that that detail is there (more to come), the lead will have to be changed accordingly, to summarize the new information. Mathglot (talk) 11:13, 10 January 2019 (UTC)

Oh, crap; I see there's a second history section way further down, that covers some of this same information. Why the actual founding of the GSA wasn't the first section of the body, I'll never know. In any case, the two will have to be merged, but preferably near the top as the first "History" section. I'll look at it tomorrow. Mathglot (talk) 11:19, 10 January 2019 (UTC)

Recent edits

Mathglot, given that you have not previously edited this article, your behavior is a violation of WP:HOUND. Do not follow other editors around by going through their contributions and persistently undoing and inhibiting their work. You have previously violated this policy with such behavior on other articles. --Justthefacts9 (talk) 22:58, 11 January 2019 (UTC)

@Justthefacts9: Your comment would be amusing, if it weren't so misguided. Wikipedia is the encyclopedia that anyone can edit, and you don't get to tell other editors whether they may edit here or not, irrespective of their previous edit history here, or anywhere else. Suggesting that I follow you around is risible; read WP:WATCH.

To be absolutely clear: you don't make the rules around here: any editor may edit this article at any time in order to improve it. And so can you, of course. Everyone who edits the article, you, me, and everybody else who does, needs to simply follow Wikipedia policies and guidelines when they do so, and especially, to stick to verifiability and use of reliable sources. Anything not sourced appropriately may be challenged and removed. The procedure for resolving disputes in a case like that, is to start by coming to the talk page to discuss the issue, and follow WP:BRD. No editor owns this, or any article, sorry. Cordially, Mathglot (talk) 23:48, 11 January 2019 (UTC)

I see now that you have reverted my edits to the Infobox that added sourced content about the founding and origins of the GSA. I will be undoing your revert when I get around to it to restore that sourced content. Your reversion reason of "Vandalism" is incorrect, uncivil, and a misleading representation of what your revert actually did. Cordially, Mathglot (talk) 00:38, 12 January 2019 (UTC)

@Mathglot: You are in clear violation of WP:HOUND. If you persist in your behavior, you will be reported to WP:ANI. --Justthefacts9 (talk) 10:34, 13 January 2019 (UTC)

@Justthefacts9: I'll just keep on improving the article according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines as I have been, subject to consensus of course, and without paying any attention to your threats, which have no basis in policy. You don't own this article. But you go ahead and do whatever you think is right, including raising a request ANI, if that feels justified to you. On the way there, please have a look at WP:BOOMERANG. Cordially, Mathglot (talk) 11:12, 13 January 2019 (UTC)

For the record, Justthefacts9 posted an ANI incident request at ANI at 13:26, 13 January 2019. Here's the archival link. Mathglot (talk) 01:06, 20 April 2019 (UTC)

Lead rewrite

Per the maintenance tag, the lead of the article may need a rewrite in order to better fulfill the goal of a lead, which is to summarize the article in proportion to the coverage of detail in the body of the article. For example: currently, there's a great deal of overemphasis on U.S. legal decisions in the lead, including much unique information not covered in the body at all, and way too much arcane detail about it for a lead summary, even if the body did cover it. Most of the legal material should be moved into the body, probably in a new section under "Impact", or perhaps in a new section. Conversely, the lead needs to be beefed up with information that is lacking, notably the very founding of the organization itself, which isn't mentioned at all. These are not the only issues, but two of the major ones; there are others. Mathglot (talk) 00:22, 12 January 2019 (UTC)

I've started on this, by moving out the U.S. case law stuff to a new section, Case law in the body, and leaving a brief summary in the lead. Lead still needs a lot more work. Mathglot (talk) 22:24, 19 April 2019 (UTC)

Unfocused

The article suffers from a lack of focus. To put it another way: what is this article really about? The title has a big role in the development and scope of an article; per WP:AT, the title indicates what the article is about and distinguishes it from other articles. Currently, the article covers at least two separate organizations with similar goals: the original, 1988 club in Massachusetts, "Gay Straight Alliance" founded by students, and the 1998 California non-profit LGBT support organization, "GSA Network". The current article title, "Gay–straight alliance" uses sentence case perhaps suggest a different topic, a sort of genericized GSA club concept, not connected with either org, or somehow subsuming them both: "Gay–straight alliance". All three are attested in reliable sources. If the current title is kept, perhaps the other two should be split out into child articles, while retaining a summary of each of them here, following Summary style. Each clearly passes the threshold for notability, and could easily stand alone as an encyclopedic article, but it's not a requirement to do so. My opinion is that at least the original "Gay Straight Alliance" club from Concord in 1988 deserves its own article, as it is of historic importance in the course of development of LGBT rights in the United States, and by extension, in the world. Either this should be that article, in which case a move would be required, or else a new article should be created for it. Thoughts? Mathglot (talk) 22:21, 12 January 2019 (UTC)

As I'm fleshing out the #History section, the focus problem is becoming more apparent. For example, how does one name the subsections? MOS:SECTIONS advises Not redundantly refer back to the subject of the article (Early life, not Smith's early life or His early life). In a single-focus article, under "History" we could have, "Concord" (the 1st GSA), "Phillips Academy" (2nd), but then, 3rd (currently, at least) is "GSA Network" and we can't just call it "Network" in parallel style, because it makes them seem all subsets of the same thing, but the first two are student clubs in Massachusetts schools in the late 1980s, whereas the latter is a 1998 California social justice and LGBT activist non-profit aimed at promting LGBT rights in schools through the formation of student clubs. So, distributing out the common part of the subject or of higher level section titles doesn't work. Maybe have one section for clubs themselves, and another for outside orgs that support or promote them? Mathglot (talk) 12:43, 13 January 2019 (UTC)

Notes

Fragmented history sections

There are currently history sections in three places:

• section History, mostly about the founding of the first GSAs in Massachusetts private schools
• section History in the United States, which covers mostly the same ground, in a different way
• section History outside the United States, which covers rest of world.

These need to be merged in a rational manner. Mathglot (talk) 22:59, 19 April 2019 (UTC)

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 29 January 2020 and 29 April 2020. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Emihoff.

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 26 January 2022 and 17 May 2022. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): TheCrownJul (article contribs). Peer reviewers: Aecomey, Jaime Wegener.

Quebec section missing or removed

Just wanted to come in and mention that the Quebec header in the Canada portion of the international GSA section is completely empty. I'm not sure if it was left there as a placeholder for later or if someone has removed all of its content. User:KiraLiz1 | she/her 13:32, 29 March 2022 (UTC)